Buddy and I have a Mudro EP 23 permit for Saturday Aug 10 2019. This is both of our first time in BWCA and honestly each of us has very little canoeing background (just paddling around a small lake here in PA), though we're both experienced backpackers. We're both guys in our mid-30's and not in terrible shape.

The outfitter we're working with in Ely provided a couple proposed itineraries, the one we're tentatively following is Mudro to Horse Lake to Fourtown, and out. The boilerplate itinerary has a side daytrip up and down the Horse River to Basswood Falls or the pictographs. The outfitter advised 5 days for this loop and being novices we followed this advice and booked a canoe for 5 days.

Digging into this loop more, this sounds like it would very low mileage each day. To the point it's making me look for longer itineraries. The Mudro, Horse river, Friday Bay, string of lakes down to Fourtown and out might be biting off more than we should though?

As an avid backpacker, this notion of not sharing campsites is completely foreign to me; this would never fly on the AT. And if campsites aren't meant to be shared, I'm not getting why they aren't reservable to ensure everyone has a place to crash each night. In any event, this idea of vying for sites has me a bit spooked too and thinking that short mileage days are necessary if only to ensure campsites?

So with all that said, thoughts on what we can do with 5 days at our disposal starting from Mudro 23? Options for extending the basic Mudro-Horse-Fourtown loop in case we find we get out there and find that we're killing it? Advice on approaching this loop to minimize campsite competition?

This is an awesome area, but extremely popular. I agree that Mudro to Horse to Fourtown and out is a bit short for 5 days. I also agree that Mudro to Mudro through Friday bay of Crooked might be a bit much if you are inexperienced. I would stick to the plan to see how it goes. Maybe Horse day1, lower Basswood falls/pictographs day 2, back to Horse day3, Fourtown day4, and out on day5. Take it easy and soak it up. See how you like it, see how good you are at paddling and navigating up there, see how far you travel per day, take the time to explore the lakes. Don't worry about backtracking a little on day 3, you will get to enjoy the horse river twice and you will still see new things. Don't try to do too much on your first trip, many people do and it ends up being a race. No need to make Lower basswood a daytrip, just go there and explore and stay the night .That way you don't have to stress about getting back , you may have to go north a ways to get a campsite if the ones at the falls are taken. As far as sharing campsites, reserving campsites, etc. The whole point of BWCA is to get a wilderness experience, and to have the freedom to go where you want when you want as long as you want to go. Also to have privacy that you seldom get other places. That is what makes BW and Quetico ( as well as the other Canadian parks) so special and unique. The quota system works well to keep crowding down, but near entrances and extremely popular places campsite availability can be an issue. That being said we have always found a site. Since you are going to an extremely populated area, travel early, set up camp by 3-4pm, and enjoy yourselves. If you did do the loop through Crooked you would see far fewer people once you got to the main body of Crooked. That is a really nice route, but not sure of your ability and you would be rushing anyway.

I don't think that the loop down the Horse and onto Crooked and out via Friday Bay would be too much for five days. My suggestion would be to do it in the opposite direction- head to Fourtown first and up towards Gun. After the first day you'll have an idea of what you are capable of and if you don't want to bite off the big loop you can explore east (Moosecamp), west (Gull) or north into Wagosh and towards Crooked. I've managed an extended version of the loop, solo, with just one night of camping (on Robinson in the Quetico) but I was single portaging and have a good deal of experience but it should be easy in five days.

I did the Mudro loop through Friday bay last year on August 11th.

The first day we camped just north of Lower Basswood Falls by 2 pm.
2nd/3rd day we stopped in Wednesday Bay for two nights. Great area and saw only two canoes go by in those two days.

4th day we were headed for an overnight stay on Moosecamp Lake but the sites were taken. (3) We ended up pushing into Fourtown Lake and could not find a site there either so we ended up going all the way back to the entry point. Arrived about 9pm.

I agree about doing that route in reverse if you're worried about campsites.
Go out through Fourtown and look to camp your first night on either Boot, Fairy or Gun Lake. You'll be fresh for the portages and it shouldn't take you any longer than 5 hours to get there.

2nd night I would head for Crooked Lake. Grab a site somewhere between Friday and Thursday Bay. Again about a 5 hour paddle depending on where you stop.

3rd night I would stop at site 1859 on Wednesday Bay. My favorite one!
Easy day on the water. 2 hours of paddle time.
Give yourself some time to rest and enjoy Crooked lake.

