BWCA Sleeping pad or air bed? Boundary Waters Gear Forum
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twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
01/30/2019 07:02AM   (Thread Older Than 3 Years)
What are the pros and cons of a sleeping pad vs an air bed? I was in Cabelas the other day and they had Thermarest Luxury Map XL pads on clearance for $110, about $60, so I got two of them. They seem nice 30 x 77 and 3 inches thick, but they are pretty big not very heavy but big and not sure they will fit in any pack. It looks to me like two twin air beds along with a pump would take up about the same amount of room as a single one of these pads although I'm sure it would be heavier.

I know the self-inflating pads would be quicker set up and with the air beds I'd be carrying an extra piece of equipment with the pump, I'm just not sure which way to go. Kind of leaning towards the air beds, I've slept on them plenty of times and I think are more comfortable than any self inflating pads I've ever used, but any self-inflating pads I've used have been smaller ones at 1 or 1.5 inches thick and not very comfortable at all.

Just looking for some opinions and pros and cons of each. Thanks for any help.
 
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mike2019
member (42)member
  
01/30/2019 07:48AM  
I can only speak from my years backpacking, my choice was Therm-a-Rest NeoAir Xlite Ultralight Backpacking Air Mattress https://www.amazon.com/Therm-Rest-Ultralight-Backpacking-Mountaineering/dp/B00PZL14EK/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1548856180&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=neoair+xlite&psc=1
R value 3.2 2 1/2 inch thick, about 16 oz if I remember right. Pricey but so worth it to me

The large size was perfect for me. The 25" width is generous. But, my number one choice is to hammock, which I will do in the BW. I have a warbonnet blackbird with a double bottom that allows me to insert the NeoAir and becomes my bottom insulation.



 
Tomcat
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01/30/2019 08:10AM  
 
Savage Voyageur
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01/30/2019 08:36AM  
One of the cons of sleeping on an air bed is there is no insulation. If you were in a goose down bag you would compress the down to nothing. The air bed is like a refrigerator sucking all the heat away from your body. If you can stop this somehow I would vote for the air bed. It’s just like a hammock without an underquilt, zero insulation.
 
01/30/2019 08:52AM  
Inflated insulated backpacking mattresses in a variety of sizes (certainly impacts packed size), from a bunch of manufacturers are about the size of a coffee can and weigh 2 pounds or less. Straight air inflated will be cold due to internal convection drawing heat from the sleeper so insulated to some degree is much better.
A few to start with.
Exped
Thermarest
Big Agnes
Nemo
Klymit
Sea To Summit

butthead
 
twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
01/30/2019 10:30AM  
Ok please forgive my ignorance but whats the difference between the backpacking air mattresses and the cheap twin size I already have from Walmart that the kids use for backyard camping at home? Of course the size and weight I know but what else? I doing a trip with my 14 year old daughter and will only have a few short portages between the number lakes so I'm not too concerned with some extra weight if it means being more comfortable.
 
Tomcat
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01/30/2019 10:53AM  
 
01/30/2019 11:10AM  
What time of year you plan on going makes a difference. Early or late in the year you nee d insulation. Mid summer you don't. I really like the airbed and I have tried everything ffom sleeping directly on the ground to self inflating mats to the airbed. One real downside of the airbed though. One leak and you are sleeping on the hard ground.
 
01/30/2019 11:26AM  
Tomcat: "
twistertail: "Ok please forgive my ignorance but whats the difference between the backpacking air mattresses and the cheap twin size I already have from Walmart that the kids use for backyard camping at home? Of course the size and weight I know but what else? I doing a trip with my 14 year old daughter and will only have a few short portages between the number lakes so I'm not too concerned with some extra weight if it means being more comfortable. "



In general lighter weight, often more durable, and foam filled or baffle designed to provide thermal protection and superior comfort.


A well designed pad is unlike a regular air mattress in that it supports without feeling squishy or bouncy. Best to try some at a store and feel the difference.


