I'm getting more long in the tooth than I'd like to admit and paddling my tandem is becoming less enjoyable, so my grandson and his new wife will be gifted my beloved Northstar.

I decided to shift to a dedicated solo and am considering two boats currently on the used market: Kevlar Wenonah Advantage and Graphite Bell Magic. I'll be paddling my neighborhood lake four days per week and trip in the BWCA three times per season (5 night max/trip.) Thoughts?

Well, I am thoroughly loving the used Advantage I recently acquired. It has taken some seat time to get the balance required to feel comfortable, but now that I'm there it is a blast to paddle.

I haven't tripped with it yet, but many here have with the same canoe. Hopefully, in early June, I'll be able to paddle it in the BWCA.

Flip a coin both are very good hulls and amazingly close in performance in spite of opposite spectrum hull style. Been on many group solo trips with Magic partners and often paddled one. Always matched the handling with a very minor speed advantage. That last may sound contradictory but with any skill I have been able to keep up turn for turn on the tightest streams a Magic can negotiate.

butthead

And I am also in love with my 2013 Black Magic. I am 73, paddle a couple times a week on flat water and only trip about once a year anymore. Both boats will get lots of love from their paddlers, great boats.
I had been kayaking after losing my paddling partners and now use a kayak paddle with the Magic. There is a lot of discussion on which paddle, another important decision. I raise this as I believe the Advantage has a wider gunnel. I tried a Prism and the Magic when I was looking and hit my knuckles on the gunnel of the Prism, not so much on the Magic.
If it is important, scratches tend to be more noticeable with the carbon boats, the white on black stands out.

Advantage is noticeably faster, especially for strong paddlers. Magic handles tough seas from the side better and is more forgiving in general. I like the sliding seat that comes with the Advantage for trimming the boat- especially empty. Width at paddling position are basically identical. Both are great hulls.

Another vote for the Advantage here. I've had mine for 3 years and couldn't be happier. I've never paddled a faster solo. I did have the tractor seat out with a foam insert in order to sit much lower when I purchased it but quickly opted to re-install the sliding tractor seat.

What just hit me is how accurate their naming is! Magic is that, and explains why it is so popular! Advantage is also that, a bit of an edge beyond many solos (but not the Magic)!
Despite the different appearance Magic is a bit wider tween gunnels and has a bit of rocker, Advantage has no rocker but makes up for that with better paddle placement due to a bit narrower width tween the gunnels. Far as sea-worthiness I have paddled a Magic in whitecaps same as my Advantage. Crossed Bailey Bay to PP in near whitecap wave conditions accompanied by Magics. Honestly there is very little difference beyond each craft's idiosyncrasies.
Why do I paddle an Advantage after experience in both? It is a tad less common is the only real reason. I'd be as happy and do the same paddling with a Magic!

butthead

My Advantage is by far the best canoe I have ever paddled. Paddling efficiency is incredible and it's surprisingly stable. Loaded, it firms up nicely. I've owned three going back to the late '80s. Don't let anyone tell you they're tough to turn. A little lean gets the bow and stern out and shortens the waterline hull length.

I've owned both. My advice would be to test paddle each before deciding. I can tell you that I no longer own the Advantage, but still own two Magics. I like the touch of rocker that the Magics offer. They make me smile. But the Advantage is a nice boat, too. Try them both and see which one makes you smile more.

I appreciate the insightful comments. I'm considering the same two boats. One question to Advantage owners...are you also happy with the handling on rivers (in current)?

butthead: " Far as sea-worthiness I have paddled a Magic in whitecaps same as my Advantage. Crossed Bailey Bay to PP in near whitecap wave conditions accompanied by Magics. Honestly there is very little difference beyond each craft's idiosyncrasies.

butthead"

The Advantage is a champ in rough conditions if you're heading into the wind. The Magic has a definite edge if the seas are coming perpendicular to direction of travel.

The magic is a wonderful all around lake canoe, I loved mine. Perfectly fast, safe, maneuverable tripping/day canoe. Everything everyone says about both canoes are true.

No canoe is really fast. But, both hulls are faster than most others with the Advantage being the quickest of the two. The Magic works better in the chop than the Advantage, but I stayed off the lake with winds over 15 mph. It’s not much fun fighting the wind anyway.

