Hey folks,

I need rod advice.

I'm in need of 3 rods.

Trolling rod- trolling up to 1 ounce keel sinkers with spoons or tail dancers behind the weights.

Jigging rod- vertical jigging up to 3/4 ounce jigs and spoons. As light as 1/4 ounce also.

Slip bobber/Shore casing rod- long, fast tip with stout backbone. Needs to cast far with little weight.

I'd like to accomplish these 3 rods in 2 rods if you follow me. 2 rods that would do the work of 3.

Is it possible?

I have a bunch of rods laying around. Sad to say, I’ve fished my entire life but really know not that much about how to pair different presentations with different rod and reel setups.

Thanks.......

I'm going to say no. Those are 3 very different rods you need.

Trolling Rod = Cheap composite Baitcaster with a lot of give. Not good for anything else.

Jigging = Expensive high modulus graphite with a lot of sensitivity and not much give. Not good for anything else.

Shore Casting Rod = what you said. I suppose the shore casting rod would be the only one that works for multi-purpose use. Your still better off using the right rod for the right application.

Just be happy that your smart enough to know that you need different rods and leave it at that.

I use Ugly Stik gx2. Light, strong, sensitive. I have a 6’6” baitcaster that works well for trolling & jigging. I have a 7’6” spinning for casting. A 3rd rod I sometimes take is a 5’6” ultralight spinning. Go with the first two and you’ll be set for 90% of fishing situations.

Here are the rods I currently have in my possession.....(not counting ultralights and dock fishing rigs)

6 ft 6 in Med Light spinning
7 ft Med Heavy Bait caster
6 ft med bait caster
6ft med heavy spinning

I have various spinning reels and 1 old baitcaster.

Looking to buy 1 nice setup to help my cause up in canoe country. Working toward a 3 rod setup as described above. How should I use the rods I've got and what should I buy?

I will only give advice on the slip bobber rod. You cannot do better IMO than with a 8' rod designed specifically for steelhead fishing. Get a model rated for 6 to 12 lb line. The upper half will cast light baits a mile but the rear half has significant strength. I also use such rods for trolling provided they are "loaded" correctly I.e. The rod pointed ar a 45 degree angle back towards the lue which engages the stiffer rear portion of the rod.

The long steelhead rods are not the "be all, end all" in the rod discussion and do poorly for jigging and are cumbersome for casting all day. But for slip bobber fishing, still fishing from a bank and trolling they are simply peerless and have no equal. Once you use this type of rod for these applications you will never go back to shorter rods. Throw in that you are able to use lighter lb test line (provided your knots are 100%) because the long rod protects your line so much better and a whole new world of effectiveness happens.

Casting light bobbers far and having them land with a gentle plop is very satisfying. Holding the rod tip high in the air to help facilitate the free flow of line through the slip bobber without having to have heavy split shots is also superior. When the bobber slides down having a more direct angle to set the hook is helpful and lastly the long rod helps "pry" the fish up and off the bottom.

I own 2 such rods. An 8' Loomis and a 9' St Croix. Both perform superbly for their assigned tasks.

Depending on the trip I bring 2 or 3 set ups.

Always a 5 ft ultra light. I use this for slip bobber fishing for walleye.

Then I normally bring my 7ft med action spinning combo. Its a 2 piece so it packs easy. This can also be used with a bobber or this for casting for pike or for trolling. Its an all around good pole for just about any species.

The third pole that sometimes goes with is a med baitcaster. This is my main rod if we are trolling for Lakers bc it is has a stiffer backbone and can handle the aggressive action of a deep tail dancer. This set up is also used to target larger pike where I am throwing larger than normal baits.

You already own all the rods you need.

Use your MH action baitcaster for heavier trolling and jigging applications, and use one of your spinning rods for lighter jigging and slip bobbering. Is it ideal? No. But it would definitely work.

