Anyone else find loud talkers in the Q/BWCA irritating? I just came back from a two week trip in the Quetico, and several times I got irritated by blabbermouths.

First time we had just pulled into a campsite, and a group of about 6 guys pulled into the site just across the bay and started blabbing away. I could sit there and listen to what they were saying. I know they saw us too, since they first headed for our site. I guess if you want to talk, that's your right, but stop and consider your neighbors.

Also had a loud group across from us on Russell. Actually not that loud in terms of hooting and hollering, but at least one chatterbox. They were a half a mile a way, but once the wind goes down voices carry.

Ran into a group on upper Sturgeon who spent a lot of time just seeming to drift while one of the guys talked CONTINUALLY to the other canoe. Could hear it over the whole lake.

Geez, I don't really get it. You pay the Quetico prices for solitude, you work your butt off to get into the back country, don't you want to sit and listen to the loons, the wind in the pines, the waves on the shore? I guess there's nothing that can really be done about it. I guess it's a blessing that I'm losing my hearing!

Yes, your on the right track - losing your hearing will solve that, but it does come with disadvantages. :)

A larger group will just naturally multiply noise compared to a solo or tandem.

Just get over it. Other people are there to have fun too. There are plenty of lakes that you can have all to yourself. Maybe you were on the wrong lakes or just were unlucky that week. Or the breeze was blowing the wrong way. Being annoyed is a choice. That is the way I look at it anymore. Cheers.

I also get annoyed by "excessive" noise, but if it's just folks talking around the fire, laughing, etc., I can deal with it pretty easily.

My last trip there was a group of six young men who were literally yelling well after dark. They were playing some sort of game in camp, and the camps were fairly close together, so I could hear every word, alas. Thankfully, a storm rolled through, which sent them to their tents for the evening, and we were gone the next morning.

That is indeed annoying. You have to remember that people go to the BWCAW and Quetico for different reasons. You and I want solitude and quiet reflection. But some are there for the fishing or to party and socialize with their friends. Many visitors to BWCAW are newbies and may not understand the etiquette or just don't care. It is what it is. I try to find campsites that have more separation from the neighboring campsites. Sometimes that doesn't work out and I have to deal with noisy neighbors. Barking dogs, rattling pots and pans, parents yelling at their kids. The key to increase your odds of solitude is to find dead end lakes or lakes off the main routes. Also find those lonely campsites in the isolated bays. And then when all of that fails then go to Woodland Caribou Provincial Park. You won't have any noisy neighbors in WCPP because you won't have any neighbors at all.

scat: "Just get over it. Other people are there to have fun too. There are plenty of lakes that you can have all to yourself. Maybe you were on the wrong lakes or just were unlucky that week. Or the breeze was blowing the wrong way. Being annoyed is a choice. That is the way I look at it anymore. Cheers."

+1
Now people can't talk in the Quetico/BWCA. Wow! Where does it end? I don't like people fishing around me, but hearing people talk (no guitars, radios, or obnoxious yelling) Geez, just relax.

Carry ear plugs.

Most people just don't understand how far sound can travel, or just don't think about it.
One of the few times I every give people the benefit of the doubt.

The one good side to that fact is still one of my best memories of tripping. Once when my daughter was a young teen she went to the shore at about dusk and yelled "Marco" almost immediately we heard "Polo" come drifting across the water. We both had a good laugh and appreciated that somewhere out there was someone with a great sense of humor.

I wish there was some socially/politically correct way to let people understand when they do this.

It's probably safe to say they aren't doing it on purpose, and have no idea how irritating and needless it is to be so loud... they just don't know any better.


I experience this all the time, paddling, hiking, camping, etc. It's funny because I can be on a lake with a whole bunch of quiet people and it's a better time than being on a lake with just one other boat with one loud person. Most people seem to "get it" but there's eventually going to be someone who is just extremely loud for no reason. If I can hear you clearly from a mile away, the person 4 feet from you certainly can as well...

Ironically, I'm pretty sure if the tables were turned, they would notice how some other person was ruining their beautiful trip by being excessively loud as well.


I don't think there's a solution to this, I wish there was because we all enjoy the peacefulness of the outdoors and I think most everyone finds it at least a bit less enjoyable when someone is being really loud... even the person who is being really loud - they just don't realize they are being that person to others.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT! :-o

alpinebrule: "Most people just don't understand how far sound can travel, or just don't think about it.
One of the few times I every give people the benefit of the doubt.


The one good side to that fact is still one of my best memories of tripping. Once when my daughter was a young teen she went to the shore at about dusk and yelled "Marco" almost immediately we heard "Polo" come drifting across the water. We both had a good laugh and appreciated that somewhere out there was someone with a great sense of humor. "

Most people on this site would think that is terrible for her yell "Marco." I think that is a great memory:)

jcavenagh: "I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT! :-o"

Hahahahahaha! Eat it or go to a "real" wilderness with JC. Complaining accomplishes NOTHING.

You need to go farther north into Canada.

Zwater: "

alpinebrule: "Most people just don't understand how far sound can travel, or just don't think about it.
One of the few times I every give people the benefit of the doubt.



The one good side to that fact is still one of my best memories of tripping. Once when my daughter was a young teen she went to the shore at about dusk and yelled "Marco" almost immediately we heard "Polo" come drifting across the water. We both had a good laugh and appreciated that somewhere out there was someone with a great sense of humor. "

Most people on this site would think that is terrible for her yell "Marco." I think that is a great memory:)"

Maybe yelling "Marco" would be a good way to let another group know that you are there and can hear them.

