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oravavaara
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09/02/2020 04:10PM  
My friend and I have both been to the BWCA a number of times before, but neither one of us have a lot of experience battling high winds. We are going on a trip with moderately sized lakes (East Bearskin- not big but long, so the wind could get going if it's coming from the right direction) this weekend and the forecast calls for gusts up to 25 mph, but the wind speed is only supposed to be 5 mph. I have read on another forum that other folks feel 25 mph winds can be dangerous, but I am assuming they were talking about sustained wind speeds. Are 25 mph gusts dangerous? Would you consider yourself "wind bound" if there were 25 mph gusts?

Neither my friend nor I consider ourselves to be very strong paddlers- we're capable, but we're mostly accustomed to good conditions. I went on a trip last fall when it was windy and crossing Lake One made me very nervous. I felt that there was a non-negligible chance that we could tip given how hard it was to control the boat (we were getting blown sideways at some points), and given the waves, it would have been very difficult to maneuver the boat (not to mention the gear) to shore safely if we did tip. On that day, weather underground says the max wind speed was 18 mph and the gusts were up to 31 mph. What do you think- would you ever call a trip off due to wind? Do you think this trip would be a good opportunity for my friend and I to gain more experience battling wind, or do you think if the forecast holds we would be better sitting it out?
 
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09/02/2020 05:24PM  
I would not sit out my vacation time in the BW. If concerned as you seem to be, I would leave early as around dawn and reduce the odds that wind will be a factor. You could do that again when your last day says it is time to exit. It is good that you are thinking this through in advance and have some idea of your shortcomings in the paddling. Of course, if in doubt, error on the side of safety.

At camp, be aware of the wind and accept a wind blown day at the camp. Plan on that and if not needed, spend an extra day near the exit point.
MikeinMpls
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09/02/2020 05:38PM  
I think "too much wind" is an individual definition based on a number of factors.

First, experience and comfort in paddling in big wind. I've done it a lot, but I also know my limitations. If you're not comfortable, listen to yourself and stay put.

Other factors:

Is boat loaded or not? A loaded boat will ride more stable in wind, but has less freeboard if you trough. I discuss troughs below.

Wind direction: Will you be paddling into the wind, with the wind, or cross wind? I find paddling into the wind to be the safest actually because I can read what the water is doing second-by-second. If you have a cross wind, do you have enough lakeshore to paddle on the lee side and avoid the wind? A following sea (lake) can be fun, but can easily trough the boat (see below.) Consider paddling in the lee of the shore as far as you can, even if you paddle a little further.

Troughs and quartering: In a cross wind, a lot of new or inexperienced paddlers will paddle a straight line to where they want to go. They end up getting caught in the trough of waves, which is where swamping occurs. Learn to quarter into the wind, paddling through the waves at a 45 degree angle. Sure, you'll zigzag across the lake and paddle further than a straight line, but you'll arrive in one piece.

Timing: wind is less early in the day. It picks up as the atmosphere heats up. Paddle early for (usually) less wind.

Have an out: if you're paddling in waves that are big, have a plan if the water gets too big for your comfort, such as if a gust picks up. That may mean a quick turn toward a point of land on the shore or an island. Your identified safe place will change as you move across the lake, so always terrain associate (know where you are on your map by matching the terrain on the ground with your map.) This suggestion is easier said than done.

If you're on a lake with islands, consider using them for lee as much as you can. "Hopscotch" between them. In May, we had big wind on Kawishiwi Lake. Just to keep us moving faster, I used the islands as the wind breaks and was exposed to the wind less than if I took my usual route through the lake.

Gear: you might want to tie your gear into your boat. If you swamp, the gear will stay with your canoe. This applies only to lakes. Running rivers is a different story. And no loose stuff. Everything is in a pack or tied in.

Communication: if you're the stern paddler, keep your bow partner informed of what you're doing, where you're going, etc. Let them know if you intend to quarter the waves. If and/or when you have to make a big turn, you will need their power to make the turn quickly, efficiently, and safely.

Paddling: learn to steer your canoe from whatever side you are paddling! Learn to J-stroke or "goon" stroke. If you are one of those people who has to constantly switch sides to keep the canoe going straight, you raise your risk of putting your canoe in a vulnerable spot. A wave will hit your boat while you're switching sides and you'll be in trouble. Besides, paddling the length of a lake, wind or no wind, never having to switch sides to steer, makes you look cool. OK, probably not.

