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Boundary Waters Quetico Forum Gear Forum Canoe or kayak paddle when solo? |
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03/07/2018 04:22PM
Different strokes for different folks, 'eh? Even when I paddled a decked canoe and a kayak, I preferred a single blade. My wife, she started with single blade and changed to a double blade. She carries a single only for emergencies, but she almost never uses a single blade.
Try both, see which you prefer. I just happen to prefer single.
Try both, see which you prefer. I just happen to prefer single.
"Let us live so that when we come to die even the undertaker will be sorry." Mark Twain
03/07/2018 04:53PM
I have used both but I personally prefer the Yak paddle in a solo canoe. I would take both. If on a windy lake you will be paddling on the same side and will want a single. If on a calm Lake you can out paddle a tandem canoe with a Yak paddle.
"So many lakes, so little time." WWJD
03/07/2018 06:44PM
boonie: "Both - need a spare anyway and both have different uses. It's nice to switch and use different stroke and muscles sometimes. Strap the spare to the thwarts. "
Well said boonie!
I paddle both solo canoes and kayaks and own both. For many years I fought the temptation of using a kayak paddle in a solo canoe. I was somewhat of a purist and felt that single-bladed canoe paddles are for canoes and double-bladed kayak paddles are for kayaks.
After a 2012 Quetico solo trip, I decided that using a kayak paddle on the big, long lakes of Quetico, the BWCAW, Woodland-Caribou, etc. would be more efficiently traveled using a kayak paddle. There's nothing like getting in a rhythm and paddling down the length of Quetico Lake, Sturgeon Lake, Pickerel Lake, Knife Lake, Saganaga Lake, etc. with a nice lightweight kayak paddle. This is especially true if you want to keep pace when your traveling with a group of other solo canoeists that are using kayak paddles.
I still prefer a bent shaft canoe paddle for the smaller lakes and for river navigation, but to each their own.
Hans Solo
Water reflects not only clouds and trees and cliffs, but all the infinite variations of mind and spirit we bring to it. – Sigurd Olson
03/07/2018 06:48PM
I bought a bending branches Slice at last Canoecopia and took it out in June and never used my canoe paddle. Love loved it. On a previous solo I had a yak paddle from outfitter - tried it once and used my canoe paddle rest of trip. So imho purely a matter of paddles.
03/07/2018 07:01PM
boonie: "Both - need a spare anyway and both have different uses. It's nice to switch and use different stroke and muscles sometimes. Strap the spare to the thwarts. "
I usually travel with the double but fish with the single. I bring them both. If you get a double make sure it's long enough. I'm 6 ft. and use a 260 cm.
"Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself." --- George Bernard Shaw
03/08/2018 09:23AM
billconner: "I bought a bending branches Slice at last Canoecopia and took it out in June and never used my canoe paddle. Love loved it. On a previous solo I had a yak paddle from outfitter - tried it once and used my canoe paddle rest of trip. So imho purely a matter of paddles."
I lied. Its a BB "Manta Ray Hybrid", not a Slice, and a close out at last years Canoecopia. 250 cm.
03/08/2018 02:47PM
Did my first solo last year with a new carbon graphite kayak paddle from Canoecopia and my trusty, old Bending Branches bent-shaft cruiser. I thought I would use the canoe paddle more, but on windy days and to make better time the yak paddle was much more efficient. I did find that the yak paddle was a pain to fish with and the canoe paddle was far handier for that activity. You need a spare anyways, so take one of each and see which one you use more often.
Happy paddling!
Happy paddling!
03/08/2018 02:52PM
I agree that both have their place, but suggest that if you are taking both, it is a good idea to train with both. I am fortunate enough to have water that is both ice and motor boat free year round. When training for my last solo, I considered taking my double blade as my back up and took it for a morning paddle, though I had not used it in some time. I was hurting the next day, and decided to stick with the single blade.
Just because you like the sound of your logic, does not mean your logic is sound
03/08/2018 04:27PM
billconner: "I bought a bending branches Slice at last Canoecopia and took it out in June and never used my canoe paddle. Love loved it. On a previous solo I had a yak paddle from outfitter - tried it once and used my canoe paddle rest of trip. So imho purely a matter of paddles."
Bill did you buy the telescoping Slice paddle?
03/09/2018 01:23AM
I started useing a yak paddle about 3-4 years ago with my solo, 260 cm BB slice. On my 21 day solo up in Ontario last fall I found my shoulders simply would not take it. Per my GPS I could cruise at least 1 full MPH faster with the yak paddle. Used my straight wood paddle for the rest of the trip without regrets, Hey I decided my paddleing style is a lot like me," built for comfort not speed". Did not like the yak paddle for fishing, continually in my way. One of our departed members used to say that "useing a yak paddle in a solo was an excuse for not learning proper canoe paddleing". FRED
Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked, the good fourtune to remember the ones do, and the eyesight to tell the differance.