I spent eight nights in the Q in July and was for the most part impressed with the quiet of folks. Of the eight nights I had to "share" lakes with different groups on three nights. The first time a group of six (from Widjiwagan I think) pulled into the lake late in the day and took a camp fairly close to me but I could hardly tell they were there. There was a camp set up on Ted when I rolled in- I assumed it was a soloist because I only ever saw one guy and never heard a peep despite being down wind and within sight (about a mile). I was surprised to see two canoes and five people leave the next morning. The other group (nine from the scout base) talked a fair amount but were never loud (especially considering the size of the group)- not to mention that their leader met me 2/3's of the way across the first portage carrying my pack (good deed for the day!).

some people are just plain loud all the time. they do not know any better. adrenaline,
excitement, it's a noisy world that get's brought into quiet places.
i have moved camp before and made my environment quieter.
it is annoying though.

At 6am, two guys fishing off my campsite woke me up with their loudness.

You can say I'm being too picky with this request, but have some respect for where others are staying, esp. in the early hours of morning.

They didn't much like it when I told them how exceedingly annoying they were.

I think if big talkers realized how far their conversations carried in calm conditions , they would put a lid on it. I have a place on a popular fishing lake. Sometimes for entertainment, I listen to the conversations going on out there while sitting at the campfire. You can hear a lot, and some of it should be embarrassing to the talker. Some of it could be incendiary if the wrong person or group of people heard it.

marsonite, beware. As one's hearing diminishes there is a tendency to compensate by increasing one's own volume of speech. We are no longer hearing our own vocalizations as effectively within our own skulls so we are adapting by talking louder. A 'trickster', if you will.

Ear plugs are a camper's best ally in those situations of loud talkers, non-stop yakkers and car door slammers (national parks).

mjmkjun: "marsonite, beware. As one's hearing diminishes there is a tendency to compensate by increasing one's own volume of speech. We are no longer hearing our own vocalizations as effectively within our own skulls so we are adapting by talking louder. A 'trickster', if you will.


Ear plugs are a camper's best ally in those situations of loud talkers, non-stop yakkers and car door slammers (national parks). "!$/i
This is true, marsonite. Once you decide to get the hearing aids, people will tell you that you talk so softly now that they can't hear you . . . :)

If you shared Alpine, the area around Englishman's Island on Sag, and the area around Fishhook Island on Seagull with me and my kids last week chances are good that you heard them. They're loud, especially the 6 year old. Sorry if it ruined your trip. I was happy they were getting along.
(this is not directed at anyone in particular in this thread)

I'd expect a greater degree of quietness deeper into the BW or in the Q, but ultimately when people are out on a vacation with their buddies they're going to talk. Many don't know/care about how well sound travels across open water.

So now I guess we should start a "grassroots movement" for only allowing whispering in the Quetico/BWCA?

After the third encore of Kumbaya was started up by church group across the lake, I put in the ear buds to listen to some devil's music. :)

I don't expect solitude in the BW, and I bring earplugs to deal with the loud late night campfire talkers in my own group, not to mention the forthcoming heavy snoring.

It is what it is, I try and not let that which I cannot control get to me.

I've lived on a city park for the last 24 years, if I let the sounds of other people having fun and enjoying themselves get to me, I'd be pretty darn ornery by now.

sueb2b: "At 6am, two guys fishing off my campsite woke me up with their loudness.


You can say I'm being too picky with this request, but have some respect for where others are staying, esp. in the early hours of morning.


They didn't much like it when I told them how exceedingly annoying they were."

YES , that is a bit over the top. people do like to have fun around a campfire , as many have stated on a calm night sound does travel .

marsonite: "Anyone else find loud talkers in the Q/BWCA irritating"

Hell, I find them irritating outside of natural environments! The guy going deaf in the cubical farm ensures that I spend my time at the office with headphones on, whether I'm listening to music or not. The problem with earplugs in a natural setting is now you can't hear nature.

I find the noise of kids playing and laughing more tolerable than the noise of screaming parents and crying and whining kids, but in the end I can't do much about either, so I try to let it just let it go. For offenders in my own party I talk softer hoping they catch on (some do), I'll wince and give them the softer sign, I'll shush them and "did you hear that?", and/or ask them to try to talk quieter.

Loud talkers anywhere drive me nuts. We've got a couple "yell talkers" at work and its almost unbearable some days. Even through my closed office door I can hear them and have to play music to drown them out. If they were ever in the BWCA I'd assume people from 3 lakes away would paddle over to tell them to shut up.

This is a big part of the reason why all of my trips are with the same person. Many days we barely talk at all as we are off doing our own thing. We also have no problem taking a less desirable campsite in order to get a little further away from people.

Those of you with the mocking "banning talking" in the BWCA responses are missing the point.

Yes, noise travels over water much further than people understand. And yes, people will talk in the BWCA/Q. And yes, I will hear some of it. But I think it's OK to find irritation with those groups of two, three or four canoes who have to yell "which way are we going?" or "Hey, Ryan's a dick" (from some canoeing scouts on Moose Lake) rather than paddle their craft closer so as to display even a modicum of consideration to others. Aside from averting or attending to an emergency, there's no reason why one needs to yell like that. I just don't get it.

I understand that people will talk, and I will hear it. I don't mind talking or hearing it, but yelling out of laziness is another thing. Also, making noise to make noise, or the primal screams after a few shots, is just stupid. On a Wood Lake solo last year, a girl passed by my camp singing "99 bottles of beer on the wall," to herself, and not in a library voice. (She was on bottle 86, by the way.) Her stern paddler was quiet. Again, noise to make noise.

Overall, it's people's lack of consideration and lack of awareness of anyone else outside of themselves that is all too common today, in all kinds of contexts.

Mike

The OP was not talking about yelling, hooting or hollering. They stated that they heard someone talking a lot, a "chatterbox." I go to the BWCA with some friends I haven't seen in awhile. We talk a lot to catch up on life. Nothing louder than a normal conversation. I will continue to "talk" to my buddies in the Boundary waters. Sorry if that offends anyone.