Concentration: paddling in big water and wind requires hyper-focus. You have to watch the water, the boat, the boat's position in the water relative to the waves, the terrain, your "outs," your map, and your bow partner...all at the same time. It's not a time for sightseeing.

Safety: I wear a PFD 99% of the time, wind or no wind. If you are in big water and you are near the limit of your experience, wear it.

Prayer: if you follow the above, you won't require it.

Hope this helps.

Mike


09/02/2020 05:46PM  
A sudden gust can be more destabilizing than a steady wind. Stay closer to shoreline and travel early and late as winds tend to pick up early afternoon. If there is a front and winds will be blowing all day the early late input is of no import. Check weather and a weather radio is a great tool.
Also consider campsite selection. An exposed firegrate and a nice breeze is great when bugs are bad, but a bigger wind blows sparks and can easily become a hazard. And check for widowmakers.
09/02/2020 06:00PM  
As a mostly solo canoeist I can handle steady 20-25 mph winds-though I prefer not too. Wind gusts are another issue, though. Most of the time you can “read” the lake surface and prepare yourself for gusts, but it’s definitely nerve racking. Problems arise on larger lakes that can produce larger waves and the potential for swamping. Sometimes people don’t read the lake well enough to know not to cross and then they get in over their heads. Even staying close to shore may not be good enough either as there may be rocks below the surface you can’t see. If you’re concerned about wind, get up early and get moving before the wind picks up and plan on a shorter travel day.
Northwoodsman
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09/02/2020 06:22PM  
Since gusts are very unpredictable I would stay close to shore on the leeward side (the side that the winds are coming from ) if possible. As other have stated the best chance for calm water is early in the morning or close to dusk.
cyclones30
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09/02/2020 07:18PM  
I think it's by feel and situation. I'm not sure what the wind speed actually is most of the time I'm out there. Anything forecaste in the 30s will have my attention at least to look at route and how to best navigate it. Loaded or at least half loaded canoe and in the morning....I'm willing to go through quite a bit of wind. Later in the day or empty canoe...not as much
09/02/2020 07:31PM  
So much depends on the wind direction, your paddling abilities, and the wave's height and direction.
09/02/2020 07:58PM  
Agree with everything said here and picking up a few pointers myself. Mike, your response is epic! I'll just emphasize a couple of points from my experiences-

-Can't stress enough about using islands, points, etc. to help on a windy day. If you are crossing a lake, think about it is sections. For example, pick a point that is blocking the wind and just worry about that segment. Once you get in the wind shadow, take a breath and plan out your next segment.

If you do tip, know that you are in great company. It sucks but it happens. If you are prepared as Mike spelled out with all your gear strapped in while staying close to shore you will be fine. Yes you will be wet along with your gear, but countless people have done the same.

Early mornings are your friend. As well as being the calmest part of the day your chances of seeing wildlife are much higher at this time. You can always catch a hammock nap after you get to your campsite nice and early in the afternoon.
scotttimm
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09/02/2020 10:12PM  
Agree with all of the above - and I think the temps are supposed to drop this weekend - so I would make damn sure to have at least one warm change of clothes and your sleeping bag in either waterproof stuff sacks or air-tight in garbage bags in case you do tip.
09/02/2020 10:14PM  
Good responses here, wind, gusts and waves are one element of canoe tripping where experience matters. KNow your limits, if it looks scary it probably is. Often we have paddled within feet of shore, rocks are fairly obvious in wavy conditions, also we always kneel in bad conditions, balance is lower and you have much better control of your canoe. I’ll add that I have never swamped a canoe on a lake in fifty years of paddling, whitewater is another matter. I’ve done a lot of whitewater paddling, I believe the canoe handling skills used in whitewater benefit my lake paddling
straighthairedcurly
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09/02/2020 11:42PM  
Excellent advice from folks.

Canceling a trip based on a prediction means you might never fit in a trip. I find that wind speed and direction is very dependent on the specific lake. For example, what might be a south wind above the tree tops, could be a west wind on a long east-west lake. In other words, you can really only decide if a lake feels within your ability when you are actually there.

Staying close to the lee shore is the very best advice. That way you are as protected as possible and you have a quick exit if the wind suddenly picks up. Lakes in the area you are traveling tend to be easier for shoreline following.

Spend a lot of time watching the surface of the water. You can see gusts coming by watching for change in color or "shape" of the water ahead of you or to the side of you. Then you can prepare to adjust your direction slightly or be ready with a few stronger strokes until the gust passes.