I think you could do all of that with your med/light spinning rod. You can troll heavier weights than you can cast with a given rod. I troll cranks with 1-3oz weights inline with my med/light spinning rods on every trip for LT.

Thanks!

mastertangler: "I will only give advice on the slip bobber rod. You cannot do better IMO than with a 8' rod designed specifically for steelhead."

I disagree. An 8.5' rod is ideal for slip bobbers and shore fishing.
Obviously I am joking. Anything from 8'-9' is perfect. I have three rods that fit this description. Two mediums and a light. The extra length gives the "light" rod more of a med-light action. For the pike and lake trout in the BWCA I would go with a medium, for walleyes and slip bobbers the light 8.5" is great. All three cast a mile. The extra rod length also improves hook sets on distant fish under a slip bobber.

You do not need a fast or sensitive action on a rod like that. A moderate speed rod will cast further. Bite detection will be done with either the float or the bait feeder reel that you must pair it with.

For trolling an ~7' medium bait caster is great. I just got a line counter reel for my trolling rod. Looking forward to using it this spring. Plan on trolling +3 oz for lake trout. I figure about 1 oz per 10ft of depth.

Jigging rods should be short and high modulus. 6'6" can make an all purpose spinning rod. But a 6' rod with a jigging specific action will allow you to feel everything.

I don't have any issues fishing with one type of rod for the most part. A Fenwick HMG medium, fast action, 6'6 or 7' foot, 2 piece rod should be able to handle any lure, presentation or fish up there.

I'll talk length first. If you're jigging a lot and your rod is too long and cumbersome, you'll wish for something shorter. I would suggest a quality 6' rod with some decent backbone to it for jigging. I say "decent backbone" only because you might be jigging 3/4 ounce jigs. That's pretty heavy. Even more reason for a shorter rod. If you were consistently jigging with 1/8, 1/4 or 3/8 ounce jigs, you could go to a slightly less stiff rod with a fast tip. Great for sensitivity and enough backbone to land the largest walleye, smallie, pike or laker. You don't want a noodle or wimpy rod.

For trolling, casting, slip bobbering, you can do just fine with a 6'6" or 7' rod. Again, because of the weights of some of the lures you want to use, something with a strong backbone will be important. I'd opt for the 6'6" rod myself. Plenty long enough for those fishing options.

I agree with QMike and Jackfish, 6'6" or 7' rods are versatile workhorses for BW fishing. Take two with a variation in power (as some manufacturers are rated different than others). 1 ML Fast, 1 M Fast.....should be able to do it all with these. A 3rd rod could be a little shorter, 6' range, for jigging.

Again, thanks for the info!

Might take a trip to marine general soon and get rigged up.

Hmmm...If you're interested in trolling big Tail Dancers with added weight, or casting large lures for pike, or vertical jigging with heavy lures, it's nice to not have the rod already maxed out *before* the fish bites, which might happen with even a medium-power rod, especially while trolling.

I think others are right to say that you *can* do just fine with a medium-power rod...but I'd still vote for one MH baitcaster and one medium-power spinning rod. I think that gives you the most versatility and allows you to better cover the full range of options.

Just my .02.

SO I am bringing rods for my group this year and have three reels and two 6'6" medium rods. I'm going to pick up a third rod. Two reels for 4-10 lb test and the third reel is larger (8-12 lb. monofilament).

I'm leaning toward 8'6" or 9' medium power salmon/steelhead rod to pair with the larger reel, as I plan to fish for large lakers and pike. But I could get a 5'6" rod (for jigging) and pair it with a smaller reel. (This would mean that I have to put the larger real on the 6'6" rod, which might be a little akward.)

I may be splitting hairs here, so I guess my question is whether its worth having the longer rod for trolling, slip bobbers, and pike? Is it really going to be a pain to fish a 9' salmon rod from a canoe?

TheGreatIndoors: " Is it really going to be a pain to fish a 9' salmon rod from a canoe?"

