I was born and raised about 1500 miles south of Ely. I learned of the existence of the BW pretty much by accident in 1979. I was intrigued by the concept, finally made a few trips many years later. My first inquiry netted me probably 30 brochures from outfitters, and every one of them stated that their food was packaged in burnable packaging. Does anyone remember that? Also, why did the industry sorta migrate away from that? This is just curiosity.

Burning stuff as a way of disposal has become verboten, even evil. By burning paper packaging you release all sorts of nasties. Whatever chemicals or additives or inks or glue that are used in the manufacturing of "burnable" packaging are toxic in some way when released into the atmosphere.

Yes, I remember that.

When we first started canoe-tripping in '71, the "rule" was that all containers had to be reusable or burnable. We burned all food packaging. It was what you were supposed to do. We never used an outfitter, but we certainly did pack our food in burnable containers, and after use they were burned.

As with most things ecological, ideas and good practices evolved. For years we still burned everything, even plastics. And as we learned more, watched the LNT videos, packed differently, the burning of trash was cut down. After they made the rule of "no burning of trash", our ways changed. And our pack then included a trash bag to pack out all of that stuff.

If you go back to the "really olden days", long before WE ever heard of the canoe country, campers used to take food in cans and sink the cans in the lake. It was accepted practice.

Times have changed. We know more. Some of us care more.

This sort of thing really needs to be driven home to anyone who enters the BW. It's simple in my mind but unfortunately not in others. I made my first trip when I was 14 and the ideals I was taught back then has resonated ever since. Whatever you pack in, you pack out. Period. No questions. We even challenged each other to see how many twist ties we could pick up at a camp site or on a portage that others left behind.

Back in the mid 1980’s it became illegal to burn trash in Minnesota.

88.171 OPEN BURNING PROHIBITIONS.
Subd. 8.Garbage. (a) No person shall conduct, cause, or permit open burning of discarded material resulting from the handling, processing, storage, preparation, serving, or consumption of food, unless specifically allowed under section 17.135. (Farmer’s exemption)
(b) A county may allow a resident to conduct open burning of material described in paragraph (a) that is generated from the resident's household if the county board by resolution determines that regularly scheduled pickup of the material is not reasonably available to the resident.

I think cities started prohibiting it first, but I remember everyone having their own burn barrel in the city in the 1960’s.

And then there is the fire safety issue. Embers of burnt paper are very light and are carried into the nearby grass and forest very easily creating fires. I'm referring specifically to the Ham Lake fire but I'm sure there have been hundreds, if not thousands, of others on a smaller scale.

Right with ya there Bill. Early trips in Quetico, containers re-usable or burnable. Fishing remnants left on rocks for gulls. Live baits allowed. I do not think bear-canisters were even available. Float cushions sufficed for PFD's. Things change!

butthead

Last year me and my trip partner had the FS come into camp and re-dig the latrine and while talking to them they said they were doing campsite maintenance checking latrines and fire grates.
My buddy asked what they do with the fire grates when they replace them. We were told that they try and carry them out or stash if they know if they are coming back in the winter. Or if on bigger water there flat out said they deep 6 them right into the lake

This is always an interesting and frustrating topic for me. Regardless of what we do, there is waste. Is it better to put it in a landfill (which is becoming a constant problem for municipalities large and small) or is it better to burn, not only putting more CO2 and toxins in the atmosphere but also crap in the fire grate which will seep into the surrounding ground and water?

I don't have an answer but we may be leaving no trace by packing it out, but we aren't really leaving no trace when it goes into a landfill. I once heard a good quote about throwing things away. "There is no such place as 'away' "

inspector13: "

....I think cities started prohibiting it first, but I remember everyone having their own burn barrel in the city in the 1960’s.

"

Oh, man. That brings back vivid memories of me as a kid in the early 1970's....we had a rusted old burn barrel in our backyard in Marshall, MN. Dad made me and my brother grab any burnable garbage, and with boots on trudge out to the barrel to burn the stuff....sucked when windy as it was hard to get stuff started with regular matches....I don't recall ever using a lighter as nobody smoked in our house....

OneMatch: "This is always an interesting and frustrating topic for me. Regardless of what we do, there is waste. Is it better to put it in a landfill (which is becoming a constant problem for municipalities large and small) or is it better to burn, not only putting more CO2 and toxins in the atmosphere but also crap in the fire grate which will seep into the surrounding ground and water?


I don't have an answer but we may be leaving no trace by packing it out, but we aren't really leaving no trace when it goes into a landfill. I once heard a good quote about throwing things away. "There is no such place as 'away' ""

I hear your frustration OneMatch. My brain took an odd turn to Science Fiction when thinking about your comments. SciFi movies often predict or project future technologies and possibilities. But I'm not aware of many SciFi movies that don't include the "old scrap yard" with piles of junk. It's like dealing with junk/trash usefully is a box we can't even project ourselves out of in the future.

That said I think(hope?) mining old and current landfills (for metals, fertilizers, chemicals, soil, etc) will become a useful enough industry in the future to be restorative.

OneMatch: "This is always an interesting and frustrating topic for me. Regardless of what we do, there is waste. Is it better to put it in a landfill (which is becoming a constant problem for municipalities large and small) or is it better to burn, not only putting more CO2 and toxins in the atmosphere but also crap in the fire grate which will seep into the surrounding ground and water?


