First things first, I'm not really contemplating doing this, but have always wondered the answers. I used the search function, but didn't really find a solid answer. I'm not trying to set the stage for violations, and truly am curious. With that premise, here goes...

Let's say someone had a BWCA permit for a border water area, and then decided to go up into the Q for a daytrip. No permit, no RABC, 'no nothing' Canadian.

What actually would happen to someone who does not have an RABC nor a Q permit and is 'caught'? Are they actually going to escort you out of the park, say 20 miles back through the rest of the Q, to the Canadian side of the park? Or would they just say get the F out, give you a citation of some sort accompanied with a stern lecture, and bring you to the American border? Logistics compared to magnitude of the issue are essentially the question...I also wonder if this happens more than 5 times a year, and thus is even worth the enforcement effort/public investment.

What would happen if you were fishing in this case and did not have a license / Ontario outdoors card? Ticketed / fined, banned, escorted out? I get the impression the fishing related offenses are more likely the focus of enforcement.

From my quick search, I only found a bunch of debate over lack of enforcement and consequences, and opinions thereof. Not that intriguing and not trying to start that here...

Your answers can be found with a little internet search. The arresting officer has discretion about what to do but I wouldn’t take chances. It will be quite expensive and you will be banned from future entry into Canada. They don’t appreciate entitled Americans who disrespect their laws and ignorance is not an excuse.

They do a lot of air surveillance and can land anywhere to enforce the law. They can and will confiscate everything you have and give you a not so free ride to jail. Much cheaper to have the proper paperwork.

The above is not opinion, that’s a fact.

I recognize from your question that you were not planning to do this yourself, but why should anyone even consider this. This is their country and we are not admitted without permission. There is a treaty that allows US citizens to use the portage on either side of the border without needing a permit, but this does not mean camping or fishing on the Canadian side, and certainly not going deeper into Canada than the border Portages.
We have just over 200 years of respect and peace on our northern border with Canada, with common heritage, culture, language, and wars fought together.
I can think of no reason why someone should not respect their reasonable entry requirements and reasonable park permit and fishing fees.

Much like someone from a southern country, let’s say Mexico, could cross a remote
border to stay for a few days, maybe do some fishing, work for a few days, and visit some relatives. Let’s keep the remote northern border sacred so it doesn’t get treated like the southern one.

To answer the question what would happen. It really depends.

There was group who did this and got busted pretty deep the park by a float plane. They were hauled out and had to pay thousands in fines to allowed to leave Canada. That is the extreme case.

No matter what you would get fined. Especially if you were stopped by a float plane. They have to pay for that plane somehow...the motto though of Quetico is education by enforcement and fines. I highly doubt a warning would be given—-that would shock me.

I think the fine for no license is $150-250, fishing with barbed hooks is $225, entering the park without a permit $250. The prices could be different now. If the ranger/warden thought you were ignorant they might just fine one person, but if they think we’re blatantly disregarding the law they could fine each of you individually.

Most likely you would not get checked for the RABC they rarely have an immigration officer but if you did get busted that fine can be in the thousands.

T

I'm not too sure if it was the same group that timatkn mentioned, but I knew of a group that was found way in to Canada on Crooked lake that was checked by float plane. All I remember is that they flew the group and all their equipment out, jailed the folks, confiscated canoe and all their equipment and ended up fining them thousands of dollars. I would think it rare, but the consequences would be horrible! Rangers do not check RABC's, but do check permits and licenses.

Thanks guys/gals.

The float plane aspect is interesting. I wonder how they decide to land to check? Seems like one would want to have a database of permits, or better yet a list of permits picked up and in use, and then identify areas where nobody should reasonably be at without exceptional effort to get there (i.e. end up near a different entry point than originated). I would think any effort to land/inspect would be time/cost intensive, and therefore a targeted enforcement effort would be needed.

I get the cost implications of covering essentially the necessary downtime for the plane when they aren't lucky enough to catch somebody. That's not real different from how ambulance services work, particularly in rural areas in MN.

The logistics of managing such a broad area in any reliable and effective way still seems overwhelming to me from the enforcement perspective. I've not heard too many specific examples where enforcement like this has occurred. I actually would have thought this would be a multi-annual thing where folks get made an example of.

