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Boundary Waters Quetico Forum Fishing Forum I'm an idiot....... |
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02/11/2014 08:43PM (Thread Older Than 3 Years)
Yes I will say it right up front...
Last year I bought a Piranamax 160 PT and we created a PVC Mount off the front handle of the canoe to mount the transducer....
This failed miserably.
Tell me how to make this thing work or it will be in the for sale section in Sep
Last year I bought a Piranamax 160 PT and we created a PVC Mount off the front handle of the canoe to mount the transducer....
This failed miserably.
Tell me how to make this thing work or it will be in the for sale section in Sep
"One inch on the map ~ is not one inch on the ground"
02/11/2014 08:57PM
What doesn't work? Do you have any pictures? Is the transducer mounted inside the canoe, or outside the canoe? I had tried a set up with the transducer mounted in the front of the canoe (inside), however, the front of the canoe will come out of the water at times and wont give you a good reading. Mounting the transducer in the back of the canoe has worked much better for me, as this part of the canoe is always in the water.
02/11/2014 09:22PM
What kind of canoe material? It is very easy to mount the transducr to shoot thru your hull. Just use some silicone to stick down some foam, cut out to the shape of your transducer, then when using the finder, a few drops of water in the foam cutout, place the transducer in there and you are in business. Works great, and no drag on the canoe when paddling. Works in almost any material ( kevlar, fiberglass, cedarstrip etc) except shooting thru foam core.
Moonman.
Moonman.
02/11/2014 09:28PM
Rob,
Did you get the portable? If it Does not have the suction cup attachment for the transducer you can always order one. I have an older piranhamax portable and have no problems with the transducer, will even read through the hull if you get a little water in the bottom of the canoe.
Bruce
Did you get the portable? If it Does not have the suction cup attachment for the transducer you can always order one. I have an older piranhamax portable and have no problems with the transducer, will even read through the hull if you get a little water in the bottom of the canoe.
Bruce
Good Paddling, Great Fishing, and God Bless All...
02/11/2014 09:41PM
quote Arkansas Man: "Rob,
Did you get the portable? If it Does not have the suction cup attachment for the transducer you can always order one. I have an older piranhamax portable and have no problems with the transducer, will even read through the hull if you get a little water in the bottom of the canoe.
Bruce"
Thru the hull person myself id I use one. Lot more quite while paddling also. None of this gurgling sound,it drove me crazy when everything suppose to be so quite around you.
02/12/2014 12:21AM
+1 Moonman,
I have used your "thru the hull" tramducer mounting method using foam for a few years now. It works real well and there is no drag on the canoe when paddling vs. a lot of drag that you get when using a suction cup mount.
This year I am going to use the closed cell foam from a kidde (child) buckle floatation device. There are usually 4 layers of hard closed foam held together with a buckle. Kayakers in Austrailia have sucessfully used these kidde floats for a few years now to mount their transducers to the hull of their kayaks.
I am also going to try using a wad of black DUCT SEAL (what is used to fill holes around your house siding when installing air conditioner hoses and tv wires) to form a "well" ...and then you pour about 1/8 inch of water and then push in transducer and cover with more duct seal. I am told duct seal sticks real well to kevlar, composites, fiberglass etc. it is simple to use, lasts thru the trip and easy to undo and redo.
Bottomline, a lot of paddlers use a hunk of silicone to mount their transducers to their hulls. But I believe using foam or duct seal with water between the transducer and the hull provides a more accurate depth and fish reading. Many times there are too many small air pockets with silicone that can interrupt the signal going to and from the transducer.
"Thru the hull" transducer mounting is one topic that Old Salt and i will be covering in our upcoming talk at Copia "Planning a fishing-based canoe trip.'
02/12/2014 09:49AM
Sorry I gave very little information in my mini self rant....
The Canoe is SR Q18.5
The PVC/Transducer looked great until we started to move and then it bended back due to the resistance and water flow making it ineffective while moving.
This is the portable but it looks like the through the hull method is the way to go. Can someone go through the the Steps to make this work A-Z?
The Canoe is SR Q18.5
The PVC/Transducer looked great until we started to move and then it bended back due to the resistance and water flow making it ineffective while moving.
This is the portable but it looks like the through the hull method is the way to go. Can someone go through the the Steps to make this work A-Z?