The model of canoe makes a big difference. A lot of the newer canoes are designed to cut through the water for speed. But this means that if waves get bigger, they cut through the wave and it can wash over the gunwales instead of bobbing up and over like an Old Town Tripper or Grumman.

As jwartman mentioned, you learn A LOT about paddling in wind by learning about whitewater. Watch videos about how to ferry a canoe in a current and you can apply those same techniques to crossing a lake with a strong wind that is not a direct headwind or tailwind. Whitewater also teaches you about how much more stable the boat is if you kneel down. On Brule Lake this summer, I was traveling east to west with a strong south wind. I kept the string of islands close to my port side, and then wind ferried between the gaps of the islands with my bow at just a slight angle to the wind so it pushed me toward the lee of the next island (i.e. I let the wind do the work).

The size of the waves is very important. If you cannot control the angle of the boat to stay positioned correctly in the waves, do not go on the water. This gets back to my first point...wind speed alone does not tell you whether the waves will be too big or not. You need to see them for yourself.

For me personally, I am extremely comfortable in some very high winds when tandem. I have paddled 30-40mph winds often. But if the waves start coming over the top of a gunwale, I am immediately off the water. In my solo, which was new to me this summer, I built up my wind handling ability by going out on a local lake at higher and higher wind speeds. For that lake, I still felt very comfortable on a day with steady 25 mph winds and gusts to 40 mph. Can you get out and practice locally?

Lastly, always listen to your little voice of caution. Sounds like you are someone who does. If it feels beyond your ability, pull off.




09/03/2020 08:47AM  
I think some people on this thread are over estimating the wind speed they can paddle in.

I carried a (Anemomenter/wind speed instrument) in my line gear as a wildland firefighter for 30 years. I've probabaly taken a thousand weather readings in my career. It is suprising how strong a 15 mph "eye level" wind is.
The wind speed estimates from the National Weather Service are at 10 meters, roughly 33 feet, not eye level. We use a 60% reduction factor for wind speeds at eye level. In laymans terms a 25 mph wind from the NWS is around a 10 to 15 mph eye level wind depending on frictional drad with surface elements, on flat open terrain, even water. But not so, much over water. This is science based, not my opinion. I'll try to dig up the science on "wind reduction factor" and paste it here.

Quote
"The drag caused by friction slows down winds as they approach Earth’s surface. This frictional drag affects all types of winds.

Varying surface roughness causes varying amounts of frictional drag. For instance, the height, density, and type of surface vegetation can all affect the magnitude of the drag at the surface. Variations in terrain features and the presence and size of human-made structures can also change the frictional drag experienced by surface winds. "
09/03/2020 10:03AM  
LindenTree: "I think some people on this thread are over estimating the wind speed they can paddle in.


I carried a (Anemomenter/wind speed instrument) in my line gear as a wildland firefighter for 30 years. I've probabaly taken a thousand weather readings in my career. It is suprising how strong a 15 mph "eye level" wind is.
The wind speed estimates from the National Weather Service are at 10 meters, roughly 33 feet, not eye level. We use a 60% reduction factor for wind speeds at eye level. In laymans terms a 25 mph wind from the NWS is around a 10 to 15 mph eye level wind depending on frictional drad with surface elements, on flat open terrain, even water. But not so, much over water. This is science based, not my opinion. I'll try to dig up the science on "wind reduction factor" and paste it here.

Quote
"The drag caused by friction slows down winds as they approach Earth’s surface. This frictional drag affects all types of winds.

Varying surface roughness causes varying amounts of frictional drag. For instance, the height, density, and type of surface vegetation can all affect the magnitude of the drag at the surface. Variations in terrain features and the presence and size of human-made structures can also change the frictional drag experienced by surface winds. " "


I love learning about things like this on this board. Thanks LindenTree. As for the OP, I'd encourage you to go. Sounds like you have a good awareness of your abilities and what that might mean for staying put. I'd add, make sure that the people waiting for you at home know that if the winds are against you, you may need to spend an extra day in the BWCA for safety reasons. If you can communicate the situation to them via a Spot or InReach even better.

paddlinjoe
09/03/2020 10:09AM  
LindenTree: "I think some people on this thread are over estimating the wind speed they can paddle in. ....."


