Four guys, two canoes, are heading for a 4-day BWCA trip over Columbus Day , October 5-8 or 6-9.

We want to fish, but none of us are experienced BWCA fisherman so I'm looking for advice on:

1. What fishing methods can we employ that allow us to keep tackle fairly simple. We own the basics and can invest in a few special purpose items, but want to kind of stick to a strategy that is likely to work in many conditions.

2. I've read lots of advice on this board about where to find fish, but without a fish finder, is there a way to determine depth and structure? Are there bathemetry(sp?) maps that are accurate enough?

3. We're planning on a relatively short paddle into a base-camp and then longer day trips and exploring from there. We'd prefer smaller lakes to avoid waves and wind, so if someone has a location suggestion; that would be great too.

4. Written advice on boards can be limiting so if there is someone who would be willing to talk on the phone about it, let me know. Then I can ask my 1000 questions instead of typing them :).

Thanks,

Chris

BTW-I've taken an October BWCA trip and am an experienced winter camper, so I'm not worried about being prepared for the cold. I'll have plenty to keep warm.

You will want to take minnows this time of year. Get a few minnow buckets and spread them out between, don't crowd them. Keep them in the water all the time, not in the boat. Look for reefs on maps and try to find them. Also fish the two points of a bay, that have access to deeper water. The minnows will be in the bay and the fish will cruise the bays looking for food. The fish are hungry this time of year to fatten up for winter, you should be fine.

hi chris i see your relatively new to the board/site welcome , good advise from SV early may and october a person can get away without having a fish/depth finder. most fish species should be shallower, i say should be , what is your entry [point/ destination ? i always willing to share on the site , private emails or a phone call , hit us back , i plan on hitting a brook trout lake around the same time. i hope :) with my resent back injury the wife says i'm not going , LOL , if i can paddle i'm still going ;)

I also like minnows in the fall. I like the idea of putting them on the back of jigs. Choice of minnows could play a big part.......I am not really a big fan of silversides as they are hard to keep alive. Choose something else.

But do all of your minnows need be alive? I say no. If I were base camping with maybe only a day travel in I would freeze some bait in water, dividing them up into daily uses. Keep the separate blocks stored together but pull one out several hours before use or keep them in reserve when you run out of live minnows. The use of live / dead bait would be quite key I think.

I would also have a wide variety of jig weights. Are the fish shallow as SV suggests? Perhaps.......I cannot say as I have had very little experience fishing canoe country in the fall. But, and this is just a hunch, I think fish may be deeper than 10 ft and might be much deeper than that. But, that's just a hunch. Fish the shallow water first and see if anyone is home.

Another option, if it exists, is to fish river inflows. Walleye like moving water regardless the time of year and may very well be stacked up. You MUST present your offering within inches of the bottom however. Fish the tail end where the waters ease up a tad and keep that bait near bottom. You will get hung, a lot. Go back and get it......otherwise have plenty of jigs.

Add to your jig heads some spin jigs if results are slim with a straight jig head........you know, the wire bent arms with a blade attached. Or you could buy pre made under spins and add the minnow.

I am not a huge fan of casting minnows with jigs as you quickly go through them, mostly by casting them off. You can help keep them on the hook however by adding a tiny piece of plastic after the minnow is on. This keeps them on the hook rather nicely.

But mostly I like drifting with minnows in the fall. The problem is fall can be windy and you must fish SLOW. A drift sock can be employed to great advantage at this time of year and keep you in business.

I would also be certain to have some lighted slip bobbers to fish with while hanging out next to the campfire. Gets dark early, might as well soak a bait.

If minnows aren't your thing, then I would be relying on Chatterbaits to a very great extent. 1/4 and 1/2 oz selection with a plastic trailer. I like Big Bite Bait Warmouths rigged sideways. Awesome combination........be certain to add a drop of super glue to keep the trailer in place. Not only can you cast and retrieve Chatterbaits you can also drift them. Ease them to the bottom and give them a sharp snap. Feel that blade vibrate? Drift along, keep it near bottom and snap it, let it gently fall. Keep your forefinger on the line and when you feel "tick" set the hook quickly. They will be there........remember, bites may be rather gentle this time of year.

Lastly, if I were unable to connect with walleye or bass I would have an extensive selection of pike lures. Pike definitely put the feed bag out in the fall and they may make your trip. Don't think small lures this time of year. They are keying on fish which have grown up. Spoons are always good but I like a Super Shad Rap right now. A stout flipping stick and some braid of at least 20 lb test will work just fine. I also like Cobra jigs coupled with big reaper tails. Don't forget your titanium leaders. Don't get cheap silver stainless steel premade leaders or you will be sorry.