In a word... yep. There's no need for fishing rods that length in canoe country.

Don't try to out-think your fishing rod requirements. A good 6-foot spinning rod for jigging and a good 6'6" spinning rod for trolling/casting will work for any fishing you want to do. The preference for a baitcaster would be the only wildcard in the equation.

You're thinking too hard and listening to MT, two things that are likely to get you into trouble (with less money in your pocket than you should otherwise have :).

You don't need a long rod to fish for northerns. I only like a MH action rod because I like using big, heavy lures and I prefer the handling of a baitcaster in that situation. And you certainly don't need a 9' to bobber fish.

I do like long rods for trolling, but that's only if I'm pulling planer boards or using two rods on one side of the boat (with one being a shorty and the other a long 10-12'). For canoe country, keep it simple.

As others have said, a plain-Jane 6'6'' rod will do everything you need.

The rod is important, but equally important is the line you are using. I bring 3 rods but all are virtually the same, just rigged differently. I like medium weight, 7 foot, fast action. BUT, I use 8 lb power pro on 2 reels and 10 on the other, for trolling. The lack of stretch with the line compensates for stiffness with jigging, and I jig a lot. For me, the key to jigging is the touch/sensitivity.

Truly, I am comfortable with my gear and that makes all the difference. I'm not sure how much the fish care!

carmike

As others have said, a plain-Jane 6'6'' rod will do everything you need. "

I strongly advocate for 8'-8'6" rods, but I can't disagree that a 6'6"-7' rod can do everything you need.

The longer rods really shine when you are fishing from shore. Since we are ALWAYS fishing in while in camp we get as much use from our 8'6" "bank rods" as we do from our 7' "canoe" rods.

I think fishing rods are like golf clubs. You could play with a 7 iron, but it is easier to have a club tuned for the shot your taking.

As for line, I recommend 15lb braid. It has the same diameter as 4lb mono. For casting and trolling applications I tie on at least 6' of 12lb Spider Wire fluorocarbon with a Uni to Uni knot. All the advantages of braid with all the advantages of mono. When bait fishing around pike I step that up to 25lb saltwater fluorocarbon leader.

When bait fishing around pike I step that up to 25lb saltwater fluorocarbon leader. "

No steel leader?

TheGreatIndoors: "

When bait fishing around pike I step that up to 25lb saltwater fluorocarbon leader. "

No steel leader?"

If you are going to use a leader, use titanium, not steel. Sure they cost more, but they last forever, unlike steel. They are stronger, have a smaller diameter and don't kink up like steel.

A few years ago I found myself fishing in Florida. All the bait shops stock heavy mono or floro leader material. It is much stiffer and harder than regular line. I picked up a spool of the stuff because it was recommended for catching Spanish mackerel. (Note: mackerel teeth are waaay sharper than pike teeth).

I haven't used a metal leader since. We catch a lot of pike while dead baiting for trout, and I have never had a leader cut off. We also loose some rigs to snags. Since I have a 25 yard spool of material I don't have to worry about packing enough leaders for everyone to loose 2 or 3. Also, it attaches with regular knots and can be made any length I need. Since they are fluorocarbon (or at least clear) I don't have to worry about fish seeing them.

Just curious in hearing more of your thoughts, TylerW...what are the major advantages (other than shore fishing) for using an 8' (or longer) rod?

It is a simple matter of actually having used the type of rod I am describing, an 8' or 8'6" steelhead rod, rather than just commenting on how you think it would perform. They are superior for slip bobber fishing and trolling typical canoe country crank baits. I own and use a ridiculous amount of rods, last count was near 50 so I speak from experience. The long rods do many things better than short rods that's just a fact ( with all due respect, IMHO, etc.etc.)

On the other side of the coin they can be a hindrance or perform poorly for many other types of fishing. I like short rods for jigging for example and your not tossing big heavy pike lures with them. And if your doing lots of casting lures not only can it be fatiguing it can become flat out dangerous if your fishing out of a tandem canoe.

