Hey guys,

I'm kicking around the idea of buying my own kevlar finally. Let's say I bought a used Kevlar to save some money, and I wanted to get it refinished by a professional. Are there places around the twin cities that do this? What would the cost be approximately? Would be looking at a Northstar 17 if that matters,

I assume you do know it's an easy diy job? I'm just curious what you would expect a professional job to be different from a diy?

I agree with billconner. I think anything that would need to be done to refinish a used kevlar canoe could be done inexpensively yourself, especially a Northstar 17 which would only be five or six years old. Without seeing the specific boat though it's hard to say.......

GearGuy: "Hey guys,

I'm kicking around the idea of buying my own kevlar finally. Let's say I bought a used Kevlar to save some money, and I wanted to get it refinished by a professional. Are there places around the twin cities that do this? What would the cost be approximately? Would be looking at a Northstar 17 if that matters,"

Start with Northwest Canoe. .

It appears they have moved but, still close enough to the Twin Cities. Even if you ultimately do the job yourself, this looks like a good resource for the supplies you'll need.

Good Luck

Bill,
refinishing a gold colored skin-coat Kevlar boat? how to? My Clipper Sea 1 is skin coat polyester resin, I think.

Vs. a colored gel coat boat like a Kruger. Now THAT refinish job would be tough.
Joe

joewildlife: "Bill,
refinishing a gold colored skin-coat Kevlar boat? how to? My Clipper Sea 1 is skin coat polyester resin, I think.


Vs. a colored gel coat boat like a Kruger. Now THAT refinish job would be tough.
Joe



"

Both of my canoes are SR Kevlar skin colored. I sand lightly, clean with lawyer thinner, and two coats of Epifanes spar varnish. Looks good, easy,

I have no experience with gel coats.

billconner: "I assume you do know it's an easy diy job? I'm just curious what you would expect a professional job to be different from a diy? "

Honestly I got enough projects going on! But if it's a couple day long project then that wouldn't be bad at all. Thanks for the feedback that it'd be an easy project to do at home and save the money.

GearGuy: "

billconner: "I assume you do know it's an easy diy job? I'm just curious what you would expect a professional job to be different from a diy? "

Honestly I got enough projects going on! But if it's a couple day long project then that wouldn't be bad at all. Thanks for the feedback that it'd be an easy project to do at home and save the money. "

Not a whole day for me. Maybe an hour to sand and clean, and a half hour each coat.
But I understand too many projects. I have quite a few on my docket. I'm hopeful retirement will help catch up. ??

Northwest Canoe previously mentioned.

They were great with an extra seat I put in my Quetico 18.5, ultimately I had them put it in. It was inexpensive and definitely professional. They work on your canoe like it is their own.

I see many refinish their canoes with spar varnish? Isn’t the original finish a type of resin that is stronger? I am very elementary on my knowledge—-so I don’t really know. That might be a good thing to run by Northwest?

I could see someone paying a professional. A professional does this job all the time and you would know the quality is good, if the price isn’t too high it might be worth it to gain back the time for something else. If you aren’t handy their is a price for equipment tools that is an extra cost that having someone else do it may off set. I also get doing a job yourself is nice, cheaper and a sense of self satisfaction.

T

I agree with many of Tim's points. I would not try to repaint my car. But my canoes are different - tools - not show pieces nor anywhere near the car investment.

They look great to me when refinished. I haven't had any structural damage to the fabric, just light scratches. Epoxy might be better but not much IMHO. And some question in my mind about available diy epoxies and the polyester resins used on US built canoes. And epoxy has no uv resistance, compared to spar.

So, my effort to refinish diy is practically less work than transporting to and picking up at a canoe shop.

Bill I really appreciate your opinion and especially mentioning varnish vs. epoxy. I know that lots of folks use epoxy but it sounds like a lot more work, fumes, and expense. If it is only marginally better, than there is your answer. Also the UV protection from varnish is definitely a plus.

I understand if you use epoxy on a polyester resin canoe, then it limits you to future repairs using epoxy. As in, new epoxy sticks to polyester resin but polyester doesn't stick to existing epoxy. I could be wrong about that.

On my Krugers, they use a polyester resin and a polyester gelcoat. It is a large amount of work to reapply gelcoat. It is hard to get the gelcoat on thick enough for it to get hot enough for it to cure correctly. My Clipper has a skin coat hull and a gelcoat deck. So two different methods would be required to refinish the hull vs. the deck.

The OP was about a skin coat Kevlar boat...after all this discussion and some additional research, I think your recommendation to use varnish is spot on. I believe that Souris River recommends the exact thing to refinish their boats. Seems I saw that on their website once.

