Hey everyone,

I just got back from a 6-night, 7-day trip last Friday. I took two rest days, and then headed back to the gym, which I go to 3-4 days a week, usually. This was my second trip this year, and I've noticed that my fatigue levels at the gym are pretty intense following trips. It takes me a couple weeks to recover to my normal strength and endurance levels.

For those BWCA goers who are also gym rats or exercise junkies out there, have you ever had something like this happen?

If this isn't just me, any theories as to why this happens? Dehydration? Just plain old exhaustion? It annoys the heck out of me because it's not like I'm just laying around in a hammock getting soft on canoe trips! Okay, for part of the day I'm laying around in a hammock getting soft, but the other part is a pretty darn good work out as we tend to only take one rest day a trip.

Thanks for any input! May your paddles stay wet and your tent dry.

Annie

Gym exercise is typically short and intense. I can't think of a routine that mimics what you are doing in the canoe all day. Stop going to the gym 10 days for any reason and you will feel lack of strength in your routines the week back. As for endurance, I'd bet you burn a lot more calories than what you think on a trip. I have a year round running routine and will still drop 10# on a canoe trip (and we don't skimp on the food). You simply deplete your reserves. Distance runners will load up on carbs for 4 days before a race to "stock up". Canoe tripping has an opposite effect. Taking a couple weeks to regain your peak doesn't sound unusual.
-YB

I'm 55 and haven't had fatigue problems yet after a trip, I'm not a go to the gym guy, I just hike and paddle as much as I can, last few trips have been hundred mile plus trips, I'll paddle and portage about ten hours a day on spring trips. Might be more of the excitement and adrenaline from the trip and just hard getting back in the groove of working out knowing the next trip is a ways off and the closer it gets it's easier to be more motivated.

Agree with YB. Gym exercise your doing I am guessing is likely anaerobic, lactate forming stuff. Most exercise in canoe land ,even the extreme , is aerobic. Not being able to allow your body (muscles) to remove lactate , by producing lactate on a canoe trip means its going to suck for awhile once you get back doing anaerobic gym stuff.

different muscles, different rate, different sleep, different food.......add it up.
Truth is, I usually feel better after a canoe trip. I'm not a gym rat but canoeing/portaging beats the heck out of getting beat up by 1500 pound cows every day.

There is somewhat of a false sense of fitness that you get with workouts at the gym. You think you are "in shape", but your body adapts to our routine and your metabolism levels out. If you don't vary your routine a lot, you will not achieve a level of real fitness. You have to constantly challenge your body in different ways, or it just adapts.

So, I don't find it unusual that you will have a period of time after a canoe trip for your body to readjust to your gym exercises. You actually got better "exercise" on the canoe trip. That's why we all tend to lose weight while tripping. We're exercising in a way that our bodies are not used to. Which is of course, good for us.

I have been so fatigued after a 7 day Quetico trip I barely made it throught work days on Monday and Tuesday after I got back on Sunday. It took about a week to get back to normal although I always feel stronger when I get back especially in the arms. 4 night trips I'm not as fatigued afterword.

Dehydration came to mind right away, and what others have said. Doing a lot of what your body is not used to for days.

On a trip several years ago, we did a 45 mile loop in 5 days with one layover day, and I had issues with fatigue for about a week when I get home. Since that trip, I have not had issues that bad, but now I try to more of what I do on a trip before the trip. Hike with a 30 lb pack and a canoe every day or at least every other day. Paddle as much as you can.

Odd though. I did not work out ahead of time for my two trips in May and June this last spring, and my body did fine. I started to wonder if body just realized I was canoe tripping again and automatically when into canoeing mode like it know how to adapt?

quote WhiteWolf: "Not being able to allow your body (muscles) to remove lactate , by producing lactate on a canoe trip means its going to suck for awhile once you get back doing anaerobic gym stuff."

Fascinating stuff! I'd only recently learned about anaerobic vs. aerobic because I have been having some lactic acid build-up issues that foam rolling has helped alleviate a lot. Do you have a theory as to why canoe trips would cause a lactic acid build up if the activity is aerobic?

quote NorthlandFan: "

quote WhiteWolf: "Not being able to allow your body (muscles) to remove lactate , by producing lactate on a canoe trip means its going to suck for awhile once you get back doing anaerobic gym stuff."