"


Kind of hard to explain to someone who has not used an air inflated insulated backpack mattress. A large leap up in comfort over a self inflating, with added weight savings and pack size. You asked, those are the differences. Tomcat didn't mention the existing down filled inflated mattresses from Exped, some will work well below 0 while still a manageable backpacking mattress.

butthead
 
deepdish71
distinguished member (235)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
01/30/2019 02:49PM  
Mega mat
We like that they are insulated to r-9.5 and are well, mega. We take 2 of these and still can single portage if we are careful with excess gear. They are luxurious
 
SourisMan
distinguished member(583)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
01/30/2019 05:46PM  
butthead: "
Tomcat: "
twistertail: "Ok please forgive my ignorance but whats the difference between the backpacking air mattresses and the cheap twin size I already have from Walmart that the kids use for backyard camping at home? Of course the size and weight I know but what else? I doing a trip with my 14 year old daughter and will only have a few short portages between the number lakes so I'm not too concerned with some extra weight if it means being more comfortable. "




In general lighter weight, often more durable, and foam filled or baffle designed to provide thermal protection and superior comfort.



A well designed pad is unlike a regular air mattress in that it supports without feeling squishy or bouncy. Best to try some at a store and feel the difference.



"



Kind of hard to explain to someone who has not used an air inflated insulated backpack mattress. A large leap up in comfort over a self inflating, with added weight savings and pack size. You asked, those are the differences. Tomcat didn't mention the existing down filled inflated mattresses from Exped, some will work well below 0 while still a manageable backpacking mattress.


butthead "


I agree, the comfort of an air inflated mattress is head and shoulders above the self inflating kind. At least that's the case for my 66 year old body.

Someone else mentioned problems with cold air. I don't know for sure that this is a good idea, but I put my non-insulated air mattress on top of a space blanket. On a November trip, with below freezing temps, I felt no cold at all coming up into my 20 degree bag.
 
twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
01/31/2019 09:15AM  
We are going the last week of June, from what I've found it looks like i should expect lows in the 50's over night or even the 40's. Planning on entering lake one and heading towards Insula, most portages will be short so I dont mind some extra weight or double portaging if needed. Its my 14 year old daughters first trip so I'm trying to go a little easy on the traveling distance and portages and make sure she stays warm and comfy. If she enjoys this trip and wants to do it again we adjust things on future trips to rough it a little more and travel further. So i'm thinking air mattress with some type of insulating pad and a good sleeping bag will do the trick.
 
Tekeya
Guest Paddler
  
01/31/2019 09:44AM  
I see nothing wrong with your plan. One advantage of air beds is they usually have more depth than camping pads which helps keep you high and dry should the tent floor accumulate water.

 
01/31/2019 09:55AM  
twistertail: "So i'm thinking air mattress with some type of insulating pad and a good sleeping bag will do the trick. "


Is that a bag and a pad or a bag, mattress and a pad? You really want the mattress/pad to be one item. If you are still looking at using a twin air mattress like you mentioned earlier, I would encourage you to reconsider. If you try to lay a insulating pad down first then an air mattress, then you are heating the entire mattress with your body heat. The 2 issues with that are that it takes time to warm it up, and you lose a lot of heat on all exposed surfaces of the mattress. If you put the mattress down then the pad, you will be warmer, but you also lose the comfort of the air mattress.

You really want the mattress and the pad to be the same item so it can provide comfort and warmth at the same time throughout the sleeping pad. The thermarest pads you mentioned would do the job nicely.
 
twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
01/31/2019 10:29AM  
I did some research on how to stay warm when sleeping on an air bed and found several people use a thin closed cell foam pad between the air mattress and your sleeping bag to provide insulation. Something like this
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00168ZJWY/ref=sxts_kp_lp_3?pf_rd_p=8778bc68-27e7-403f-8460-de48b6e788fb&pd_rd_wg=UojSw&pf_rd_r=08RSF7J93WFPD83D0XCR&pd_rd_i=B00168ZJWY&pd_rd_w=Axrxc&pd_rd_r=86ed6014-75ae-4e46-bc96-5c32bd68c68f&ie=UTF8&qid=1548952141&sr=3


We'll do some test runs in the back yard this spring and see what works best.
 
01/31/2019 10:52AM  
Yeah a foam pad would work, but I don't understand why you wouldn't just use the thermarest pads you already bought. A 3 inch pad is thick enough that you won't even feel the ground unless it is really bad and you don't have to worry about having the pump charged to inflate it. Plus the weight savings makes it a clear choice for me.
 
twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
01/31/2019 11:26AM  
I tired the thermarest and dont think its nearly as comfy as the air mattress. The air mattress is only about a pound heavier but i think will be easier to pack, the thermarest at 30" wont fit in my pack and I've not been able to find a pack that they would fit in. I know i'll need a pump as well but I wont be portaging much so I dont think a few extra pounds will be a problem. Of course if I end needing a foam pad to go on top of the air mattress I might be better off just taking the thermarest. I guess we'll just have to do several nights in the back yard this spring when we get some nights that will be in the 40's and 50's and see what works best.
 
