I am having a difficult time finding a canoe around where I live that is good enough for the BWCA. I live in Lake Ozark Missouri. I need a tandem canoe 16-17 foot. My boyfriend and 2 dogs will be in the canoe. I am going to be in the BWCA and want a good reliable canoe that doesn’t weigh a million pounds. I will be in BWCA canoeing for at least 30 days. I have found a few canoes in ELY. I wanted to buy it here instead of driving 12 hours to Ely. But currently it looks like I will go to Ely to get a canoe. Ok so I found a few. What do you guys think?

17ft Grumman canoe

16’ 11 inch Buffalo Royalex canoe

16’9 North fork

16’9 Discovery 169

Osage canoe

16’ Bell Morningstar

17’ Wenonah Boundary Water 2016 Kevlar

17’ Wenonah Boundary Water 2015 Kevlar.

Finding suitable used canoes for the BWCAW here in MO is tough. Most of our paddling is rocky streams, which lends itself to roylex and polyethylene. Heavier and rounded stems; not the best hull for paddling lakes.

Expand your scope to Wisconsin and Minnesota. You will be going in that direction anyway. Chicago and DesMoines Craigslists are possibilities and you can find the occasional lake canoe in KC area.

I own a Morningstar, it's actually 15'6". Not enough volume for your load unless day tripping sans packs.

Grumman, heavy, hot in the sun, cold when it's cold. Noisy as hell. But it used to be the "Standard" and many people have tripped in them, including friends and me.

Kevlar Wenonah Boundary Waters may have the volume you need plus added stability. If you're not an experienced paddler, the addition of canines may make things "Iffy?" Dogs move around and with a heavily loaded canoe with little freeboard you could end up in the drink!

You'll want at least 17 ft with the dogs, boyfriend, and gear. 30 days all at once? If so you''ll want a high volume tripping canoe.

I don't know your budget and don't know the size of you, your boyfriend, or the 2 dogs, but . . . I'd wonder if even the 17' Wenonah Boundary Waters will be big enough for you, your boyfriend, 2 dogs, gear, and food for 30 days for 2 people and 2 dogs . . . or even for 15 days if you resupply half way. Besides just the weight, you'll need to consider the volume.

Do you have an idea yet how many packs you'll have to put in the canoe to hold all the gear? You could take the packs with you to look at some canoes just to get an idea.

boonie: "I don't know your budget and don't know the size of you, your boyfriend, or the 2 dogs, but . . . I'd wonder if even the 17' Wenonah Boundary Waters will be big enough for you, your boyfriend, 2 dogs, gear, and food for 30 days for 2 people and 2 dogs . . . or even for 15 days if you resupply half way. Besides just the weight, you'll need to consider the volume.
Do you have an idea yet how many packs you'll have to put in the canoe to hold all the gear? You could take the packs with you to look at some canoes just to get an idea.
"

I think there are a few 17' canoes that would handle the load (like Nova Craft Prospector) but I concur that 18' would be better for two paddlers, two dogs, and 4-6 packs. 30 days will probably require 2-3 food packs since you will also need dog food?

Where did you find 2 Wenonah Boundary Waters? I have been searching for months for one. I am buying a used rental from an outfitter up in MN at the end of this season.

That is a great canoe. One of the most stable that Wenonah makes. I call it a high performance tank. It is surprisingly easy to to maneuver, I think it is pretty efficient to paddle. I think that it can handle the weight, but I too worry about the bulk. It's rare in that it doesn't have a thwart behind the bow seat so you can actually paddle it backwards as a solo. It can hold 3 large packs. You could possibly get a dog in front of the bow paddler and one in front of the stern paddler but you don't mention their size.

Depending on budget and the precise nature of your plans for the trip, I wouldn't automatically discount an aluminum or fiberglass canoe. They can be very cheap and nearly bulletproof. Since you plan to have 30 days, you also might not be planning on not moving everyday...or at least not being in a hurry. If you're not in a hurry, don't mind carrying a little more weight on the portages, want to save some $$, and don't mind paddling 1 mph slower, they might be worth looking into. Just my .02.

Northwoodsman: "Where did you find 2 Wenonah Boundary Waters? I have been searching for months for one. I am buying a used rental from an outfitter up in MN at the end of this season.


That is a great canoe. One of the most stable that Wenonah makes. I call it a high performance tank. It is surprisingly easy to to maneuver, I think it is pretty efficient to paddle. I think that it can handle the weight, but I too worry about the bulk. It's rare in that it doesn't have a thwart behind the bow seat so you can actually paddle it backwards as a solo. It can hold 3 large packs. You could possibly get a dog in front of the bow paddler and one in front of the stern paddler but you don't mention their size."

