Hi everyone, I purchased a 1997 Bell Northstar this fall. My intention is to use as a tandem/ solo boat. My question is: I was considering removing the thwart in front of the stern seat and placing a seat where stern thwart was. Remove stern seat and replace a small thwart for structural support. Looking for ideas. Thanks Troy

Not sure I follow what you're trying to do.

Leave the existing stern seat in place and install the third seat so that the back of that seat is at the thwart position or slightly ahead by an inch or so. That way it will not interfere with the stern seat. You can remove the thwart altogether. Or you could just put in a kneeling thwart instead of a third seat. If you totally remove the stern seat the trim will be way off for tandem use. I've done this on two canoes with good results (Ranger and Northwind). In fact on my Ranger, the builder told me to do it that way.

quote jhb8426: "Leave the existing stern seat in place and install the third seat so that the back of that seat is at the thwart position or slightly ahead by an inch or so. That way it will not interfere with the stern seat. You can remove the thwart altogether. Or you could just put in a kneeling thwart instead of a third seat. If you totally remove the stern seat the trim will be way off for tandem use. I've done this on two canoes with good results (Ranger and Northwind). In fact on my Ranger, the builder told me to do it that way."

So I just had my Northwind out paddling with my wife and son. I used it to fish solo and found myself struggling with a stiff wind. I jumped up out of the stern seat and settled in front of the thwart and got on my knees. The trim was still off as the the wind seemed to slam into the exposed bow and it was indeed a struggle. I have a magic that I paddle solo. What am I doing wrong in the Northwind (which paddles beautifully wot my wife and 2 year old)?

Butch

quote golanibutch: "

quote jhb8426: "Leave the existing stern seat in place and install the third seat so that the back of that seat is at the thwart position or slightly ahead by an inch or so. That way it will not interfere with the stern seat. You can remove the thwart altogether. Or you could just put in a kneeling thwart instead of a third seat. If you totally remove the stern seat the trim will be way off for tandem use. I've done this on two canoes with good results (Ranger and Northwind). In fact on my Ranger, the builder told me to do it that way."

So I just had my Northwind out paddling with my wife and son. I used it to fish solo and found myself struggling with a stiff wind. I jumped up out of the stern seat and settled in front of the thwart and got on my knees. The trim was still off as the the wind seemed to slam into the exposed bow and it was indeed a struggle. I have a magic that I paddle solo. What am I doing wrong in the Northwind (which paddles beautifully wot my wife and 2 year old)?


Butch"

You might have to add a bit of weight to help with the trim. I have a small tandem canoe that I've paddled solo for years. When paddling solo, I sit in the bow seat facing the stern. In the stern, which is now the bow, I have a waterproof bag filled with water, under the seat. This balances the canoe, allowing me to paddle in windy conditions and because it is filled with water, the canoe would not sink if I flipped.

quote awbrown: "

quote golanibutch: "

quote jhb8426: "Leave the existing stern seat in place and install the third seat so that the back of that seat is at the thwart position or slightly ahead by an inch or so. That way it will not interfere with the stern seat. You can remove the thwart altogether. Or you could just put in a kneeling thwart instead of a third seat. If you totally remove the stern seat the trim will be way off for tandem use. I've done this on two canoes with good results (Ranger and Northwind). In fact on my Ranger, the builder told me to do it that way."

So I just had my Northwind out paddling with my wife and son. I used it to fish solo and found myself struggling with a stiff wind. I jumped up out of the stern seat and settled in front of the thwart and got on my knees. The trim was still off as the the wind seemed to slam into the exposed bow and it was indeed a struggle. I have a magic that I paddle solo. What am I doing wrong in the Northwind (which paddles beautifully wot my wife and 2 year old)?



Butch"

You might have to add a bit of weight to help with the trim. I have a small tandem canoe that I've paddled solo for years. When paddling solo, I sit in the bow seat facing the stern. In the stern, which is now the bow, I have a waterproof bag filled with water, under the seat. This balances the canoe, allowing me to paddle in windy conditions and because it is filled with water, the canoe would not sink if I flipped.

Appreciate the advice. I’m getting more solo time in with magic. I’m wondering if the lack of a tumble home and thus, a broad target for the wind, has much to do with it? It’s a 17ft Kevlar Northwind, really early year model I picked up that was in pristine condition before my trip this past year. But solo in that thing felt goofy as heck. Will try your position and report back. Thanks again.


"

quote golanibutch: "What am I doing wrong in the Northwind (which paddles beautifully wot my wife and 2 year old)?
Butch"

Sorry, I should have qualified the comment regarding the northwind. I did it but it doesn't work very well. At 17.5 ft I think it's just too big to paddle solo w/o a load. It acts like a big sail with no load in it. Any wind at all takes you all over the lake. On my Ranger (16 ft) it worked well and I'm thinking it would in a northstar as well. Adding ballast will help but you would really have to load it up in my opinion.

The Bell northwind does have tumblehome but it is still a big target for the wind. Do you have the Northstar model or the Bell model?

As far as moving to the front and paddling it stern first, that works ok with a symmetrical hull boat, but with a Bell northwind or northstar it would exaggerate the issue of the trim being off due to the swede-form hull.

Bell Northstar:
Did my First solo on 10/18-19, EP 77 South Hegman Lake,beautiful lake and weather, mid 60's. Wanted to keep it simple. Paddled from bow seat,knees draped over thwart.loaded gear in bow and headed out. Very little wind going out, the boat handled very well.The wind was gusty coming off lake, it grabbed the boat and put me side ways once, it happens really quick. All in all it went pretty well, could have had more weight in bow and it would have been better in the wind. Soloing is a whole different game, from getting into and out of boat, finding a good put in, take out spot, trimming boat. I was trying not to get a wet foot, that didn't happen, better than getting everything wet! I'll do it again, best way to learn is from doing it and paying attention to this site.

quote jhb8426: "

quote golanibutch: "What am I doing wrong in the Northwind (which paddles beautifully wot my wife and 2 year old)?
Butch"

Sorry, I should have qualified the comment regarding the northwind. I did it but it doesn't work very well. At 17.5 ft I think it's just too big to paddle solo w/o a load. It acts like a big sail with no load in it. Any wind at all takes you all over the lake. On my Ranger (16 ft) it worked well and I'm thinking it would in a northstar as well. Adding ballast will help but you would really have to load it up in my opinion.

The Bell northwind does have tumblehome but it is still a big target for the wind. Do you have the Northstar model or the Bell model?

As far as moving to the front and paddling it stern first, that works ok with a symmetrical hull boat, but with a Bell northwind or northstar it would exaggerate the issue of the trim being off due to the swede-form hull."

I have a Northwind, really early model though I can’t remember the year. I know it was picked up at Ted Bell’s garage. You’re right about the sail imagery. That thing jackes way up! Appreciate the feedback.

quote Wayouttroy: "Hi everyone, I purchased a 1997 Bell Northstar this fall. My intention is to use as a tandem/ solo boat. My question is: I was considering removing the thwart in front of the stern seat and placing a seat where stern thwart was. Remove stern seat and replace a small thwart for structural support. Looking for ideas. Thanks Troy"

I have done this, with this exact boat on my first solo. It works fine. The paddling station is a little WIDE and the size of the boat is taller and wider than most solo's so it is tuffer in the wind.

There are pictures on my album on this site if you look for awhile. My NorthStar was Blackgold.

I ordered a different seat from Eds Canoe Seats fyi.
I also saved everything and when I was done put the boat back to "normal"
Eventually bought a true solo

Have Fun
SunCatcher