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      Bikes in Boundary Waters bill passes House committee     
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OSLO
distinguished member (430)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/15/2017 05:15PM
A bill that would allow wheeled devices in federal wilderness areas — including bikes, wheelbarrows and motorized wheelchairs — passed a House committee Wednesday in Washington.

Members of the House Natural Resources Committee voted 22-18 in favor of the bill that applies to all 110 million acres of U.S. wilderness area, potentially including the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness and Isle Royale.

From the article found here: http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/news/4373533-bikes-boundary-waters-bill-passes-house-committee
 
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Savage Voyageur
distinguished member(13261)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
12/15/2017 06:14PM
I can’t see this going very far in our present government. So far there is no similar legislation in the Senate According to the article. These guys can’t agree on what day it is.
LuvMyBell
distinguished member(5946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
12/15/2017 06:18PM
What does potentially including the BW mean. It either does or does not allow bikes in the BW.
Even if it does include using bikes in the BW. I need more details. Does the bill say bikes and wheelchairs can be used on existing trails which means it's highly likely no one will ever see a bike on a portage trail or have bikes wizzing by their campsite.

Does the bill allow for the funding and creation of new trails, trails that could potentially intersect with portage trails and campsites. This would not be a good thing.

I'd like to see the language in the bill to see if and how it could interfere with the BW.
OSLO
distinguished member (430)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/15/2017 06:47PM
LuvMyBell: "OSLO: "A bill that would allow wheeled devices in federal wilderness areas — including bikes, wheelbarrows and motorized wheelchairs — passed a House committee Wednesday in Washington.


Members of the House Natural Resources Committee voted 22-18 in favor of the bill that applies to all 110 million acres of U.S. wilderness area, potentially including the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness and Isle Royale.


From the article found here: http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/news/4373533-bikes-boundary-waters-bill-passes-house-committee"



What does potentially including the BW mean. It either does or does not allow bikes in the BW.


Even if it does include using bikes in the BW. I need more details. Does the bill say bikes and wheelchairs can be used on existing trails which means it's highly likely no one will ever see a bike on a portage trail or have bikes wizzing by their campsite.


Does the bill allow for the funding and creation of new trails, trails that could potentially intersect with portage trails and campsites. This would not be a good thing.


I'd like to see the language in the bill to see if and how it could interfere with the BW."

A quick search found this at the bottom of a Pioneer Press article (http://www.twincities.com/2017/12/05/congress-considers-allowing-bikes-other-wheeled-devices-in-wilderness-areas/) about the issue:

The bill’s exact wording is: “Section 4(c) of the Wilderness Act (16 U.S.C. 1133(c)) is amended by adding at the end the following: ‘Nothing in this section shall prohibit the use of motorized wheelchairs, non-motorized wheelchairs, non-motorized bicycles, strollers, wheelbarrows, survey wheels, measuring wheels, or game carts within any wilderness area.’ ”

I think that "potentially including" was used for the BWCA because if the bill was passed, "the bill would only allow the option of bikes but that specific agency land managers still could enact regulations to ban bikes in specific wilderness areas."
Duckman
distinguished member (283)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/16/2017 03:36AM
Well, if you really want to portage a bike, go for it, see where it gets you!
mjmkjun
distinguished member(2218)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/16/2017 05:46AM
Savage Voyageur: "I can’t see this going very far in our present government. So far there is no similar legislation in the Senate According to the article. These guys can’t agree on what day it is. "
+1
Wheelchairs? Seriously?
meh
Pinetree
distinguished member(13000)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
12/16/2017 10:41AM
12/16/2017 10:59AM
Duckman: "Well, if you really want to portage a bike, go for it, see where it gets you!"

No Mt biker is going to bring their bike on a canoe trip just to ride the portages.
GoSpursGo
distinguished member (291)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/18/2017 10:02AM
youre gonna see some impressive times on the kek trek
12/18/2017 10:33AM
Well, I'm not a fan. And if you don't think Mtn Bikes won't be brought in by canoe you haven't seen the ingenuity of people good or bad. We'll have to live with it. All the more reason to go to places unknown if you want that good voyageur experience. The forest service will have their hands full fixing the problems created and most will be erosion and increased campsite issues. So, sad but that's the way it is bound to go. See... you allow the double blade, and next thing it's all bets are off. Hahahahah!
LuvMyBell
distinguished member(5946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
12/18/2017 12:54PM
nctry: "Well, I'm not a fan. And if you don't think Mtn Bikes won't be brought in by canoe you haven't seen the ingenuity of people good or bad. We'll have to live with it. All the more reason to go to places unknown if you want that good voyageur experience. The forest service will have their hands full fixing the problems created and most will be erosion and increased campsite issues. So, sad but that's the way it is bound to go. See... you allow the double blade, and next thing it's all bets are off. Hahahahah! "

Is it possible that someone will mistakenly think that it will be easier to ride a bike across a portage with a pack on their back than it would be to walk the portage with a pack? I guess a few will try and most will learn that bikes aren't a better idea. I think that portage wheels will be tried far more often.