"One inch on the map ~ is not one inch on the ground"
02/12/2014 10:48AM
I have not used that particular model in the past. All of my depth finders use a suction cup to attach the transducer to the outside of the hull. Can you add a second piece of pvc or similar pipe to the inside of the current one? Or what about sanding it and adding some fiberglass to the outside to stiffen it up?
02/12/2014 11:35AM
Through hull should work for you.
I have a foam core so I bent a piece of 1/4" X 5/8" aluminum stock. It clamps nicely under my tite-loc rod holder and has very little water resistance. Electrical tape holds the 'ducer on and the chord in check. Just another idea.
I have a foam core so I bent a piece of 1/4" X 5/8" aluminum stock. It clamps nicely under my tite-loc rod holder and has very little water resistance. Electrical tape holds the 'ducer on and the chord in check. Just another idea.
All Rapalas that wander are not lost.
02/12/2014 11:42AM
quote bojibob: "Sorry I gave very little information in my mini self rant....
The Canoe is SR Q18.5
The PVC/Transducer looked great until we started to move and then it bended back due to the resistance and water flow making it ineffective while moving.
This is the portable but it looks like the through the hull method is the way to go. Can someone go through the the Steps to make this work A-Z?
"
It is very easy to set up. The transducer will shoot through your hull and only needs to have a layer of water between it and the hull to start working. The foam cut out, just is an easy way to hold the transducer and the water.
1) get some suitable foam. You can use a small section of an old blue foam sleeping pad or a section of the foam fatigue mats you might put on a workshop floor (the ones with the jigsaw puzzle type cut outs along the edges, to join multiple panels). Anything that water will not permeate.
2)Place your transducer on top and with a sharpie marker trace around the transducer, onto the foam. This will be the inside of the cut out. Then make another line, approx one half inch or so away from and around the first line. Cut the foam along both lines so you have a ring, shaped like your transducer. You want the inside line, that holds the transducer, kind of tight to hold it by friction when you place it in there. Test the fit to get it to your liking.
3)Choose a location to glue down the foam. Some guys like it up nearer the bow seat, so they get readings slightly in advance of where their stern seat will be a second or so later. I like it located near me, just under the rear thwart.
4) Glue the foam cut out down. I use silicone, as this can easily be removed again ( at least on my wood strip varnished hull). Don't use too much so that the glue oozes out and prevents the transducer from sitting in there nicely. Let the glue dry.
5) Thats it. When underway and wanting to use your finder, just scoop out a few drops of water (you can just dip your paddle in the lake and let the drops sit in the foam cut-out), place your transducer in there and start fishing. You do not need any fancy transducer, the one that comes with your unit will work fine. Nothing could be easier and no messing with extra weight and bulk of transducer attachment arms, or the added drag on your canoe. Although if using something like Arlo has rigged up, I agree, not much extra drag.
Here is a pic of mine:
Moonman.
02/12/2014 01:50PM
A good way to compare and test is to take your canoe down to a lake. Take a plastic bag with you. Paddle out a bit, then put some water in the bag, place your transducer in there, and plop the works down on your hull. Look at the screen and readings etc. Then hold the transducer over the side and compare the screen. You'll see there is no difference.
Moonman
Moonman
02/12/2014 04:26PM
quote bojibob: "Sorry I gave very little information in my mini self rant....
The Canoe is SR Q18.5
The PVC/Transducer looked great until we started to move and then it bended back due to the resistance and water flow making it ineffective while moving.
This is the portable but it looks like the through the hull method is the way to go. Can someone go through the the Steps to make this work A-Z?
"
Hey Boji. I've got the Piranhmax 230 and I've gone through several "I'm an idiot" trial and error methods for the transducer while in the Quetico...that's the most I'm gonna admit to anyway....except for that time in 1998 when I almost dropped my Explorer into a Wisconsin lake in the middle of January while ice fishing....oops....
Anyway, I heard from a buddy 2 years ago that a simple method (too simple) is to put the transducer into a quart freezer ziplock half full of water and place it on the bottom of the canoe a few feet in front of you....and the results?? It works!! Bring a little sour cream container with the bottom cut out to keep the ziplock from falling over....How simple is that??