4th night I would try and camp somewhere around Lower Basswood Falls and if that is full then head for Horse Lake and if those are all full just keep working back towards the entry point until you find one.

There is nothing super hard about this route. The portages going into Fourtown are really rocky but quite spectacular.

I have a trip report and a video posted if you care to read it.

Just did the loop through Crooked this year. This was the third trip for two of us and the first for one. We did it in six days with a layover day. Three of our days were relatively short paddles. It is doable in five days and we never had a problem finding a campsite. As you get closer to the entry point you will see more people. Here is the trip report: https://bwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=trip.report_view&sel_trp_id=5423

An option if you don't want to go through Crooked. Take the portage from Sandpit to Jackfish Bay of Basswood and stay on Jackfish. There is an island site that is very nice just north of the portage to Pipestone bay. Paddle to Upper Basswood falls and take the portage around the fall to the Basswood River. Stay somewhere near Lower Basswood falls. Lots of great campsites in the area. Take the Horse River to Horse Lake/Fourtown area. Head up to Gun/Gull/Moosecamp lake area. Head out down the Moosecamp river through Fourtown to the entry point. This will give you more paddle miles and you can still see falls, pictos, rivers, etc.

I Soloed the Mudro up to Crooked and back down in 4 days. About 12 miles per day which is very doable. Go counter clockwise if you decide to do the loop because of the Horse River.With 5 days, what I would do is make your fist day short and camp at Tin Can. This avoids trying to find a site on crowded Horse Lake. the 2 longer portages on the route are pretty flat and mellow.

Lots of opinions here already so I'll add mine. I've done the full loop starting and ending at Mudro, both times we did the Sandpit to Jackfish Bay route so we could see the upper Falls. It adds a long portage but it's flat and very easy.

That said...yes, 5 days to do Horse to Fourtown and out is very easy. Experienced paddlers could do that as a day trip. (Notice i didn't say enjoyable)

The biggest thing is be prepared to be flexible. Have a plan, but be able to adjust on the fly if you're ahead of schedule or behind for any number of reasons.

Route 1 - easiest since you only setup camp twice, but still plenty of travel. Mudro to Horse for night one. Day 2 leave early and leave camp and day trip down the Horse R. to see the falls on Basswood River and then back to camp. Day 3 pack up and head over to Fourtown, you should be able to be looking for a site in the late morning and find one easily. Setup and explore the new lake rest of the day. Day 4 head through Boot to Fairy or try going up the Moosecamp river if water levels aren't real low. (Or if you feel you're a seasoned paddler now do the full loop of Boot, Fairy, Gun, Moosecamp, and down the little winding river back) Day 5 head out with light food pack and more portage experience on the hardest portages of the trip.

Route 2 - night one on Horse unless you're on the lake by mid morning and want to keep going. Day 2 head into Fourtown and up Boot, Fairy, Gun. Go as far as you want. Day 3 layover? Day 4 head down Moosecamp river to Fourtown and camp. Day 5 head out. Having a layover day in the plan is nice to allow for high winds or other reasons you can't travel.

Route 3 is the full loop mentioned before. It's doable in 5 days but as a first timer that's a good trip to bite off with no easy way back if you find yourself on Crooked and not doing well for any reason.

Don't fret the campsite details, but on Horse and Fourtown I'd like to be looking for a site to claim by lunch or early afternoon.

Yes, you can probably do more, but there are unknowns too. Based on you are experienced backpackers, in pretty good shape, you will be paddling a lightweight Kevlar canoe, you are bringing your own lightweight gear and will be able to single portage. Unknowns include the weather, which can impact your trip by keeping you off the water at times due to lightning or strong wind. You probably won't have much trouble navigating and finding portages if you can read a map and follow a compass, but it's not the same as following a well-trod and marked trail like the AT. Some portages will be a little rougher than that too, but shouldn't be a major problem. Based on my own experience - paddling a small lake in WV - not translating well to paddling a large wind-swept lake like LLC, I'd ask how small is small, how windy was it when you were paddling, how many miles did you paddle, what was your average paddle speed? How does that compare to what you'll be doing? So yeah, plan other options, but see how it goes and adjust on the fly based on how you are doing and the weather forecast. You may also want to consider going CW since the prevailing winds are westerly and you'd not be going against the wind on Crooked. Of course, the prevailing winds don't always prevail . . .