But if your doing lots of slip bobber or live bait fishing, especially with light line, they are peerless, they have no equal, it's just that simple. And they are an exceptional trolling rod.......I am able to run hard deep diving lures on surprisingly light line very fast........and when a big fish strikes the rod absorbs a great deal of energy and protects the line in ways shorter rods can't. The front 1/2 of the rod is akin to a light action rod while the rear, the butt section, is more like a heavy rod and still able to move surprisingly big fish. Steelhead are, after all, a very powerful fish which often requires light line to get bit.

In addition to 2 steelhead rods, I have 3 loomis Pelagic 8' salt water rods. All the same model. The rod is rated for 25lb test and when I bait up with a 6oz weight and hand sized baitfish the long rod loads and flings the set up very far indeed. I fish 30/40/50 on each rod. And even though the rod is only rated for 25lb test I have winched 9ft nurse sharks off the bottom, 48 lb / 52 lb kingfish and quite a few big grouper........the front 1/2 has the sensitivity to detect snapper bites and the rear of the rod can handle the brutes.

Long rods, don't knock them until you try them. In canoe country it is Steelhead rods which fit the bill for the uses already described. Not some clunky heavy planer board rod (I have one of those to) .

I'm sorry to touch such a nerve, MT, and thanks for the reply (and heavy condescension). I had read your previous response and I know your preferred fishing styles, so that's why I didn't ask you. You and I have different preferences and make different assumptions about fishing in the BWCA/Q, so I figured I'd ask Tyler to see if he could give a bit more explanation.

I do own one example of the rods you mention. I genuinely do not understand the need to buy a fancy $200+ 8' fishing rod to the BWCA/Q (or a planer board rod, which I also wouldn't bring and didn't advocate anyone do) to cast bobbers or troll crankbaits. You're right about the benefits of using them, especially with light line, but I'm willing to bet you're a good enough fisherman to catch just as many fish on a slip bobber or trolling while using a shorter rod.

Well, on a side note.....

I ended up going to L & M and picking a couple Fenwick HMX rods. A 6 foot medium fast and a 6 foot 6 inch medium light fast. The other medium light I own just never impressed me much.

I’ll use my medium heavy rod I already had for trolling. The shorter medium for jigging. The longer medium light for rigging and slip bobber. Obviously haven’t tried them yet, but, can’t wait.

After thorough research and some deep soul searching :) I decided that while I would love to own a fleet of high end rods, I think some “nice” rods are more my speed.

With this 3 rod setup I hope to be able to handle whatever canoe country has to throw at me.

Bring it on fish.

QueticoMike: "I don't have any issues fishing with one type of rod for the most part. A Fenwick HMG medium, fast action, 6'6 or 7' foot, 2 piece rod should be able to handle any lure, presentation or fish up there."

+1
This is exactly what I use, and I've been very happy with it in all situations.

carmike: "I'm sorry to touch such a nerve, MT, and thanks for the reply (and heavy condescension). I had read your previous response and I know your preferred fishing styles, so that's why I didn't ask you. You and I have different preferences and make different assumptions about fishing in the BWCA/Q, so I figured I'd ask Tyler to see if he could give a bit more explanation.


I do own one example of the rods you mention. I genuinely do not understand the need to buy a fancy $200+ 8' fishing rod to the BWCA/Q (or a planer board rod, which I also wouldn't bring and didn't advocate anyone do) to cast bobbers or troll crankbaits. You're right about the benefits of using them, especially with light line, but I'm willing to bet you're a good enough fisherman to catch just as many fish on a slip bobber or trolling while using a shorter rod. "

A nerve? Condescension? Perhaps that is true. Several posters have flatly stated that you don't "need" such a rod as the one I am advocating. If I had to guess most probably have never even used one. And if they haven't ever used one how is it that they speak with authority against its usage?