Fascinating post! I was initially reluctant to respond to this post because while I am good at eyeballing wind speed/waves that are at my limits, I’ve never felt I was any good at estimating wind speed - I’ve really got nothing but wild guesses that may not be close. Lindentree’s post caused me to scoot over to Amazon to check out reasonably priced anemometers.

The idea of wind speed reduction due to ground friction is very interesting. It makes me wonder how much friction there is over an open lake? I’d assume there is some but relatively less than most flat ground?

There is lots of good advice above. MikeinMPLS’s post up top is excellent, but I will disagree with one point - I would not tie my gear into my canoe. My bags are going to float for many hours. The wind might blow them around a bit, but they are all going to end up in just about the same place. Having gear tied in will make the canoe more difficult to try to right, and next to impossible to right should another canoe come to assist using the perpendicular rescue technique (not to mention more risky for the rescuers).
09/03/2020 10:22AM  
I'd for sure go on the trip. You've already made the first and biggest step toward being safe while paddling in the wind and that is to recognize your own limitations. Most people don't do that and thats where the trouble starts. Knowing your limits and avoiding situations that make you uneasy will keep you safe.

If it does get windy and your feel uneasy you've got options. Nothing wrong with a lay up day, I've had a few of them where paddling made no logical sense due to the conditions so it gave us permission to have a lazy camp day. Just make sure you have a buffer day built in to accommodate. You can also make a plan for how to attack a lake that seems a bite rougher than your abilities are suited for. Shoreline features often can be used to give you good relief from the wind, you may have to paddle a longer distance to stay in protected waters but a longer safer paddle is the better option in some cases.

I'm sure you'll be just fine given you're aware of your limitations and seem willing to make the tough call and admit when conditions are beyond your ability.
tomo
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09/03/2020 11:14AM  
All good points above. This summer my brother and I were camped on a bay on Brule Lake and in the morning the wind was raging--in the distance on the full reach of Brule we could see row upon row of big whitecaps. Instead of doing our planned loop onto Brule and back toward Winchell, we retraced our previous route back to Winchell.

On one of the smaller lakes just past Brule we met a family heading to Brule. They said they needed to get to the landing and asked about the wind. I opined that it wasn't the day to paddle Brule and wondered about what they ended up doing. I was thinking it was a perfect storm for a bad decision--sunny day, so close to the take-out, big wind and waves, but again, tantalizing close. It's hard to be patient under those circumstances.

My brother and I (in a borrowed MN II) ended up paddling the length of Winchell in a wicked tail wind. I was on my knees and on guard the entire time. At one stretch we surfed a wave for several paddle strokes and I don't think I've ever gone faster in a canoe. The trip down the lake was invigorating and, at a few junctures, nerve wracking. I wouldn't have done it solo, and I wouldn't have done it on a cold day or in a season with cold water temp (it was mid-July). But on that day, under those circumstances, I felt as though the likelihood and consequences of a dump were minimal.

Over the years I've seen so many people who shouldn't be on the water given the conditions and their paddling ability. But I tend toward being risk averse and cautious, more so as the years pile up behind me. And that's the beauty of wilderness travel: we all need to make our own choices.

Agree that whitewater paddling helps immensely, as does practice under the right conditions. But overall, I think patience and deference to the power of wind and waves are key. Know and respect your limits, and push them only under the right circumstances.
09/03/2020 12:20PM  
Jaywalker: "
LindenTree: "I think some people on this thread are over estimating the wind speed they can paddle in. ....."



Fascinating post! I was initially reluctant to respond to this post because while I am good at eyeballing wind speed/waves that are at my limits, I’ve never felt I was any good at estimating wind speed - I’ve really got nothing but wild guesses that may not be close. Lindentree’s post caused me to scoot over to Amazon to check out reasonably priced anomometers. "


Follow the link, it is for the sea. I am not aware of anything for lakes, guessing there are too many variables, size, topography of the shoreline, depth and many other factors.
Use this scale and try to picture yourself in the middle of a big lake like Sag or others.
I am also unsure if these are 33 feet winds or eye level in this chart.

Beauforts wind speed in relation to wave height.
09/03/2020 01:15PM  
Too much wind is different for each individual. If you ever feel wary or uncomfortable, or you're unsure if you should attempt paddling somewhere, DON'T EVEN ATTEMPT IT!
09/03/2020 01:49PM  
tomo: "All good points above. This summer my brother and I were camped on a bay on Brule Lake and in the morning the wind was raging--in the distance on the full reach of Brule we could see row upon row of big whitecaps. Instead of doing our planned loop onto Brule and back toward Winchell, we retraced our previous route back to Winchell.


