BWCA Canada/US border Boundary Waters COVID-19 Information and Discussion
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LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
10/15/2020 11:49PM  
On October 15th Justin Trudeau, Prime Minister of Canada, said in a TV interview:
“The U.S. is not in a place where we would feel comfortable reopening those borders. We will continue to make sure that Canadian safety is top of mind when we move forward. We see the cases in the United States and elsewhere around the world, and we need to continue to keep these border controls in place.”

 
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yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
10/16/2020 08:02AM  
Unfortunately it is the other way around too. Our closest cities to us are in Canada and Montreal and Quebec City have rates way above ours.

They are also far more into lockdown ( again) than we are.
 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
10/16/2020 08:23AM  
Yes, cases are on the rise in Canada and the second wave is largely in the cities in Quebec and Ontario. As you noted Canada is fighting back with renewed restrictions. Cases are also rising in the US. Unfortunately, the US is not fighting back at this time. Although the absolute numbers are larger in the US, cases are rising faster in Canada on a per capita basis. Over the last week an American was about twice as likely to get COVID than a Canadian. Twice is much, much lower than it had been. However, I think the statement by Trudeau indicates that the border will not open until the case load is much lower in the US overall than it is now. As you point out, there are certainly places where you would increase your risk by going to Canada. For example, going from Vermont to Montreal. However for the border to open, I think you’ll have to look at national averages. I expect an official statement extending the closure for another month soon.

Unfortunately, I don’t see the US getting down to the numbers of new cases necessary without a safe and effective vaccine. I think the best case scenario for getting the vaccine, getting people vaccinated and having new cases go down to the desired levels is the end of next summer or the fall. If we put our hopes on herd immunity being developed without a vaccine, I think it will take years and years and many more hundreds of thousands dead.

Fortunately deaths have not been increasing at as fast a rate as infections. The cause for this is unclear to me. Perhaps better treatment, the virus having already killed the most vulnerable or the virus is mutating to a less lethal form. What implications this will have for opening the border is unclear at least in the short term.
 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
10/19/2020 05:00PM  
As expected Canada has extended the ban on nonessential travel for another month until Nov. 21.

 
mutz
distinguished member(1289)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
10/21/2020 09:19PM  
LarryS48: "As expected Canada has extended the ban on nonessential travel for another month until Nov. 21. "
This is kind of mutual, we are not allowing Canadians into the US for the same reason.
 
outsidethebox
distinguished member (139)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
11/01/2020 12:00PM  
While protective compliance (masks and social distancing) remains problematic it is likely that enough is being done to reduce the viral load that is being transmitted-which is believed to be a significant factor relative to the severity of ones infection. Also, more younger, healthier segments of the population are becoming infected and so the death rate is decreasing. Many of these are "school infections"-again where measures are in place that reduce the viral load and afford a measure of protection.

Unfortunately there remains a significant segment of noncompliance that is keeping this virus very much alive and well...and the virus is taking full advantage of the situation. My wife is a primary care pediatric health provider and they are now up to 5 infections within their office staff of 25-even given all the measures they have in place. And let's be honest, the actual compliance relative to the reported compliance is much worse. Additionally, the reported cases relative to the actual cases, contrary to many conspiracy theorists is much lower-and is going to continue to worsen as the general population's weariness grows and compliance further deteriorates. My guess is that we are going to have half a millions deaths before a viable vaccine becomes available.

Here, please wear a mask because all indications are that it affords a level of protection that reduces the virus' virulence which can keep hospitals from being further overrun. Regardless, from the medical side, the end is not yet in sight.
 
Grandma L
distinguished member(5539)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/05/2021 02:02PM  
Now the border closure is extended until January 21, 2021. I just want to go cross the Dawson Portage -this coming summer - not move in or stay.
 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
06/18/2021 10:28AM  
The border has been closed to nonessential travel for another month until July 21. There will be an announcement on new rules for Canadians and permanent residents of Canada returning to Canada on Monday. It looks like Americans will still not be able to enter, but fully vaccinated Canadians will have less restrictions.
 
homers
member (43)member
 
06/22/2021 02:32PM  
Pressure needs to come from the people. The "leaders" are not following the science anymore. The number of vaccinated, those with antibodies, and those naturally immune have reached herd immunity. The number of cases, hospitalizations and deaths prove this. People need to stop putting up with these orders and put pressure to follow the science and get freedoms back from the power hungry politicians.
 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
06/22/2021 03:33PM  
I actually think the Canadian government is taking a responsible course in keeping the border closed. The Delta variant (B1.617.2 first discovered in India) is on the rise in North America. In the UK which had things pretty well under control, it is causing a new surge. Two doses of the vaccines still control Delta reasonably well, but one dose is not very effective.