The Magic is more maneuverable and it does have a better on-the-water feel (response) to it. The Advantage is sterile, like it’s on a rope or like a knife edge thru the water, more efficient, crazy long glide and stays on line across the lake which requires less input to keep it straight. It’s really fun to slice thru the water with it. It was exactly what I was looking for.

I use mine for exercise and I love blasting down the shoreline. I can fly using a kayak paddle, but usually use sit and switch. I’m less tired and cover more water in a shorter amount of time in the Advantage. I’m not very patient and when I have a destination in mind I like to get there.

I can sit in a Wenonah tractor seat for hours, but need a cushion if I’m on a flat seat. The Magic is a perfect tripping canoe and the Advantage is a racing hull. Each canoe can be used either way with subtle characteristics and compromises. I still can’t decide which I like the most. I don’t do solo trips so the Advantage is better suited to how I use it. I hope that helps.

justpaddlin: "I appreciate the insightful comments. I'm considering the same two boats. One question to Advantage owners...are you also happy with the handling on rivers (in current)?"

Are you talking mild rapids or just current? In a current, it's a champ. I've been paddling mine in high water strong current most of the Spring.

Blatz: "

justpaddlin: "I appreciate the insightful comments. I'm considering the same two boats. One question to Advantage owners...are you also happy with the handling on rivers (in current)?"

Are you talking mild rapids or just current? In a current, it's a champ. I've been paddling mine in high water strong current most of the Spring. "

Just current. I know that neither is a whitewater boat. I do a lot of upstream paddling on rivers. I like efficiency for driving against current and I tend to use obstacles on the edge of the river to minimize exposure to the main current, but I need some cooperation when I have to go around obstacles and stick the bow into the main current.

It sounds like the Advantage is cooperative for a race boat. I hope my favorite dealer has both Magic and Advantage in stock.

I'm a Prism owner. I struggle at times to get my pack to fit laying down inside the 26" wide gunwales. I assume you all must have a relatively narrow pack or two with the Magic or Advantage? Seems like a downside to me, but clearly the narrower canoes would be faster.

gopher2307: "I'm a Prism owner. I struggle at times to get my pack to fit laying down inside the 26" wide gunwales. I assume you all must have a relatively narrow pack or two with the magic or advantage? Seems like a downside to me, but clearly the narrower canoes would be faster."

I've fit a GG Quetico, Kondos Outfitter Special and a CCS Explorer laying flat with no trouble removing them.

justpaddlin: "Just current. I know that neither is a whitewater boat. I do a lot of upstream paddling on rivers. I like efficiency for driving against current and I tend to use obstacles on the edge of the river to minimize exposure to the main current but I need some cooperation when I have to go around obstacles and stick the bow into the main current.

It sounds like the Advantage is cooperative for a race boat. I hope my favorite dealer has both Magic and Advantage in stock."

I never shuttle. Upstream, then down for me. We've had some heavy rains at times this Spring in NE Illinois. The Des Plaines river is aggressively flowing. A typical upstream speed lately has been 3-4 mph. That's using sit and switch, shortening the stroke, and increasing the cadence a bit. Great uphill canoe.

I've had both canoes you're interested in. I sold my first Advantage (I hope bobbwca is still paddling it) when a Magic with CCS covers became available to me.
I paddled the Magic for a few years and decided I preferred the Advantage I had sold. It took me a couple years to find the used Advantage I wanted and then I sold my Magic.

They're both fine canoes, but, personally, I prefer the Advantage. The Advantage is faster, but the Magic has some rocker and turns a bit easier. Either will serve you well.

butthead: "Advantage matched the handling with a very minor speed advantage. butthead"

Or as Gene Jensen said, "You can make a fast boat turn, but you cannot make a slow boat go fast".

I've paddled both, but never owned either. I'd say butthead & Banksiana have hit the nail on the head in their comparisons. My two cents added is that if you are sit & switch... Advantage. Anything else... Magic.

Really helpful comments and thanks again. It's good to know that the Advantage works well going upstream (thank you Blatz). I did see one YouTube video where the Advantage seemed to have no trouble making turns on a stream...and the glide was pretty obvious.

I've always knelt but am shopping for a sitting boat to let me avoid knee pain and spend more time on the water. I do have five other (essential) solos that do very well at the things that aren't the strengths of the Advantage (or Magic). I tried Swift's 16.8 Cruiser last year and didn't like it. I appreciate the experience and wisdom shared on this thread.