Of course you don't "need" a $200 rod and you don't "need" an 8' steelhead rod to fish anywhere. I was intellectually honest and trying to be helpful about the advantages and disadvantages of such a rod. I will restate my position as I have decades of experience using the Steelhead rod........if you are using live bait and especially if you are slip bobbering the longer rods are just better, much better. They are also exceptional for trolling typical walleye / lake trout crank baits particularly if you use light line. That opens up an entirely new option for difficult bluebird high pressure days. Try trolling 6lb line with a hard diving crank bait on a short rod.......very dicey proposition to be sure.

The long rods do not fare so well as a jig rod or casting all day or as a general all purpose option.

I have strong convictions about certain things and am not shy about letting my perspective be known. Sometimes it rubs people the wrong way. If my trip was primarily a live bait trip with some crank bait trolling thrown in I would definitely be bringing my steelhead rod and I wouldn't have to think twice.

MT's advice for using a steelhead rod for bobbering is right on. Takes up extra slack on the hookset and casts far.

Thanks to MTs conviction (thanks! You go, gurl), and a handful of suppoters, I’ll spring for an 8’6” St.Croix avid salmon /steelhead rod. Pricey. Hardly justifiable, but probably the last time I’ll buy a rod of this kind unless my life turns upside down, for the better.

Although it will be wrong for the average canoe casting experience, I don’t need a third all around 6’6” rod. (I can also plan on casting for winter steelhead in northern MI.) I look forward to boating some big trout and pike and listening to the buzz of line peeling off my reel from camp. Thanks for the insites. May the ice melt on time.

Enjoy the rod. They are pretty sweet.

lundojam: "MT's advice for using a steelhead rod for bobbering is right on. Takes up extra slack on the hookset and casts far."

This conversation reminds me of the boys down at the local tavern. They are jabbering about the big game coming up and one says he's thinking about getting a flat screen. Everybody else tries to convince him he doesn't need it as they have been perfectly satisfied for years with their sets. The $200+ rod is the ultra HD 4K screen where even the commercials are eye candy. Do you need one? Nope, but it certainly takes the entire experience to a new level of satisfaction.

TheGreatIndoors: "Thanks to MTs conviction (thanks! You go, gurl), and a handful of suppoters, I’ll spring for an 8’6” St.Croix avid salmon /steelhead rod. Pricey. Hardly justifiable, but probably the last time I’ll buy a rod of this kind unless my life turns upside down, for the better.


Although it will be wrong for the average canoe casting experience, I don’t need a third all around 6’6” rod. (I can also plan on casting for winter steelhead in northern MI.) I look forward to boating some big trout and pike and listening to the buzz of line peeling off my reel from camp. Thanks for the insites. May the ice melt on time.


"

Thinking of my experiences with this style rod and I thought I would pass them on a bit since you took an expensive plunge on my advice.

*You will be surprised at just how light of line you can fish with this style of rod and still put big fish in the boat. The long rod protects light line extremely well so why not take advantage of that? I routinely fish 4lb green XT on this rod provided there are no nasty weeds or timber around. Knots have to be 100% but thats another conversation. If I am not using the 4lb green XT and want something light but clear I will go with 6lb copolymer Gamma. The 4lb would be for casting slim bodied lures like an original rapala and the Gamma clear would be for live bait fishing.