Again, I am by no means planning such an expedition. I feel like some people were disgusted or annoyed that I posted these questions....and I totally get it....Sorry, just been wondering/curious and nobody I interact with on a daily basis would know these answers. If we want to collectively deter, I would encourage someone to post a response with a link to the enforcement actions or news articles. I honestly haven't been able to find them aside from some stories with unique circumstances. The first one sounds like mental health issues (apparently the guy tried to keep a fawn deer as a pet, too) and the second is not the Q.
Shoeless Camper

Illegal fishing in the BW

Thanks again

timatkn: "To answer the question what would happen. It really depends.


There was group who did this and got busted pretty deep the park by a float plane. They were hauled out and had to pay thousands in fines to allowed to leave Canada. That is the extreme case.


No matter what you would get fined. Especially if you were stopped by a float plane. They have to pay for that plane somehow...the motto though of Quetico is education by enforcement and fines. I highly doubt a warning would be given—-that would shock me.


I think the fine for no license is $150-250, fishing with barbed hooks is $225, entering the park without a permit $250. The prices could be different now. If the ranger/warden thought you were ignorant they might just fine one person, but if they think we’re blatantly disregarding the law they could fine each of you individually.


Most likely you would not get checked for the RABC they rarely have an immigration officer but if you did get busted that fine can be in the thousands.


T"

$225.00 for a barbed hook? Wow, that makes the cost and inconvenience of back-up pliers seem like a bargain.

Regarding the float planes. My camp was visited via float plane once on Oliphant Lake. Checked our camp and our permit and made sure we had no fire (fire ban). Also let us know to start toward our exit within a couple days due to fires. We were pretty surprised actually. This was many years ago however.

Hey, Gopher,

Count me as one who finds the premise of your OP to be disgusting or at least annoying....seems like the only reason you ask such a question/scenario is because you wonder if it's plausible. Yes, people have broken the law in the Q and been caught. Other have not been caught. If you want to break the law you know is there, fine. But don't expect any enforcement folks to tell you how they enforce. And don't expect any sympathy from me. And if you choose to do what you propose, I hope they catch you....I'll apologize now if my response seems too much....

PineKnot: "Hey, Gopher,


Count me as one who finds the premise of your OP to be disgusting or at least annoying....seems like the only reason you ask such a question/scenario is because you wonder if it's plausible. Yes, people have broken the law in the Q and been caught. Other have not been caught. If you want to break the law you know is there, fine. But don't expect any enforcement folks to tell you how they enforce. And don't expect any sympathy from me. And if you choose to do what you propose, I hope they catch you....I'll apologize now if my response seems too much.... "

Ok, sorry for offending or annoying you. someone can delete this thread if needed.

For the float planes they run the border a lot. We got checked in 2015, they were actually checking people on Crooked illegally fishing the walleye opener (Ontario opener is a week later) on the Canadian side. I heard business was good which surprised me because the weather was miserable.

Otherwise they often drop Ranger or portage crews off in remote areas then use the float plane to enforce their way out. Also I think their fire spotter planes serve a dual purpose.

T

Thwarted: "

timatkn: "To answer the question what would happen. It really depends.



There was group who did this and got busted pretty deep the park by a float plane. They were hauled out and had to pay thousands in fines to allowed to leave Canada. That is the extreme case.



No matter what you would get fined. Especially if you were stopped by a float plane. They have to pay for that plane somehow...the motto though of Quetico is education by enforcement and fines. I highly doubt a warning would be given—-that would shock me.



I think the fine for no license is $150-250, fishing with barbed hooks is $225, entering the park without a permit $250. The prices could be different now. If the ranger/warden thought you were ignorant they might just fine one person, but if they think we’re blatantly disregarding the law they could fine each of you individually.



Most likely you would not get checked for the RABC they rarely have an immigration officer but if you did get busted that fine can be in the thousands.



T"

$225.00 for a barbed hook? Wow, that makes the cost and inconvenience of back-up pliers seem like a bargain."

Just to clarify it is the hooks on your lure connected to your pole. They claim they won’t fine you for the ones in your tackle box.

T

To be honest I don’t think many people violate the rules...sure the occasional person person fishes Rebecca Falls or the far side of crooked, but I doubt you see a lot of people going deep into Quetico with no permit or RABC. It really isn’t that complicated and if your think it is then people have an easier alternative like the BWCAW—-so people just don’t do it. The reward vs. the risk is not worth it.

