Westernmost campsite on Stuart lake... I dare you to outdo us!

Someone left us a decent amount of tinder and we had some time while the wind was blowing.

South arm of Knife. Next occupants had to be happy.

FishonFishoff

I usually pay it forward with a small stash of split logs and some tinder to get a small fire started in case of a rainy arrival or emergency. I believe this idea should be promoted and is well within the leave no trace rules, but I'm not so sure that a large stack of 5"- 6" diameter unsplit logs would fall within the same leave no trace rules.

Also, a 6" diameter log that isn't split requires a pretty large and hot fire to get started, especially when it is wet and raining. Personally, I'd prefer to arrive at a campsite with a small stash of tinder and a few small split logs that are less than 3" in diameter. Just my opinion.

We always carry an axe with us so a good portion of that would be split and stacked when we left. The hard part (sawing the logs) has already been done. That pile represents a lot of cookfires for those of us who cook over wood every day.

Nice! We didn't split it all because it would have looked ridiculous. Yours is better wood than pine for cooking as well.

-Duluth I pretty much agree but the tree was down over a main part of camp.

I left a few larger rounds recently for the same reason. A tree was fell across the trail to the loo. Looked like the FS dropped it to the ground which was better than waist high where it started. I decided to just clear it from the trail and left a few rounds near the grate. But it was too large for me to split.

For those who can split the wood on site... isn't it better to have wood like this than already split? In the event of soaking rains, you would be able to split this to get to dry wood and have fire success?

520eek: "For those who can split the wood on site... isn't it better to have wood like this than already split? In the event of soaking rains, you would be able to split this to get to dry wood and have fire success?"

I would say yes. Once split, it would absorb a lot of water and become kind of punky pretty fast. Not sure how long the logs are, but anything over a foot gets harder without a regular splitting maul.

At home, I have the ability to split about anything. Out there, I struggle splitting anything too long. The other thing about the sawed logs is that it can season or dry better than if left unsawed, so good efforts.

I wonder how many people are going to have the means of splitting that wood. I bring a small hatchet for splitting wood but don't usually tackle wood that size. Without splitting its more or less unusable under the fire grate.

I do try to leave a stash of wood for the next person but I also try to leave it in a very clean pile without a bunch of the debris littering the site. Maybe its just me but I like a clean camp and really don't like when people process firewood and then leave all the debris scattered all around the fire grate area or just leave a bunch of sticks laying all over the place. Usually half of those sticks are wet or rotten so they are useless. I usually spend a few minutes at every camp cleaning up debris. I don't really get upset about it because I realize its probably more my issue but still.

For reference here is what my wood piles usually look like. Similar piles are usually left for the next person.



The loose stuff laying around those piles is what bugs me. Anything like that gets cleaned up if its too wet or rotten to add to the pile. Always find a lot of that laying around campsites when I first pull up.

dhfish: "Westernmost campsite on Stuart lake... I dare you to outdo us!

Someone left us a decent amount of tinder and we had some time while the wind was blowing."

Ha! We wondered who went to that much effort to pay it forward. We stayed on that site on July 2. At first, I couldn't tell what it was from a distance but once I realized I was shocked. Unfortunately, this was coincidentally the same day I lost my axe on one of the portages so we didn't get to enjoy any of it... A bit too big to batton. Hopefully, the next person did. Kudos to you!

nctry: "

520eek: "For those who can split the wood on site... isn't it better to have wood like this than already split? In the event of soaking rains, you would be able to split this to get to dry wood and have fire success?"

I would say yes. Once split, it would absorb a lot of water and become kind of punky pretty fast. Not sure how long the logs are, but anything over a foot gets harder without a regular splitting maul.

At home, I have the ability to split about anything. Out there, I struggle splitting anything too long. The other thing about the sawed logs is that it can season or dry better than if left unsawed, so good efforts."

Can’t imagine if I split those logs in July that they would be stacked and left long enough for the wood to be punky. We have a lot of small bonfires in the back yard in the fall on those nice cool northern Michigan nights, and the wood is all split and stacked in the spring. By fall the wood is dry and hard and burns great.

fishonfishoff: "South arm of Knife. Next occupants had to be happy.

FishonFishoff"

Though as an experienced "heat my house with wood for twenty years" guy- birch don't burn well unless it is cut, split and sets for a month or two.

I like burning drift. Like setting flame to busted art.