*Trolling with the long rod is exceptional. When slapped in a rod holder the rod doesn't seem long at all. I do strongly suggest using a rod holder as due to the shock absorbing nature of this rod it needs be "loaded" rather precisely to be effective. But when done correctly the bent rod instantly transfers power to the hooks and fish are snatched quite effectively. What I mean by "loaded" is that the first half of the rod is already in an arc and its the rear stiff 1/2 which transmit the required power. This is achieved by angling the rod at about a 45 degree angle back towards the lure you are dragging. Fail to do this and you will not hook many fish as the flex in the rod will deprive you of the physics required to set hooks. Naturally your drag needs be correct regardless. I start out trolling with 8lb green XT while pulling deep diving crank baits like tail dancers. I do not tie to split rings but dispense with them altogether and instead use fas snaps. The double wire of the split ring makes for poor physics to tie the mono off to. The fas snap in medium or large is best. They look frail and tiny........I have never had one fail while using lighter lb tests. If fishing is difficult you can drop to 6lb and a crank bait. At that point you must insist on using the fas snap and ditching the split ring as knots must be 100% especially if you tend to troll fast as I do. I have caught lots of lakers and walleye on the 8lb test and the long rod. Several times I have had to drop to 6 to pop the walleye but with good results. No small trick to troll deep diving cranks on such light line and have big fish like walleye and pike hammer them hard and not get broke off. The long rod makes this a far more practical option as it absorbs much of the energy of the strike. Naturally your drag must be set correctly as well.

*You will find fishing slip bobbers a dream with this rod. One of the nice things is after casting out you can help feed the line through the bobber by holding the rod high in the air and creating a bit more of a direct connection from rod to bobber instead of having to have enough weight to "pull" the line off the water and through the bobber as per what a shorter rod would be required to do. So, you can typically use lighter weight and thus a slower drop. As per what Lundojam stated taking up excess line is also clearly superior as you move far more line on the upward hookset. I also find the long rod sets small, even tiny, hooks much better than shorter rods. Not sure why but it certainly seems that way.

*Here is a secret tip I will toss your way. Use a j-11 perch colored original rapala on 4lb green XT line. The lure "comes alive" on the sewing thread. You should be able to cast very far indeed with this set up provided your reel isn't overly small (small diameter spools equate to short casts). Now, heres the secret tip.........While your retrieving pretend like your beating eggs with a whisk in a bowl. Make 6" circles with the hand holding the rod. By the time the energy transfers out to the end of the rod the circles are over a foot, even 2 ft at the end of the rod. Reel slowly with the other hand all while gathering in the slack. This round whipping retrieve throws very fast and erratic jerks into the lure which fish cannot resist. A word of warning........one needs popeye forearms to execute this for very long. I used to do this for hours and hammer very large bass in shallow clear marshes on Lake St Clair in the spring before the weeds grew in. They were there to soak up the sun off the mud bottom in 3ft of water. Lots of big ones fell for this. Getting the Popeye forearms are the tricky part. I suggest watching the movie "The Mechanic" in which Charles Bronson plays a hit man. He was always squeezing a round ball.........I was inspired and was seldom without a hand grip of some type in my younger years. An exhausting technique but supremely effective if a fish sees it they will eat.

*Fighting fish with the long rod is lots of fun. I like the long forearm grip which not only aids in flinging your offering it also helps in fighting fish. Learn to lay it along your forearm and it becomes an extension of your arm. To truly learn how to fight big fish on light line I suggest you learn to back reel if you don't already use the method. You will always be the one in control if you master it. In the unlikely event a fish pulls you down faster than you can back reel and you fear getting broke off merely let go of the handle and let it twirl freely. It will not backlash....(Now I do it if I am just lazy and don't feel like back reeling with any concentration)...I have been put into the "let go or get busted off" situation maybe 4 or 5 times in 30 years of fishing this type of rod. When the fish slows, which will be quickly, just jump right back on the handle with max pressure. The long rod tends to pry fish up and off the bottom which is a good thing.

*Fishing from camp is also excellent with this rod. The back 1/2 of the rod is stiff enough to set larger J style hooks and toss larger dead baits a considerable distance if required. The rod will bend substantially and then catapult your offering out supremely well. Baits lying on the bottom do not need light line as the bottom camouflages the line nicely indeed. I would gravitate towards 12lb when fishing for lakers or pike on dead bait in the spring. Don't let your rod get pulled into the water!

