Boundary Waters Quetico Forum :: Gear Forum :: Help in Selecting my First Solo Canoe.
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SinglePortage |
I have decided that since tripping is my main purpose at this point, I am going to get a canoe that is designed for it. That being said, I will likely buy a less expensive canoe with a little rocker to satisfy my urge to get into small rivers and backwaters. I have learned that no one canoe excels at everything. You either get a specialist at one end or the other, or find a model that compromises and lands in the middle somewhere. |
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Dooger |
Bear said I'll be fine. You never go out in your canoe, empty, once in the backcountry? If you want to go for an evening paddle or fish, you load it back up first? |
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SinglePortage |
Dooger: "SinglePortage, Did I say that? Yes, I go out fishing or on day trips with little or no gear in the canoe every day when I am up there. In fact, fishing and solitude are the main reasons I go. My comment saying that raising the seat will raise the center of gravity and effect stability was not a criticism, just a fact. But I don't like sitting too low either and would likely raise the seat too. I am just curious if you notice much of a difference. I know that I sat on a boat cushion once in my MN II and I could really feel the difference, but maybe it would have less effect in the middle of the canoe. |
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Banksiana |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: "I've paddled a lot of solo boats and while I prefer fast lively hulls (ie Advantage, Voyageur, Blackwater) I think that the Magic makes for one of the best all around hulls I've paddled. It's relatively quick and user friendly, turns when necessary, carries a decent load, doesn't catch a lot of wind and positively shines in rough conditions (especially considering its low profile)." As of now my top two are the Magic and Prism, in that order. I like the idea of a lower profile to catch the wind, which made the Blackwater very interesting. I have read a couple of reviews that said the Blackwater was surprisingly stable, but if not I am not as interested. But I would love to paddle that beautiful boat to know for sure. |
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Dooger |
SinglePortage: "Dooger: "SinglePortage, No you didn't say that outright, but some of your comments make it sound like you just want to go from Point A to Point B without much of anything else. Just get the kneeling drops if you get the Magic. It's basically the same as what I did with a slight drop in the front. You can always even them up if you'd like. If you poke around a bit, you'll find that a lot of folks aren't fond of the sitting drops because they're too low and "kayak-like". A lot seem to cut them and are happy with them once they're shortened. I'd call Northstar if I were you and ask if you should buy the bigger Solo. I was in the same predicament as you are when I was looking to buy. I would have bought the Magic too if it weren't for my load (including personal size) and if just wanted a boat for going straight and fast on big water. 6'3" and 230#...I'd go Solo over Magic, IMO. |
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Ladyonthefly |
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Pinetree |
Ladyonthefly: "Hello, will be doing my first boundary waters trip this year. I purchased a 22 lb classic solo canoe from Hornbeck canoes . This boat came recommended by a person who has done numerous trips. I couldn’t be happier with this boat. I’m rough on gear and have smacked it into numerous rocks already & it has survived. Might be worth checking into. Good luck." How long a canoe is that. That is superlight. |
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Marten |
SinglePortage: "Bannock: "Prism. Two packs. Encounter will be too much for you." I am one suggesting the Encounter but understand how close a call this is. 230 pounds, 6-3 and two week trips tip the choice in my mind. |
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ForestDuff |
Plus rod and reel case, shotgun and a couple dekes. :) I wanted something a little different (rudder), a little tougher, could handle a tad more gear, and wasn't super tippy. After 10 years, she's still the same girl I fell in love with. |
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SinglePortage |
Lailoken: "I just bought a Northstar Solo blacklite with wood trim. I am 184 lbs and 5'9" I had paddled the NS Magic and loved it and the Wennonah Prism on separate trips. I don't like bucket tractor seats that the Prism had and like Northstar, so went with them. The Magic is tight, like 26 inches, and loading and unloading it, the buckles always caught, so I went with Solo, which is tad wider. It "seems" bit slower than Magic, but also, It has been two years since did Magic solo, so I just might be out of shape." What packs do you use? Twenty-six inches should not be too bad if you narrow your pack a bit. I tightened the compression straps on my Superior 1 pack and loaded up at 18" wide. |
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Marten |
With the details you have added about your packing so light and fishing time in an empty canoe I will change my opinion and suggest a Prism type canoe. I still suggest having that second pack to aid in trimming the canoe. |