Do what you can, with what you have, where you are -- Teddy Roosevelt
02/12/2014 04:45PM
quote Moonman: "What kind of canoe material? It is very easy to mount the transducr to shoot thru your hull. Just use some silicone to stick down some foam, cut out to the shape of your transducer, then when using the finder, a few drops of water in the foam cutout, place the transducer in there and you are in business. Works great, and no drag on the canoe when paddling. Works in almost any material ( kevlar, fiberglass, cedarstrip etc) except shooting thru foam core.
Moonman."
will mounting it inside the canoe also work with an aluminum?
"If you don't like my fire then don't come around, cause I'm gonna burn one down"-----Ben Harper
02/12/2014 04:51PM
quote brantlars: "quote Moonman: "What kind of canoe material? It is very easy to mount the transducr to shoot thru your hull. Just use some silicone to stick down some foam, cut out to the shape of your transducer, then when using the finder, a few drops of water in the foam cutout, place the transducer in there and you are in business. Works great, and no drag on the canoe when paddling. Works in almost any material ( kevlar, fiberglass, cedarstrip etc) except shooting thru foam core.
Moonman."
will mounting it inside the canoe also work with an aluminum?"
yes
02/14/2014 01:11PM
No fancy mounting system or glues needed. It will shoot through the hull as long as the transducer sits in a puddle of water in the bottom of the canoe (standard equipment in my boats, it seems). You could go so far as partially filling a ziploc bag with water and set the transducer on that, if desired.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." -- Yogi Berra
02/14/2014 02:22PM
quote PINETREE: "I see no reason why you would want to mount it in the bottom,it sits very good by itself. Mounting it I think would make a mess in your canoe and it would get in the way at times."
This can be true, but depends on the shape of your transducer. A ziplock with water will work as I stated abive, but then it can still flop over at times and then you are propping it up. With the foam, you are not so much as 'mounting' the transducer, as you are 'mounting' the foam. The foam holds both the water and transducer, weighs nothing and you just pick up the transducer to pack up, flip canoe, portage etc. no mess no smell.
Moonman
02/14/2014 07:19PM
A glob of vaseline will hold a transducer in place and facilitate the through-hull signal. You'll get a few double-takes on the portage trail as well when you yell "Larry, you got the vaseline brand petroleum jelly?"
"Life is not a beauty contest. It is a fishing contest." --me
02/14/2014 08:12PM
quote lundojam: "A glob of vaseline will hold a transducer in place and facilitate the through-hull signal. You'll get a few double-takes on the portage trail as well when you yell "Larry, you got the vaseline brand petroleum jelly?""Will KY work then too? :^)
All Rapalas that wander are not lost.
02/14/2014 11:21PM
quote Moonman: "A good way to compare and test is to take your canoe down to a lake. Take a plastic bag with you. Paddle out a bit, then put some water in the bag, place your transducer in there, and plop the works down on your hull. Look at the screen and readings etc. Then hold the transducer over the side and compare the screen. You'll see there is no difference.
Moonman"
That is going to be harder to do than it sounds...this week...lol
I'm just here to give my opinion...If you don't like it, ignore it.
02/15/2014 09:08AM
Shooting through the hull does lose a lot of detail, but with a lower end unit & inexperienced user fishing shallow on inland lakes...you probably won't notice.
Making a transducer out of metal is easy, either 3/16 stainless steel rod with the end ground flat to drill a couple small mounting holes or a piece of angled aluminum cut & bolted into an "L" shape. Both will clamp to the side of the boat.
Total cost will run you $20 from Home Depot.
Making a transducer out of metal is easy, either 3/16 stainless steel rod with the end ground flat to drill a couple small mounting holes or a piece of angled aluminum cut & bolted into an "L" shape. Both will clamp to the side of the boat.
Total cost will run you $20 from Home Depot.
02/15/2014 09:33AM
Thanks for the info regarding the cutout foam mount. I use a suction cup and didn't like the drag and noise it produces. Looking forward to this little project.
"Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself." --- George Bernard Shaw
02/15/2014 10:35AM
quote Dilligaf0220: "...with a lower end unit & inexperienced user fishing shallow on inland lakes...you probably won't notice..."
Wow. I know the OP named the post "I'm an idiot......." but, REALLY?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." -- Yogi Berra
02/15/2014 11:54AM
quote schweady: "quote Dilligaf0220: "...with a lower end unit & inexperienced user fishing shallow on inland lakes...you probably won't notice..."
Wow. I know the OP named the post "I'm an idiot......." but, REALLY?
"
I fish with guys that swear by shooting through the hull.