Just have a loud demented conversation about" where are we going to bury the body this time"type thing. If you're solo you'll have to use a disguised voice. Have some fun with it. It might quiet things down

I would trade my hearing loss any day for the chance to be annoyed by loud talkers. Instead I get annoyed by soft talkers and mumblers..even with hearing aids I have to keep asking them to repeat themselves. Without my hearing aids birds and frogs and all kinds of sounds disappear.

deerfoot: "You need to go farther north into Canada."

I was at a place in Canada in May that besides my son we heard no other voices.

The neat thing was we drove with in a 100 feet of the lake.

After my Canadian friends left we didn't hear or see another person.

The man made fake wilderness of the BWCA is not the place to go to be alone.

In June we had a lake all to ourselves in the BW. Good fishing, awesome campsite. Was right off a well traveled route. Just tucked off to the side a bit. Never saw, nor relevant to this, heard a soul. Until we ventured out to look at pictos. I’m keeping that one a secret.

"The man made fake wilderness of the BWCA is not the place to go to be alone"
BINGO! It's still one of my favorite places though.

I totally agree with that. Well said. There are always people around. That’s what I don’t get it when people are all freaked out about sat phones, leaving their itinerary with loved ones etc. The wilderness thing is a tad over played. I honestly feel safer in the BW than I do on the drive up. Once I put in my worries are over. It is an awesome place to go canoe camping. Fishing, hanging out with friends. People don’t bother me. Let it be.

I did get to listen to two rather inebriated gentlemen on Murdoch (WCPP) as they stood on the dock of the outfitter's outpost cabin, trying to howl for wolves. I could hear them discussing it from a couple of miles away. It was actually pretty funny.

I will add this. I’ve done 4-5 solos. I don’t care for it. I would rather be with other cool people and share the experience. I always say hi to other trippers, some seem offended by this. Not many, but some. I understand the solo mentality, wanting to have time to yourself to reflect or whatever, but it’s not for me. What’s the point of catching a musky on East Pike Lake if nobody else is there to see it? Some people are loud and obnoxious, but they go away, or you can get away from them.
And lastly, I don’t think the people of ‘today’ are any more inconsiderate than those of yesteryear. Get real. I recently had to answer some security questions to set up email on my new phone. One of the questions was, who was your best friend in high school. I had to chuckle. My first thought was, I didn’t have any friends in high school. There were guys I hung out with and played sports with but they were all a bunch of jerks mostly. These days they preach respect and courtesy in high school. ‘Back in the day’ it was like dog eat dog. Nobody respected you unless you could fight back. And I don’t think it was any easier when my dad was in high school. Or back when Cain and Abel were toting their Snoopy lunchboxes to third grade lessons. If that makes any sense. There have always been jerks, always will be. If you let them bother you, that is your choice. It’s like the guy behind you at a red light that honks because you didn’t step on the gas pedal immediately. You just start real slow, and when he gets next to you to pass, start to pick your nose. Victory!

FlambeauForest: "
"The man made fake wilderness of the BWCA is not the place to go to be alone"
BINGO! It's still one of my favorite places though. "

My thoughts exactly! The people that like to delude themselves that they are in a pristine wilderness and get offended by people talking , or according to another thread, leaving to much courtesy wood piled up are in the wrong spot. Throw in the noise of a passing motor boat and the horror is compounded. If your outdoor experience is fragile enough to be ruined by these things, the sheer number of users in the BWCA every year should make you look elsewhere. Those pristine places where you can have solitude exist but unlike the BWCA they won't be convenient to get to.

It's just me, but I don.t even like loud talkers in MY group. If I hear it from another group...so be it. I guess we need to travel farther in.

I find "loud talkers," as originally stated, annoying in general. I carry earplugs; it is a simple bandaid solution to a temporary problem. If it was a situation where it was necessary to directly interact with someone who is constantly loud and does not respect the conversational space (ie, a chronic rather than temporary problem), then a conversation would most likely occur.

When I get annoyed about this type of thing, I try to remember that we all have parts of our personality that some others will find annoying or abrasive. I know I am a long way from being a saint, but also know that I am capable of evolving and learning to be a better member of the human race.

FlambeauForest: "
"The man made fake wilderness of the BWCA is not the place to go to be alone"
BINGO! It's still one of my favorite places though. "

I manage to seek and find solitude and quietness in the 'regulated' wilderness.
(stealth (stelth) n. 1. The act of moving, proceeding, or acting in a covert way.)

I've been watching this thread for days, finally had to chime in. The best teacher I ever worked with tells kids, "99% of your happiness in life is due to where you set your expectations". People who hike the AT hoping for complete solitude are bound to be disappointed. People who enter the BWCA with 250,000 other people, planning for complete silence and solitude will also be disappointed. That's on you, and you can adjust your expectations or not. Having rambunctious and awesome kids, I've had to adjust many of my expectations. I remember getting frustrated that "fishing" (my favorite pastime) turned into helping OTHER people fish nonstop; once I accepted that my happiness, patience, and satisfaction improved. Teaching them to do the things I love means I get to do the things I love WITH them for years to come. Now my kids all tie their own knots, change lures, remove fish on their own, and I get to fish a lot more. I get to sit with my daughter in a treestand. I only harvested one deer last year, a doe, because my 13 y/o son was skilled enough to take two.