Fascinating stuff! I'd only recently learned about anaerobic vs. aerobic because I have been having some lactic acid build-up issues that foam rolling has helped alleviate a lot. Do you have a theory as to why canoe trips would cause a lactic acid build up if the activity is aerobic?"

I think for many people, the exertion of canoeing and portaging all day is more anaerobic than you might suspect.

quote NorthlandFan: "

quote WhiteWolf: "Not being able to allow your body (muscles) to remove lactate , by producing lactate on a canoe trip means its going to suck for awhile once you get back doing anaerobic gym stuff."

Fascinating stuff! I'd only recently learned about anaerobic vs. aerobic because I have been having some lactic acid build-up issues that foam rolling has helped alleviate a lot. Do you have a theory as to why canoe trips would cause a lactic acid build up if the activity is aerobic?"

I was typing from a phone earlier and had a bad choice of words-- by "Not being able to allow your body (muscles) to remove lactate"-- by producing lactate..." What I meant is that by working out anaerobically and producing lactate your muscles (overall body) gets better at removing lactate (and maybe actually converting it to fuel) over time with many workouts -- called getting in shape or improving your "shape" -- actually really good shape.-- especially if your train anaerobically- especially intervals- for an aerobic event. (Marathon etc.) This is called obtaining your maximum aerobic potential, is called “VO2 Max”-- or how efficiently your body uses 02 during exercise. Miss a few workouts and your body will let you know. So what I'am saying is that the canoe trips for you are not like working out anaerobically(imo a canoe trip is not an anaerobic exercise-- but much more aerobic and thus no lactate build up- and that is why you feel like you did (do) coming back. For others-- a canoe trip may be an anaerobic exercise at times-- many variables involved.

As were on the topic--- common soreness associated with working out has nothing to do with lactic acid-- but more so with working muscles that your not used to using enough. Lactic acid / muscle soreness?
Lactic acid is produced by our bodies as a defense system so we don't push it too hard do to lack of Oxygen. (this is the reason the Olympic Training Center is at elevation in Colorado Springs-- and so athletes can produce more lactate-- but by training can get there bodies to translate the lactic acid into fuel-- and then compete at a lower elevation. The trick is training hard enough day in day out to feel the pain of lactic acid (commonly called the Grand Piano , The Wall , The Boogeyman ) slowly (painfully) disappear- is how elite athletes make themselves better and actually have their blood tested for lactic acid after or during a serious anaerobic set. The lower the amount of lactate the better-- either your body is not producing as much as it did (good) or your super in shape and your body converts lactic acid into fuel. (freakish) I know this because - as a world class swimmer(in the day :O) - I went through this.
Northland Fan-- feel free to email myself if you have any questions. Some of this talk can get pretty technical.

I've managed to hurt myself pretty good pretending that it wasn't happening.

I'm not a beast by any means, but I can hold my own.

BWCA trips for me are usually 10+ days long, moving most days for however many miles we can manage in 6-8 hours of travel.

My shoulders and lower back really take a beating, even though I feel really good. I'll go so far as to say my 'work capacity' or conditioning, or whatever you want to call it increases measurably during these trips.

Then I go back to the gym, try to pick up where I left off, and absolutely destroy myself (not in a good way). I've hurt my low back, pulled a rotator cuff, tweaked my knee, pulled a bicep, you name it.

Here's what I think is happening (for me) -

at a certain level of fitness, specificity becomes increasingly important. So does over-use. Even though I may be at a high level of 'gym' fitness, when I go to the BWCA, I'm not deadlifting 405# 10 times in a minute and waiting a week to do that again. I'm putting on a 50# pack, hoisting a 45# 16 foot long boat, carrying it for a quarter mile, putting it down, and repeating that 10X per day, for 10 days. I adapt to different loading parameters.

Then I get back to the gym, and try to deadlift 405# 10 times in a minute, and get absolutely crushed/hurt etc.

what I've learned, is to do a 'reset', upon returning to the gym. Take a few pounds off, and build back up (one step back so I can go 2 steps forward).

Backing off and building back has never made me weaker. Getting hurt because I'm now conditioned for different loading parameters, and having to heal, has always made me weaker.

YMMV

Thanks very much, everyone! WhiteWolf, I'm taking you up on your offer for sure. I think I'm blaming lactic acid when I shouldn't be.