As far as fines, I don’t think you are going to find news articles. All the costs I posted are from articles in the BWJ, conversation with Quetico officials when I’ve been checked, outfitters posting on here as a warning because one of their customer were fined or a poster putting a warning because they were fined for visiting warrior Hill, or Rebecca Falls or Moose Bay...you can do the search and probably find some of those discussions. I believed people because they seemed upset at getting pinched or felt they were treated heavy handed. It doesn’t happen a lot and it isn’t really newsworthy.

It is hard to read the written word sometimes and understand the intent, but I think why you might feel attitude is people are answering your question and you seem to want more evidence. That might not be what you are trying to convey, but that is how it comes off. It comes off like you lost an argument with a friend on this and now you are trying to prove them wrong on technicalities :)

I think it's a great question to ask. You're camped at the edge of the BW, you can see the Canadian shoreline not far away, a guy in your group thinks it looks really cool & scenic over there and thinks "what's the harm in paddling over, checking it out and coming back?". A logical thought - it's Canada, not East Berlin or Iran. Knowing what the penalties might be, you can have an answer and more thoroughly assess the actions vs. risks.
Gopher,...no need to go to confession and do penance for your impure thoughts.

The consequences could be very serious and costly. Several years ago, 6 of us were camped on Tiger Bay of Lac La Croix in the BW. On a day trip to see Curtain Falls, somebody suggested a side trip to visit Rebecca Falls, just slightly into Canada. One of our paddlers strongly objected. She had a summer retreat on a Canadian island off of Victoria BC. With a border crossing violation on her record, she could lose access to her summer home. So we paddled on to Curtain Falls.

gopher2307: "First things first, I'm not really contemplating doing this, but have always wondered the answers. I used the search function, but didn't really find a solid answer. I'm not trying to set the stage for violations, and truly am curious. With that premise, here goes...

Let's say someone had a BWCA permit for a border water area, and then decided to go up into the Q for a daytrip. No permit, no RABC, 'no nothing' Canadian.

What actually would happen to someone who does not have an RABC nor a Q permit and is 'caught'? Are they actually going to escort you out of the park, say 20 miles back through the rest of the Q, to the Canadian side of the park? Or would they just say get the F out, give you a citation of some sort accompanied with a stern lecture, and bring you to the American border? Logistics compared to magnitude of the issue are essentially the question...I also wonder if this happens more than 5 times a year, and thus is even worth the enforcement effort/public investment.

What would happen if you were fishing in this case and did not have a license / Ontario outdoors card? Ticketed / fined, banned, escorted out? I get the impression the fishing related offenses are more likely the focus of enforcement.

From my quick search, I only found a bunch of debate over lack of enforcement and consequences, and opinions thereof. Not that intriguing and not trying to start that here..."

i was searching a topic today and stumbled on this old thread.

unlike many others here i find this to be an interesting question.

i have no idea how they would handle the logistics of removing an individual or group from the park under these circumstances. i can only assume it would be by float plane.

i also assume this would involve several layers of government agencies to sort out.

first you would have to deal with the penalties for entering a provincial park without a permit, then deal with any penalties for any possible fishing violations (this would probably be the most costly), and then any immigration issues.

the park wardens would not be able to deal with the immigration problem but i would assume they certainly would be bringing that agency in the loop.

it would then be up to immigration to decide whether you are ever allowed to enter canada again.

this brings me to what i was searching for........

i had been told recently that anyone from the usa can cross the border on a body of water without checking in with our border services as long as they dont touch canadian soil. this would only be in summer as in winter apparently they treat the ice as land. can anyone confirm if this is true?

i was also told many years ago by a canadian that lives on a body of water that shares a border with the usa, that he cannot cross the water border under any circumstances without checking in with the usa border services. perhaps the usa and canada handle these types of cases differently??

gopher2307: "First things first, I'm not really contemplating doing this, but have always wondered the answers. I used the search function, but didn't really find a solid answer. I'm not trying to set the stage for violations, and truly am curious. With that premise, here goes...

Let's say someone had a BWCA permit for a border water area, and then decided to go up into the Q for a daytrip. No permit, no RABC, 'no nothing' Canadian.

What actually would happen to someone who does not have an RABC nor a Q permit and is 'caught'? Are they actually going to escort you out of the park, say 20 miles back through the rest of the Q, to the Canadian side of the park? Or would they just say get the F out, give you a citation of some sort accompanied with a stern lecture, and bring you to the American border? Logistics compared to magnitude of the issue are essentially the question...I also wonder if this happens more than 5 times a year, and thus is even worth the enforcement effort/public investment.