Good luck.

Thanks, MT! I can't stop dreaming about it all. Headed up for the opener.

4/6/8 lb. seem pretty light while trolling for lakers. I'll try it for walleye to get a feeling.

Was planning on 20 lb. monofilament or fluorocarbon leader to braid for my laker trolling setup (for a couple reasons: I only have one spool, many users, etc. etc.). We'll be trolling some big water. I had a big hit break off last spring on a 15 lb. fluorocarbon leader. Probably my knot.

I'll be sure to let you know how it turns out.

TheGreatIndoors: "Thanks, MT! I can't stop dreaming about it all. Headed up for the opener.


4/6/8 lb. seem pretty light while trolling for lakers. I'll try it for walleye to get a feeling.


Was planning on 20 lb. monofilament or fluorocarbon leader to braid for my laker trolling setup (for a couple reasons: I only have one spool, many users, etc. etc.). We'll be trolling some big water. I had a big hit break off last spring on a 15 lb. fluorocarbon leader. Probably my knot.


I'll be sure to let you know how it turns out."

Yup you are correct.......4/6/8/ for lakers is to light. Reread the info several times and absorb it, it will serve you well. The lightest I will go with lakers is 8lb green trilene XT. You might as well move up a line class with whatever green XT states........4lb XT is like 6lb regular mono. My partner turned me onto the stuff after having nailed many large smallmouth in Sylvania on it. Despite being a stiffer line it casts exceptionally well in the lighter lb tests and is tough stuff. You cannot however, use it on smallish/tiny spinning reels due to its stiffness.......to really get the most out of it use larger diameter reels with a 2500 being the smallest I would go.

8lb green Trilene XT is more like 10lb regular mono........plenty strong enough to beat almost any fish in canoe country. And indeed my largest laker in a canoe, which scaled at a tad over 15lbs on a certified scale (many fisherman might have put that fish in the coveted 20 plus range if they didn't have a scale) was bested on 8lb green XT while I was walleye trolling. But even targeting lakers on Crank baits I typically reach for the green XT and have put quite a few in the 8lb class in the boat with the long rod. Not so very hard to accomplish.

There is no reason to lose a Laker on 15lb line or even 10lb for that matter. There may of been a number of circumstances which conspired against you. If you were using braid and had poor knots then lb test doesn't matter. 15 or even 20 is likely to part. If the line broke and you were using braid factor in carefully that braid doesn't stretch. The shock absorbing nature of straight mono has some significant inherent advantages. Less lines broken and less pulled hooks (hooks which get yanked out of a fishes mouth due to excessive force).

The only reason I would use 20lb fluorocarbon, and I do, is to match the line with the lure I am using. If you are using large heavy spoons for example they require heavier line. If I am using crank baits I drop to smaller lb tests as the heavy line would be counter productive by ruining their action and not helping any with the setting of small hooks.

I like using braid but only for certain situations. If I am trying to set larger hooks for example like large spoons.........If I am fishing deep water..........If I am fishing in heavy current.........if I am fishing in heavy cover. These are all good reasons to fish braid. Otherwise I typically reach for mono. Have a spool of the Trilene GREEN XT in 8lb test on hand. You can catch most anything that swims provided you are not trying to set large diameter hooks. Do not fish 10lb XT and do not use clear (which is anything but clear).

