I've convinced my better half that purchasing a pair of lightweight canoes is a reasonable financial decision for our family. We are currently looking at either Souris River Quetico 17 and 18.5 or Northstar Northwind 17 and 18. The larger of either will be outfitted with a 3rd seat for one of our younger kiddos.

Our primary use is flat water wilderness tripping for ~5-10 day trips with our kiddos (15,12,10). One boat will carry my wife and 15yo with me in a second boat carrying my two younger kiddos.

I'd like to paddle the smaller boat on solo wilderness trips (~5days) if I can find a suitable boat - as a kevlar 17' would still be lighter than anything in my royalex fleet (Solo Plus, Spirit 2 or Penobscot).

While I understand that paddling each would be the ideal scenario - it's a bit tough to find demos within a reasonable distance from our home.

I'm looking for pros/cons of each boat? Are the hulls significantly different? Is one faster? Does either exhibit oil canning? Is one reasonably more durable than the other?

Any other thoughts?

Thanks for reading!

Love them both and see them as almost interchangeable. The NW does have a larger degree of what they call "initial instability," which is the fancy way of saying "It might feel just a little tippier at first movement, and might tip slightly further to the side at times than the SRQ, but it stops well short of actually tipping any further after that initial twitch." ("secondary stability" kicking in) I've really only noticed this when unloaded... day trips, fishing, etc. Both feel the same when paddling fully loaded and both carry the same size load well.

The only time I notice a preference for the SRQ is when placing a fish locator transducer to shoot through the hull. In that one, anywhere between the ribs is okay. In the NW, there is a larger, diamond-shaped foam core that has to be avoided under the 'ducer.

I have no experience in the longer ones, but after paddling the Q17 and a NW17 I think the NW is a bit more efficient when loaded. Aka faster. Neither is a MNII of course but my seat of the pants feeling.

Have rented the SR Q17, and own a NS NW17. Both nice tripping boats, I think the NS is about 10% lighter. Think they perform quite similarly...the SR may be very slightly more stable an the NS slightly faster. But that may be splitting hairs.

One difference - I am pretty sure about this - is that the SR canoes are made with epoxy, and the NS canoes are made with vinylester.

sns:One difference - I am pretty sure about this - is that the SR canoes are made with epoxy, and the NS canoes are made with vinylester. "

I noticed that difference as well. My understanding is that the epoxy boats are a bit more resistant to damage? Is there any truth to that?

If we were to throw a minnesota II/III into the mix - are they noticeably faster (and less stable) boats?

I have both the SR 17 and 18.5. I also purchased these so all the family can trip in the BWCA together. Great canoes! Very stable and fast enough for my crew. I bought both of mine used from an outfitter. I don’t think there is anything wrong with the NS canoes. They build a good boat. Decision may come down to what is available. From what I hear the canoe market is tight. Good luck!

I find my Q17 can take a beating and be fine. I think it is more a factor of the rib versus full foam bottom construction than epoxy vs polyester. I do like being able to refinish with spar varnish, which I'm not sure is possible or recommended for polyester.

I'll bet you love whichever you end up with.

Oh, if you before you buy an SRQ, talk to outfitters about their experiences with its more easily broken ribs. I think this became a problem in those manufactured more recently... thinner design ?? It's why VNO is going to NW as they sell off their existing SRQ fleet. Of course, the stress put on a canoe to cause such is most evident in rentals.

Have you pals with SR Queticos noticed any oil canning?

OHPaddler: "Have you pals with Quetico's noticed any oil canning?"

I have a SRQ 16 and 17. No issues with that.

AmarilloJim: "

OHPaddler: "Have you pals with Quetico's noticed any oil canning?"

I have a SRQ 16 and 17. No issues with that."

+1 for the many years we've rented the 17 and 18.5

I too own both an SR17 and an SR18.5. I purchased the SR17 new in 2007 and the SR18.5 used from VNO in 2015. I've had no issues with either canoe and have been very pleased with both.

That being said, my brother and his kids have rented the Northwinds a could of times from VNO and these canoes are just as nice as the SR's in my opinion.

As mentioned above, a number of outfitters are moving away from the SR's as the ribs can crack when the canoes are abused. When I purchased my 18.5' canoe, it did have repairs made on a couple of cracked ribs. I can tell you that the repairs have held-up just fine and our group does not baby the canoes.... and we've always got kids and teenagers along that are not particular about how to approach a rocky shoreline in a kevlar canoe.

I would highly suggest looking for used kevlars from VNO or any of the Ely outfitters. You can pick up a nice used canoe for 1/2 price without too much effort.

OHPaddler: "

sns:One difference - I am pretty sure about this - is that the SR canoes are made with epoxy, and the NS canoes are made with vinylester. "

I noticed that difference as well. My understanding is that the epoxy boats are a bit more resistant to damage? Is there any truth to that?