I apologize, in advance and for past transgressions for my loud, happy, excited, cranky, angry, family. There, did my due diligence lol. Some of us like to let loose and enjoy ourselves, and the BW facilitates that. We will enjoy peace and solitude at times. We'll scream like crazy people as we jump off of rocks, whoops, another thing we're not supposed to do. We'll hoot and holler when we get a big fish into the boat. We'll sing songs as we paddle to pass the time and try to take our kids' minds off of the long painful day. My youngest will talk your ears off if she runs into you at a portage, no stopping that. I might ask you how the fishing is. We'll sing around the campfire. We'll also shush our kids if they are loud and it looks like there are people nearby. We'll be respectful as possible, we actively teach our kids about BW etiquette - but really - when trying to keep a family group happy, with young kids and adults who are enjoying their one summer vacation, telling everyone to be silent all day just ain't gonna happen. Heaven help the traveler that tries to shush my wife. It'll be quiet enough when they all leave the nest, until then I'm going to spend my vacation talking with my kids as much as I can. I'm sure my perspective will change as I age and head out into the BW alone with my wife...but I hope someday my kids bring us along with their loud kids too.

I guess it's in the title here "loud talkers"... I don't like it either, but I also like people. Some are actually entertaining. Once I heard a young gal yell Marco... I'm kidding.
Enjoy where your at in any and all circumstances. Deal with what your dealt... Some people talk loud... Some not loud enough... If quiet is what your after there are alternative places to paddle. But I think you'll be disappointed wherever you go.
Not everyone shares the idea that quiet is good... My neighbor kids have dirt bikes... They can be annoying... But I bet I was annoying too and still am. I drive a stinky old deisel truck... Some find that annoying. I sometimes I sing... Everyone thinks that is annoying. But fart and everyone laughs.

scotttimm: "I've been watching this thread for days, finally had to chime in. The best teacher I ever worked with tells kids, "99% of your happiness in life is due to where you set your expectations". People who hike the AT hoping for complete solitude are bound to be disappointed. People who enter the BWCA with 250,000 other people, planning for complete silence and solitude will also be disappointed. That's on you, and you can adjust your expectations or not. Having rambunctious and awesome kids, I've had to adjust many of my expectations. I remember getting frustrated that "fishing" (my favorite pastime) turned into helping OTHER people fish nonstop; once I accepted that my happiness, patience, and satisfaction improved. Teaching them to do the things I love means I get to do the things I love WITH them for years to come. Now my kids all tie their own knots, change lures, remove fish on their own, and I get to fish a lot more. I get to sit with my daughter in a treestand. I only harvested one deer last year, a doe, because my 13 y/o son was skilled enough to take two.


I apologize, in advance and for past transgressions for my loud, happy, excited, cranky, angry, family. There, did my due diligence lol. Some of us like to let loose and enjoy ourselves, and the BW facilitates that. We will enjoy peace and solitude at times. We'll scream like crazy people as we jump off of rocks, whoops, another thing we're not supposed to do. We'll hoot and holler when we get a big fish into the boat. We'll sing songs as we paddle to pass the time and try to take our kids' minds off of the long painful day. My youngest will talk your ears off if she runs into you at a portage, no stopping that. I might ask you how the fishing is. We'll sing around the campfire. We'll also shush our kids if they are loud and it looks like there are people nearby. We'll be respectful as possible, we actively teach our kids about BW etiquette - but really - when trying to keep a family group happy, with young kids and adults who are enjoying their one summer vacation, telling everyone to be silent all day just ain't gonna happen. Heaven help the traveler that tries to shush my wife. It'll be quiet enough when they all leave the nest, until then I'm going to spend my vacation talking with my kids as much as I can. I'm sure my perspective will change as I age and head out into the BW alone with my wife...but I hope someday my kids bring us along with their loud kids too."

I, too, have been watching this thread for days, scotttimm, and I think I will chime in now. It has given me "food for thought" a great deal. First, because I am, by nature, a "loud talker". I have been told by friends and acquaintances that I am too boisterous, too explosive, too demonstrative, and too noisy on more than a few occasions. In the canoe country I try to temper my voice, and actually Spartan1 (a naturally quiet person) and I rarely talk while paddling. I am a professional musician and choir teacher, but I never sing out loud in the canoe or on a portage, just in my head. I always went on canoe trips, be it BWCA, Quetico, Algonquin, Temagami, or wherever. . .for the enjoyment of the sounds of nature as much as for the sights and the experiences.

But sometimes I am sure I have made more noise with my voice than I should have. I have called out, laughed, or talked loudly. It happens.

I loved hearing about your family, scotttimm. You are exactly the kind of people that the BWCA needs, and I cannot imagine being annoyed by the sounds of your family having a good time there. Unless, of course, you are making a LOT of noise at 2 AM! :-) The only times I ever remember being super-annoyed and downright irritated by other campers' noises was (1) on Square Lake when a group of guys had a keg party that went on for a few hours after midnight and just got louder and louder. They, too, were just enjoying themselves and having fun. But after awhile I became very tired and really, really wanted to get some sleep! Even ear plugs didn't do the trick! (There are only two campsites on Square Lake, and they aren't that far apart, unfortunately.) (2) On Gaskin when an inebriated camper (I'm guessing here from the additional chatter) insisted on howling at the full moon for a very long time after midnight. Wasn't as funny to us as he was to his companions. :-(

We have been on many a lake when we were the only campers on that lake. It is wonderful to enjoy that peaceful silence. But we never expected that in the BWCA, and it was just a treat if it happened. Seeing people on a portage was often expected, and a friendly greeting was always returned. While I prefer that people not sing while paddling, and I don't do it myself (aloud), I would never be offended. Happy sounds, especially those of young people, are always much preferred to rude, unpleasant ones.

And as been said in this thread already: there is very little true wilderness left in the U. S. anymore. The BWCA isn't a true wilderness. It is just a very good place to go canoeing. Enjoy!