The overwhelming majority of campsites are accessed by water, not portage trails so once you get to your site, you'll never see or hear bikes or portage wheels. Nobody will have their wilderness experience ruined by this new law.
Pinetree
distinguished member(13000)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
12/18/2017 01:35PM
It is ironic the largest Mountain bike group in the U.S. is against any changes in the Wilderness act. They would rather have the attention placed on the majority of public land that is already open. This is more of a push by certain Western Congress people to dismantle wilderness areas and public ownership of public land.
12/18/2017 08:52PM
nctry: "Well, I'm not a fan. And if you don't think Mtn Bikes won't be brought in by canoe you haven't seen the ingenuity of people good or bad. We'll have to live with it. All the more reason to go to places unknown if you want that good voyageur experience. The forest service will have their hands full fixing the problems created and most will be erosion and increased campsite issues. So, sad but that's the way it is bound to go. See... you allow the double blade, and next thing it's all bets are off. Hahahahah! "
Erosion is not caused by Mt biking. Erosion is caused by running water on poorly constructed trails. I've been involved with IMBA approved Mt Bike trail construction for 15 years. The trails we build are sustainable, no rutting. And as far as bringing in a Mt Bike in your canoe. That would only be done by some uneducated rookie, not an actually Mt Biker. The only portage that might even be remotely attractive to a Mt Biker might be Grand Portage and even that would be considered short in distance.
Northwoodsman
distinguished member(1142)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/19/2017 11:20AM
Here is a map of current bike trails (all types) in Northern MN.
Northern MN Biking Trails
Pinetree
distinguished member(13000)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
12/19/2017 11:34AM
Northwoodsman: "Here is a map of current bike trails (all types) in Northern MN.
Northern MN Biking Trails "


Thanks and that is a lot of trails in Cook County and than you have a 100 times that trails that are not designated. There is trails everywhere with all the old logging trails and secondary roads.
12/19/2017 06:05PM
Pinetree: "Northwoodsman: "Here is a map of current bike trails (all types) in Northern MN.
Northern MN Biking Trails "



Thanks and that is a lot of trails in Cook County and than you have a 100 times that trails that are not designated. There is trails everywhere with all the old logging trails and secondary roads."

This is nice, but if you want to make this area a Mt Bike destination to bring in Tourist money Like the Chequamegon does, then you need well marked single track.
overthehill
distinguished member(4413)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
12/19/2017 06:32PM
Boundary Waters CANOE Area. That was the original intent and I wish it could stay that way. Why can't they just leave things be? My 2 cents.
OSLO
distinguished member (430)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
12/28/2017 10:38AM
Blatz: "nctry: "Well, I'm not a fan. And if you don't think Mtn Bikes won't be brought in by canoe you haven't seen the ingenuity of people good or bad. We'll have to live with it. All the more reason to go to places unknown if you want that good voyageur experience. The forest service will have their hands full fixing the problems created and most will be erosion and increased campsite issues. So, sad but that's the way it is bound to go. See... you allow the double blade, and next thing it's all bets are off. Hahahahah! "
Erosion is not caused by Mt biking. Erosion is caused by running water on poorly constructed trails. I've been involved with IMBA approved Mt Bike trail construction for 15 years. The trails we build are sustainable, no rutting. And as far as bringing in a Mt Bike in your canoe. That would only be done by some uneducated rookie, not an actually Mt Biker. The only portage that might even be remotely attractive to a Mt Biker might be Grand Portage and even that would be considered short in distance."

Mountain bikes do cause erosion during normal use, since they are wearing down whatever surface they are being used on. Running water then greatly accelerates the process. The question is whether the erosion will be significant or not, and you can obviously reduce the impact of the bicycles through proper trail construction (choice of trail materials, consideration of water flow, etc.). That having been said, I am very curious to see trails built in the hills of NE MN that do not significantly rut (aside from those built on rock or that are paved). I live near miles of outstanding mountain bike trails up here which draw people from all over the area, but the trails still rut and require regular maintenance to fix those areas.

I agree that the portages in the BWCA would be ridiculous to bother with, and very few people would probably even attempt them. The Kek and the BRT would probably be a different story. Portage wheels would also likely be a bigger problem caused by this bill. Regardless, from what I have read, the bill is unlikely to be brought up for a vote in the House. Even if the bill is brought up and passes the House, it is likely DOA in the Senate.
The Great Outdoors
distinguished member(5648)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
12/28/2017 11:23AM
overthehill: " Boundary Waters CANOE Area. That was the original intent and I wish it could stay that way. Why can't they just leave things be? My 2 cents."

Hey overthehill, I said "why can't they just leave things be" over 55 years ago, but no one listened! :)
12/28/2017 01:06PM
My question is: are you going to hang the bike or stash it, to avoid bears making off with it. Cause, once bears have bikes, we will really be in trouble.
ozarkpaddler
distinguished member(5508)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
12/28/2017 01:25PM
rtallent: "My question is: are you going to hang the bike or stash it, to avoid bears making off with it. Cause, once bears have bikes, we will really be in trouble. "

Allow bikes and ban the BEARS maybe (LOL)?
 
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