01/31/2019 11:56AM  
If you have a pack that has the top flap fold over like the Duluth Packs, then you can do what my buddy does and put it sideways on top letting the ends stick out. Otherwise you can do what I have done with a backpacking style pack and attach it to the exterior of the pack using straps.

For comfort, you can try messing with the amount of air in the Thermarest. You can blow into it to add more air and make it firmer or let some out to soften it. I find that those adjustments are necessary on pretty much all sleeping pads.
 
Tomcat
distinguished member(700)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
01/31/2019 12:12PM  
 
01/31/2019 01:17PM  
I found the self inflating pads did not offer enough thickness and comfort and always woke up sore. I tried the thermarest luxury lite cot but still didn't find it comfortable for side sleeping. Switched to using a NeoAir All Season inflatable mattress and it is by far the best for me. Only weighs a pound with the included battery operated inflater. Easy to setup and takes up very little space in the pack and I think the insulation R-value is 4.9R. I recently picked up a Klymit Ultralight Insulated Double Sleeping Pad for when I camp with my wife. It's R-value is 4.4 and weighs under 2lbs and packs up reasonably small.
 
Tomcat
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01/31/2019 01:34PM  
 
twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
01/31/2019 02:12PM  




I feel there is nothing wrong with using the air bed if you like the idea better than the luxury map. However if fitting it in you pack is a factor I posted photos of my 30x77x2 thermarest
on my pack with a tent and bugout shelter for size comparison. My wife and I place the thermarest in the bottom of packs with no issues. The luxury map is one inch thicker than our camp rest but has larger air gaps in the foam liner so that it should roll to the same or similar size, about 15in x 8in when folded in half and rolled-up. It takes me about 3 minutes to roll my mattress.




So you fold the mat in half before you roll it up? I thought that might rip it. I wanted to get everything in a pack so if we get rain or tip everything would still be dry and i couldnt find any packs that were 30" tall, but if i fold them in half and then roll that might work. Thanks.




 
Tomcat
distinguished member(700)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
01/31/2019 02:55PM  
 
01/31/2019 03:23PM  
twistertail: " So you fold the mat in half before you roll it up? I thought that might rip it. I wanted to get everything in a pack so if we get rain or tip everything would still be dry and i couldnt find any packs that were 30" tall, but if i fold them in half and then roll that might work. Thanks.

"


Try rolling it up once to push all the air out, then unroll, fold, and roll it up again while it is flat. You can open the valve again on the reroll if you have more air to push out.
 
01/31/2019 08:18PM  
I agree with Butthead. I have used both exped and big agnes. As comfortable as my home matress. Rolled up, the size of a nalgene bottle. Blow up by mouth in a couple minutes.
 
twistertail
senior member (86)senior membersenior member
  
02/01/2019 03:10PM  
What about the therma rest ultra light cots, anyone use those?
 
02/01/2019 03:53PM  
I don't think cots are worth the trouble. If you get a nice pad then you can't feel the ground anyways. A cot just seems like extra weight and harder on tent floors. They can be nice on really rough ground and they will help with making a spot flatter to sleep, but I think that they are not worth the weight. I'd rather be a little lighter and move faster so I can get the campsite I want, or have time to scout other spots.
 
02/05/2019 07:56AM  
Tekeya: "I see nothing wrong with your plan. One advantage of air beds is they usually have more depth than camping pads which helps keep you high and dry should the tent floor accumulate water.
"


If your tent leaks badly in a big storm they also will double as a swimming pool as your body pushes down an area where water will collect. It's best to plan ahead and let theis happen when the weather is really warm. BTDT
 
Takeya
Guest Paddler
  
02/05/2019 10:29AM  
RMinMN: "
Tekeya: "I see nothing wrong with your plan. One advantage of air beds is they usually have more depth than camping pads which helps keep you high and dry should the tent floor accumulate water.
"



If your tent leaks badly in a big storm they also will double as a swimming pool as your body pushes down an area where water will collect. It's best to plan ahead and let theis happen when the weather is really warm. BTDT"


There are pros and cons to equipment but not always right or wrong, more often just personal choice. There is no reason an air bed could not be used successfully in BWCA.