Exactly! +1000 Spartan2

I was paddling a lake in June and a group of teens with two leaders were at a camp site yelling and screaming as they jumped off the cliff at the front of their site into the water. At first I started to think 'how rude', then I thought about those young boys thinking back to the trip where they had the camp site with the cliff and how much fun they had and I laughed at myself.

One question for the OP. What % of time on your trip did you hear other humans talking? Likely a low %. Why not dwell on the hours of time where you could hear nothing but nature?

I am leaning to find peace and solitude on my local river. Savoring the short periods of time between the car going by, or the tractor. I try hard to hear the natural sounds around me over the sounds of civilization.

How the tables have turned. I think we can all agree. People talking and hearing kids having fun is acceptable in the BWCA. If not, go to WCPP. Enough said.

Exactly. Well said

I would like to add that I did answer that security question. My best friend in high school was Tom Cooper. And through college and a couple years after that. Then he moved to California. I’m not sure how great of a friend he was though, we sure got into a lot of trouble together. I may as well add I went to an all boys high school, so that environment may have exacerbated the situation.
Ever hear that Howlin Wolf song, something like, my friends are no good for me, all they do is bring me down. My friends don’t like me, don’t like the way I do. I hear ya Wolf! That’s the way it was ‘back in the day’.
Me and Coop were canoe partners on an Outward trip on the 11 Point River in the Ozarks after our senior year. I got stories... he was, and I’m sure still is, one interesting dude.
Sorry for getting off track. I was trying to make a point somewhere along the way.

Ssshhh...... not so loud... nobody cares...

Well, I started this, so I get the last word, ha ha! Interesting to read all the reactions. Gee, I would have no expectations of quiet in a lot of the BWCA (even though the introduction video they make you watch makes the point that sound travels very well over water and to be considerate of others, but obviously some of you are ignoring that.). I was in the interior of the Quetico though. Actually we would have gone to WCPP but it was sort of on fire. And the only incident that really irritated me was the group that pulled up to a camp about 300 feet away, knowing full well that an older quiet couple was near by, and start blabbing and yelling. That's just plain inconsiderate. Can't think of another word for that.

Oh well, nothing to be done about it anyway. People all go up there for all sorts of different reasons and I guess in the end I'm glad they all enjoy it.

In your first post, you said nothing of people yelling. Just about "blabbermouths" That is a different story. I will talk with my friends as long as I trip with them.

I wish I would have taken a picture of a bumper sticker I saw yesterday while stuck in Chicago downtown traffic. It was close to , The older I get, the more I want to tell people to F off. I am paraphrasing, but I’m not too far off. I don’t plan on getting that way. I almost died of cancer. I actually like people. I get a kick out of goof balls. Some people are loud. As long as they are good at heart, I can live with it.

scat: "I wish I would have taken a picture of a bumper sticker I saw yesterday while stuck in Chicago downtown traffic. It was close to , The older I get, the more I want to tell people to F off. I am paraphrasing, but I’m not too far off. I don’t plan on getting that way. I almost died of cancer. I actually like people. I get a kick out of goof balls. Some people are loud. As long as they are good at heart, I can live with it.
"

Tolerance, the sign of a mature individual. Good for you.

scat: "I wish I would have taken a picture of a bumper sticker I saw yesterday while stuck in Chicago downtown traffic. It was close to , The older I get, the more I want to tell people to F off. I am paraphrasing, but I’m not too far off. I don’t plan on getting that way. I almost died of cancer. I actually like people. I get a kick out of goof balls. Some people are loud. As long as they are good at heart, I can live with it.
"

A lot of times I really don't understand your posts:) My Father passed away from cancer 6 years ago. Congrats on beating it!!

I'm guessing if any of us has a true emergency, we'd love to hear some nearby voices.

When I go to Quetico, BWCA, or other wilderness I am there for the fresh air but many times it is ruined by people with camp fires, should I start another thread complaining about all the times my experience was ruined by someone building a camp fire? breathing all that fresh air, and then someone ruins it by building a fire, damn people!

Seinfeld: "When I go to Quetico, BWCA, or other wilderness I am there for the fresh air but many times it is ruined by people with camp fires, should I start another thread complaining about all the times my experience was ruined by someone building a camp fire? breathing all that fresh air, and then someone ruins it by building a fire, damn people!"

Haha. Agree. Start a new thread. "Ban campfires"

Seinfeld: "When I go to Quetico, BWCA, or other wilderness I am there for the fresh air but many times it is ruined by people with camp fires, should I start another thread complaining about all the times my experience was ruined by someone building a camp fire? breathing all that fresh air, and then someone ruins it by building a fire, damn people!"

That's why I only go during fire bans.

I don't know, i think it's reasonable to self-monitor our noise levels out there....but if I hear that guy yell "polo!" one more time from across the lake ... :)

Seinfeld: "When I go to Quetico, BWCA, or other wilderness I am there for the fresh air but many times it is ruined by people with camp fires, should I start another thread complaining about all the times my experience was ruined by someone building a camp fire? breathing all that fresh air, and then someone ruins it by building a fire, damn people!"

My big pet peeve is flashlights. Those headlights... Yikes! Some of those campsites look like old car lots when they used to have those spot lights... :)

If you can't tolerate a group having fun, move. If someone is offended if you say hi, don't give them a second look. We all go into the BW or Q to enjoy the experience. If you are offended by someone talking to loud and you want solidtude go to a monistary.

I would either put in earplugs or move to another lake.

Why isn’t noise pollution part of the “leave no trace “ mantra? And light pollution too? Not alerting the wildlife to my location is always a priority for me

A perfect world it is not....
Don't sweat the small stuff...

A perfect world it is not....
Don't sweat the small stuff...

Psst. You don't pay the prices for Quetico for the solitude. .
You pay to enter the park....