Fish hard despite the lack of action. You must be determined and thus persistent. Fish may only be feeding at very specific times and if you hit the "window" you might clean up during a rather short time frame. But who knows, if your living right they might bite all day ;-)

roadrunner jig ripple shad


this is mainly what i use...you can fish it slow, fast, rip it off the bottom, anything....and most everything will bite it, which might be good or bad....haha....good idea to use the superglue as these will tend to slide down the hook...i use the plain white jig and the pearl white shad....have had success with the fire perch color also, but mainly use pearl i think because it is a confidence bait for me....only one hook, easy to get out....

I was mulling over October fishing and it came to me some utube videos I had watched on Snap Jigging. Check those out for sure..........that might be the ticket. Pretty sure they were doing it in the fall.

Awesome advice. Thanks to everyone on the board.

A few follow up questions:
1. Is there one rod/reel setup we can use for everything? I love the idea of lighted bobbers at night, but if we need 20 lb test, can we use that for 'general' fishing as well? We aren't planning on extra rods and reels.

2. Assuming we're using jigs and minnows or ripple shad, how do we set up the line? I've used bottom bouncers in the past with good luck, are these recommended? I see lindy rigs are popular here, can someone share their entire setup?

3. If we're using rapalas or other lures, do we weight these somehow too? Or just let them dive on their own?

4. Lastly (for today anyway), do you fish when you're travelling? I met some folks last October trip who recommended dragging a rapala or spoon (maybe a dare-devil?) behind them all trip and said it always brings in fish. Any thoughts?

Thanks again.

^^ when it comes to trolling while getting to your destination , is a preference thing on how fast you want to get to camp or just enjoy the paddle and fish along the way.
weights on rapalas , depends on which rapala , the original floaters , you can add some split shots up from the lure (a good walleye presentation) the countdowns sink on there own and of course crankbaits with a the larger/bigger diving lip can get down 20' plus depending on the model.
if you've used bottom bouncers in the past and had success stick with it. a lindy rig is basically a carolina rig .
fishing line- #8 mono(XL triline) on a spinning reel with a medium or lt medium, rod for smallies/walleyes gets the job done , for pike lakers (shore fishing)#10 XT triline is good , a person can pump that up to #12-#16 with a medium heavy rod if casting bigger/heavier lures.
if only bringing 1 rod and reel set up go with the #8 line medium rod will cover the basis's . but bring in an extra spool of line , just in case ;)

quote Chuckles


2. Assuming we're using jigs and minnows or ripple shad, how do we set up the line? I've used bottom bouncers in the past with good luck, are these recommended? I see lindy rigs are popular here, can someone share their entire setup "

I
I use these Snap lock ....just tie to your line using a Polamar knot.....I use 10lb spiderwire braid and just tie straight to this snap.... then pick your size roadrunner jig depending on water depth , current ....and catch fish

20 lb test? Oh boy.......we have lots of talking to do. Who said anything about 20 lb test? Let's start from the beginning........what are the types of line your intending to use? This wii make or break your trip.........go to heavy and its game over unless your in the pike game. (Which is actually not a bad plan).

I tried to reply to his yesterday and I don't see it; so forgive me if this ends up a double post.

The 20 lb line idea came from your suggestion about night fishing for pike if we don't have any other luck during the day. I suspected this would be overkill for walleye and I am hearing you're correct.

Shock recommended 8 lb setup; does this make sense to everyone else? We could potentially bring an extra reel with 20 lb test and a tough leader for pike.

I suck at fall fishing in canoe country but when I do get into a decent number of walleyes they are usually deep if I'm fishing a deep lake. 30', 40', or more. In these situations jigs and big minnows work great. 20-30' seems to produce just bass. Big pike that spend the summer in deep cool water can be caught shallow. Especially if it's a windy, cold, rainy day. Shallow lakes of course are completely different. My best fall days for walleyes on shallow lakes have been bays and shoreline pockets with the wind blowing into them.

Pay particular attention to what walleye hunter just said. Can you fish deep lakes for walleye with heavy jigs and big minnows? Tough sledding for the best of us. I like his advice of fishing shallow lakes and wind blown pockets and shorelines. These fish could be susceptible to normal sized shad raps and Berkeley Frenzy lures. Don't feel like you have to pound the bank.........drift into the bays casting as you drift toward the bank.

As per line.......my advice to you is to spool with 10 lb mono, either Gamma or trilene XL. Make sure it is fresh and spooled professionally if possible. Bigger bait shops and the box stores will have fresh line and can put it on for you.

I would also spool up with some 20 lb braid and titanium leaders. This would be your pike set up. BTW pike feed little (or not at all) at night. Yes I have caught one or two at night but it is not common. The lighted slip bobbers could be used at night. I would thread on 2 or 3 minnows on a hook and toss them on the bottom way out. Maybe ditch the slip bobber or have it precisely set to grab bottom in 20 ft. Never know right?

