Boundary Waters Quetico Forum :: Trip Planning Forum :: Hey Bear! That's My Food!
|
Author | Message Text | ||
DenisLemeiux |
Thinking about renting one instead of my Duluth pack . . . But if I gotta hang it, then might as well stick with big green! |
||
shock |
|
||
rdgbwca |
However, I think this video is relevant. bear encounter |
||
Grandma L |
|
||
Guest |
|
||
DenisLemeiux |
|
||
Schmoe |
|
||
boonie |
|
||
boonie |
|
||
johndku |
When we were on day trips or just fishing in the canoe, we took it with us, mostly to trim the canoe properly but also to prevent any curious critters from finding it. |
||
Arkansas Man |
Bruce |
||
OneMatch |
Woke up the next morning to a dragging sound and saw Mr Black Bear dragging my barrel off into the woods. Chased him a bit, and got "bluff charged" by him. Bear won. If I hadn't had the back pack straps on (for him to grab) and secured my barrel to a tree with a metal strap, I'd still have that barrel today. |
||
mjmkjun |
|
||
Renol |
|
||
boonie |
|
||
schweady |
quote boonie: "...Just stash it outside camp, off trails, but not on a rock at water's edge :). I usually set it next to a down tree, stump, or rock..." Fair enough, thanks. How about Ursack users? Stash? Hang? (I suppose not)... Strategies to keep the contents dry? Is the newer AllMitey worth the extra $$? |
||
boonie |
quote schweady: "quote boonie: "...Just stash it outside camp, off trails, but not on a rock at water's edge :). I usually set it next to a down tree, stump, or rock..." Yeah, I got an Ursack to save weight and bulk when kanoes did the big group buy with the discount. The Ursack can be carried off, unlike the bear canisters, so it needs to be attached to something. Plus, the Ursack bag material does not provide the same level of protection to the contents as the hard exterior of the bear canisters, but does reduce in volume as the contents diminish and is more conformable. A branch is recommended vs. tree trunk to reduce the bear's leverage. There's some good info and video on their site, I believe. Not as much water gets in as you might think and the material does not absorb a lot. They do recommend use of the OPSacks (OP = Odor Proof) and they also provide a waterproof barrier. I remember reading some discussion about the Allmitey question you pose, but don't remember the consensus. I think it was a thread somewhere on bwca.com, but don't remember for sure. I believe the Allmitey is bigger . . .?, so it might depend on the amount of food you have. I can get quite a lot (more than a week) in the standard one, but I take mostly dehydrated and calorie-dense, low bulk foods in more minimal packaging. I would guess you'd probably find a larger one useful. |
||
boonie |
quote Renol: "So I see a lot of recommendations for bear canisters. If only staying at a site for a night with all food and smelly stuff in scent proof bags is that enough?" If you are talking about the OPSacks, I'd still put the OPSacks in a dry bag or pack and at least stash that a little way outside of the main camp area. |
||
BnD |
|
||
schweady |
quote Bumstead: "...Best price I've found is Austin Canoe and Kayak with their monthly discount emails when you sign up for their newsletter." +1 Went with REI because it worked out to a few bucks cheaper than ACK, but I didn't factor in the fact that ACK doesn't charge sales tax for non-TX residents. I started to console myself with the REI dividend earned, but then I remembered that it's not awarded on these coupon sales... It's been a tricky week of working everyone's spring sales come-ons... :-) |
||
Renol |
quote boonie: "quote Renol: "So I see a lot of recommendations for bear canisters. If only staying at a site for a night with all food and smelly stuff in scent proof bags is that enough?" Yea those are the ones I was referring to. Appreciate the input. |
||
nctry |
quote BnD: "OK I'll jump in. We have a 60L Blue Barrel and GG harness. We have used it and not had any bear issues. Of course that could change next trip. However, I will add this, when we looked at ways to lighten our load and I actually weighed everything on a certified digital scale the 60L barrel plus harness weighed 9.5# empty. Wow, that had to go. So I looked at the bear canisters at 500 Cu In. that's 8.33 liters. That's not much for the weight 2.5#. We would need at least 2-3 canisters or 5#-7.5# of canisters. Long story, we're going back to hanging lightweight dry bags inside a sealine black canyon dry bag with our food to minimize odors, weatherproof, packable inside portage packs and lightweight comparatively speaking. Of course this is not bear proof at all but neither is a CCS, Duluth, kondos, etc.... foodpaif ck. My .02 Good Luck with your choice." I take two vaults, when I figure the rope and everything needed it wasn't enough weight savings. And the hanging trees? Most aren't anything worth hanging in. I'd still be stashing. I just like closing both eyes when I sleep. Haha. I quit using my food saver for most things. I get way more in my vaults now. Well to be fair I also trimmed my food some too. Most bears don't like my food... too much work to prepare. Haha. |