If we were to throw a Minnesota II/III into the mix - are they noticeably faster (and less stable) boats?"

I thought I saw a graphic someone had of all the different hull designs here.....well I know I did. It's a pretty dramatic difference. You're also talking now a MNII is an 18.5' boat compared to a 17 tandem for tandem...right there you're gaining speed before you even look at shape at and all the rest. Some bow paddlers complain of lack of leg room in a MNII which is valid to a degree...some don't mind it at all.

But seat of the pants experience and paddling them side by side....if me and and another person paddled a MNII, NW17 and a Q17 across a large lake....we'd finish in that order hitting the far shore and it would be a fair bit of time/distance between each boat. MNII also does feel more "lively" in the water but never was concerned in wind or anything.

I think the NW18 is a more special boat than the 17...it's a fast boat that does everything the 17 will do and more. Maybe a NW16 and 18 would be better for you since the 16 would make a much better solo than the 17 (NW17 is actually a 17.5 and is a huge boat for a solo). One poster wanted fastest possible boat and leaned towards Minn II and ended up with NW18 and was impressed with the speed. The NW boats are exceptionally seaworthy...just what you want if the weather turns nasty. I'm not familiar with the SR tandems.

Northstar B16 and B19???

I’ve paddled both brands...really can’t go wrong.

As other have said the Q17/18.5 feel less tippy...the 18.5 never tipped in 18 years even with a GSP jumping in and put of it and kids leaning over the side. I am not sure you can tip it?

The NW seems to glide easier and is still stable.

T

You mention wanting to solo at times and that the 17 ft would be lighter. That may be so but keep in mind that a 17 ft boat can be a bit difficult to solo. It may be ok loaded, but will be a bear unloaded. That was what I found with my Bell Northwind. Any wind at all and it was real tough to paddle.

jhb8426: "You mention wanting to solo at times and that the 17 ft would be lighter. That may be so but keep in mind that a 17 ft boat can be a bit difficult to solo. It may be ok loaded, but will be a bear unloaded. That was what I found with my Bell Northwind. Nny wind at all and it was real tough to paddle."

A guy can dream, ya? The primary mission will be 8-10 day family wilderness trips, which will morph into husband/wife trips as the kiddos get older. It is probably unrealistic to solo a 17+' boat - however - I'm not sure that our people and gear will fit into a 18.5' and 16' boat.

Renting is easy. Good for needs that will change in 5 years as it seems yours will. Sounds like you might have long term need fir a tandem. I'm happy I bought used from outfitter. $1300 for a Q17 iirc. Still fine 10 years later but if/when not used at least every year, I could sell it for not much less than I paid - $1000 or so. Sons moved away and I bought a solo used here very cheap - $600 for a 1 year old Tranquility with a bent gunwale. I splurged on replacement - $200 for a pair from factory.

So rent this season, or buy if available, and make arrangements with an outfitter to buy at end of season.

This assumes your pockets are not infinitely deep. If you can drop $6000-7000 for two new canoes, go for it, and pay for the lightest weight laminate available.

I have a NW 17 and really like it. More bow space than most canoes. Plenty stable, and room for more than enough gear. I would jump on your decision soon if you want it for this summer. Last I herd Northstar is several months out on their orders. Not sure about SR

No issues with oil canning. Mine both seem plenty stiff. I will say that if you are a tall person the seats on the Souris River canoes sit a little high then the Wenonah or Northstar boats. For me (I’m 6’3”) it makes for a more comfortable boat.

OHPaddler: "

sns:One difference - I am pretty sure about this - is that the SR canoes are made with epoxy, and the NS canoes are made with vinylester. "

I noticed that difference as well. My understanding is that the epoxy boats are a bit more resistant to damage? Is there any truth to that?

If we were to throw a minnesota II/III into the mix - are they noticeably faster (and less stable) boats?"

Epoxy is "harder" than vinyl-ester. Largely meaningless as the difference in hardness is insignificant compared to the hardness of rocks. The lateral ribs of the SR allow more flex reducing the overall stiffness of the hull- especially from stem to stern. This will reduce padding efficiency. The overall shape of the Northwoods is also considerably more efficient. The SR layup is more prone to hull deformation, particularly oil-canning.

As someone that has performed a lot of repairs on canoes it seems to me that the SR resin seems to be more subject to solar degradation.

Blatz: "I have a NW 17 and really like it. More bow space than most canoes. Plenty stable, and room for more than enough gear. I would jump on your decision soon if you want it for this summer. Last I herd Northstar is several months out on their orders. Not sure about SR"

Wayne at SR said the entire years production is sold out. That doesn't mean a dealer doesn't have some in stock. I'm sure that is the case for all manufacturers. Call a few dealers if you have to have them by August. I'd start with Rutabaga and Piragis, but there are others. Not sure but Red Rock may be able to get you a Souris River.