This is somewhat related to the recent thread “Lead by Example” discussing people who leave a wood pile for the next camper. We also try to always leave a pile of split wood by the fire pit, but we seldom cover it because we usually can’t find any birch bark nearby and wouldn’t want to harvest it from a living birch. This of course exposes the pile to rain.
How would people feel if they arrived at a campsite in the rain and found a pile of dry firewood covered by a small square of plastic, perhaps held down with a few rocks? Would you be so disgusted with the violation of the LNT philosophy that you would refuse to use the wood? Would you use the wood and pack out the plastic? Would you use the wood and leave another pile covered with the plastic? I have never encountered this scenario, but it raises an interesting ethical issue.

I would say that you have more than done your part by leaving the stacked wood for the next campers. Leaving plastic, for any reason, seems like a bad idea to me. Generally, people in the wilderness know how to, and expect to get a fire going with less than perfect wood. If it has been sunny and dry for 3 days and the wood is perfect that's great. If not, it is still a treat to not have to immediately go on a wood run while you are trying to get camp set up.

I would use the firewood. Thank the previous camper for leaving it. Put the plastic in my trash bag. Enjoy my trip. Leave an uncovered pull if firewood for the next group. Continue on my way and think no more about it.

No plastic. It is easy enough to get wet wood to ignite by notching it.

I would say no plastic or birch bark needed here. Just leave a split pile of wood and you are good. Just stack the wood with the bark up and split down.

As I mentioned in the "Lead By Example" thread, I have arrived into a BWCA campsite to find a small sheet of plastic covering a pile of firewood. That absolutely does NOT conform to the LNT philosophy. I find it perfectly acceptable to leave a few small logs and a bit of kindling for the next traveler. The next travelers may be cold, wet, and tired and that small gesture might make or break their trip. But to leave a sheet of plastic is NOT acceptable. The plastic will eventually get pulled up by animals or blown away by the wind. The plastic should not be burned which means someone else has to haul it out. Quite frankly, I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival. Leave No Trace!

If I felt the need to cover the wood from rain there never seems to be a shortage of rocks to lay on top.

quote LuvMyBell: "I would use the firewood. Thank the previous camper for leaving it. Put the plastic in my trash bag. Enjoy my trip. Leave an uncovered pull if firewood for the next group. Continue on my way and think no more about it."

That's exactly how I would handle it. Nice gesture, but the plastic will end up as trash somewhere along the line if left there.

We don't always have the good fortune or opportunity to leave charity wood as we leave every site every time, but when we do, we stack it against a tree that has some decent needle cover above. If we have access to down birch bark, that might be used to cover (it's the perfect fire starter, BTW). Start your fire with some of the middle/bottom pieces, maybe split again to assure some dry wood, then feed the rest later. No plastic.

Reminds me of the first time I met Zulu (member here) in Aug 2011. We were headed out and he was coming in on the Nina Moose R with his beagle Freddie. We told him of the nice site on Agnes that we had just left and the pile of cooking cedar, split and stacked. He took that site and it was pretty fun to hear, first-hand, from somebody who appreciated the gift. :-)

quote DuluthPak.... I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival. Leave No Trace!
"

so...you don't want a pile of wood there, either?....

quote Cc26: "

quote DuluthPak.... I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival. Leave No Trace!
"

so...you don't want a pile of wood there, either?...."

I think you know what I mean Cc.

You took my quote out of context. If you read my entire post, I specifically said that "I find it perfectly acceptable to leave a few small logs and a bit of kindling for the next traveler."

When I said that 'I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival', I meant that I don't want to see any garbage, sunflower seed shells, pistachio shells, burnt tin foil, half burnt socks or underwear, carvings in logs or trees, twist ties, rubber bands, fishing lures, rope, rusty iron skillets, old lantern batteries, or sheets of plastic.

I reiterate, I am definitely in favor of leaving a few small logs and some kindling for the next traveler if you feel inclined. Just don't leave the plastic sheet.

Absolutely 100% no with the plastic. Slightly wet wood is not that big of a deal.

quote Cc26: "

quote DuluthPak.... I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival. Leave No Trace!
"

so...you don't want a pile of wood there, either?...."

And cleans out the latrine if used?

Leave the gun; take the cannoli
Leave the wood; take the plastic

I would appreciate the gesture if I came upon this in a campsite I was planning to use. I would also leave a pile of wood when I exited and pack out the plastic with my garbage.

I'm amazed that folks can find enough wood to burn for themselves and leave for others. I paddle Crown Land and if I stay put for a week, it seems like I've used the easy wood...and I might be the only person to use that site all summer.

quote DuluthPak: "

quote Cc26: "

quote DuluthPak.... I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival. Leave No Trace!
"

so...you don't want a pile of wood there, either?...."

I think you know what I mean Cc.


You took my quote out of context. If you read my entire post, I specifically said that "I find it perfectly acceptable to leave a few small logs and a bit of kindling for the next traveler."