DuluthPak: "I usually pay it forward with a small stash of split logs and some tinder to get a small fire started in case of a rainy arrival or emergency. I believe this idea should be promoted and is well within the leave no trace rules, but I'm not so sure that a large stack of 5"- 6" diameter unsplit logs would fall within the same leave no trace rules.

Also, a 6" diameter log that isn't split requires a pretty large and hot fire to get started, especially when it is wet and raining. Personally, I'd prefer to arrive at a campsite with a small stash of tinder and a few small split logs that are less than 3" in diameter. Just my opinion."

Really? You would complain about this and not just be happy that someone tried to do you favor?!

Make mine cedar.

Saberboys: "

DuluthPak: "I usually pay it forward with a small stash of split logs and some tinder to get a small fire started in case of a rainy arrival or emergency. I believe this idea should be promoted and is well within the leave no trace rules, but I'm not so sure that a large stack of 5"- 6" diameter unsplit logs would fall within the same leave no trace rules.


Also, a 6" diameter log that isn't split requires a pretty large and hot fire to get started, especially when it is wet and raining. Personally, I'd prefer to arrive at a campsite with a small stash of tinder and a few small split logs that are less than 3" in diameter. Just my opinion."

Really? You would complain about this and not just be happy that someone tried to do you favor?!


"

I'm just stating that a huge stack of 6" to 7" diameter logs that aren't split are not doing the majority of BWCA travelers without an axe any favors. Firstly, that size log is almost not burnable within the confines of the fire grate unless it is split. Secondly, that size log wouldn't fit under the fire grate for a small campfire as the Forest Service requires. Thirdly, the leave no trace video specifically states to gather "wrist sized logs or smaller well away from camp and away from the waters edge" which wasn't done in this case.

Personally i don't see a problem with leaving some dead fall where it fell as long as it is not directly on a tent pad or hindering movement around the camp trails. Is it that big of a deal to step over a tree trunk on the hike to the throne?

All I was saying is that THE accepted practice is to leave a few wrist sized logs and maybe some small tinder for the next traveler. Preferably firewood that is gathered away from camp that would be sufficient for a small fire within the fire grate. Maybe a contest to see who can stack the largest pile of huge logs at a campsite is a bit excessive.

So yes, while I do appreciate the thought, maybe I was complaining.

This is absolutely NOT leave no trace and is highly inappropriate.

The people before us left enough wood for 2 days. We were going to return the favor but the ax handle broke. We did leave enough for an evening fire.

I put a penny in the dish at the minimart. Does that count?


;)

Tolerance is good. The big blowdown which was in the way is no longer an obstruction and was probably an eyesore. That was a significant amount of effort with the intention of benefiting others, it is to be applauded.

That pile will be used eventually.

My first "real" canoe trip in the Quetico was the Hunters island loop. I did not know enough to understand that it was a bit ambitious for a newbie canoeist. I was frequently pleased to find cut and split stacks at numerous sites. I had neither saw nor hatchet on the trip and I found the little fires in the evening pleasant.

I now try and process enough wood for a simple fire if I have time and will always be grateful to those who did so for me.

Imagine the horror of pulling up to a campsite only to see a pile of firewood not stacked or processed in the way you approve of. Inconsiderate dolts! To ruin your day by not doing it the way you deem proper! I can't believe what some people can find to bitch about. If my outdoor experience was that fragile I'd stay home.

I always try to leave enough wood for an evening/morning fire under the assumption that whomever arrives next will have enough to do just setting up camp and will appreciate the gesture.

~M

We left a very large stack of one foot perfect size wood when we left our base camp on North Bay of Basswood lake. A newbe was bored out of his mind and spent his time for 3 days creating our masterpiece. Good result for the next campers for a while, but wrong intentions, I think. He never returned to "Boston" as the Kingston Trio could say.

K52: " Imagine the horror of pulling up to a campsite only to see a pile of firewood not stacked or processed in the way you approve of. Inconsiderate dolts! To ruin your day by not doing it the way you deem proper! "

Agree! Just proves that one person may pull up to the campsite and bless you and the next may curse you.... just can't make everyone happy.

mmarksnp: "This is absolutely NOT leave no trace and is highly inappropriate."

Lighten up, Francis.