I found the Wenonah boundary waters canoes at Canadian Waters in Ely. https://www.canadianwaters.com/canoe-trip-gear/used-gear-for-sale/used-canoes/#.WqPmSiJMGEc

Man, I really think you'll want at least an 18 If not larger. The dogs, dog food and 30 days of food seems impossible in a 17.

I agree. I can't imagine that much people/dogs/gear in a canoe less than 18' long. A month long trip is quite the expedition and will require careful planning and preparation. I would work out the pack requirements well in advance and purchase or rent the appropriate canoe based on that.

unshavenman: "I agree. I can't imagine that much people/dogs/gear in a canoe less than 18' long. A month long trip is quite the expedition and will require careful planning and preparation. I would work out the pack requirements well in advance and purchase or rent the appropriate canoe based on that."

yep

The more I watch this thread the stronger my conviction that you need to resupply on this endeavor. If you can't find a suitable large canoe that you can afford at this time and absolutely can't wait to do the 30 day trip until you find an appropriate canoe than resupply is the answer. The Wenonah Boundary Water would be a great canoe for 15 day trip. but I think that unless your outfit is really ultralight, this will be the limit of comfort and safety.

I don't think it would be difficult to get two permits that fit a moderate travel itinerary. You could even do two 15 day loops from the same entry. Come out after the first loop and do laundary, have some ice cream, enjoy a day in town while you resupply. Then out for another 15 day loop.

I would also suggest that while you are up there rent a Souris River Quetico 18.5(or other equally large canoe) for a day and put your outfit and dogs in it and go for a day trip. It will be enlightening.

I'd take a Wenonah Itasca or a MN II or a Northstar Northwoods. Something at least 18.5 feet long. With 2 dogs and human AND dog food for a month you'll need some capacity.

mr.barley: "I'd take a Wenonah Itasca or a MN II or a Northstar Northwoods. Something at least 18.5 feet long. With 2 dogs and human AND dog food for a month you'll need some capacity."

That would be fairly safe too. If you have to go to a 17 footer I think for safety you would have to resupply. Maybe even twice. 10 days are my usual time frame and I'm usually ready to come out.

Here's an idea if you have to settle on a 17 footer. Put in on Moose Lake and take the border route east fo 10 day to one of the outfitters near an entry point. Go ahead and reserve the 2nd permit for when you get your resupply which you can mail to the outfitter.

Ok, 2nd leg make your way west and south through the interior for 10 days to Sawbill Outfitters. Same deal, have a new permit ready to go and mail your resupply to them. Then you head back to your start on Moose Lake going north and east through beautiful lakes like Adams and Boulder. Lot's of route options if you have a good resource book like Pauley or Beymer.

This is the way I would do it. You may have your heart set on no resupply but IMO it will be dangerous with that kind of load in a 17 foot boat. Even an 18 footer with the 2 dogs. The dogs and their food are what creating the space problem. Two resupplys solves that issue. Best of luck and please write up a trip report for us. Very few people ever attempt what you are doing.

sedges: "The more I watch this thread the stronger my conviction that you need to resupply on this endeavor. If you can't find a suitable large canoe that you can afford at this time and absolutely can't wait to do the 30 day trip until you find an appropriate canoe than resupply is the answer. The Wenonah Boundary Water would be a great canoe for 15 day trip. but I think that unless your outfit is really ultralight, this will be the limit of comfort and safety.


I don't think it would be difficult to get two permits that fit a moderate travel itinerary. You could even do two 15 day loops from the same entry. Come out after the first loop and do laundary, have some ice cream, enjoy a day in town while you resupply. Then out for another 15 day loop.


I would also suggest that while you are up there rent a Souris River Quetico 18.5(or other equally large canoe) for a day and put your outfit and dogs in it and go for a day trip. It will be enlightening."

Really good idea. I've never had a problem finding a last minute mid week permit on the Gunflint when I've changed my mind or plans. Get a permit for the first leg, come out, re-supply, then see what's available and do leg #2. Better yet, try a 15 day trip in two different areas, like out of Ely AND Grand Marais?

This would make the 17' SOuris River or Wenonah Boundary Waters possible I believe? Better yet look for a Wenonah Champlain or a Souris Quetico 18.

You might try this outfitter that sells used canoes out of Ely:

https://www.piragis.com/canoes-for-sale/used-canoes-and-kayaks

They still have some used 2017 season rental Kevlar canoes for sale, including an Itasca, which is probably the order of magnitude needed for a 30 day trip.

They will send you pictures of the canoe if you ask for them, and will deliver to your front door from Ely. They delivered to my house in the Chicago area for $100.

This might be an option in Olatha, KS.
20' Kevlar Canoe $850

It doesn't list the make/model, but it might be worth checking out. Actually, it is only $800, not $850. It was just listed Tuesday evening.

Edit: Looks like it has sold.