I can't stand it.
It's like thinking the picture on your standard def cable TV is fine...until you see a true 1080p HD video.
Throwing together an arm is simple.
02/15/2014 05:47PM
Just call me old fashion... I use the suction cup and simply turn it up out of the water if I am paddling some where in a hurry, otherwise it doesn't bother me if there is a little gurgle of water as I slowly paddle fishing or looking for structure.
Bruce
Bruce
Good Paddling, Great Fishing, and God Bless All...
02/17/2014 02:47PM
In one of my kayaks, I glued a small piece of plastic plumbing pipe, cut to fit, to the bottom, fill it with water and put the transducer inside with some weight on top. But I did not want to do that in the canoes because its a permanent mount and could get in the way.
I love the simple idea of using a zip lock with water, or vasaline. Thanks you guys. Sometimes the simplest is the best.
I love the simple idea of using a zip lock with water, or vasaline. Thanks you guys. Sometimes the simplest is the best.
There are no strangers here, only friends who haven't yet met!
02/17/2014 02:55PM
Yes the ziplock will work fine, except that it is not easy to get your transducer sitting flat and even against the hull. It just flops over. If you have some gear in the boat, you could wedge it against something to get it flat and to hold it in position, but that would get old fast. The foam is just so easy. Once its on there, which would take maybe twenty minutes to cut out and glue down, setting up your transducer would take a second to put a few drops of water in there, and another second to place your transducer in it. Done. Vaseline would also be easy to do, but again, the issue is getting the transducer to stay laying flat. The beauty of the foam is not just that it will hold water, but that friction holds transducer exactly as you place it. Place it in there and start fishing. Back on shore for portaging or to flip your boat at night, just pick up your transducer. Its really just an easy, no hassle way to do it.
Moonman.
Moonman.
02/17/2014 03:15PM
quote lundojam: "A glob of vaseline will hold a transducer in place and facilitate the through-hull signal. You'll get a few double-takes on the portage trail as well when you yell "Larry, you got the vaseline brand petroleum jelly?""I hear Banjos :-)
" I want to know Gods thoughts , The rest are details " Albert Einstein. WWJD
02/18/2014 07:57AM
With my unit all I want is water depth and type of bottom structure eg: hard flat, boulders, weeds, etc. I'm not looking to see walleyes stacked on a dropoff because I'm trolling for the most part and looking for a reef I can then stop and work.
My question is will going through the hull skew any of this for me? Will I still get an accurate reading but maybe not see the big bass behind the boulder? I use a 14 year old Vexilar Boundary Waters model.
The TV analogy is a good one btw. And loving the Apollo 13 stuff. You guys crack me up.
My question is will going through the hull skew any of this for me? Will I still get an accurate reading but maybe not see the big bass behind the boulder? I use a 14 year old Vexilar Boundary Waters model.
The TV analogy is a good one btw. And loving the Apollo 13 stuff. You guys crack me up.
"Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself." --- George Bernard Shaw
02/18/2014 09:22AM
quote TomT: "With my unit all I want is water depth and type of bottom structure eg: hard flat, boulders, weeds, etc. I'm not looking to see walleyes stacked on a dropoff because I'm trolling for the most part and looking for a reef I can then stop and work.
My question is will going through the hull skew any of this for me? Will I still get an accurate reading but maybe not see the big bass behind the boulder? I use a 14 year old Vexilar Boundary Waters model.
"
I have the same unit, not quite as old. It will see fish through my wood and glass kayak.
There are no strangers here, only friends who haven't yet met!
02/18/2014 10:02AM
quote TomT: "With my unit all I want is water depth and type of bottom structure eg: hard flat, boulders, weeds, etc. I'm not looking to see walleyes stacked on a dropoff because I'm trolling for the most part and looking for a reef I can then stop and work.
My question is will going through the hull skew any of this for me? Will I still get an accurate reading but maybe not see the big bass behind the boulder? I use a 14 year old Vexilar Boundary Waters model.
The TV analogy is a good one btw. And loving the Apollo 13 stuff. You guys crack me up.