From Ontario Parks - Quetico Regulations

Noise: Enhance your own experience and the experience of others by keeping noise to a minimum. We also encourage all aircraft to fly 4000 ft. above sea level when possible to help reduce noise levels.

Just saying.

When the two 10-year olds tried to teach 4 adults how to do the floss dance, things did get loud.

Sorry-not-sorry

I know this thread is about loud talkers, but I can't resist...

Man, do the loons really make a racket...they wake me up all the time when I trip and it's still dark out. They don't seem to have a sense of what time it is or that people are sleeping...aahweeehooo! And don't get me started on those Barred owls with their "who cooks for you all" b.s. when I'm trying to fall asleep. Nobody does, I'm the cook, they can keep on asking as they do...but the answer is the same.

I probably wake up talking, but I don't make a racket till I've got a fish on. I usually paddle with 1 other person, so we're quiet. We go out far, so we don't usually see families when we camp. I don't have kids, but I love that they are out there making memories with their big families. I was a kid too. The scouts with their flotillas, have at it. I prefer the kids noise & dog noise over the parents/owners (adults) yelling like crazy at them. This weekend I paddled small creeks with a big group in the rain & some of us sang "raindrops keep falling on my head" with giant smiles on our faces, no one was around because of the rain...does that mean no one heard us?

"I'm never gonna stop the rain by complaining...
Because I'm free...nothing's worrying me..."

I don't mind sharing space with others. I don't mind people making noise at their camp. They're there to have fun.

As long as they keep it quiet after sundown... once the sun goes down, the volume needs to go down too.

On a backpacking trip in British Columbia, we found ourselves camped at a lake with 2 or 3 other groups, one of which was a large group of teens and tweens from the YMCA of the Rockies, with a 2 or 3 leaders/chaperones. They were noisy in the afternoon, but it was ok. They were having fun and they weren't obnoxious. But the group leaders were good about keeping a lid on the sound once the sun went down (which was about 10:30pm that far north in August.) They were silent from sundown to well after sun-up.

One of my last backpacking trips to Colorado, there was a big group of fraternity douchebros who were drinking and smoking cigars and singing fraternity songs well after dark. I wanted to go punch them in the face. If we weren't exhausted from our hike in, we would have packed up camp and moved away from them.

Loud talking before and after dark is a completely different scenario. I guarantee no one hears our six guy camp discussions after dark. During the the day, 3 of our canoes are fishing close by eachother, and you hear us talking.... Well sorry then. We will continue to talk to each other every trip.

Ever since I lost most of my hearing I talk loud. I don't notice it but my wife tells me to speak softly as often as I ask her to speak up.

: "How the tables have turned. I think we can all agree. People talking and hearing kids having fun is acceptable in the BWCA. If not, go to WCPP. Enough said."

Sorry, my kids will be coming with me to WCPP! I'll post our itinerary online so everyone knows when to stay home. :)

Have fun! And talk all you want! I hope your kids have a blast!

Heheheheh, I thought the title "Loud Talkers" sounded kinda like a Seinfeld episode (LOL)?

Lots of reasons this seems to be an issue, IMHO? Sometimes kids, sometimes folks that are hard of hearing; but I think MANY people just don't realize how much sound travels on water because less people spend much time outdoors as the population has become more urbanized? Plus, due to that urbanization, many folks come from loud environments and are used to talking loudly to be heard. So I believe many are not even aware they may be offending the folks down the lake? Sounds like a good thing for the USFS to mention and emphasize when we pick up our permits? Maybe they can show an excerpt of Seinfeld's "Low Talker" and tell campers to "Model" her (LOL)?

Low Talker
High Talker
Close Talker

I've been seeing this brought up in comments here and there. I guess I am never aware of how well the sound carries. I never hear anyone so I always assume no one can hear me. But maybe that isn't the case. I like that Marco Polo idea to see if anyone responds.

Sounds carries incredibly well over water. Some people don't understand that. Others don't care.

Boppasteveg: "Sounds carries incredibly well over water. Some people don't understand that. Others don't care."

I care I just wonder how far I guess. Usually I am quite a ways away from people so I doubt they can hear but maybe...

I'll have to remember to talk more softly to the chipmunks, trees, and rocks. :)

A few years back over labor day weeend I was so annoyed trying to fall asleep and the site across the lake from us had at least 5-6 kids, hooting and hollering all night.

But, in reality, these kids were enjoying the great wilderness, unplugged, and doing what we should all be doing.

I think if you really need (for your own reasons) to keep things quiet and more reflective, then you have to evaluate what lake you're going in on, and what time of year you're going in on.

Know when the BWCA is SUPER quiet.... winter.

It's amazing.

[dangit, why do I keep convincing myself I love winter camping...?]

It seems to me that this discussion boils down to expectations on a BWCA trip.
My expectations are guided by (as several others have already pointed out) the "leave no trace" credo. All of the senses should be respected.

Please refrain from improving the evening call of the loon or howl of the wolf with your mimicry. Please hold back the urge to "help" by creating trail blaze markers, etc... Please, for everyone's sake, pattern your behavior more like a "guest" of the wilderness and less like its' landlord.

I’ve been on trips with zero human sounds other than myself and on trips where the group a half mile down is starting to get on my nerves talking loudly at 11 at night. I guess it’s just a matter of letting it go. Sometimes that loud group can be quite entertaining, especially if some of them had to much of grandpa’s cough medicine!

Tony

On a trip this past winter I woke up to what sounded like someone walking up to our tent. Turned out it was just a couple of guys walking out on the ice roughly 1/3 of a mile away. The crunching of the snow was so loud it literally sounded like it was right out our door. We could also hear their conversation quite well. Amazing how well sound travels sometimes.