What would happen if you were fishing in this case and did not have a license / Ontario outdoors card? Ticketed / fined, banned, escorted out? I get the impression the fishing related offenses are more likely the focus of enforcement.

From my quick search, I only found a bunch of debate over lack of enforcement and consequences, and opinions thereof. Not that intriguing and not trying to start that here..."

i was searching a topic today and stumbled on this old thread.

unlike many others here i find this to be an interesting question.

i have no idea how they would handle the logistics of removing an individual or group from the park under these circumstances. i can only assume it would be by float plane.

i also assume this would involve several layers of government agencies to sort out.

first you would have to deal with the penalties for entering a provincial park without a permit, then deal with any penalties for any possible fishing violations (this would probably be the most costly), and then any immigration issues.

the park wardens would not be able to deal with the immigration problem but i would assume they certainly would be bringing that agency in the loop.

it would then be up to immigration to decide whether you are ever allowed to enter canada again.

this brings me to what i was searching for........

i had been told recently that anyone from the usa can cross the border on a body of water without checking in with our border services as long as they dont touch canadian soil. this would only be in summer as in winter apparently they treat the ice as land. can anyone confirm if this is true?

i was also told many years ago by a canadian that lives on a body of water that shares a border with the usa, that he cannot cross the water border under any circumstances without checking in with the usa border services. perhaps the usa and canada handle these types of cases differently??

rick00001967: " i had been told recently that anyone from the usa can cross the border on a body of water without checking in with our border services as long as they dont touch canadian soil. this would only be in summer as in winter apparently they treat the ice as land. can anyone confirm if this is true?


i was also told many years ago by a canadian that lives on a body of water that shares a border with the usa, that he cannot cross the water border under any circumstances without checking in with the usa border services. perhaps the usa and canada handle these types of cases differently?? "

To your first question, it's true. See these articles:

Lake of the Woods article

Lake St Clair article

plander: "

rick00001967: " i had been told recently that anyone from the usa can cross the border on a body of water without checking in with our border services as long as they dont touch canadian soil. this would only be in summer as in winter apparently they treat the ice as land. can anyone confirm if this is true?



i was also told many years ago by a canadian that lives on a body of water that shares a border with the usa, that he cannot cross the water border under any circumstances without checking in with the usa border services. perhaps the usa and canada handle these types of cases differently?? "

To your first question, it's true. See these articles:


Lake of the Woods article


Lake St Clair article

"

That might be specific to LOTW not Quetico. Quetico has more specific/restrictive fishing regs as well as a permit requirement.


I’ll say this again…I had a float plane drop down on me checking permits and licenses on the Canadian side of Crooked Lake and they informed me that they gave out A LOT of fines. Now that was 2015 so maybe the Canadians lightened up? But I’d want to know for sure and not rely on an internet post. I can guarantee the Canadians won’t care what the internet said and if you give them a hard time they will find a way to fine you more. Something like $225/barbed hook, $200 per license. $180 per person per missing Q permit and thousands per person if they call in immigration.

I’d just contact the Park directly and get the rules confirmed. Don’t take chances.
T

yes of course the park has its own rules and regulations as you mentioned. those certainly need to be followed at all times to avoid trouble, but those would be separate issues from an immigration stand point. so crossing the border into the park could have extra consequences as opposed to crossing in an area outside of a provincial park like rainy river or lake of the woods area for example.

my question was just pure curiosity about a border crossing on water in general and how canada and u.s. might handle that differently since there are so many people who live near or on waters that border our two countries.

i remember when i was a kid we camped on Arrow lake which is south of where i still live. it was possible to take our boat down the lake and up a river into Rose lake which was partly in canada and partly in the u.s. anyone going up there made sure to remain on the canadian side. crossing over would put you in the bwca.

interestingly.....that area was well know for smugglers way back during prohibition. Al Capones fellas were rumored to have come across that way more than once.

i found my answer this morning

https://www.canada.ca/en/border-services-agency/news/2022/04/the-canada-border-services-agency-reminds-boaters-of-entry-and-reporting-requirements.html

but as discussed, entering and/or fishing within Quetico park comes with its own set of rules and regulations that must be followed.

so technically an american who is in the bwca, and is on a lake that shares the border with canada and the u.s., can cross into Quetico if they have a park entry permit.

if they will be fishing, they would need to have any applicable licence's etc to do so, and be sure to be following any specific park regulations like not using barbed hooks (you can have them with you but you cannot be using them) or using any live bait for example.