When I said that 'I don't want to see any sign of the people that used the campsite prior to my arrival', I meant that I don't want to see any garbage, sunflower seed shells, pistachio shells, burnt tin foil, half burnt socks or underwear, carvings in logs or trees, twist ties, rubber bands, fishing lures, rope, rusty iron skillets, old lantern batteries, or sheets of plastic.


I reiterate, I am definitely in favor of leaving a few small logs and some kindling for the next traveler if you feel inclined. Just don't leave the plastic sheet.



"

:)

ok with the wood. no to the plastic.

quote drnatus: "ok with the wood. no to the plastic. "

That says it all right there.

walltentjon left lots of burnable wood in nice small pieces and was quite vilified for it. Guess he should not have left any plastic

Folks, I'm a little in left field on this leaving firewood...
If I'm done camping and there is wood left. (A rareity) I will leave it.
Sorry, I'm not going scrounging in the woods just so I leave you some wood... I'm a nice enough guy without doing that. If that's your thing that's great. I'm just not putting in the time to do it.. leave a clean site... you betcha.... I would prefer to use that time fishing...might sound kinda dickish to some but............

No to the plastic. Don't want to be at a KOA type site.
I also don't feel obligated to leave firewood. Nice to do but don't leave it unless it is leftover.

quote LuvMyBell: "I would use the firewood. Thank the previous camper for leaving it. Put the plastic in my trash bag. Enjoy my trip. Leave an uncovered pull if firewood for the next group. Continue on my way and think no more about it."

Sorry to copy but my sentiments as well.

T

quote : "walltentjon left lots of burnable wood in nice small pieces and was quite vilified for it. Guess he should not have left any plastic"

Huh. Just noticed that the thread finally disappeared (although his trip report remains...)

I'm pretty on-board with GraniteCliffs and yogi59weedr regarding what they posted just above on this topic.

Have I benefited from wood left behind by a previous camper? Yes, but I don't feel an ethical obligation to leave some for the following campers. Would I leave extra wood for the next campers if I have it left over when ready to depart the campsite? Also yes but would not consider any extra measures to make it more useable. If the wood was nice and dry when the next campers came, well good for them but if not, then finding other wood or ways to "make do", even in challenging conditions, is something we all signed up for when we pulled a BWCA permit and frankly is part of the appeal for some folks to take a BWCA trip. They want to see how they can do accomplishing things and figuring it all out "on their own" without support of those outside of their group.

I DO feel an obligation to leave any campsite, to the best of my abilities, as unchanged as I can and in the condition that will allow the next party to most enjoy it as the Forest Service intended for them to.

My first thought was to agree with LuvMyBell, but then again...maybe it depends on the type of plastic, and what might be inside :)? Talk about a little help on a cold, rainy day!

in addition to leaving wood I always scrub down the pottie and fire grate, in addition when I get back to the parking lot I clean everyone's windows, and in particular, their headlights

I'm always thinking of others, if only everyone was as thoughtful as me

My wife and I also try to leave at least enough wood to get the first fire going under a nearby small pine. In addition to ensuring that the latrine is as good as it can be, the campsite scouted for general human sign, fire grate cleaned off, log seats repaired if broken, ashes are also dug up with garbage removed and ashes are buried an appropriate distance from the water.

It is rare, but what bothers me more than anything else in a campsite is a fire grate that is nearly full to the top with ashes mixed with garbage. It is absolutely critical that no human trash is left in the campsite.

I love my camp fire. I always look for and find enough wood to satisfy my need....my campfire is important to me.
If I could get all the world leaders to sit around the campfire some night,
I bet we could cure a 1/4 of the world's problems.

I would rather get to the site and it Not look like anybody has used it for a while. When there is a pile of wood there is a small part of me that is always dissapointed. That's part of the trip for me, gathering fire wood.

If I came upon a pile of wood covered in plastic I would be disappointed for sure.

quote outdooraddict: "I would rather get to the site and it Not look like anybody has used it for a while. When there is a pile of wood there is a small part of me that is always dissapointed. That's part of the trip for me, gathering fire wood.


If I came upon a pile of wood covered in plastic I would be disappointed for sure."

So you wouldn't use the wood? Would you leave it for the next group?

I'd be very thankful if it was a very cold wet day. Just don't come back saying because you had a pile of wood covered with plastic that is how you marked that as a campsite already claimed and expect me to leave. Haha.

quote LuvMyBell: "I would use the firewood. Thank the previous camper for leaving it. Put the plastic in my trash bag. Enjoy my trip. Leave an uncovered pull if firewood for the next group. Continue on my way and think no more about it."

This is precisely what I would do as well.

I do as much as I can to keep the wood dry by using the natural means at my disposal. If I can't find birch bark then I stack as much as I can under the fire grate. I do the best I can but in the end it still may get wet, at least I tried. If nothing else some of the wood at the center or bottom of the stack may have stayed relatively dry.

I certainly wouldn't get upset over a piece of plastic left over some firewood. Sure it violates the LNT code but one could argue that leaving a stack of cut firewood does as well. You do have to take intent and the manner in which is was left into account.

quote LuvMyBell: "I would use the firewood. Thank the previous camper for leaving it. Put the plastic in my trash bag. Enjoy my trip. Leave an uncovered pull if firewood for the next group. Continue on my way and think no more about it."

