Neither of my vehicles have suitable bolts to attach loop straps under the hood. However, they do have holes that a new bolt could be attached to. I'm trying not to overthink this, but there are so many options for fasteners out there. The only information I can find involves using existing bolts to attach the loops. Has anyone tried installing *new* bolts onto their car?

There are lots of factors to consider: the length of the bolt, the width of the head, the width of the shaft, different ways of "locking" the bolt (split lock washer vs. nord-lock vs. loctite), the type of head (hex, flange, etc), and the material of the bolt. I just want to make sure they won't vibrate loose, or cause corrosion, or just not fit well. It can't be that complicated, right?

I have been using the T style loops for years, but after driving up to the BWCA last summer I noticed they bent one of my fenders a bit. "Soft loop" tie down straps are another option, but I'd have to loop the straps around pretty sharp edges which doesn't seem ideal. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Cars are made with different options to fit on the same frame. So if you have existing holes I would use them. Your empty bolt holes are probably to mount something.

You need the hole threads to have 1-1/2 times the bolt diameter to work. That is the threads in your frame need to be deep enough to hold a bolt. I would use a bolt that has a shoulder on it to get extra support on the strap. Also make sure to look if there is anything on the back side of your bolt that might interfere with the length of the bolt. I would use some blue loctite on the bolts because you are probably going to just tuck them out of the way when you are not using them. Also make sure the part you are screwing into can support your load. Cars nowadays are a unibody style and not solid as yesteryears cars.

Here's a shot of the passenger-side tie down on my 2011 Suby Outback; both sides of the car had vacant holes near the radiator. The webbing is 1" tubular climbing webbing (less than $ 0.50/foot at your local climbing shop, ~4000# break strength); the webbing segment is about 10" long. I used a hot nail (nail held with ViceGrip, heated repeatedly with propane torch) to melt a hole in the webbing ends to accommodate a 1/4-20 x 3/4" hex-head bolt. The bolt goes through a 1/4" fender washer, the webbing, the radiator bracket sheet metal (existing hole) another 1/4" fender washer, and the stack is secured with a 1/4" ESNA (nylon locking insert) locknut. Easy peasy. Cheap. Straps fold under the hood when not in use, and give me a nice loop when I'm carrying the canoe. I've got several thousand miles of carrying the canoe on the Outback, and haven't seen signs of rust at the attachment points, no signs of paint abrasion at the hood/fender gap, nor have I had any loosening of the fasteners.

TZ

You might also look for just holes into which to tie some webbing. In my Tacoma, I just tied some 11/16" climbing webbing through a hole under the hood with a water knot. The loop fits under the hood for tying, and falls down into the engine compartment when not needed.

You might consider something like these Hood Loops

A setup like TrailZen's is what I had in mind. It's good to know a locknut will hold everything together without loosening. That's my main concern.

Tomcat is probably correct that there are fender bolts under the molding on one of the vehicles. I guess I'm inclined to not tear off the molding if I don't need to.

MReid's suggestion is tempting too. So you just stuff the webbing through the hole itself?

Here's a photo of both vehicles for reference. Like I said, I already have the T-style loops, but they bent the fender on my little car. If I'm careful, I can sort of wedge them in place, but otherwise there's a lot of tension on the corner of the fender.

boonie: " You might consider something like these Hood Loops "

I've used these. They work just fine

boonie: " You might consider something like these Hood Loops "

+2
These are what I use on my 10+ year old SUV. For the back I use a loop around the rear door’s latch mechanism. Learned it from a BWCA outfitter. Simple but effective!

oldtownfunk:
MReid's suggestion is tempting too. So you just stuff the webbing through the hole itself? "

Just thread the webbing through an opening and tie it in a loop. Pics:

If you do add your own bolts, I'd recommend not skimping on the bolt. It's just a couple pieces, so get stainless so that they don't begin to rust over time. This isn't out of concern for the bolts themselves but for the surrounding sheet metal of your car.

Very helpful recommendations. MReid, that's the other method I thought about. My only concern was that the edges on the car would cut into the webbing. Your Tacoma looks like it's set up well for that. That might work on both my vehicles too if cutting isn't an issue.