just be sure not to land or anchor your canoe etc as outlined in the link i posted.

interesting. i learned something new today. :)

Eyedocron: "I recognize from your question that you were not planning to do this yourself, but why should anyone even consider this. This is their country and we are not admitted without permission. There is a treaty that allows US citizens to use the portage on either side of the border without needing a permit, but this does not mean camping or fishing on the Canadian side, and certainly not going deeper into Canada than the border Portages.
We have just over 200 years of respect and peace on our northern border with Canada, with common heritage, culture, language, and wars fought together.
I can think of no reason why someone should not respect their reasonable entry requirements and reasonable park permit and fishing fees."

Very well stated, abuse it we will lose the privilege of going there. We are a guest.

rick00001967: "i found my answer this morning


https://www.canada.ca/en/border-services-agency/news/2022/04/the-canada-border-services-agency-reminds-boaters-of-entry-and-reporting-requirements.html


but as discussed, entering and/or fishing within Quetico park comes with its own set of rules and regulations that must be followed.


so technically an american who is in the bwca, and is on a lake that shares the border with canada and the u.s., can cross into Quetico if they have a park entry permit.


if they will be fishing, they would need to have any applicable licence's etc to do so, and be sure to be following any specific park regulations like not using barbed hooks (you can have them with you but you cannot be using them) or using any live bait for example.


just be sure not to land or anchor your canoe etc as outlined in the link i posted.


interesting. i learned something new today. :)"

Yep.

You can buy a seasonal vehicle day use pass for Quetico (and other provincial parks) here: Summer Day use vehicle permit

Have that day use permit in your canoe and you can venture across the border on the lake (one permit per canoe). If you have an RABC permit, you can day trip deeper into Quetico this way as well (step on Crown Land, etc), however, you need to return to the US for overnight. We've done this when we have been up on Crooked. Day trip into Bart, Gardner Bay, Argo, Roland Chain, Rebecca Falls, etc.

timatkn: "

plander: "

rick00001967: " i had been told recently that anyone from the usa can cross the border on a body of water without checking in with our border services as long as they dont touch canadian soil. this would only be in summer as in winter apparently they treat the ice as land. can anyone confirm if this is true?



i was also told many years ago by a canadian that lives on a body of water that shares a border with the usa, that he cannot cross the water border under any circumstances without checking in with the usa border services. perhaps the usa and canada handle these types of cases differently?? "

To your first question, it's true. See these articles:



Lake of the Woods article



Lake St Clair article


"

That might be specific to LOTW not Quetico. Quetico has more specific/restrictive fishing regs as well as a permit requirement.



I’ll say this again…I had a float plane drop down on me checking permits and licenses on the Canadian side of Crooked Lake and they informed me that they gave out A LOT of fines. Now that was 2015 so maybe the Canadians lightened up? But I’d want to know for sure and not rely on an internet post. I can guarantee the Canadians won’t care what the internet said and if you give them a hard time they will find a way to fine you more. Something like $225/barbed hook, $200 per license. $180 per person per missing Q permit and thousands per person if they call in immigration.


I’d just contact the Park directly and get the rules confirmed. Don’t take chances.
T"

Of course, you need the seasonal or annual Day Use Vehicle Permit as well to be in Q during the day. But I didn't think the question was specific to Q. See my comment to rick00001967 above. Trevor Gibb (Q Park Superintendent) is a great resource on these matters.

I couldn't get your link to work, but at least in the Quetico area you would need an RABC even if you did not ever touch land. This was explained to me in detail a couple of years ago by the governing authorities.

To cross in to Canada waters, even on a shared border water, you need an RABC, a day use vehicle permit, a passport and to fish an outdoors card and Canadian fishing license. The group that was arrested were clients of an outfitter I know and they had crossed in to Canada on Crooked lake and had not touched land in any way. It was explained to them that it is their responsibility to know where the border was even on the water, but that they did allow a little leeway but not the over 1 mile they had strayed. We have seen them on 3 different occasions checking people by float plane, all on border waters, but have never been checked ourselves. Of course, these are border agents mostly concerned with smuggling, not park rangers who are not concerned with border policies. During my talk I was told that drugs were frequently smuggled by water routes. I also know of people who were warned by Quetico rangers about going to look at pictographs and warrior hill on LLC. The rangers said that if actual border agents had checked them they might have been arrested. The border is the border and the Canadians do not play. They want record of exactly who enters and exits and if they have ever been convicted of a felony or DUI which makes entering impossible unless record is cleared.

sorry about the link.

if your search "boater entry and reporting requirements" you will find the canada.ca posting if you would like to see it.

thx
rick

The border policy was changed October 2022. All of the Quetico regs and Ontario fishing regs still apply, but you do not need an RABC to visit Canadian waters on a border lake any more.