Unfortunately there is nothing in the permitting process to weed out loud people so we deal with it. Should probably remember that those same loud people may have been the ones who pulled you out of the lake once you capsized.
Zwater, we got your message - no need to keep repeating yourself. Thank you for your input.

You do realize, don't you, that zwater's last post on this thread was almost a year ago? This is an old thread that was bumped up recently.

Spartan2: "You do realize, don't you, that zwater's last post on this thread was almost a year ago? This is an old thread that was bumped up recently."

True Spartan2 but I was thinking of making a thread about noise thoughts and then came to a dilemma. Should I create something new that already exists....or should I just add onto what exists?

That is an actual question spartan2 by the way. What is the more preferred option out of those two?

x2jmorris: "That is an actual question spartan2 by the way. What is the more preferred option out of those two?"

Oh, I think it was fine to bring this thread back up. My only point was that perhaps it doesn't do any good to chide zwater for talking so much, since he hasn't posted on the thread in more than a year. ;-)

When I took MadNat on her first trip on Saganaga, I took the opportunity to discuss being quiet in the woods. We were headed into first bay, and I could see a canoe on the other side of the lake that was dropped off at Hook Island........

It was a beautiful morning for paddling, the lake was a solid sheet of glass, and not a sound in the world......NOT ONE. I was whispering to her, and it was like I was yelling.

A few minutes into our paddle, she asked me what that sound was.....I looked around a little, and immediately noticed the canoe on the other side of the lake, nearing cache bay, and explained to her, that it was the folks over in that canoe talking.....

She was amazed at how much sound traveled.......

I never had to have a conversation with her or any other young person who want with me / us.......MadNat was sure to let other younger folks know that story.

I sure do miss those times she went with me...... :( :(

Later,

Geo

Zwater: "

scat: "Just get over it. Other people are there to have fun too. There are plenty of lakes that you can have all to yourself. Maybe you were on the wrong lakes or just were unlucky that week. Or the breeze was blowing the wrong way. Being annoyed is a choice. That is the way I look at it anymore. Cheers."

+1
Now people can't talk in the Quetico/BWCA. Wow! Where does it end? I don't like people fishing around me, but hearing people talk (no guitars, radios, or obnoxious yelling) Geez, just relax."

I've vetoed the guitar on numerous trips. I have guys in my group that are wonderful musicians..........BUT I"m not too sure everyone else wants to hear their music or voice. So I've respectfully asked folks to not bring them at our planning meetings.

If I ever had someone insist, I'd ask them to put their own group together :) :) .

alpinebrule: "Most people just don't understand how far sound can travel, or just don't think about it.
One of the few times I every give people the benefit of the doubt.


The one good side to that fact is still one of my best memories of tripping. Once when my daughter was a young teen she went to the shore at about dusk and yelled "Marco" almost immediately we heard "Polo" come drifting across the water. We both had a good laugh and appreciated that somewhere out there was someone with a great sense of humor. "

You know.........that is a GREAT memory.............she also learned how far and long a voice will travel up there.

sueb2b: "At 6am, two guys fishing off my campsite woke me up with their loudness.


You can say I'm being too picky with this request, but have some respect for where others are staying, esp. in the early hours of morning.


They didn't much like it when I told them how exceedingly annoying they were."

A couple of my buddies.....years ago got yelled at for talking off a campsite, while fishing.

IT was foggy as hell, and they were fishing a reef prob 100 yards from the campsite. They were not making noise, or talking that loud, as I know they don't.........but out from no where, came a booming voice....YOU'RE NOT THE ONLY ONE'S ON THIS LAKE........

They got the message......

It was a border lake, so WTF did the other campers expect.....

Oh well. :) :)

Later,

Geo

nctry: "

Seinfeld: "When I go to Quetico, BWCA, or other wilderness I am there for the fresh air but many times it is ruined by people with camp fires, should I start another thread complaining about all the times my experience was ruined by someone building a camp fire? breathing all that fresh air, and then someone ruins it by building a fire, damn people!"

My big pet peeve is flashlights. Those headlights... Yikes! Some of those campsites look like old car lots when they used to have those spot lights... :)"

I have definitely lighted up some campsites with my surefire headlamp. BOOM. there are some serious lumens for you.

Spartan2: "

x2jmorris: "That is an actual question spartan2 by the way. What is the more preferred option out of those two?"

Oh, I think it was fine to bring this thread back up. My only point was that perhaps it doesn't do any good to chide zwater for talking so much, since he hasn't posted on the thread in more than a year. ;-)"

Thanks Spartan2. I will continue "talking" with my friends in the BWCA.
I hope your trip to the north country went great with your Granddaughter. Hope you do a trip report.

Probably not. It wasn't a canoe trip, just a week at a cabin.

This thread reminds me of a hike my son and I took on the border route trail. It was pretty rugged. Blowdown, trail not always clear etc but the views were fantastic. So we reached a stopping point for the day, collapsed by a fallen log and took in all the silence looking out over a border lake. All of the sudden...from across the lake in Canada, ruhruhruhruh ring aninganinganinganingningningning (that's my best spelling for the sounds) followed by the high pitched buzz of the chainsaws. Don't know if it was the work of Canadian rangers or campers or what but it sure was a buzz kill (pun intended) for all our hard work to get remote. We just laughed. What are you going to do?

You have wrote about them before. I enjoy your write ups. I am thinking about doing a cabin trip up by the BWCA next year with my 2 daughters.

Zwater: "You have wrote about them before. I enjoy your write ups. I am thinking about doing a cabin trip up by the BWCA next year with my 2 daughters."

Well, I will give it some thought. But I thought I was probably pushing the envelope doing it once, and then I did it with the other grandkid, too. The trip reports are supposed to be about real canoe trips, and I haven't been on one of those since 2013.