Each of you that love to cut & split wood are welcome at my place. I’ve got to lay up a supply for winter. Post here to let me know when you’re coming. Thanks.

mmarksnp: "This is absolutely NOT leave no trace and is highly inappropriate.
"

??? Well, I guess I'm just an "Inappropriate" jerk, then? We always do. On my first trip I was taught by a former guide to leave a stash of "Courtesy wood" in case the next campers need a quick fire. One time a canoe in our group dumped and we were pretty fortunate some "Inappropriate" group left some courtesy wood! I doubt our friends would have died of hypothermia, but it was certainly nice to be able to warm them up so quickly!

ozarkpaddler: "
??? Well, I guess I'm just an "Inappropriate" jerk, then? We always do. On my first trip I was taught by a former guide to leave a stash of "Courtesy wood" in case the next campers need a quick fire. One time a canoe in our group dumped and we were pretty fortunate some "Inappropriate" group left some courtesy wood! I doubt our friends would have died of hypothermia, but it was certainly nice to be able to warm them up so quickly!"

I read the entire thread and I didn't see anyone call anyone a "jerk". So that's on you.

I don't think this debate was ever about whether or not to leave some courtesy firewood. I think most everyone believes that a small stash of "wrist sized" (Forestry Service guidelines) for the next traveler is most definately an accepted practice. I think the debate here was surrounding the size of the logs and the number of logs.

As it turns out, dhfish said a downed tree was blocking a main area of camp and that clearing the log and cutting it up was necessary. Fine. I accept that. Someone with an axe will eventually come along and split those logs into a more manageable size.

Many newbies visit this site for tips prior to their first trip. A large stack of wood like the one featured here may lead a newbie to misconstrue the definition of a "courtesy wood" supply. So I would just like to summarize that most experienced wilderness travelers would consider the definition of "courtesy wood" as enough wrist sized logs for one small campfire.

Good discussion

I would be grateful for any fire wood left at a camp site whether large or small.

Does giving your fishing pole away at the end of each trip count as paying it forward?

When I land at a campsite after a hard day's paddle and find a neatly stacked pile of firewood it just makes me feel good about humanity. Thank you all who do so, even though we can't thank you personally. You make a difference!

Dave

My philosophy has always been to leave enough wood for an emergency fire in case someone arrives at the site and it is very cold or they are wet and cold from rain or tipping. That requires some kindling, maybe a couple of bigger pieces once the kindling is going and some protected birch bark as a starter.

When I started going almost 50 years ago that is how I was taught by those who went before me-wood was placed as an emergency supply for the next paddler and not as a competition to see who could leave the most wood.

I usually leave just enough wood to get a small fire going. I rarely find any usable wood that is left for a fire. Large birch logs are rarely dry enough to burn, which is what I see a lot of. I’d prefer a nice clean campsite as a way of paying it forward. I don’t mind taking a little time to find sticks for a fire, especially if I have kids along.

mmarksnp: "This is absolutely NOT leave no trace and is highly inappropriate.
"

Here is where we disagree. Leave no trace was a principal invented in the last few years. Leaving a pile of firewood in a wilderness for the next group has been around for hundreds of years. LNT is for a place in the wilderness that not developed. A campsite is a developed manmade area, fire grate, latrine, tent pads, canoe landing.

Haha I don't do that much but I usually leave something like this

Like x2 I usually leave enou8gh for one fire.
It is really great to arrive in the rain and then not have to run around getting firewood.

dhfish: "Westernmost campsite on Stuart lake... I dare you to outdo us!

Someone left us a decent amount of tinder and we had some time while the wind was blowing."

That was extremely nice of you !!!

I havent come back to this thread for a few years since it wasnt meant to be as controversial as it got. That was my fault for the title probably. We left it unsplit so that it would dry not rot, and i cant believe someone found my post after being there! I wish you had that Axe, and hope the next group did. dhfish

Not trying to restart this thread but would like to point out something I learned from Uncle Phil of the Wabakimi Project about leaving firewood for the next occupants of a campsite. For nearly 10 yrs I traveled with Uncle Phil and he usually had us prepare firewood to leave at campsites. He always had us remove the bark stating the wood would dry out w/o rotting and thus last much longer. Doubtful at first I recall coming back to campsites we had used in previous yrs only to find the firewood piles we had left behind weathered gray and very nicely dried out. He always told us leaving the bark on furthered the rotting process and this seemed to be the case in my experience.

... I like to

Bogwalker: "My philosophy has always been to leave enough wood for an emergency fire in case someone arrives at the site and it is very cold or they are wet and cold from rain or tipping. That requires some kindling, maybe a couple of bigger pieces once the kindling is going and some protected birch bark as a starter. "

I share your thoughts as well Bogs.
I only start a fire 1/3 of the time, when I leave I stash enough starter and kindling under something dry around the campsite for a person to get another fire going. After that, they are on their own.