Thanks for the thoughtful responses. Seems like a win/win situation.
Still, would like to know thoughts regarding graphite vs kevlar in these crafts. The Magic I'm considering is graphite, and the Advantage is kevlar.

PVnRT: "Thanks for the thoughtful responses. Seems like a win/win situation.
Still, would like to know thoughts regarding graphite vs kevlar in these crafts. The Magic I'm considering is graphite, and the Advantage is kevlar."

I have a background in composites professionally. Regarding the Graphite/Carbon vs Kevlar......the short answer is graphite is stiffer and lighter, but less wear resistant than Kevlar. It is also more expensive (& attractive IMHO).

Resin infused graphite is sandable….resin infused Kevlar just fuzzes when sanded. The Kevlar fibers are just more resistant to shearing or breaking. Anyone who has tried to cut both cloths with sheers will see that as well.

Both boat constructions will take on damage if contacted with rocks in the BWCA, so neither should be paddled to the portage with reckless abandon. :)

Graphite vs Kevlar. Graphite will be stiffer, possibly more resistant to abrasion but more brittle so the abrasion resistance is sort of a wash as it is more likely to puncture or fracture from impact. Weight is basically the same. In the end it really isn't all that significant. Graphite is a little easier to repair because it doesn't fray to the same degree kevlar does when sanded. I would say the preferred hull shape is more significant than the material in this case.

PVnRT: "Thanks for the thoughtful responses. Seems like a win/win situation.
Still, would like to know thoughts regarding graphite vs kevlar in these crafts. The Magic I'm considering is graphite, and the Advantage is kevlar."

If you order a new construction Advantage you probably could get graphite. Among other personalized options like wood trim and a smaller Kevlar seat. It's available in some of the other Wenonah models, and the Advantage is not listed in catalogs but can still be ordered I do believe.

butthead

PVnRT: "Thanks for the thoughtful responses. Seems like a win/win situation.
Still, would like to know thoughts regarding graphite vs kevlar in these crafts. The Magic I'm considering is graphite, and the Advantage is kevlar."

I think the BlackLite is a superb choice for a Magic. It actually adds 2 pounds and you get an extremely stiff and strong boat in return. I have a BlackLite Polaris tandem and two older Bell BlackGold solos and the solos can really take a beating (my Polaris hasn't seen much abuse yet). I accidentally ran my BlackGold Merlin II full power into a submerged concrete barrier (the boat bounced hard off the concrete - twice) and it just put a bb size chip in the gelcoat. The BlackLite and BlackGold both use a combination of Aramid (Kevlar) and graphite so in principle you get the stiffness of graphite plus the toughness of Aramid. I'm not as familiar with Wenonah lay-ups but they seem to use the graphite for added stiffness and reduced weight while the Northstar canoes use it for stiffness and added durability so presumably they don't just swap Kevlar for graphite like Wenonah, they add more fabric. Outfitters rent both Northstars and Wenonahs in lightweight Kevlar so I think again you have a win/win choice and can't really go wrong.

My Magic was Blackgold (now called blacklite) and my Advantage is UL Kevlar. I loved the black look, hull was stiffer with really no flex but showed scratches easier. The UL Kevlar also looks great, has some flex to it on the sides and is lighter. You can’t go wrong either way. If I had the choice and the money I’d buy the black canoe because of the aesthetics and the stiffer hull. It’s more about preference. I bought my Advantage in UL Kevlar because thats what they had on hand at the time I found it.

butthead: "

PVnRT: "Thanks for the thoughtful responses. Seems like a win/win situation.
Still, would like to know thoughts regarding graphite vs kevlar in these crafts. The Magic I'm considering is graphite, and the Advantage is kevlar."

If you order a new construction Advantage you probably could get graphite. Among other personalized options like wood trim and a smaller Kevlar seat. It's available in some of the other Wenonah models, and the Advantage is not listed in catalogs but can still be ordered I do believe.


butthead"

That is correct. Wenonah has not re listed the Advantage on their site or catalogs. But it is still available to order. And it can be ordered in the graphite. I have a 2020 model in that combination. So far I love it.

slight rocker or no rocker - fundamental different handling - pros and cons to each. I'll take the rocker and the ride any day, especially solo.