For example, on the eastern end of Saganaga which is not part of Quetico, you can freely go back and forth across the border with no official customs stops or RABC. Portaging in any further would require touching land and would be a violation, but in terms of crossing the border line on a lake you don’t need to do anything official.

Look up “loop movements” and you will find the policy. You can’t touch ground, anchor, or make physical contact with another boat.

plander: "

timatkn: "

plander: "

rick00001967: " "

Lake of the Woods article

Lake St Clair article

"

T"

Of course, you need the seasonal or annual Day Use Vehicle Permit as well to be in Q during the day. But I didn't think the question was specific to Q. See my comment to rick00001967 above. Trevor Gibb (Q Park Superintendent) is a great resource on these matters."

For the Day use vehicle permit, I assume a permit is needed per canoe vs. the whole group? Did Trevor give any specifics on that?

T

great question.
i was bored at lunch so i went on the ontario parks site today and it let me make a back country reservation for up to 9 people.
my question is....if i can get one permit for up to 9 people, what do they do if there are 2 or 3 vehicles?
each vehicle needs to display a permit.
i would guess there would be extra charges for the extra vehicles as each permit only allows one vehicle.

Funny question about your extra vehicles. And while I didn't provide vehicle information when I got my permit for an August trip through Prairie Portage, the system informed me that I have a valid parking permit for my car. Don't think the USFS will be checking for my Quetico parking permit at Moose Lake!

TZ

TrailZen: "Funny question about your extra vehicles. And while I didn't provide vehicle information when I got my permit for an August trip through Prairie Portage, the system informed me that I have a valid parking permit for my car. Don't think the USFS will be checking for my Quetico parking permit at Moose Lake!


TZ"

haha ya i guess i forgot which forum i was on haha. i was thinking of how it works up here. sorry. i guess you cant drive into quetico from MN right? lol

rick00001967: "great question.
i was bored at lunch so i went on the ontario parks site today and it let me make a back country reservation for up to 9 people.
my question is....if i can get one permit for up to 9 people, what do they do if there are 2 or 3 vehicles?
each vehicle needs to display a permit.
i would guess there would be extra charges for the extra vehicles as each permit only allows one vehicle."

With a back country reservation you can have 9 people on a reservation and your canoes are included as part of that reservation. Vehicle permits (for the back country) are just for day use, not for camping overnight. Park staff will give you 2 printed permits to have among the group and it is recommended to always have those available should rangers request them. If some are going out fishing and some are staying at the site, then have a permit in each location. (When car camping in the main campground, that is when there is one vehicle, a car in this case, per reservation). Most of the back country enty points will not be concerned about your actual vehicle (car) as that will likely not be in the park...or even in the same country for Praire and Cache enteries.

Vehicle permits for day use in the back country are per canoe. For day use if you had 3 canoes and 9 people you would then need 3 vehicle permits.

timatkn: "

plander: "

timatkn: "

plander: "

rick00001967: " "

Lake of the Woods article

Lake St Clair article

"

T"

Of course, you need the seasonal or annual Day Use Vehicle Permit as well to be in Q during the day. But I didn't think the question was specific to Q. See my comment to rick00001967 above. Trevor Gibb (Q Park Superintendent) is a great resource on these matters."

For the Day use vehicle permit, I assume a permit is needed per canoe vs. the whole group? Did Trevor give any specifics on that?

T"

One day use vehicle permit per canoe.

thegildedgopher: "The border policy was changed October 2022. All of the Quetico regs and Ontario fishing regs still apply, but you do not need an RABC to visit Canadian waters on a border lake any more.

For example, on the eastern end of Saganaga which is not part of Quetico, you can freely go back and forth across the border with no official customs stops or RABC. Portaging in any further would require touching land and would be a violation, but in terms of crossing the border line on a lake you don’t need to do anything official.

Look up “loop movements” and you will find the policy. You can’t touch ground, anchor, or make physical contact with another boat.
"

Interesting. Good to know.