||
BnD |
|
||
mastertangler |
I am not a fan of OP saks and find the seals eventually get contaminated and or bent and they fail. I was not impressed. An interesting note (speaking of dry bags) the night we were under siege by a bear in Algonquin the bear batted around a small Sealine dry bag which was left in camp. It had a "butter accident" (butter had leaked out of its container and had contaminated the bag). Although the bear was curious it never ripped it open. I am a huge fan of the Watershed Duffels which have a ziplock type seal (supposedly waterproof to 30 ft of depth).........that is a tight seal. These are tripping bags deluxe and I highly recommend them. I use a combination of bear vaults and Ursak Bags and stash. Along with the Watershed Duffels I feel good about my chances. I have been clipped once of my entire food supply and that will get your attention. Fortunately it was on our last night out on Sawbill and the truck was 30 minutes away. |
||
BnD |
quote schweady: "quote Bumstead: "...Best price I've found is Austin Canoe and Kayak with their monthly discount emails when you sign up for their newsletter." Not to ruin your day but you can get them from Campsaver for 20% off plus free shipping plus no tax. Still really expensive for 11 liters of food storage in my book but I know everyone has their own style and preferences. |
||
ccterrell |
I know this thread is a few week old but just wanted to pass some thoughts on from my experiences with the BV500. My wife and I have used them on many backpacking trips. As far as expanding the vault capacity, what we typically do is put our first days worth of food and snacks in a dry bag to allow more room in the vault for food that needs to be kept secure for day 2 and beyond. All of our snacks get sorted and put into freezer zip lock bags, and then those backs get grouped and put into a larger bag to help conceal smells even more. Also, all of our trash goes into a freezer zip lock as well. If we eat a mountain house meal it gets rolled tightly and sealed with its seal and then placed in the trash bag. All of the trash gets put back in the vault. I just started some forums threads asking bout blue barrels and hanging them, but after reading these posts I think I'm going to stick to my true and trusted vault. Not sure what I'll do with my cookset though if it won't fit in...I think in the past I've hunnit on pre-established bear wires that are in western nation parks. One question: one of the guides mentioned packing them with food for "big" and food breakfasts etc...what kind of food are you packing? |
||
ockycamper |
The reason we use them is that they eliminate the need to hang or stash in the woods. The bear get a handle on them. I formerly brought Blue Barrells but moved over to the smaller Bear Vaults as I can organize them for one Bear Vault per day and I can see what's inside without opening them. Never liked the idea of the Ursack. Can be dragged off and didn't seem to be a good deterent to mice. As a guide. . .we bring one BV500 per day for our groups when they are 6-8 guys per camp. Again. . .we eat big breakfasts and dinners. No "survival" rations in our camps. |
||
schweady |
It's taken a real 180 degree turn in our thinking to challenge some of our solidly entrenched paradigms regarding the usual (time-consuming) tasks easily accomplished by a larger group -- stove cooking vs firewood collection and cooking over a fire, stashing vs hanging food, dehydrated vs fresh foods, etc. Looking forward to it, but it has been a bit of a shopping spree lately... :-) |
||
andym |
quote ockycamper Tie it to a tree, it is designed for that. Then, it can't be dragged off. Never had a problem with a mouse or squirrel getting into one, even at sites with many little critters. |
||
Grandma L |
|
||
LostRanger |
|
||
jeremylynn21 |