+1

quote ZaraSp00k: " in addition to leaving wood I always scrub down the pottie and fire grate, in addition when I get back to the parking lot I clean everyone's windows, and in particular, their headlights


I'm always thinking of others, if only everyone was as thoughtful as me"

You're no longer invited on my route. I hate to have that trace where someone has cleaned my windshield. :^)

I have found a sheet of plastic in the water out in front of a campsite, a nice heavy plastic about the size that would have been used to cover a pile of wood. While we think that we are holding it down securely with rocks on the corners, most of us are not willing to carry a big enough rock to hold that plastic when the thunderstorm wind hits it.

If I have extra wood I leave it.

If I come into a camp site that has some wood already I am grateful.

I would not leave a plastic to cover it. I do not carry extra.

It is nice of you to leave the split wood. I would think of the plastic as trash left behind though.

We leave more wood than what we found or at least the same amount Usually, we leave any stacked wood and gather our own. No plastic.

Well CanoeKev, I think you have the answer to your dilemma. I count 37 responses ranging from "thanks but don't do that again" to "don't even leave a pile of wood at all", and not one says "yes leave some plastic".

When was the last time we saw such a uniform opinion about just about anything on this forum?? (DON'T ANSWER THAT: it was a rhetorical question and not an invitation to get this thread deleted! :-) !

Why not just cut your own wood and not worry about leaving wood for the next guy? Then you don't have to be faced with the agonizing dilemma of whether or not they'll hate your or love you over it...and no plastic will be left behind. Sometimes the best thing to do is nothing..

quote : "Why not just cut your own wood and not worry about leaving wood for the next guy? Then you don't have to be faced with the agonizing dilemma of whether or not they'll hate your or love you over it...and no plastic will be left behind. Sometimes the best thing to do is nothing.. "

unfortunately some people think the world will end if they do not save it, a BWCA camper arriving on a rainy day, OMG! they'll probably die if I don't leave them some dry wood. It wouldn't be all that bad except they insist others do as them. In reality, we would all be better off if they died of hypothermia and left the rest of us alone, we'll do just fine.

to cover the wood with plastic or not is not a dilemma, it is an obsession

There were fire bans on my first two trips to the BWCA. It got me used to not building fires up there. I rarely build a fire. I've certainly never considered whether the next person will have dry wood - or any wood. Personally I'd rather my site didn't look like anybody had been there recently.

But I also give it just about zero thought. When we're worrying about things like this, it probably means we need to get off the computer and get into the woods :)

I hide my extra wood way back in the woods so it's there for my next trip.

Too bad I never go back to the same sites.

Hehe

quote : "Why not just cut your own wood and not worry about leaving wood for the next guy? Then you don't have to be faced with the agonizing dilemma of whether or not they'll hate your or love you over it...and no plastic will be left behind. Sometimes the best thing to do is nothing.. "

Well, I do it for the same reason I open the door for people, say hello to strangers, nod or wave at someone, leave a nice tip for service, etc. We weren't put on this earth merrily to serve ourselves.

quote ozarkpaddler: "

quote : "Why not just cut your own wood and not worry about leaving wood for the next guy? Then you don't have to be faced with the agonizing dilemma of whether or not they'll hate your or love you over it...and no plastic will be left behind. Sometimes the best thing to do is nothing.. "

Well, I do it for the same reason I open the door for people, say hello to strangers, nod or wave at someone, leave a nice tip for service, etc. We weren't put on this earth merrily to serve ourselves. "

Well, why you're in such a good mood why don't you swing by and pick me up and drive me to the BWCA...I'll even let you pay for gas, buy my lunch, and bait my hook! My point is this...we all go to the BWCA to "get away from it all", to "accept the challenges" that nature and the environment throw our way...so why not go with the attitude that unless someone is dire need of help (aka an emergency) that it's every man/woman for themself? I don't want or need your help. I'm a big boy and I can do for myself, cut my own wood. I'd prefer the feeling I get that I'm the first person to ever use a particular campsite that season over the euphoria of a woodpile ready and waiting.

quote CanoeKev: "

quote outdooraddict: "I would rather get to the site and it Not look like anybody has used it for a while. When there is a pile of wood there is a small part of me that is always dissapointed. That's part of the trip for me, gathering fire wood.



If I came upon a pile of wood covered in plastic I would be disappointed for sure."

So you wouldn't use the wood? Would you leave it for the next group?"

you see, this is the problem, because someone cut the wood, I cannot use it?
it is likely that if you hadn't gathered the wood, I would have picked up the very same wood that you did, because after all there is a limited supply of available wood, so if I can't use it, you've made my job harder since I now have to search farther than you did away from the campsite.

I agree with the previous poster, if you are such a goody two shoes, please come to my house, I have many chores to be done, in addition you can pay my real estate taxes, grocery bill, ...

and BTW, you don't need to feed the ducks, birds, deer, etc. they can find food on their own and they'll be better for it