boonie: "Yes, you can probably do more, but there are unknowns too. Based on you are experienced backpackers, in pretty good shape, you will be paddling a lightweight Kevlar canoe, you are bringing your own lightweight gear and will be able to single portage. Unknowns include the weather, which can impact your trip by keeping you off the water at times due to lightning or strong wind. You probably won't have much trouble navigating and finding portages if you can read a map and follow a compass, but it's not the same as following a well-trod and marked trail like the AT. Some portages will be a little rougher than that too, but shouldn't be a major problem. Based on my own experience - paddling a small lake in WV - not translating well to paddling a large wind-swept lake like LLC, I'd ask how small is small, how windy was it when you were paddling, how many miles did you paddle, what was your average paddle speed? How does that compare to what you'll be doing? So yeah, plan other options, but see how it goes and adjust on the fly based on how you are doing and the weather forecast. You may also want to consider going CW since the prevailing winds are westerly and you'd not be going against the wind on Crooked. Of course, the prevailing winds don't always prevail . . . "

Disagree on the clockwise suggestion. Horse river will be a pain going up stream compared to the relative short distance you'll be traveling the west- east part of Crooked

I have done this loop many times and you have received some good advise from everyone that has posted.
My advise: I remember my first trip and I expected everything to go as planned and it didn't. Be flexible. Build several outs in your trip plan. The full loop is very possible but be prepared for some changes.
Suggest you hit Fourtown first and push on to Fairy or Gun the first day. If your still feeling good about the trip then go for Friday Bay and Crooked the next day and the full loop. If your feeling like this is too much then head over to Moosecamp and slow down and complete a shorter loop. You will still have time to do a day trip up to Lower Basswood Falls on the Horse River.

It will be VERY crowded in that area at that time. Start early and stop early. You have many trips in the future to see the BW. Just take it one small piece at a time my friend.

You have chosen a very popular area/entry point during the most busiest time span for the paddling season. Heed all the advice given in this thread. Have a plan B, C, D and E. Your fears of not finding a vacant campsite are real in that area for that time of year and yes......your paddling hours may be cut short due to finding a campsite early in the day. I think it will be somewhat less crowded to the northern parts of the proposed routes and busier to the South and East. Lump it all together, make plans, keep a positive attitude and I wish you the best of luck.

Thanks everyone for the input, it's much appreciated. Not sure I feel better about the campsite situation, but we're definitely going in with open eyes at least. Talking with the other half, we're inclined to take on the big loop (Mudro to Mudro via Crooked) though a bit concerned with taking on high (for us) mileage days combined with the need to claim a site early every day. I think we'll take day 1 as best we can and decide over the course of that day whether to stay local to Horse & Fourtown or to take on the big loop. Very willing to be flexible, the limited camping options in high demand makes it difficult to be so though.

UofDoboe: "Thanks everyone for the input, it's much appreciated. Not sure I feel better about the campsite situation, but we're definitely going in with open eyes at least. Talking with the other half, we're inclined to take on the big loop (Mudro to Mudro via Crooked) though a bit concerned with taking on high (for us) mileage days combined with the need to claim a site early every day. I think we'll take day 1 as best we can and decide over the course of that day whether to stay local to Horse & Fourtown or to take on the big loop. Very willing to be flexible, the limited camping options in high demand makes it difficult to be so though."

Have a good time! Your first and last nights will be the main time to find a site early. Once you're along the border or NW of Fourtown it gets better. You can stretch those middle travel days longer.

Even if you push past Horse Lake toward the border on day 1, if you want to take it easier the rest of the week just enjoy life in a great area for a few days and head back out the same way you came in.

I agree with cyclones 30.......first and last nights are toughest. Start looking early the first day and don't plan to find a site near your exit for a quick paddle out last day.......gets risky near the e.p. Instead, lay up a little short and make it a little longer paddle out.

What they said - start early, especially the first day. If you single portage it's not that long a loop - probably 40-45 miles. Four 10-12 mile days, and you should be able to average at least 2 miles per hour; start at 7-8, be done at 12-1. Starting early also reduces your chances of stronger wind, thunderstorms in the afternoon. Have fun!