On one of the smaller lakes just past Brule we met a family heading to Brule. They said they needed to get to the landing and asked about the wind. I opined that it wasn't the day to paddle Brule and wondered about what they ended up doing. I was thinking it was a perfect storm for a bad decision--sunny day, so close to the take-out, big wind and waves, but again, tantalizing close. It's hard to be patient under those circumstances.


My brother and I (in a borrowed MN II) ended up paddling the length of Winchell in a wicked tail wind. I was on my knees and on guard the entire time. At one stretch we surfed a wave for several paddle strokes and I don't think I've ever gone faster in a canoe. The trip down the lake was invigorating and, at a few junctures, nerve wracking. I wouldn't have done it solo, and I wouldn't have done it on a cold day or in a season with cold water temp (it was mid-July). But on that day, under those circumstances, I felt as though the likelihood and consequences of a dump were minimal.


Over the years I've seen so many people who shouldn't be on the water given the conditions and their paddling ability. But I tend toward being risk averse and cautious, more so as the years pile up behind me. And that's the beauty of wilderness travel: we all need to make our own choices.


Agree that whitewater paddling helps immensely, as does practice under the right conditions. But overall, I think patience and deference to the power of wind and waves are key. Know and respect your limits, and push them only under the right circumstances."


My last lay up day due to wind was on winchell. We had planned a day trip but seeing winchell whipped up like that had us thinking again pretty quick. No amount of sight seeing was worth the beating we'd have taken. Late in the day the 2 USFS guys that pulled up to camp made us feel kinda silly seeing how they attacked the wind and waves like it was a no big deal. They did comment though that everyone is pretty much hunkered down that day due to the wind.

I later found out that a friend and his family put in on Brule that same day. They dumped the canoe twice that afternoon and had to come back the next day to retrieve their packs that they weren't able to retrieve. They found them still floating along the shore the next morning.
straighthairedcurly
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09/03/2020 05:30PM  
Super cool info LindenTree. I love learning things like this.
09/03/2020 08:45PM  
Some awesome posts on technique...can’t add to that.

MikeinMpls: I wish you wouldn’t be so brief...LOL EPIC informative post

I think the most important thing I’d say is DO NOT cancel the trip based off a weather report from today. For up North I always say if you don’t like the weather report wait for tomorrow it will change. My experience is the likely hood that report stands the test of time is very small.

In fact I just checked Wunderground for East Bearskin and it shows max wind speeds for Sat./Sun to be 8mph now—-so it appears the weather has already changed for the better :)
09/04/2020 07:42AM  
LindenTree: "I think some people on this thread are over estimating the wind speed they can paddle in.


I carried a (Anemomenter/wind speed instrument) in my line gear as a wildland firefighter for 30 years. I've probabaly taken a thousand weather readings in my career. It is suprising how strong a 15 mph "eye level" wind is.
The wind speed estimates from the National Weather Service are at 10 meters, roughly 33 feet, not eye level. We use a 60% reduction factor for wind speeds at eye level. In laymans terms a 25 mph wind from the NWS is around a 10 to 15 mph eye level wind depending on frictional drad with surface elements, on flat open terrain, even water. But not so, much over water. This is science based, not my opinion. I'll try to dig up the science on "wind reduction factor" and paste it here.

Quote
"The drag caused by friction slows down winds as they approach Earth’s surface. This frictional drag affects all types of winds.

Varying surface roughness causes varying amounts of frictional drag. For instance, the height, density, and type of surface vegetation can all affect the magnitude of the drag at the surface. Variations in terrain features and the presence and size of human-made structures can also change the frictional drag experienced by surface winds. " "