I'm going to stick my neck out and copy and paste some discussion I saved from another forum about refinishing boats, FYI. It sounds like epoxy can be a lot of work. They are more likely talking about carbon fiber Texas water safari type boats.

"“Is the boat a skincoat or gelcoated (colored boat)?

If the boat is a skincoat Wenonah, it never had a gelcoat surface (although clear gelcoat does exist).

If you have a colored boat (or skincoat), forget gelcoat. Gelcoat is the vilest resin known to man. In order to harden, gelcoat must be applied thick to generate enough heat to cure...then it's hard to sand and polish. Matching color, especially yellow is impossible. Use a respirator, skin barrier cream and gloves if you (unfortunately) decide to apply gelcoat.

Suggest you lightly sand the worn spots (remember that kevlar fuzzes, it doesn't absorb resin and/or sand nicely). Then coat the bad spots with West System 105resin/207 hardner. Apply the mixture with a bondo squeegee as thinly as possible. The resin will cure quickly and you can apply a second (or more) coat(s) in 30 minutes. Sand as needed and then paint over with a) clear lacquer on a skincoat boat or b) appliance paint from Home Depot/ Lowe's etc...if the boat is colored.

This is pretty easy stuff that took me 20 years and a lot of hours and $$$ to figure out.

Always work in a well ventilated space and wear a mask/respirator/gloves when sanding and applying resins or paint.” -Lee
I sent Scott a PM but thought I'd add to the forum. I do exactly as Lee does- however you can save a lot of time and trouble by doing this. After you've lightly applied a coat of West Systems, with a cotton rag lightly rub it in before it sets. If you leave too much it'll ripple on you= more work. If you just lightly rub it in/ wipe off, you'll get a super, shiney, laminar surface. My 2Cents. -Chuck Henry
I'm with Chuck's method. I apply a slightly heavier coat with a cheap paint brush, then immediately wipe it off with a wasteful amount of paper towels. I let it sit about five mintues between coats and add as many coats as I can handle before passing out - wiping off each coat as soon as I finish the painting the boat. Saves on sanding. –West
"


thanks again,
Joe

Epoxy adds considerably more weight than spar varnish; it is a noticeable increase. It will last longer if applied properly but better to consider epoxy after years of heavy use. Spar varnish is simple and the results look really good. Benefits are basically cosmetic- perhaps more on a Souris River as the resin they use seems to be more subject to UV degradation.

https://www.sourisriver.com/refinishing
And I do know that painting on a polyester resin over any surface doesn't work worth a darn. No adhesion. But putting on a layer of Kevlar or Dynel as a keel strip, with epoxy, works quite well.

Joe

If you are just getting rid of scratches, 30 minutes with a 1/4 sheet sander and a couple coats of spar varnish will do the trick. Some deep gouges may need some epoxy fill, but it isn’t complicated. Cracks and holes are a different story. I refurbished one a couple years ago that had been pretty abused then blown off a truck that I billed 25 hours on. Got no cash, but a sweet pack from frost river.

I have refinished a handful now. Not that hard of a diy project, but there are some tips and learning curves.....especially with epoxy. I have done Wenonahs, SR's and Mad Rivers. My biggest tip is to judge the canoe to see if it is just cosmetic repairs, or is there some structural needs. Most times, it is just cosmetic and I would go with the sand and spar. Pretty easy project. Older boats with UV damage, gouges, deep scratches etc, may need epoxy. I have always worked with West Systems. SR boats refinish nice with epoxy cuz they are made with epoxy plus they have a final layer of FG over their kevlar. Sands nicer, doesnt fuzz, etc. I have done a Mn 2 skin coat.....more careful sanding, but turned out nice. Also did a Wenonah gel coat.....kind of an experiment with epoxy....but turned out great and has held up really good. I have not done any Bells/Northstars, but I would think the sand/spar route would give you great results. For a great look, follow all the rules.....proper prep, tape things off, avoid sags (stuff really likes to sag on the side walls, keep it thin there). Should be a fun project.

A few have asked about the use of polyester resin. The only thing polyester resin sticks well to is uncured polyester resin. It is fine for laminating/wetting out as this is usually done wet on wet so it is making the chemical bond but once it is cured you are relying on a secondary mechanical bond for resin applied after that. Polyester does this poorly. If you have to do repairs regardless of the original resin makeup I would always use epoxy as it has excellent secondary bonding ability. For skin coating epoxy or varnish can be used. I think the varnish is easier to apply that's why it is recommended so often. Whether one is better than another can be debated.