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SinglePortage |
boonie: "SinglePortage: "Bannock: "Prism. Two packs. Encounter will be too much for you." This makes a lot of sense. I tend to travel pretty light and would never exceed even 300 pounds unless I brought my dog along. My first trip to the bwca 35 years was with four other guys who "go every year". Well, it turned out that they bring everything including the kitchen sink on their trips and I was just an unpaid sherpa. This taught me that less is more when it comes to this type of trip. I have seen a lot of pictures here of solo canoes loaded with two large packs and a smaller day pack and I am always surprised. I bet most of the difference is in the food pack though. I tend to go with very simple food choices and count on fish for dinner every night. I have read some trip reports that included some pretty elaborate (and tasty) meals. Maybe I need to give that a try some time. Having a lower profile in the water is very important since I try to spend more time fishing from an empty canoe than I do travelling with a loaded one. I threw all of the gear that I normally bring on trips in my pack and weighed it. The pack and two fishing rods came to 33 pounds. My spartan food pack averages about one pound per day, putting me at 40 pounds for a week long trip and 55 pounds for a three week trip. If I add 5 pounds for things I missed and a few extras I am at 45 to 60 pounds of gear weight. So for me, I should try to find a canoe that performs best with a load range of 230-290 pounds. |
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MReid |
SinglePortage: "boonie: "SinglePortage: "Bannock: "Prism. Two packs. Encounter will be too much for you." I wouldn't overthink it too much. For sure, a shallower boat will be less affected by wind, but depth is good for waves, etc. FWIW, before I had the Encounter/Voyager, I paddled a 15" deep Wenonah C1W (16'), and paddled in some rough conditions, both loaded and empty. It worked, I had fun, I didn't dump, I made it to the takeouts. Except for 18-25 pounds of camera gear, I pack fairly light--less than 50 pounds for a 10 day trip, and I weigh 165. All three boats have worked for me. The one trip I did with the Encounter (5 days), I had no wind (great trip!), so whether it was too big a boat for me (!) I can't tell you. It paddled well and I had fun--absolutely no problems. Trim is critical for making solo boats paddle well in wind, but then trim is very easy to adjust with two packs (I use main pack in rear, day pack in bow)--you can just shove/pull the packs around, and my boats also have a sliding seat. |
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ducks |
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Dooger |
I recently bought a Northwind Solo. Reason being is I'm a big gut, 250#, and wanted a boat for a load. But, I also wanted a boat to fish out of when empty and a boat to maneuver small winding creeks/channels. The Magic just isn't my thing unless I wanna go relatively straight, quickly. That's not my style though. I'm half rec, half tripper. I fished out of the boat while empty recently in wind. I'll say it was a bit twitchy at first, but I overcame it within 10 minutes. Very enjoyable. The seat was too low for me though....as it is a common complaint. I cut the hangers two inches (my paddle seemed too long due to the seat height too). I will get it out again in next few days to see if my mod proves effective. I'm guessing I'll enjoy it a lot more. I'd say that the kneeling drops would have been way better for me, but I'm primarily a sitter. P.S. I sorta wonder if the seat is positioned so low due to the more recent popularity of using a double bladed paddle??? Personally not into that though. |
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Pinetree |
Marten: "Singleportage, A second pack helps to balance extremely for me. Yes I love my prism. |
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SinglePortage |
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Banksiana |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: "They must have changed the Superior One since I bought it. My compression straps only affect the thickness of the pack, not the width- the width is constant, determined by the seams of the pack." My packs are all 20+ years old. Try doing what I did. Tighten all of the straps all the way tight, THEN pack it. I will be shocked if you do not end up with an 18" wide by 13" deep pack. If you tighten the straps to a lesser amount you will end up with a wider pack. |
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SinglePortage |
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billconner |
Pinetree: "Prism here but surely check than all out. I like the Prism in the tractor seat,very stable. I would like t hear more about the SR solo." I had grown comfortable with my Q17 so I decided to rent a Tranquility for my first solo, from Doug Chapman. He said it was his wife's and she loved it. Three or four of the Q rangers also seemed very pleased with theirs. After loading it and getting in for the first time at the Beaver house landing, I had a few moments of doubt but in half an hour and for rest of trip it was very comfortable. Finally found an outfitter used one for a very good price. I only trip in BWCAW and Q, and have always been loaded with two packs. That is what I wanted it for. Comfortable at 4-5 mph, was easily faster than a Prism on a group solo but I don't care about speed. Did well on whitecaps on LLC. All in all, a great solo for me. What else can I tell you? |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: " If attempting to single carry I'll put everything in one pack- usually I carry a CCS Rucksack as a bow pack and double (my knees are no longer appreciative of the single carry)." On my last trip with my daughter we ended up with a few little loose things in the canoe so we doubled. I hated the extra time spent on the busy BWCA portages, but man it was easy on the back and knees. |