I do, however appreciate knowing that you enjoyed what I wrote.

I used to get annoyed by loud talkers...I have extremely good ears, not sure where I got it, but loud talkers sometimes it feels like they are shouting in my ear. Then I married into a family of loud talkers...ya either adapt or die I guess :) I now find it entertaining.

I can hear everything a loud talker says, sometimes you hear some embarrassingly funny stories. Very good entertainment.
When a loud talker talks quieter, which is still really load to me, I know to really pay attention to the juicy details.
A loud talker doesn’t have secrets, they tell you everything whether they mean to or not. That isn’t a negative, loud talkers I’ve known are highly honest, they don’t really have a choice :)
Finally we all have faults, if I limited my relationships to non loud talkers or got annoyed all the time my life wouldn’t be as good for sure.

I was doing yard work one time and the neighbors behind us a couple of house away were drink8ng beer, his girlfriend is an extremely loud talker...once again getting some serious funny info as I work. My wife Sara and my sister come out onto the deck talk8ng and all of sudden the loud talker girlfriend let’s out a belch form the beer that I can only describe as impressive and inhuman. Sara stops her loud talking with my sister, looks at me and then in an even more loud talking voice “aren’t you going to say excuse me! That was gross!” My sister whispers “Sara that wasn’t Tim” Sara loud talker “who could it have been”...loud taking girlfriend 2 houses a way Hidden on the deck, “it was me!”. Sara turned completely red...I think I laid on the ground laughing for an hour. Never found out if the neighbor was proud or embarrassed by his girlfriend—-knowing him probably a little of both, which is appropriate.

Spartan2: "

Zwater: "You have wrote about them before. I enjoy your write ups. I am thinking about doing a cabin trip up by the BWCA next year with my 2 daughters."

Well, I will give it some thought. But I thought I was probably pushing the envelope doing it once, and then I did it with the other grandkid, too. The trip reports are supposed to be about real canoe trips, and I haven't been on one of those since 2013.


I do, however appreciate knowing that you enjoyed what I wrote."

Man Lynda, trip reports are about how we all enjoy canoe country. You (and right now me) can not go on trips as we did, but sharing even being on the edge in a cabin and enjoying that experience is worth writing. You are family on this site... your experience may get others who can’t canoe ideas how they might go enjoy what is available to them.
As far as this whole noise issue... get over it people. I too have been guilty of complaining of such trivial stuff. In the end it happens and how you perceive it will be how you react. If it bothers you to all ends you can choose to let it ruin your moment or even your trip. I live where it’s quiet most of the time. The town beach and boat landing is right here... and often my little peaceful world is broken by noise and whatever. Who am I to say old noise box over there can’t do their thing. Kids on dirt bikes... well, when I was their age I spent whole weekends buzzing back and forth across our lake with my little boat and motor. Not as many people here back then but there was people. I’m sure they just laughed. We’re all different and it’s ok to be different. That noisy person may one day be the person that helps you in a pinch unexpectedly. One thing I’ve learned is tolerance in my old age. Taking the beam out of my eye before examining the speck in theirs really helps.

Ben, you are a treasure.

Perhaps I have a trip report to write when I get a minute. Just finished Anna's book on Snapfish, and need a break from hours at the computer for a few days.

Thanks. Especially the part about being family. Sometimes when I am no longer canoe-tripping I wonder what I am doing here.

I was able to reduce my pack weight by four pounds. On sportsmansguide I was able to find a pair of Kevlar megaphones. Now I pack these in for my trips, and leave the old steel ones at home (only use those for my daughter's soccer games or dance competitions).

nctry: "

Spartan2: "

Zwater: "You have wrote about them before. I enjoy your write ups. I am thinking about doing a cabin trip up by the BWCA next year with my 2 daughters."

Well, I will give it some thought. But I thought I was probably pushing the envelope doing it once, and then I did it with the other grandkid, too. The trip reports are supposed to be about real canoe trips, and I haven't been on one of those since 2013.



I do, however appreciate knowing that you enjoyed what I wrote."

Man Lynda, trip reports are about how we all enjoy canoe country. You (and right now me) can not go on trips as we did, but sharing even being on the edge in a cabin and enjoying that experience is worth writing. You are family on this site... your experience may get others who can’t canoe ideas how they might go enjoy what is available to them.
As far as this whole noise issue... get over it people. I too have been guilty of complaining of such trivial stuff. In the end it happens and how you perceive it will be how you react. If it bothers you to all ends you can choose to let it ruin your moment or even your trip. I live where it’s quiet most of the time. The town beach and boat landing is right here... and often my little peaceful world is broken by noise and whatever. Who am I to say old noise box over there can’t do their thing. Kids on dirt bikes... well, when I was their age I spent whole weekends buzzing back and forth across our lake with my little boat and motor. Not as many people here back then but there was people. I’m sure they just laughed. We’re all different and it’s ok to be different. That noisy person may one day be the person that helps you in a pinch unexpectedly. One thing I’ve learned is tolerance in my old age. Taking the beam out of my eye before examining the speck in theirs really helps."

I enjoy both of your posts and trip reports very much. Please keep them coming. nctry, you should bump up your epic trip report. I have read it a few times.

Spartan2: "Ben, you are a treasure.


Perhaps I have a trip report to write when I get a minute. Just finished Anna's book on Snapfish, and need a break from hours at the computer for a few days.


Thanks. Especially the part about being family. Sometimes when I am no longer canoe-tripping I wonder what I am doing here."

I couldn't agree more with Ben's sentiment about your trip reports and your presence here! I miss your reports and the photography dearly. It was always a treat for me when you posted them. Not a "real canoe" trip... then mark it as "other." It's still farther in to the wilderness than many people ever get in their lifetime.