+1. I also carry a handheld anemometer with me on most of my trips. Wind speed forecasted by the NWS (even with friction effects mentioned above- and by the way spot on the 10 meter height*) I've never witnessed a forecast over do the winds. They are almost always underdone.
The speed is officially measured at 10 meters (mainly at airports) because that is the crucial level for planes landing and taking off.
The frictional effect of the difference between 10meters and surface wind (2M) is also why the NWS changed wind chill calculations in 2001 too better represent a human being. Instead of the wind chill being calculated at 10 meters (from resulting 10 meter wind speed) it was calculated at 2 meters with a formula calculating the wind speed at 2M . And resulting wind chills went up around 10-15F across a broad spectrum of the wind chill chart.
09/04/2020 08:45AM  
^^^ the stuff you can learn here!! Thanks Whitewolf and Lindentree. I remember wondering why the windchill charts changed a while back. I was also thrilled to see that my new anemometer (arriving tomorrow) calculates windchill too. It won’t compare to the anemometers professional fire fighters and meteorologist carry, but no doubt will be better than sucking my finger and sticking it in the air. Very handy given how much time I’m out winter camping or working at dog sled races.
arm2008
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09/04/2020 10:00AM  
Great discussion. I will add be prepared to be wind bound so that you won't be pressured to go out when you shouldn't.
- extra food and fuel
- something to do if stuck in camp
- ability to communicate with loved ones expecting you to return on a certain day, or an understanding that you may be late and only call in the search parties after appropriate wait period
09/04/2020 01:19PM  
Jaywalker: "^^^ the stuff you can learn here!! Thanks Whitewolf and Lindentree. I remember wondering why the windchill charts changed a while back. I was also thrilled to see that my new anemometer (arriving tomorrow) calculates windchill too. It won’t compare to the anemometers professional fire fighters and meteorologist carry, but no doubt will be better than sucking my finger and sticking it in the air. Very handy given how much time I’m out winter camping or working at dog sled races. "


They can be fun, I've used the Kestrel 3000 the last 15 years. Before that we used to have to take temp and Humidity with a Belt Weather Kit with Sling Psychrometer using wet and dry bulp temps and an old plactic wind guage with a plastic ball inside that gave you wind speeds.
Read about "Adiabatic Lapse Rate" if you are not familiar with it, you would have experienced it in your Yellowstone travels.

I still have my Kestrel 3000
09/05/2020 06:17PM  
Some of my most memorable trips were ones battling wind and often rain... driving rain! Sometimes conquering a lake like Brule or Snowbank can be gratifying. But you should not only feel good about your abilities, but practice awareness such as constantly creating a plan should you dump. And don’t be afraid to give it up if you don’t feel comfortable with what you see. The best way to ensure your good to go is like said, get on the water early. Showing up at Brule at noon is not recommended. Haha!
09/05/2020 06:31PM  
oravavaara: "My friend and I have both been to the BWCA a number of times before, but neither one of us have a lot of experience battling high winds. We are going on a trip with moderately sized lakes (East Bearskin- not big but long, so the wind could get going if it's coming from the right direction) this weekend and the forecast calls for gusts up to 25 mph, but the wind speed is only supposed to be 5 mph. I have read on another forum that other folks feel 25 mph winds can be dangerous, but I am assuming they were talking about sustained wind speeds. Are 25 mph gusts dangerous? Would you consider yourself "wind bound" if there were 25 mph gusts?

Neither my friend nor I consider ourselves to be very strong paddlers- we're capable, but we're mostly accustomed to good conditions. I went on a trip last fall when it was windy and crossing Lake One made me very nervous. I felt that there was a non-negligible chance that we could tip given how hard it was to control the boat (we were getting blown sideways at some points), and given the waves, it would have been very difficult to maneuver the boat (not to mention the gear) to shore safely if we did tip. On that day, weather underground says the max wind speed was 18 mph and the gusts were up to 31 mph. What do you think- would you ever call a trip off due to wind? Do you think this trip would be a good opportunity for my friend and I to gain more experience battling wind, or do you think if the forecast holds we would be better sitting it out? "



With a screen name like that you need to join!
09/06/2020 08:32AM  

Just be flexible on your itinerary. I’ve had a couple of wind-bound days in camp due to traveling with younger kids, and we always had a blast on those days. Plus nothing like a nice book and nap on a hammock on a windy day.
Savage Voyageur
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09/06/2020 09:36AM  
So many variables to answer this question. Canoe type, your paddling ability, how much freeboard, wind direction.

One trip in particular we had a strong tail wind that was about 30 mph, with big waves. If the winds were in any other direction, we would not have left then. If there are whitecaps and waves, we stay in camp. Get up at the crack of dawn and break camp if it’s a travel day. This way you will beat the thermo winds that form from 11:00Am until 4:00pm.

The shape of a lake is also important. Example of a East to west long lake with a high shoreline like Pine. That lake is a wind tunnel. But the same wind, same day on round or bigger Water, that lake might be okay to travel.
09/06/2020 09:55PM  
Interesting stuff, interesting replies.