If you insist on fishing braid (part of the fun of fishing is doing things your own way ;-) then a few suggestions. On Utube go to the salt strong video which shows how to tie the FG knot. Learn it and use it. Make your leaders long, say 10ft. I do not use wimpy lb tests of braid either. I like 20 suffix 836 for that work. Any heavier and I go to Power Pro in 30 and up. As per tying the fluorocarbon that can be tricky as well. I use a tie fast tool which does wonders with FC. If your tie off point (what you are tying to) is equal or greater diameter than the line you are using then you can do no better than the gryp knot that the tie fast tool enables. Clearly superior as the loops circle the running line and the knot gets tighter as force is applied. The instructions are geared toward light lb tests as this is primarily a fly fishing tool. Disregard the instructions pertaining to the number of loops used. The heavier the line the less loops. Try 5 as opposed to 6 with 20lb. I use 4 with 50 and 3 loops with 60. You know you have it right when the tag end is straight up. Do not cinch FC quickly as you can create heat which burns your knot and damages it. Rather tighten FC in two steps........wet it and then gradually tighten about 3/4 of the way. Relax the knot and then cinch it done, again gradually. Avoid speedy motions except for popping the knot off the tool than a quick little snap gets the knot off the tool. I learned this from the very best snapper fishermen that I have ever seen. So tools for knots are not for the uninformed as per what I used to think.

But everything has its limitations.......the tie fast tool and the Gryp knot do poorly when tied to connection points which are a smaller diameter than the line. But in that instance a plethora of more widely used fishing knots excel. What is difficult, and what the Gryp knot does exceptionally well is tying to lures / hooks that have larger diameters than the line you are using.

If you are headed in for the opener what is your plan? What is your strategy? Are you going to fish dead bait from camp at all?

Since fish are going to be shallow I personally find the braid unnecassary and the 20lb leaders distinct overkill which may hamper your fish catching ability. The most sure way to do poorly in the north country is to use to heavy of line. Perhaps you need to start a thread describing what you are intending to do, include your time of year and let others chime in. There are many on the board who are far better suited to give you advice on spring lakers than I. My success has been very specific.......I go to the same place, the same time of year and do pretty well. But a laker guru I am not.

BTW.........the fish which broke the 15 how do you know it was a laker? Maybe it was a pike which nipped you. I have caught numerous pike, especially smaller ones in the 30" class, in open water down as deep as 65ft. Weird right?

carmike: "Just curious in hearing more of your thoughts, TylerW...what are the major advantages (other than shore fishing) for using an 8' (or longer) rod? "

Looks like they all got covered while I was away... I think everything I like about long rods was already stated once. But, since I was asked politely here are my reasons.

1. Casting distance, casting distance, casting distance
2. Slip bobbers force your line into a 90 deg angle. To set the hook you need to pick up all the slack and make the line tight before the fish drops the jig. A longer rod does that better.
3. Longer rods "cushion" your line while fighting fish. I fish braid exclusively, a longer rod more than compensates for the lack of stretch in the line. I have caught lake trout on a "light" 8'6" rod and never felt outgunned. The long backbone and flex mean you can handle larger fish on a light 8'6" rod than you can on a 6'6" rod.
4. Long handles. I also rest the long rear grip of the long rod against my forearm when reeling up or fighting heavy fish.
5. I am adding in shore fishing even though it wasn't part of the question. When you can fish effectively from shore you don't have "wasted" windblown or rainy days stuck in camp. You just have days when you fish by the camp fire.

I have one of those +$200 St. Croix 8' 6" rods and how do I love it. I bought that one because I used the first two 8'6" rods so much. My buddy turned me onto long rods crappie fishing. He anchored the boat and cast a light jig and a rocket bobber onto a weedbed. I grabbed my 7' rod and came up short... eventually he moved the boat because I couldn't cast far enough to catch anything. If you have a friendly rivalry with a fishing buddy, you can use the same trick to "win" a day of fishing.

These threads are funny...most of the rods I have are steelhead/ drift rods. I too advocate for longer rods. You can cast further and it has more backbone to handle a big lure or big fish but still have a fast tip so you don't feel like your fishing with a broom handle. For Slip floats you can pick up the slack line easier to set the hook. For jigging, well, I do have Psoriatic Arthritis but I can't imagine what it's like to get tired from a day of jigging. Jigging? LOL. I don't get tired from casting big lures all day so...I haven't used a short rod since the 90's when I watched my first European fishing video.