quote LostRanger: "Anyone try a 4" PVC ` 3' long, capped on both ends for food storage on one end with the other garbage? Bears should not be able to smell or get into the PVC, unless the know how to unscrew a cap. Have heard of one person doing this. Also wondering if it should be hung? Intresting. I think it would work just fine. Not sure how much food could be packed in it though. I'll make one for the heck of it. Endless supply of sch40 and all the fittings. |
||
schweady |
|
||
boonie |
There's a big difference (besides size :)) between the big blue plastic barrels that people are securing to a tree and the BearVaults you are contemplating. The blue barrels are not "approved" for use where bear resistant containers are required. BearVaults (BV) and other similar ones are. Link to information about testing protocols . More information about approvals and use is available at the various websites. The bear canisters like the BV and Backpackers Cache are designed so there's nothing for the bear to get ahold of and carry it off, so there's no need to secure it to anything. They are also made of material that the bear cannot just simply bite or claw through like they can with the blue barrels. They are round though and can be rolled around, so don't stash them where they could easily be knocked into the water or over a cliff. Just stash it outside camp, off trails, but not on a rock at water's edge :). I usually set it next to a down tree, stump, or rock. |
||
nctry |
|
||
boonie |
quote schweady: "Used my REI 20% this morning to start my BV500 collection. My wife and I will be doing a 3-day in mid-July so this one vault should suffice and then we can get a better feel for what might be right for larger groups or longer trips. You should easily be able to get the 6 person-days (2 people x 3 days) of food in the BV500 and that even assumes you'd have 3 breakfasts, 3 lunches/snacks, and 3 dinners each; even easier if you only have 2 breakfast and dinners. I can get 8-9 days of food in one, but it is stuffed. You may already have discovered in your research that there are tricks to it - some foods and packaging methods pack better. If you have any trouble, there are some tricks that people have shared. Just ask. |
||
lindylair |
The plan is to put them out in the woods 25 yards or so from camp, although i have read of some who just leave them sit right in camp. Hanging was never a real problem for us, we were always able to find something that would work and it was kind of a fun tradition. But I think, based on what I have read that our food is probably safer in the bear vaults stashed in the woods than it was in our tree hangs, some of which were perfect, but some of which were pretty marginal. Looking forward to the simplicity. |
||
mastertangler |
Indeed the simplicity of stashing is appealing. A few suggestions........Avoid the shoreline as that is a travel lane for most critters but especially bruins. I also try and avoid high ground as air sinks when its cool and can carry odors further. Rather, I look for blowdown or thick places just off easily traversed areas usually about 20 yards out of camp. It can be "easy" to forget where you stashed your food particularly if you are up before dawn. For that reason I use Runners reflector bands (meant to be wrapped around an ankle or wrist) and put them in the tree above my food. The velcro makes it a snap to mark your spot and the reflector shows up instantly when a light is on it for those predawn starts. Nothing more annoying than spending 20 minutes looking for your stashed food. Don't forget to retrieve your marker as well. |
||
boonie |
quote sns: "I don't hang the canisters. I don't think most dry bags are designed for prolonged submersion. |
||
boonie |
You should be able to get all your food in those, but packaging bulk and dead air space with the Mountain House meals were problems for me in the beginning. Solutions that people gave me were squeezing air out of the bags through a pinhole, then covering the pinhole with tape, or repackaging them into Ziploc bags. I also found that the Mountain House ProPacks, which were vacuum-packed, were like packing baseballs into the canisters and left a lot of dead space. I use a liner and am careful not to get food on it. I usually take them out of camp, but not far - about like you're planning. I do like the simplicity and ease compared to when I used to hang mine in a dry bag. |
||
sns |
Not to hijack, but has anyone ever tried a waterproof dry bag, with a heavy rock inside along with the food, submerged? Theoretically it should be a winner - as long as the bag is well & truly waterproof (& probably secured too...) |
||
Bumstead |
|