"
My unit is a garmin echo 100. I can see depth and fish just fine shooting through the hull. I mainly just want depth and bottom type same as you mentioned. I bought my unit because it has great features, screen size and resolution, is small and not bulky to pack, it was cheap and has a very low current draw - meanng longer lasting battery power. My hull is a cedar strip and even though I have heard people say you can't read through a cedar strip hull, that is simply not true. I think you just have to go out and test it for yourself, with the baggie/ziplock as I mentioned in a post above. Hull type has an effect, foam core doesn't work due to the air - an analogy would be like holding your transducer over the water and expecting it to read. The signal is designed to work through water, so materials closest to water characteristics will work best. There is some info on that aspect on a couple forums I read a few years ago. Also, I have heard guys say it didn't work on one section of their boat, but they moved it a few inches and then it worked perfectly. So if you are presently using a suction cup or arm setup, just take a baggie with you next time, fill with water and put our transducer in there and test it through your hull. You might be pleasantly surprised.
Moonman.
02/18/2014 11:53AM
Okay after breaking of the transducer on the roller portage between triangle. And ojibway and tring to keep it off the rocks while putting on portage wheels st newton falls maybe I shpuld mount thru the hull.. I hav a14ft alumacraft with15hp evinrude.. question is will I still get a reading while on plane
Ah retired @ 50
02/18/2014 12:23PM
quote yogi59weedr: "Okay after breaking of the transducer on the roller portage between triangle. And ojibway and tring to keep it off the rocks while putting on portage wheels st newton falls maybe I shpuld mount thru the hull.. I hav a14ft alumacraft with15hp evinrude.. question is will I still get a reading while on plane"
Yes...IF that part of the boat is in the water.
You don't want an air gap...anywhere in the column.
I'm just here to give my opinion...If you don't like it, ignore it.
02/18/2014 03:36PM
quote yogi59weedr: "How will this affect the. Temp reading"
Temps will be off, but by how much depends on time of year and how much your hull insulates from the water. In spring when the ice is just off the lakes, the freezing water cools my woodstrip hull down to the same temp as the water, so same reading. In summer there is a greater differential, so yes, temps will not be accurate then.
Moonman.
02/18/2014 03:41PM
quote Moonman: "quote yogi59weedr: "How will this affect the. Temp reading"
Temps will be off, but by how much depends on time of year and how much your hull insulates from the water. In spring when the ice is just off the lakes, the freezing water cools my woodstrip hull down to the same temp as the water, so same reading. In summer there is a greater differential, so yes, temps will not be accurate then.
Moonman."
Just reading surface temps anyhow,stick the probe over the side for a second.
07/30/2018 09:29PM
Frenchy: "
"
I'm looking for information and pictures on how to mount my pmax 175 transducer outside of my canoe. Some of the responses on this thread are still pretty funny and make me laugh, even from four years ago.
That said, I do like the external mount using the metal rod or plate but I think I'm going to try a 3/4 in lightweight pvc pipe and a small, plastic clamp. I have the suction cups and appropriate hardware...looks like I'll be out in the garage tinkering at my work bench this week before heading north this weekend. Any thoughts?
"It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed.”
07/31/2018 07:30PM
So will it shoot thru a foam core?
I am renting a Wenonah Boundary Waters canoe from VNO.
I don't think that is a foam core but I'm not 100% sure.
Maybe I should switch to a Q17?
I have my foam cut out and I plan on putting my transducer in a ziploc bag full of water and then setting that inside the foam cutout. I can't attach/glue it to a rental.
Any advice on this?
I am renting a Wenonah Boundary Waters canoe from VNO.
I don't think that is a foam core but I'm not 100% sure.
Maybe I should switch to a Q17?
I have my foam cut out and I plan on putting my transducer in a ziploc bag full of water and then setting that inside the foam cutout. I can't attach/glue it to a rental.
Any advice on this?
07/31/2018 10:47PM
I believe the Boundary Waters is a foam core just like my Spirit II. You should be able to shoot through the hull at either end of the canoe where there is no foam. I think your set up will work. I siliconed my foam in place (I own it) but as long as your set up steadys the bag, you should be good.
08/01/2018 10:47AM
AmarilloJim: "It is pliable enough to bend if I forget to rotate it up before land fall but water pressure does not move it."
Thanks. I may look into this as an option as it looks fairly simple to set up and carry in to the backcountry.
"It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed.”
08/01/2018 11:38AM
I have a foam core MN II and my setup is as simple can be. I just lay the transducer on a flat spot in the stern. A little water always accumulates in the stern and the signal is great. This allows me to transfer between my canoes and kayaks with ease.
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