Tomcat, that's a good point. I didn't think about the distance from the hood lip. Maybe I will try the MReid method on that front/arm piece, and put it closer to the hood lip (so, up and right of the yellow circle). Otherwise I may have to remove the molding like you said. I've just never messed with those plastic fasteners before.

MReid: "

oldtownfunk:
MReid's suggestion is tempting too. So you just stuff the webbing through the hole itself? "

Just thread the webbing through an opening and tie it in a loop. Pics:
"

+1.....this is what I do

Oldtown,

My suggestion would be to just use the existing fasteners shown in your pictures. Just remove the existing fastener, slip-on the strap, and reinstall the fastener.

You can make a strap very easily with the hot nail method mentioned above, our you can buy ready-made ones for under $10 from a many places.



Dave

Okay, I'm having a bit of a breakthrough. I worked up the courage to remove the so-called fender seal from the black vehicle, and now I have options! There are two solid bolts near the hood lip. The only question now is which one to use? If the canoe is perfectly centered, the front handle should be about 1/3 of the way between the front and back bolt. (See drawing) What do you think?

For the smaller white vehicle, I think I'll just tie some webbing around the piece the fender connects to. The existing bolt looks pretty wimpy compared to the other vehicle. If the webbing doesn't work well, I can always go back to the T-style loops. I was mainly concerned about not damaging the other vehicle since it's newer and I owe lots of money on it!

I prefer the forward mounting position, but only because that's similar to the rigging I did before auto manufacturers started making it tougher to tie down to a bumper or some point near the front lip of the vehicle.
TZ

Either one will work fine. The purpose of those lines is only to provide lateral control of the front of the canoe, not to secure the canoe to the car, and either position will do that. Your roof rack straps are what do all the work of securing the canoe to the vehicle.

Why bother with bolts at all? Why not just run a strap under the hood and out each side? It’s not like your strap is going to get caught in the engine somehow??

Have you looked at Yakima hood anchors? I have used them and work well.
https://www.yakima.com/hoodanchor

Garny: "Have you looked at Yakima hood anchors? I have used them and work well.
https://www.yakima.com/hoodanchor"

That's the T type that deformed his car and he doesn't want. I probably don't tighten them as much as OP, not sure I could since I use nylon rope and truckers hitch, not ratchet or cam straps.

I use loops of Kevlar "pulling tape". I like it because it's floppy and narrow so easily fits in sheet metal gaps plus it's super strong and I've never had any problems even when wrapped around relatively sharp metal. I got mine from my favorite canoe dealer, Carl at Carl's Paddlin in Lone Rock. I think it's typically sold in half mile or full mile rolls which may be more than you need. ??

+1 on the Yakima hood anchors.

mschi772: " Your roof rack straps are what do all the work of securing the canoe to the vehicle."

I couldn't disagree more. A good strong wind will easily show you that all of the tie-outs are needed. They are all equally important.

Blatz: "

boonie: " You might consider something like these Hood Loops "

I've used these. They work just fine"

Same here, though different brand. This past weekend I used them for my 17' Grumman and my WS Pungo140 driving to northern WI and back (from Downers Grove, IL) and they worked fine.

Rented a NW17 from VNO this past week. They supplied the foam blocks, temporary hood loops like the ones boonie linked to, and cam straps (one with a pad for the buckle that goes around the top, and 4 with hook ends - two in front, two in back) and could get it ready for the road in just a few minutes. At trip end, my wife and I easily got it back on and snugged down, and it only took us about twice as long. :-)

This was my first time using a foam block and straps install on our Highlander, and I was a bit anxious about it, but it turned out to be rock-solid on the bumps and grinds up and back on the Echo Trail. Will do it again in a heartbeat.

HowardSprague: "

Blatz: "

boonie: " You might consider something like these Hood Loops "

I've used these. They work just fine"

Same here, though different brand. This past weekend I used them for my 17' Grumman and my WS Pungo140 driving to northern WI and back (from Downers Grove, IL) and they worked fine.
"

I also use them with great success. I actually use just on in the center of the hood in back. It gives me more of a directly downward hold. I saw Walmart even carries them now.