Tying into current times, I can tell you that the first two-thirds of the day on Thursday 9/3 were beyond what I would consider safe in the BWCA and thus it was hammock time. At a guess I'd say it was blowing 15-20 with gusts to 30 or even more.
Today, 9/6, I paddled 8.5 miles (+ 4.5 miles of poratging) into the teeth of a 15mph-ish wind - no whitecaps, but I did delay one launch for 15 minutes to let the worst pass...was doable in a solo but it was real work.
09/08/2020 12:45AM  
My son from Duluth did a family trip this weekend. Brule lake with gusting winds and high waves. They had a five year old and a three year old barking commands. Big waves and winds forced them to line the canoe up the lake. They weren’t windbound, they did the Yukon thing. My daughter in law has the Yukon/NWT experience, my son whatever he learned from me in a lifetime of paddling. I have to admit that knowing brule lake in high winds, it can be dangerous. Fortunately I just gave my son my stupidly heavy old town canadienne, it’s not the fastest boat, but if you want a safe boat incrap conditions, this is or was the go to canoe.
bretthexum
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09/08/2020 12:02PM  
Pipestone Bay was pretty scary this weekend with the wind. We saw many groups turn around as they came south of the narrows. I don't think I've ever seen waves that big. Talked to a guy who was windbound for 3 extra days and finally made it out yesterday. Scary stuff...
analyzer
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09/09/2020 04:33PM  
If you do capsize, most canoes will float. I hesitate to bring it up, but the young man who perished this spring, may not have, if they had focused on getting to shore, rather than trying to save their canoe. I apologize if any of their friends or relatives are reading, but I think it's a good lesson. From what I've read, and heard in an interview, they spent quite a bit of time, trying to unswamp the canoe. The water was very cold, and it sounds like hypothermia took it's toll.

Think about how cold the water is ahead of time. In the summer months, capsizing, while inconvenient, probably isn't deadly. That story changes in the shoulder seasons, and your primary focus should be getting out of the water, and getting dry/warm. In the summer, it's not as crucial. You can just float it out, and let the wind take you to shore.

@LIndentree, I'm glad you made that distinction. I was reading people's stories about tackling 20-25 mph winds, and thinking to myself, I wouldn't want to be on Sag in those wind speeds. Seems like anything in the high teens starts to get very nasty on Sag. The size of the water makes a big difference.

Most of the time we error on the side of caution. If you don't have to be out in nasty wind. Don't.

09/10/2020 12:29AM  
Your number one job on a typical canoe trip is not sinking the canoe. If it looks like you may have a chance of sinking your canoe you should be aware of that and if you continue to paddle make plans for that. Outside of Boy Scout camp no one has ever rescued a swamped canoe in rough conditions. Try it, it’s not going to work.

If it looks like you may swamp and yet you are going for it a few ideas;
Stay close to shore. An upset won’t be such a big deal.
Kneel... you won’t believe how much better control you have over your canoe. Knowing when to lean into large waves, and which direction to lean are minimal skills a canoeist should have.

If it looks scary wear your pfd. And kneel. If you can’t kneel in your canoe find a better canoe. If your canoe is based on a race hull, unless you are an expert, maybe look around at other canoes.

My last trip in the quetico we were paddling large swells and heavy winds. Keeping my brothers mn2 afloat was a class 4 challenge. God I hate that canoe. We noticed another canoe coming from thirty degrees astern. We met at the portage at pretty much the same time. I mentioned the scary crossing, he laughed, he and his twelves year old boy had a great time, fun actually. They were in a souris canoe.
09/12/2020 08:01AM  
Depends. If you get out on the water and you think, I wish I wearing Depends, then it's too windy to be on the water!

Same goes for rapids!
ppine
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09/18/2020 03:12PM  
I agree that most people over estimate wind by a lot. Being a sailor helps to get calibrated. Then you can see the wind coming.

Fetch and the size of the water body you are on determines the size of the waves. On a small protected lake you might be able to paddle in 30 mph. On big lakes a steady 20 mph might be too much with gusts.

Our first day out of Moose L we paddled the length of Basswood L when it was really blowing. In the old rental 17 foot Grummans it was all my crew could do to make any headway at all against the wind. We were all young and athletic.

Since a permit is hard to get, I would go but shorten the trip. Allow for lay over days, and short periods of paddling only in the morning. You might have to get up really early a couple of days.
 
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