If you are striking out on walleye and bass, a distinct possibility (but fish hard for them anyway) then make a day trip to a good sized river coming into a big lake. Walleye might be stacked.

Otherwise change your luck and fish for pike. They are chewing hard then and catches of big ones aren't uncommon. Check out the Mepps spinner double blade #5, I like the Butchertails in the 500 and 700 series, I like the Super Shad Rap, I like the Sebille Super Swimmer soft variety, and of course spoons. Williams whitefish is ideal as you don't need a broom stick to set the hook.

Fish bigger lures........bait has grown up. A bass flipping stick makes an ideal pike rod. Use fingerless gloves to handle your braid.......get good leaders, titanium.

quote Chuckles:

Shock recommended 8 lb setup; does this make sense to everyone else? We could potentially bring an extra reel with 20 lb test and a tough leader for pike. "

8 pound line is all you need, and I will give up one of my fall walleye secrets. If you cast out a shad rap either black and silver or blue and silver, get in about 8 to 10 feet of water and just paddle along, if there are any active walleyes at all the will track this setup down like a heat seeking missle. Make sure you keep moving or if you contact fish keep going over that same area. if you haven't caught a fish in a couple hours then its time to look deep, a roadrunner head with a minnow is deadly at this time of year, in fact these two lures are what I use 95 percent of the time in October when im fishing for walleyes.

I will address the way I fish without a locator or a map and how my fishing partners and I work at the skill to figure out depth of an unknown area or lake.

Now I do and have used a locator for decades, that being said I and the people I fish with are always watching the shoreline contour and terrain, the elevation trends, slopes and sharpness. We do it as a game quite often.

We watch for Hills that may extend into the lake, (often the drop will extend into the lake for a deep area or a continued sharper drop than average next to shore). Example, on our trip this spring we saw a huge rock cliff, that came right down to the lake edge, out off that cliff, we found water over 300' deep! If you see rock cliffs that is more likely to happen than not.

If you see lots of weeds by shore, the depth will most likely stay shallower, because sediment drops to the bottom for weeds and you see weed growth. (think marshes and topsoil, or sediment, fall leaves etc.) The deeper the bottom the more area the sediment has to disperse.

If you see a rocky shore, often you will get greater depth than areas with weeds, again because the sediment often doesn't settle shallow enough for weed growth. It also gets riled up in the wind and is carried to the end of the lake the wind blows to and the sediment gets dropped when the lake lays back down.

You can also find weeds that aren't visible to the naked eye, around bald islands that you see lots of gulls hang around, their scat and other nutrients form the fish they eat etc., will often drop to the first break line and weeds will grow out there if that break line is shallow enough, but it usually is a ways out from the shoreline. You can see the weeds on a locator but not with the naked eye. Again use trolling a known depth crank bait or vertical jig to help find them.

We watch for points when extended you see a little island off 100 yards or so, based on that there are often saddles, or a spine that runs from the point to the island, with drop offs on either side of the spine. Troll a crank bait with a known depth parallel to the spine and you can often find a depth contour that works for you. If you know your crankbait runs at 10 feet and you start bumping, you know it is typically under 10', although it sounds simple it really does work. I keep my crankbaits with permanent marker on the bills to tell me the depth they troll at. I keep them from 3-5', 6-8', 10', 20', 25', and 30'

Another telling trend is a bay with a lot of flat terrain around it on shore, often those are very shallow bays. Visible weeds are another "tell".

On most lakes the weeds will end at a certain depth, once you find that depth, via trolling or vertical jigging you can assume with some accuracy that they end at the same depths in other parts of the lakes as well, giving you an idea of the depth. This can change from lake to lake based on water clarity etc., but usually stays consistent on small to medium sized lakes where the water clarity stays the same.

Those are some things we do to help us find lake contours.

Nomad

Preyfish will be moving from shallows to DEEP water. Get a map of the lakes you will be fishing now! Follow their path to the deep water. Along the way there will be pinch points, narrows, decaying weed bed points....all will attract predators. A one ounce spinnerbait with a willowleaf blade will catch pike, walleye....swimbaits in the 5-6 inch range also(Big Hammer with a one ounce head). There are no little fish left, they all grew up and are now 4,5,6 inches long. Also, cool water means plastic won't undulate as good, a marabou jig with a Kalin's grub(thin tale, moves better) a viable option.

Sorry I've been a bit quite, took a little vacation out to Colorado.

Awesome information; exactly what I need. Thanks everyone; I may follow up with more specific information when we get a bit closer.

Now to find a route and start studying the water.