Canada has 75% of eligible people with one dose but only 20% with two. I think they will and should wait until more people are fully vaccinated. The delivery schedules of vaccines to Canada suggests they will have enough vaccines delivered by the end of July to give everyone two doses shortly there after.

The US currently has a lower percentage of people with one dose but a higher percentage with two doses. By sometime in July, I expect Canada to pass the US in second doses as well.

By the July or August renewals of the border closings, I think the time might be ripe for a safe and responsible opening of the border assuming Delta or some new variant didn’t cause new problems. The most likely way I see Canada opening the border is to fully vaccinated travelers. That might be a problem for people from the US. Canada is working on ways for Canadians to prove they are vaccinated. Many in the US are working on ways that will prevent people from showing they have been vaccinated. So, I think the onus is on the US to get more people vaccinated and to provide a way for its people to prove they have been vaccinated.
 
yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
06/22/2021 03:57PM  
homers: "Pressure needs to come from the people. The "leaders" are not following the science anymore. The number of vaccinated, those with antibodies, and those naturally immune have reached herd immunity. The number of cases, hospitalizations and deaths prove this. People need to stop putting up with these orders and put pressure to follow the science and get freedoms back from the power hungry politicians."

Unfortunately herd immunity has NOT been reached as hospitalizations are growing in a number of states.

Nations have a right to protect their citizens.

 
homers
member (43)member
 
06/22/2021 05:37PM  
yellowcanoe: "homers: "Pressure needs to come from the people. The "leaders" are not following the science anymore. The number of vaccinated, those with antibodies, and those naturally immune have reached herd immunity. The number of cases, hospitalizations and deaths prove this. People need to stop putting up with these orders and put pressure to follow the science and get freedoms back from the power hungry politicians."
Unfortunately herd immunity has NOT been reached as hospitalizations are growing in a number of states.

Nations have a right to protect their citizens. "

And people in democracies can vote as they please. The CDC has their guidance, supposed to be the experts in the US, and others in the states should follow. California is more conservative, waiting about 1 month past the recent CDC guidelines, but even California has opened up.
 
yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
06/22/2021 07:01PM  
You seem to forget there are other countries involved. We have no vote in Canada unless we have dual citizenship. Your "freedoms" matter not in Italy or Singapore.. It's not about ME ME ME.. ( ME being the USA)
 
billconner
distinguished member(8077)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
06/23/2021 06:55AM  
Interesting that European countries are opening to US non-essentials.
 
PaddleAway
distinguished member(979)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
06/23/2021 09:57PM  
LarryS48: "I actually think the Canadian government is taking a responsible course in keeping the border closed. The Delta variant (B1.617.2 first discovered in India) is on the rise in North America. In the UK which had things pretty well under control, it is causing a new surge. Two doses of the vaccines still control Delta reasonably well, but one dose is not very effective.

Canada has 75% of eligible people with one dose but only 20% with two. I think they will and should wait until more people are fully vaccinated. The delivery schedules of vaccines to Canada suggests they will have enough vaccines delivered by the end of July to give everyone two doses shortly there after.

The US currently has a lower percentage of people with one dose but a higher percentage with two doses. By sometime in July, I expect Canada to pass the US in second doses as well.

By the July or August renewals of the border closings, I think the time might be ripe for a safe and responsible opening of the border assuming Delta or some new variant didn’t cause new problems. The most likely way I see Canada opening the border is to fully vaccinated travelers. That might be a problem for people from the US. Canada is working on ways for Canadians to prove they are vaccinated. Many in the US are working on ways that will prevent people from showing they have been vaccinated. So, I think the onus is on the US to get more people vaccinated and to provide a way for its people to prove they have been vaccinated."

Great & thoughtful answer, thanks.
 
07/16/2021 01:55PM  
 
07/18/2021 01:28PM  
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/herd-immunity-and-coronavirus/art-20486808

 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 01:04PM  
It looks like the US Canada border will open to the fully vaccinated on Aug. 9.
 
yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/19/2021 03:27PM  
LarryS48: "It looks like the US Canada border will open to the fully vaccinated on Aug. 9. "

Its not that simple. You not only have to be vaccinated but you have to fill out Canada Federal paperwork ahead of time, take Covid test ( PCR) and test negative within 72 hours, have a quarantine plan if you are denied exemption from quarantine and also fill out Provincial Health forms.
 
billconner
distinguished member(8077)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/19/2021 06:06PM  
Doesn't look like RABCs fit in this.
 
yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/20/2021 09:53AM  
billconner: "Doesn't look like RABCs fit in this."

nope must show at the border proof of a PCR or equivalent test taken within 72 hours. Whether vaccinated or not.

and the PCR for travel does not seem to be covered by insurance and can cost 200 bucks a person
 
joewildlife
distinguished member(582)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 04:26PM  
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ottawa-border-measures-reopening-1.6107988
 
billconner
distinguished member(8077)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/20/2021 06:34PM  
I'm struggling to find a test near me that us relatively assured of results in three days. Most say 2-4 days.
 
andym
distinguished member(5166)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/20/2021 07:36PM  
My sister had that problem when returning to Israel after visiting our Mom. Plus, Israel required 72 hours and the U.S. was using a 3 day standard with some slop. The issue is if you get tested on Monday morning, is the test still valid Thursday afternoon? In the end, the test showed up on time. Her fallback was being tested at the airport. International airports may well have rapid, on-site testing.