+1 on things already mentioned, here's my perspective:

We just finished an epic trip, went in EP 16 (Moose River North) and came out at Mudro. We did one part of the section you are talking about from Crooked to LBF, then down the Horse and out Mudro via Tin Can Mike/Sandpit south of Horse. My older brother and his son entered at Mudro and did the Horse to LBF - they were on the water at Mudro at 6:30 and didn't pull into LBF until 1pm. They are experienced in the BWCA and the Horse River section was a BEAR, taking the majority of their time to navigate low-water levels, walking the canoe through rapids with super slippery rocks and portages that were muddy and slick. He actually fell at the end of a portage with his canoe and pack on, snapped his yoke in half and broke a thwart. Took some backwoods repair to make his canoe viable. Then my wife and the girls came up the same way to meet us at LBF, they were on the water at 10am, we met them half-way and we didn't pull into LBF area until 8:30pm. So - experienced or not, getting to LBF, depending on conditions, can be tough. If this is your first time in the BWCA - I'd recommend starting to keep your eyes open for sites starting around 1pm. If you get into LBF, all sites in that area might be booked and you'll have to keep working up Crooked until you find one, but that shouldn't be too hard once you are past the falls. Horse is a beautiful lake, with some sandy spots to swim, great fishing. Sometimes for newby's finding a spot to base camp that you are satisfied with, then day-tripping from there is totally worth it, gives you time to rest and explore unburdened. You'll feel like you are just getting the hang of things by day 4. Have maps of the whole area, pay attention to how you are feeling, don't push it. We found Crooked to be pretty darn empty between LBF and Sunday Bay. Had our choice of sites all across.

A note of caution, on our way out we came across two guys who capsized at the top of Wheelbarrow Falls (just east of LBF) and had totaled their rental canoe. With duct tape and ingenuity they made it out ok and very very lucky. The outfitter told us that, more frequently than imagined, folks pull up to the LBF portage, pull their canoe up, and rush to take pics of the falls...only to watch their canoe with all their gear pass down the falls in front of them. Make sure to pull your canoe up far enough or tie it off, lol! I'll be posting a trip report soon, check back in a week if you want to see my impressions of part of this area. HAVE FUN!

My twelve-year old son and I did the Mudro-Crooked Lake loop in early June and it is doable with a five-day itinerary. We did the trip in 6 days, but only traveled on 2.5 of those days, base-camping at the top of Thursday Bay so we could fish Thursday and Friday bays the other 3.5 days of our trip. Our first day was a long day trying to find an open campsite once we got passed LBF, so the previous advice of looking for campsites early, and taking an open campsite when you come upon it is definitely good advice. Plan on extra time on the Horse River, especially later in the summer when water levels are lower. But once you get to Crooked Lake you have no portages until you leave at the bottom of Friday Bay, so you can make good time, if the wind doesn't keep you off the lake.

Because my son wanted to maximize fishing time, we paddled all the way from the top of Thursday Bay back to Mudro in a single day, doing double portages. The mile-long portage into Wagosh was lengthy but not unbearable, especially since my son was focused on having a cheeseburger in Ely that evening.

Crooked Lake is a big body of water with lots of bays and islands so my advice is to keep a map in front of you in a plastic case so you can keep your bearings as it would be easy to get turned around if you're not regularly charting your progress and confirming your location by landmarks.

Just wanted to loop back and thank everyone this thread for the guidance. We did end up doing the "big" loop (enter via Mudro, up to Basswood Falls, over to Friday Bay, down and out via Mudro). We ended up doing the loop in 3 nights, camping night 1 near Basswood Falls, night 2 on the island in the NW corner of Friday Bay, and night 3 on Boot Lake. We were paddling no later than 7:30 am every day and found a campsite typically by 1 or 1:30. Some crowding but by some stroke of luck most traffic seemed to be going the other way. Apart from my spraining my ankle badly on the 2nd portage of the trip (buddy got really good at portaging by the end of it all) it went off without a hitch.

As long-distance backpackers, the pace was a bit foreign to us. It seemed like most folks slept in much later and made camp much earlier than we would have, but we tend to be masochists. Our gear was by far the most minimal that we saw; we were a bit shocked by the amount of gear people take out there but I suppose you aren't really carrying it all day so...

Anyway, thank you all again for the input, guidance, and route suggestions. Definitely helped make the trip a success.

Thanks for reporting back and glad everything worked out pretty well except for the sprained ankle. Some people do take a lot of stuff, but I don't think most of them travel far. Also a lot of people are mainly there to fish.

We just did this loop, unintentionally, lol. My boyfriend, myself and our 12, 11 and 10 year old. The kids had their own canoe ( we portaged it but they did all their own gear). We couldn't find a site on horse or basswood. We did murdo to basswood in a day. Then basswood to four town in a morning. Beings it's your first trip up isn't a bad idea to stick with this plan. Gives you time to get used to finding portages, reading the maps with the land, and getting your feet wet with portaging the canoes. We did this in 4 days and 3 nights. Good luck