Daughter 18, son 16 next year.

I have an ancient and reliable Osagian 18' expedition canoe with a 3.5 foot beam. I have spent countless hours in that baby and it can haul some stuff. We are not big people but we are leggy.

I do not want to put three people and all of our gear in it. I really hate fishing three from a canoe, so my plan is to take my sit on top kayak along as well. That will mean at least double portages everywhere.

Then, I think I will set up a schedule where we rotate positions daily like on a volleyball court. Kayak to front seat, front seat to back seat, back seat to kayak. That is Plan 1.

Plan 2 is that 1-3 of their cousins come and rent more canoes. Even if we do that, I think we will still plan to rotate paddle partners so everyone gets to spend some time with everyone and no one gets stuck with someone who doesn't know how to paddle (there will be a few) for the whole trip.

Has anyone ever done it that way?

On my one Boy Scout trip years ago, each canoe with 3 persons would rotate so the duffer was different each day.

Could always rent an actual 3 person canoe. some are pretty big. Otherwise I would find some more people to come with or take turns fishing. For travel days 3 to a canoe isn't bad at all. There are seats and things that can make sitting in the middle more comfortable. I worked for scouts and that is how we did it. I wouldn't call it wonderful but it beat double portaging. Just switch out who sits in middle at each portage.

What I have had trouble with on a Canoe plus Kayak trip is the amount of gear for 3 people that gets put in the Canoe. For portaging and packing the Canoe is just easier. If decide to try Canoe and Kayak then I would pack up all gear and make sure you are comfortable with fitting everything in the canoe.

I'm not a fan of rotating for the sake of rotating and switching up partners. Better to find a mix that works and stick with that. Every time you switch things up, each boat has to readjust to each other- paddling cooperation, packing gear, who grabs what at each portage.

Usually mixing a more experienced with a lesser in each boat works the best. If the 2 weakest end up in one boat and the 2 strongest paddlers in the other...all sorts of problems could development.

We have had the entire family of 4 in our big aluminum so I know we will all fit. I have an old hammock strap that serves as a seat in the middle.

My concern was whether a third plus all the gear would fit in the middle.

Several concerns and considerations about rotating. 1) Whichever kid is with me is advantaged for fishing. I position the canoe, direct the person in front on what to do, how to work the lure, which lure to use. I still seem to catch more fish than everyone else, but one kid might feel like he or she is getting the same attention.

2) when I was growing up, my dad was in the back of the canoe. I didn't learn how to effectively run the back until I started going on my own. I would go out with friends, everyone knew I had thousands of hours in a canoe, but i still couldn't steer the darn thing! So I want the kids to experts in every position on the canoe and rotating is the only way I can think to do that. We have done day trips and some lake canoeing but that has always been with the 4 of us in the canoe and, like my dad, I have always been in the back.

3) these 2 kids squabble a lot when they are in our person kayak. My son overpowers my daughter's stroke then complains that they are going all over the place. Or all he wants to do is fish and my daughter gets bored and impatient. Like we say in the Army, nothing builds espirit d' corps like common suffering. So, I want to give them some wilderness time together without dad there managing everything.

As for taking a kayak...I am really torn on this. 1) I love fishing from my kayak. I wake up at zero dark thirty and I am afraid these teenagers, who are sleep till nooners, are probably gonna drive me crazy by sleeping in. In my kayak, I can go out before breakfast by myself.

I have done my big canoe by myself, i just sit backwards in front, but it has always been a little wind sensitive. I weight 40 more pounds than back then, so I will probably spin like a compass in even a minor breeze.

When my dad and I would go on trips, we always had the worst camping gear. "We came to fish, we are gonna fish!" "Can't catch fish if you ain't fishin'!" We hardly ever spent anytime on land. Shorelunch, dinner, sleep. that was it.

While that gave my character a +1 for misery, I want this to be a great and relaxing, and memorable trip that they will want to do with me every year.

So I am thinking base camp on Horseshoe for 2 days, Gaskin for 2 days, and camp on Caribou the last night.