03/09/2018 09:28AM
I use both single and double blade. The double blade is simply more efficient and when kneeling, better body dynamics. Of course, kneeling is better body dynamics all by itself, single or double blade.
I have tried to be a purist and only use a single blade. But the double blade just works so much better for lake paddling. And don't worry about that 'wind against the blade' argument, its a non-issue.
For lakes use the double blade. For small rivers/creeks or fishing, use the single blade.
The only issue I have with a double-blade is you get more drips into the boat even using the cups. I use a 260 and should probably use a 280 to avoid the drips. But who makes a graphite/glass 280 double-blade that is not crazy expensive? I need to get Dan Cooke to make me a little shorty skirt for up front to catch the drips...
I have tried to be a purist and only use a single blade. But the double blade just works so much better for lake paddling. And don't worry about that 'wind against the blade' argument, its a non-issue.
For lakes use the double blade. For small rivers/creeks or fishing, use the single blade.
The only issue I have with a double-blade is you get more drips into the boat even using the cups. I use a 260 and should probably use a 280 to avoid the drips. But who makes a graphite/glass 280 double-blade that is not crazy expensive? I need to get Dan Cooke to make me a little shorty skirt for up front to catch the drips...
03/10/2018 05:15PM
A double blade is faster if your cadence with a double blade is faster. A single bent shaft (when seated) is more efficient. If you paddle at the same cadence with each type of paddle the bent will move you faster (providing wetted surface areas are equivalent). When used properly a greater proportion of the energy expended in the stroke of a bent shaft is used to move you forward- because the double bladed paddle stroke is farther from the center of the boat a greater portion of the energy of each stroke moves the bow away from the side of the stroke than in a bent. This side to side motion (yaw) is an inevitable function of the blade being a greater distance from the center line of the boat
Nobody exists on purpose, nobody belongs anywhere, everybody’s going to die.
03/13/2018 06:47AM
Both, But on this last trip entirely on the Gulf of Mexico I never picked up the single.
The wind was up every day and with the short steep chop and motorboat wakes ( waves 2 feet; not quite head high) I preferred the instant brace a double allows.
It was tidal too with a 2 mph current.. Seems always to be against us. Yet we did 16 miles in 5 hours. Each in a solo.
Try and see what you like. I vastly prefer the single and the rhythm and the versatility of the single but on the ocean it seems not to have so much of a role. Of course if it were calm things would have been different
If you sit high a 240 may be too short.. I am short torsoed and the 240 is perfect for me.
The wind was up every day and with the short steep chop and motorboat wakes ( waves 2 feet; not quite head high) I preferred the instant brace a double allows.
It was tidal too with a 2 mph current.. Seems always to be against us. Yet we did 16 miles in 5 hours. Each in a solo.
Try and see what you like. I vastly prefer the single and the rhythm and the versatility of the single but on the ocean it seems not to have so much of a role. Of course if it were calm things would have been different
If you sit high a 240 may be too short.. I am short torsoed and the 240 is perfect for me.
03/13/2018 03:09PM
Banksiana: "A double blade is faster if your cadence with a double blade is faster. A single bent shaft (when seated) is more efficient. If you paddle at the same cadence with each type of paddle the bent will move you faster (providing wetted surface areas are equivalent). When used properly a greater proportion of the energy expended in the stroke of a bent shaft is used to move you forward- because the double bladed paddle stroke is farther from the center of the boat a greater portion of the energy of each stroke moves the bow away from the side of the stroke than in a bent. This side to side motion (yaw) is an inevitable function of the blade being a greater distance from the center line of the boat"
What he said! And besides tried an evil double and hated it, then again, it's a personal choice.
butthead
"never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups" George Carlin
03/13/2018 05:23PM
butthead: "Banksiana: "A double blade is faster if your cadence with a double blade is faster. A single bent shaft (when seated) is more efficient. If you paddle at the same cadence with each type of paddle the bent will move you faster (providing wetted surface areas are equivalent). When used properly a greater proportion of the energy expended in the stroke of a bent shaft is used to move you forward- because the double bladed paddle stroke is farther from the center of the boat a greater portion of the energy of each stroke moves the bow away from the side of the stroke than in a bent. This side to side motion (yaw) is an inevitable function of the blade being a greater distance from the center line of the boat"
What he said! And besides tried an evil double and hated it, then again, it's a personal choice.
butthead"
+1.....no yak paddles in my canoe. 50% on what Banks said, 25% stubborn purist and I don't like them, 25% I'm a strong paddler.
"What could happen?"
03/17/2018 06:43AM
Personal choice and experience are at the heart of this. I began paddling canoes in the 1970's and got very proficient with the single blade. I had a period of no paddling and got a kayak in the mid 90"s as I had no one to go with and did not know about solo canoes. I got proficient with the double blade and when I picked up a solo canoe going back to the single blade just did not work. I carry both when I trip as each has its benefits and I am getting comfortable with the single blade again, but still prefer the double. I use a 240 Werner Corryvrecken. Huge blades and shorter shaft means I work hard and will get wet, but I love the torque that paddle can give me. Most would not like it, again choice.