Alaska is where we left seasonal cabins unlocked, with plenty of wood put up for a person to get a fire going and survive in case of an emergency.

fishonfishoff: "South arm of Knife. Next occupants had to be happy.

FishonFishoff"

I realize this thread is a couple years old, but I think we stopped at this site back in 2017 I believe. It was part of one of the most disappointing acts I’ve witnessed in the BWCA. we arrived at SAK around noon and started looking for a site. We stopped at the site just west of Eddy Falls (1429) to check it out. Saw this awesome wood pile very much like the picture and almost made a decision to stay based just on that. But there were four of us and although it was nice, we thought we’d check out the site East of the falls (2037) since it appeared to be more open and had sun so we decided to check it out at least for lunch. Another party was fishing the falls and we figured they already had a site and we didn’t see anyone else so we figured we could come back if we didn’t like the other site. Once we ate lunch we decided the first was better, plus it had a pile of firewood. As we got back on the water we noticed the two people fishing the falls had now stopped there. Oh well we proceeded to look for another site. After checking one more we noticed that the other group had left the site, maybe just stopped for lunch. So we headed back. We arrived and unloaded the canoes and were setting up camp when I realized the nice pile of split firewood was gone. Obviously they other canoe stopped just to grab the pile of wood and take it with them. I don’t mind finding my own firewood, but I was extremely annoyed someone would actually pilfer wood from another site that had already been cut and split. I tend to think there’s a code in the BWCA on how to act, and this would definitely not be allowed. Just a classless act in my opinion. So FishOnFishOff, if it was you who left it, I appreciate the generosity.

It is always a welcome site to find a site with at least some wood stacked. We have always made it a point to leave a site that looks like or better than we found it, and some starter firewood.

AluminumBarge: "

fishonfishoff: "South arm of Knife. Next occupants had to be happy.


FishonFishoff"

I realize this thread is a couple years old, but I think we stopped at this site back in 2017 I believe. It was part of one of the most disappointing acts I’ve witnessed in the BWCA. we arrived at SAK around noon and started looking for a site. We stopped at the site just west of Eddy Falls (1429) to check it out. Saw this awesome wood pile very much like the picture and almost made a decision to stay based just on that. But there were four of us and although it was nice, we thought we’d check out the site East of the falls (2037) since it appeared to be more open and had sun so we decided to check it out at least for lunch. Another party was fishing the falls and we figured they already had a site and we didn’t see anyone else so we figured we could come back if we didn’t like the other site. Once we ate lunch we decided the first was better, plus it had a pile of firewood. As we got back on the water we noticed the two people fishing the falls had now stopped there. Oh well we proceeded to look for another site. After checking one more we noticed that the other group had left the site, maybe just stopped for lunch. So we headed back. We arrived and unloaded the canoes and were setting up camp when I realized the nice pile of split firewood was gone. Obviously they other canoe stopped just to grab the pile of wood and take it with them. I don’t mind finding my own firewood, but I was extremely annoyed someone would actually pilfer wood from another site that had already been cut and split. I tend to think there’s a code in the BWCA on how to act, and this would definitely not be allowed. Just a classless act in my opinion. So FishOnFishOff, if it was you who left it, I appreciate the generosity."

Lol - this was the very subject of a thread I started a while back that got so heated it was eventually removed.

IMO when you leave wood behind at a site, it's just for someone to use....I don't see why it has to be burned at that specific campsite.

Now, a group whose main firewood collection method is to visit unoccupied sites and gather all the wood there and bring it back to their site might be pushing it. But If I stop for lunch or something and there is some wood laying around, I'll happily throw it in my boat and bring it back to my site.

And for the record, I do believe I've processed and left behind more wood than I've taken from one site and burned at my own over the years. I'm not greedy or selfish, but just don't see an issue with grabbing wood from an unoccupied site and burning it at a different one.

deerfoot: "Not trying to restart this thread but would like to point out something I learned from Uncle Phil of the Wabakimi Project about leaving firewood for the next occupants of a campsite. For nearly 10 yrs I traveled with Uncle Phil and he usually had us prepare firewood to leave at campsites. He always had us remove the bark stating the wood would dry out w/o rotting and thus last much longer. Doubtful at first I recall coming back to campsites we had used in previous yrs only to find the firewood piles we had left behind weathered gray and very nicely dried out. He always told us leaving the bark on furthered the rotting process and this seemed to be the case in my experience."

Well now I have another bucket list place. Wabakimi!

x2jmorris: "Haha I don't do that much but I usually leave something like this


"

That's good enough