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KarlBAndersen1 |
I've waited a long time for it. |
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KarlBAndersen1 |
Pinetree: Yes I am a kayak paddle person also." Same here. |
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HansSolo |
MReid: "Look at the Wenonah Encounter and the Voyager. The Voyager is a rocket (modeled after the Minn II), and the Encounter is slightly shorter and wider, and designed for large loads. They paddle quite differently--Voyager is tender until loaded, and the Encounter is more stable (yet slower). My Encounter was 36 pounds, the Voyager is 37 pounds, Kevlar ultralight layup. Wenonahs tend to be a bit heavier than the competition." I'll second what MReid has said about the Wenonah Voyager and Encounter. A Kevlar Flex-Core Voyager has been my primary solo tripping canoe since 2004. Fast, seaworthy, and carries a decent load. It's also great for tripping on bigger wider rivers like the lower Wisconsin River as well. About 4-years ago I purchased a used Kevlar Flex-Core Encounter for my son. He loves it and it can handle our 90-pound Golden Retriever and gear quite easily. Prior to that, my son was using a "Goldenglass" Sawyer DY Special. The Sawyer DY is a great solo tripper as well IMHO, but doesn't have the load capacity of either the Voyager or the Encounter. The DY Special can also be a bit of a wet ride due to its low volume hull and sharp entry lines In 2015, I wanted to compare the tripping capabilities of the Encounter to my Voyager, so I used my son's Encounter on an August BWCAW solo trip of that year. It performed beautifully! It's every bit as seaworthy as my Voyager, if not more, and is more initially stable than my Voyager, but a bit slower as MReid mentioned. The initial stability of my Voyager has never been an issue for me though. I still prefer my Voyager, but the Encounter excels when when hauling an extensive load and/or taking a large dog. For what it's worth, the Encounter is one of the few solo canoes I know that can accommodate the width of a CCS Guide pack. A few pictures below of my Voyager, my son's Encounter and the DY Special in "Canoe Country" and on the lower Wisconsin River. (My Voyager has the white gel-coat and my son's Encounter has the clear skin coat.) Hans Solo |
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billconner |
Tranq with 2 packs. |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: " This is the solo I want to own." This looks like an amazing canoe! |
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Pinetree |
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SinglePortage |
Thanks Guys |
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ducks |
Test paddling a bunch to find out what you like is a great idea. If they have any Savage River canoes there make sure you try them out. Those things are super light. |
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MReid |
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bct |
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Ottertailvoyageur |
Although I still like the Prism, the Magic is now my solo canoe of choice. |
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TominMpls |
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Jaywalker |
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HappyHuskies |
In the past I've also owned a DY Special (my first solo) and an Advantage. Liked the DY Special just fine, but it was fiberglass and I sold it after paddling it for many years to get something lighter. The Advantage I only owned for two seasons. Nice enough boat, but just never jelled with it. If I was looking for a new boat I'd take a hard look at Savage River, but would not rule out Ted Bell's offerings either. Lot of other boats out there that I'm sure are nice, but those are the two companies I'm most drawn to right now. Good luck. I'm sure you'll find a boat that makes you smile! |
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billconner |
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Marten |
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billconner |
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OCDave |
My Northstar came with the sitting drops. Initially, I couldn't get comfortable. I now have the kneeling drops, even though I sit 80% of the time, I feel more stable and way more comfortable in the canoe. Good Luck with your purchase. |
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Wick |
I bought a placid spitfire for the bwca this summer. I am having a tough time sitting on the bottom of the canoe, as my legs go to sleep. The prism has adjustable tractor seat (i love that seat) and sits much higher. My son tried the spitfire, and now he never wants to paddle the prism. The attraction to the spitfire was its 20 lb weight and no maint unless you bust it. It turns very quickly. You just don’t know until you paddle something. |