I have spent multiple days tent camping in rain and in the process of packing/pitching the tent, and entering and exiting the tent, dirt and water collect on the tent floor. Having a tall sleeping pad can help to keep the dirt and water away from your sleeping bag.
 
02/12/2019 08:39AM  
Takeya: "
RMinMN: "
Tekeya: "I see nothing wrong with your plan. One advantage of air beds is they usually have more depth than camping pads which helps keep you high and dry should the tent floor accumulate water.
"




If your tent leaks badly in a big storm they also will double as a swimming pool as your body pushes down an area where water will collect. It's best to plan ahead and let theis happen when the weather is really warm. BTDT"



There are pros and cons to equipment but not always right or wrong, more often just personal choice. There is no reason an air bed could not be used successfully in BWCA.


I have spent multiple days tent camping in rain and in the process of packing/pitching the tent, and entering and exiting the tent, dirt and water collect on the tent floor. Having a tall sleeping pad can help to keep the dirt and water away from your sleeping bag."






The best way to keep dirt and stuff away from your bag is not to bring it in in the first place.
I have some air beds I’ve used on the road. I could not imagine dragging one across canoe country. I recommend a good pad be it exped, thermarest, big Agnes, or whatever. My thermarests roll up extremely small. Air beds? I’d worry about them failing a lot faster then something made for this kind of use.
A good “mat” outside your tent can make entering a much cleaner, dryer experience. I’ve seen rugs, pads, you name it.
 
02/12/2019 02:25PM  
Three biggest problems with air beds/mattresses:
1) heavy
2) cold
3) fragile

I think the one I hear the most complaints about is the fact that they get very cold. That big open air chamber is a recipe for heat loss from convection. Backpacking mats not list as "air mats" either have a baffle pattern to interrupt air flow, insulation, or some combination of the two which helps prevent conduction and convection. Some like the neo air series also use reflective elements to prevent heat lost through radiation. This coupled with the fact that they're generally made to be tougher and lighter is what makes them overall worth the extra $$ over an air mattress.
 
em8260
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02/13/2019 12:59PM  
If by air bed you mean the big inflatable mattresses aka walmart/coleman styles, they are incredibly bulky to carry or portage with, I do also believe they are very prone to holes/tears and offer zero insulation. I personally would NEVER pack something that bulky, flimsy and uninsulated. for a few $$ more you can choose any of the name brand insulated blow up pads on these forums. Big agnes, neo, thermarest, sea to summit...pack MUCH smaller, lighter and insulate better. they are also fairly durable if you treat them ok.
 
02/13/2019 09:16PM  
I've used a Thermarest ultralight cot for years. Actually I bought my first cot before Thermarest bought the company. Up front cost is higher but you never have to replace it due to a leak. It's not fun to be in the middle of a trip and your air mattress leaks in a place where you can't patch it. The cot is lighter and less bulky than self-inflating or air mattresses. The feet keep you off of the tent floor in case of water. There may be a weight limit of 225 or 250 but since I'm 180 it works perfect for me.

Everything has it's pros and cons but after using the cot for over 10 years, it's still going strong with no rips or serious wear. There's room underneath for small gear and for stuffing dirty clothes or jackets. Okay, I'm getting carried away but I really do love my Thermarest cot. It's certainly my choice.

Terry
 
Bronco
member (39)member
  
02/19/2019 01:12PM  
I have used both and I like the insulated air bed. the problem I have found is a lot of the tent sights have rocks or roots that can't be avoided. The lumps telegraph through the sleeping pads but not through the air bed. On the other hand when you set up on a air bed you displace the air and are setting on the ground so both have their place. For my pack it will be an air bed and with the newer style with the hand pump built into the pillow you don't pass out while filling them. My only fear with the air bed is if you damage it beyond repair your sleeping on the ground. To each is own not sure there is a wrong way.
 
ExFS
Guest Paddler
  
02/20/2019 05:33AM  
twistertail: "What about the therma rest ultra light cots, anyone use those?"

Cots are the cat’s meow. We have a couple of helinox lite cots. Payed $175 for each on sale, which isn’t much more than a good sleeping pad. They weigh under 3 pds.
 
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