03/17/2018 07:30AM
I am a fan of a double blade and familiar with some strokes of a single blade. Doubles are a great help to my aging back--> Footbrace + dbI. blade gives me a definite edge on choppy waters/balance/bursts of speed. I use an adjustable length Cannon 2-piece. 250-260 cm for the Prism. Shorter adjust for other yaks & canoes in my 'collection'. Pack a single paddle for tight & narrow spots. I store the single blade strapped to glued-in D rings on the upper left side of canoe. Don't ever need to remove it on portages.
“If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.” Sir Isaac Newton
03/18/2018 05:48AM
TomT: "boonie: "Both - need a spare anyway and both have different uses. It's nice to switch and use different stroke and muscles sometimes. Strap the spare to the thwarts. "
I usually travel with the double but fish with the single. I bring them both. If you get a double make sure it's long enough. I'm 6 ft. and use a 260 cm. "
tom did you try the 280cm? are the drips minimal with the 260? what is your yak paddle? thanks.
03/18/2018 08:19AM
bwcasolo-
My experience:
I have used one of the really long double blades once on a rental. You can minimize water in the boat with it, but the disadvantages are that you have a lot of paddle and the more horizontal stroke acts more like a sweep stroke than a forward stroke. It moves the canoe more back and forth vs. powering it forward; on a calm day it's not as much of a problem with a slow easy cadence, but is more problematic on a windy day. Of course, you have a lot more paddling to hold up and swing against the wind. It wasn't for me, but YMMV. I'd give one a try before spending a lot on a purchase.
My experience:
I have used one of the really long double blades once on a rental. You can minimize water in the boat with it, but the disadvantages are that you have a lot of paddle and the more horizontal stroke acts more like a sweep stroke than a forward stroke. It moves the canoe more back and forth vs. powering it forward; on a calm day it's not as much of a problem with a slow easy cadence, but is more problematic on a windy day. Of course, you have a lot more paddling to hold up and swing against the wind. It wasn't for me, but YMMV. I'd give one a try before spending a lot on a purchase.
03/18/2018 09:35AM
Greenland paddles are long and have narrow blades, but require a style of paddling requiring short rapid stokes. I have suspected the longer the shaft the shorter the stroke would have to be to avoid pulling side to side. I ended up with the 240 because the blade fits well into the water without the drip cup joining when I sit in the seat of my Magic. I mostly high angle paddle anyway.
I think about paddles like I think about shoes. Not every shoe is right for any one situation nor all users. If it fits and works well comfortably for you it is right for you. Do try on a few before you spend money.
I think about paddles like I think about shoes. Not every shoe is right for any one situation nor all users. If it fits and works well comfortably for you it is right for you. Do try on a few before you spend money.
03/18/2018 10:44AM
Only paddle canoes; only use canoe paddles, only paddle rivers.
Always carry 2 canoe paddles; one is nearly always a "beater" that I change over
to if/when the river shallows out. Never failed to get where I was going.........
It is my personal opinion that a fairly high % of canoe paddlers using a kayak paddle do so because it's "easier". Often they don't have the necessary paddling skills to use a single blade paddle full time.
Bottom line: I don't really give a hoot what paddle anyone uses.
If it works for you; go for it!
BOB
Always carry 2 canoe paddles; one is nearly always a "beater" that I change over
to if/when the river shallows out. Never failed to get where I was going.........
It is my personal opinion that a fairly high % of canoe paddlers using a kayak paddle do so because it's "easier". Often they don't have the necessary paddling skills to use a single blade paddle full time.
Bottom line: I don't really give a hoot what paddle anyone uses.
If it works for you; go for it!
BOB
03/18/2018 01:44PM
boonie: "bwcasolo-
My experience:
I have used one of the really long double blades once on a rental. You can minimize water in the boat with it, but the disadvantages are that you have a lot of paddle and the more horizontal stroke acts more like a sweep stroke than a forward stroke. It moves the canoe more back and forth vs. powering it forward; on a calm day it's not as much of a problem with a slow easy cadence, but is more problematic on a windy day. Of course, you have a lot more paddling to hold up and swing against the wind. It wasn't for me, but YMMV. I'd give one a try before spending a lot on a purchase. "
yea that sounds like something i would not enjoy, being a good bent shaft paddler as i am. thanks for the advice!
03/18/2018 08:51PM
I am a fan of the canoe paddle but the few times that I have used kayak paddle I did feel more comfortable with maintaining a straight line. It just feels easier to keep the boat straight. I guess I use the canoe paddle for the nostalgic feel only.
"To those devoid of imagination a blank place on the map is a useless waste; to others, the most valuable part" -Aldo Leopold
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