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uiyyuc |
The Prospector series of canoes are a great "all" purpose canoe. But if your paddling plans do not include week long trips or rivers with class 3 rapids that can't be portaged around then don't buy a Prospector. If you are set on a NC prospector get the lite version. You probably don't need the regular layup for your usage. My NC Prospector is heavy and tough as they come... but I use it for everything... flat water and class 3 rocky rivers. |
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Banksiana |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: "Superior One is too much pack for the long, fast, narrow solos like the Advantage, Magic, Voyageur, Blackwater or Prism unless you travel with the pack upright on the bottom or side- makes a nice back rest but catches wind and reduces stability." I was planning on tightening the side compression straps all the way making the pack much narrower. The other option would be pulling my food pack out after each portage splitting the size and weight in two. What are the dimensions of the CCS pack? |
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sns |
Was very surprised at how good the Magic was for me...if I were buying today, it would be the Magic. The NW Solo was pretty great too, however - paddle them both. |
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Wick |
That made me smile more on my prism, as i just move my seat forward, throw the pack in,,done. I think it is very important to take a pack with weight to trial paddle a solo. Tandems are easy to pack. I bought my solos, then just lately am learning to pack them. Don’t be like me! |
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SinglePortage |
I guess that I forgot to mention that my trips are generally a week or more, and once I make camp I spend as much time fishing as I can. I am currently planning a 3-4 week trip to Woodland Caribou. |
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Bannock |
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Pinetree |
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Marten |
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Marten |
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Banksiana |
I 've used a Superior One a CCS Guide, a Granite Gear Solo and a Kondos Outfitter Special in my solo. The Kondos Outfitter is best suited for the job (the GG Solo fits even better but requires a strict gear list due to limited volume), I assume a CCS Pioneer would do well also as the CCS Guide is just ever so slightly too wide (If I pack it right it fits ok but it's easy to get it too wide and it catches). If attempting to single carry I'll put everything in one pack- usually I carry a CCS Rucksack as a bow pack and double (my knees are no longer appreciative of the single carry). As for trim the Advantage generally prefers to run stern heavy, I found the Prism similar- loading all my gear in one pack stashed just aft of the seat worked ok- still able to adjust with the slider. |
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Banksiana |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: "Tightening the compression straps will make it thinner (from back to front) but the width of the pack, gunwale to gunwale (pack down flat, harness up) is not changed by the compression straps (if anything tightening the side compression straps makes it wider)." I just unloaded my Superior One, tightened all eight compression straps, and then loaded it again. The pack ended up being 29" high, 17 1/2" wide and 13" deep. The trick is to tighten the compression straps while the pack is empty. Then when you load the pack it is forced to get narrow. I will likely buy a pack that is better suited for the task in the future, but for now this should work fine. Maybe I can trade one of my Superior One packs for a CCS or other narrow pack for my solo. |
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SinglePortage |
Banksiana: " This is the solo I want to own." I really like this canoe! I have never seen so many options available on a canoe, my mind is spinning. |
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SinglePortage |
Bannock: "Prism. Two packs. Encounter will be too much for you." Why would the encounter be too much for me? Sounds like a challenge to my manhood or something. A buddy of mine has a small chest pack that he clips to the D rings on the shoulder straps of his main pack while I carried my pack and my MN II. That might work for a light weight pack up front to trim the boat and I could single or double portage. |
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boonie |
SinglePortage: "Bannock: "Prism. Two packs. Encounter will be too much for you." I can tell you from experience with another canoe that you don't want a canoe that is too big for you and your load. It will sit up high on the water and present a big profile to the wind, which will push you around and make it a lot more work. Various online reviews suggest a minimum load for the Encounter of 350-400 lbs. How much will your maximum load (you & pack) be? |
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Lailoken |
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