DownStrm: "This might be an option in Olatha, KS.
20' Kevlar Canoe $850


It doesn't list the make/model, but it might be worth checking out. Actually, it is only $800, not $850. It was just listed Tuesday evening. "

No way! You can see in the photos how round the bottom is. It is likely to be fast, but uncomfortably twitchy especially with dogs.

DownStrm: "This might be an option in Olatha, KS.
20' Kevlar Canoe $850


It doesn't list the make/model, but it might be worth checking out. Actually, it is only $800, not $850. It was just listed Tuesday evening. "

Kinda looks like the Sawyer Cruiser? But it was only 18'6" I wonder how the seller measured it?

If so, the Cruiser IS only 33"+ beam and DOES have a rounded bottom but it settles down with a load. BUT, the "Dog" factor. IMHO, I personally wouldn't paddle a boat like that with one dog, unless it was small. TWO dogs, no way.

Sedges and Ozark,
Thanks for pointing out the issues. I knew someone on here would have good advice for her. I just saw that it was located fairly close to them.

Wenonah Spirit II 17' Tandem Canoe w/ Cooke Custom Sewing Spray Deck
$1,500
Kansas City, KS
This canoe has completed the MR340 and half the Yukon River Quest (not an equipment failure, more people/motor failure). This canoe is stable even when lightly loaded. This is a great boat but my wife prefers kayaking to canoeing so I'm converting as well! The Cooke Custom Sewing spray deck is custom fitted to the boat and it comes in handy on windy days and wilderness adventures and is held on by snaps. The hull is Tuf-weave which is light and sturdy. Contact me if you are interested.
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Paul Spackler, Kimlien Dinh, Eddie Crocker and 4 others like this.

Sorry I haven’t been on here in a few days!! Thank you everyone for all the advice. We are definitely going to resupply in 2 weeks. We just figured out tonight our food weight which really isn’t that bad anymore. Which I’m so happy about. We ended up going with pre made meals an repackaged them. The dog food will be 8 pounds and it makes 32 pounds of food. My dogs are small one is 20 pounds the other is 47. I have cut half the weight I was expecting to take. I do want to get a 17 foot canoe it’s better for us because it will be strapped to the car. We have looked at a few but nothing spectacular so we are still looking. We have 2 months till we leave. We are going to do a practice run with everything we are taking for BWCA in a month and see how it goes we are going to do 130 mile canoe trip. So far I have 2 and a half bags and 2 sleeping mats on the outside of the bags. (The half bag is a daily bag with emergency supply’s in it)

Do you have other reasons for insisting on a 17 footer? You needn't justify your choice to me or anyone else of course, but if you're basing it on transport method an 18' foot canoe will be perfectly fine on your car provided you secure it properly. A 17' boat will require the same number and style of tie downs as an 18.

Our car is a small car it’s about 15ft I believe so we didn’t want to have the canoe hang over the car so much. We also have to drive about 12.5 hours to Ely with the canoe on the roof.

Stephmed: "Our car is a small car it’s about 15ft I believe so we didn’t want to have the canoe hang over the car so much. We also have to drive about 12.5 hours to Ely with the canoe on the roof. "

I took a Jensen 18 on a top of a Toyota Corolla from Chicago to Grand Marias and back with no problem. 17 or 18 feet will be the same on the car. Don't over think it.

Blatz: "

Stephmed: "Our car is a small car it’s about 15ft I believe so we didn’t want to have the canoe hang over the car so much. We also have to drive about 12.5 hours to Ely with the canoe on the roof. "

I took a Jensen 18 on a top of a Toyota Corolla from Chicago to Grand Marias and back with no problem. 17 or 18 feet will be the same on the car. Don't over think it."

Right. Thank you Blatz. I could have stated it much better, Steph, but there's no difference between a 17' and 18' boat with regard to transport. If that's your only reason for going with a 17' your approach is misguided.

Stephmed: "Our car is a small car it’s about 15ft I believe so we didn’t want to have the canoe hang over the car so much. We also have to drive about 12.5 hours to Ely with the canoe on the roof. "

I think that you will find that most canoes overhang most cars by at least a few feet. This shouldn't be an issue for you.

I remember a trip with two canoes on top of a Toyota Matrix...from East TN to ely. Canoes were fine. Things only got hairy when the AC died.
With a 15 ft car, you should be fine.

Blatz: "

Stephmed: "Our car is a small car it’s about 15ft I believe so we didn’t want to have the canoe hang over the car so much. We also have to drive about 12.5 hours to Ely with the canoe on the roof. "

I took a Jensen 18 on a top of a Toyota Corolla from Chicago to Grand Marias and back with no problem. 17 or 18 feet will be the same on the car. Don't over think it."

The guy I bought my 17' NC Haida from transported it from the St. Louis area all the way to the Milwaukee area on top of a Hyundai Accent or some-such econobox car.