Will Canada accept a Lucira home test? They cost $50 and have an accuracy that approaches PCR.
 
billconner
distinguished member(8077)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 06:14AM  
"PCR - Polymerase chain reaction. RT-PCR – reverse transcription real time PCR"

I think maybe based on Lucira:
'Fast and convenient home collection test for SARS-CoV-2.

A lower nasal swab
RT-PCR/TMA lab analysis
Online results, typically within 24-72 hours Learn more
Official lab report provided"

 
Mocha
distinguished member(7575)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 07:02AM  
So. It sounds like it's not really opening, sort of. If you can jump thru all these hoops then you can come.

 
yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 07:37AM  
billconner: "I'm struggling to find a test near me that us relatively assured of results in three days. Most say 2-4 days."

Same here. the nearest testing faciility that has a less than two day result is 3 hours away.. 150 miles. One way
 
andym
distinguished member(5166)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 12:23PM  
I just got an email from Amazon about a rapid home collection test. Maybe look there too.

The Lucira test I was thinking of is processed at home. I’ll look for the link.
 
07/21/2021 12:51PM  
andym: "I just got an email from Amazon about a rapid home collection test. Maybe look there too.


The Lucira test I was thinking of is processed at home. I’ll look for the link. "
.

I would think Canada would want a covid test from a hospital or similar institution. People could make it up easy otherwise?
 
yellowcanoe
distinguished member(4989)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 02:51PM  
Here is what Canada requires for proof of negative test. At home kits do not seem to be included.

proof?
 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/21/2021 03:34PM  
If a US citizen goes to Canada and then wants to return, will the US authorities be ready to readmit him/her at the land border crossings?
 
Porkeater
distinguished member (185)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/21/2021 04:31PM  
LarryS48: "If a US citizen goes to Canada and then wants to return, will the US authorities be ready to readmit him/her at the land border crossings?
"


Yes.

Last updated: July 21, 2021

COVID-19 Related Travel Restrictions across the U.S. Borders with Canada and Mexico

The United States will temporarily limit inbound land border crossings from Canada and Mexico to “essential travel”.
This action does not prevent U.S. citizens from returning home.
These restrictions are temporary and went into effect on March 21, 2020. They will remain in effect through 11:59 pm on August 21, 2021. This decision has been coordinated with the Governments of Mexico and Canada.

 
LarryS48
distinguished member (183)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/21/2021 04:37PM  
Porkeater: "LarryS48: "If a US citizen goes to Canada and then wants to return, will the US authorities be ready to readmit him/her at the land border crossings?
"



Yes.


Last updated: July 21, 2021


COVID-19 Related Travel Restrictions across the U.S. Borders with Canada and Mexico


The United States will temporarily limit inbound land border crossings from Canada and Mexico to “essential travel”.
This action does not prevent U.S. citizens from returning home.
These restrictions are temporary and went into effect on March 21, 2020. They will remain in effect through 11:59 pm on August 21, 2021. This decision has been coordinated with the Governments of Mexico and Canada.


"

I just called the border crossing at Grand Portage and they are aware of the information posted above. They seem on top of it.
 
billconner
distinguished member(8077)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 06:40PM  
yellowcanoe: "Here is what Canada requires for proof of negative test. At home kits do not seem to be included.


proof? "


The Lucira test is a RT-PCR, a type that's listed. It gets into parsing words and what is "administered by a reputable lab" mean.

(transitive verb. 1 : to manage or supervise the execution, use, or conduct of administer a trust fund. 2a : to provide or apply : dispense administer justice administer punishment. b : to give officially or as part of a ritual administer a test administer the last rites.).

Haven't we just been through a period where many things have been administered virtually?

I have no idea.
 
schweady
distinguished member(7489)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 08:27PM  
 
gymcoachdon
distinguished member(591)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/21/2021 09:24PM  
I just returned from a trip to the US Virgin Islands with very similar requirements. I had to get a negative test within 72 hours of my arrival date. (done at county health department, Indiana State Department of Health. No charge to me, even though I listed the reason for testing as "Travel") Once I got the results back, I went online and submitted a digital copy of the results to the USVI travel portal, and they sent me an email with a "green code" that I showed to health officials upon landing. The timing worried me, but everything went smoothly.
I, today, requested the last week of August off from work, and when approved, I plan to drive North to enter Pickerel Lake for a trip. I was so happy all evening!
 
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