I don't have an answer but we may be leaving no trace by packing it out, but we aren't really leaving no trace when it goes into a landfill. I once heard a good quote about throwing things away. "There is no such place as 'away' ""

This is exactly what I have been thinking about!

In either case, it still EXISTS. Whether here, there or wherever. It is still on our planet. Just in various forms...

JW

My early trips pretty much all our food was purchased at the coop on Selby ave. This was an old timer hippy coop, it stunk like yeast. We’d buy stuff in bulk, mostly paper bags. Some not so good food memories from those trips.

PineKnot: "

inspector13: "
....I think cities started prohibiting it first, but I remember everyone having their own burn barrel in the city in the 1960’s.
"

Oh, man. That brings back vivid memories of me as a kid in the early 1970's....we had a rusted old burn barrel in our backyard in Marshall, MN. Dad made me and my brother grab any burnable garbage, and with boots on trudge out to the barrel to burn the stuff....sucked when windy as it was hard to get stuff started with regular matches....I don't recall ever using a lighter as nobody smoked in our house...."

Once I was told to throw out a sack of onions that started to mold after the trash burned down some. I never knew it could have smelled so good as it "cooked" away.

I remember in the 90's living in Effingham, Il people still burned their leaves in the road!

Next question; 1500 miles south of Ely Mn places you somewhere in the Gulf of Mexico. Are you a sentient aquatic species?

pamonster: "I remember in the 90's living in Effingham, Il people still burned their leaves in the road!


Next question; 1500 miles south of Ely Mn places you somewhere in the Gulf of Mexico. Are you a sentient aquatic species? "

We live in a rural area just outside a very small town in Michigan. And people do still burn their leaves in the road. We have a cemetery just across the road from our home, and each fall the caretakers rake the leaves into the paths and have huge bonfires. Because leaves and grasses are my main allergy, I have to stay indoors and even indoors you can smell it if there is a south wind. Last fall my husband asked them to not burn when the wind was carrying the smoke right at our house. (He spreads our leaves on the vegetable garden and then he works them into the soil in the spring.)

Lots of burning barrels still in the country, too. Never have appreciated the smell of burning garbage, myself.

Spartan2: "

pamonster: "I remember in the 90's living in Effingham, Il people still burned their leaves in the road!



Next question; 1500 miles south of Ely Mn places you somewhere in the Gulf of Mexico. Are you a sentient aquatic species? "

We live in a rural area just outside a very small town in Michigan. And people do still burn their leaves in the road. We have a cemetery just across the road from our home, and each fall the caretakers rake the leaves into the paths and have huge bonfires. Because leaves and grasses are my main allergy, I have to stay indoors and even indoors you can smell it if there is a south wind. Last fall my husband asked them to not burn when the wind was carrying the smoke right at our house. (He spreads our leaves on the vegetable garden and then he works them into the soil in the spring.)


Lots of burning barrels still in the country, too. Never have appreciated the smell of burning garbage, myself."

Ugh that's a bummer. At least they don't do it every week or something like that!
Definitely lots of burn barrels and burn piles all over the country here (Iowa) too! But this was in town, a city park was on the other side of the street from us. People would do it between parked cars if they happened to be in front of their house, it was weird.

OneMatch: ""There is no such place as 'away' ""

So true.

As Klaatu said in The Day The Earth Stood Still, "...The universe wastes nothing. Everything is simply transformed..."

pamonster: "Next question; 1500 miles south of Ely Mn places you somewhere in the Gulf of Mexico. Are you a sentient aquatic species? "

Profile sez...
City: Walls
State: Mississippi

jhb8426: "

pamonster: "Next question; 1500 miles south of Ely Mn places you somewhere in the Gulf of Mexico. Are you a sentient aquatic species? "

Profile sez...
City: Walls
State: Mississippi "

Damn, I had my hopes up for a sec

Grades 7 thru twelve, I got the job of taking trash and cans out back from the kitchen. Can were thrown in an open fenced area and the "burnables" like partial filled milk cartons, napkins, and other items were lit with a match and "burned" in an open barrel. I was paid 25 cents a day which was needed at our house. This was applied to the 25 cent charge for lunch. While not state approved, we were fed family style at tables for 14. High school boys had 20 minutes too stuff as much as we could down and became quite proficient at that for sure. The school board contributed all the money needed to make that work. By the way, we had 3 cooks at our small rural school and anyone who went to school during their long tenure will brag about their cooking and especially the desserts. (Passed out, not served on table. I was good friends with all 3 and was treated daily to as much of the deserts as desired.YUMMY every day, especially the raised donots and fruit pies. No weight gain as was active in sports and farm work after school.

OneMatch: "This is always an interesting and frustrating topic for me. Regardless of what we do, there is waste. Is it better to put it in a landfill (which is becoming a constant problem for municipalities large and small) or is it better to burn, not only putting more CO2 and toxins in the atmosphere but also crap in the fire grate which will seep into the surrounding ground and water?


I don't have an answer but we may be leaving no trace by packing it out, but we aren't really leaving no trace when it goes into a landfill. I once heard a good quote about throwing things away. "There is no such place as 'away' ""

That is very true , but I prefer the stuff to be away in a landfill as opposed to the atmosphere or the Boundary Waters .

Anyone remember melting plastic milk bottles over an open fire to watch the burning pieces drip? And putting oil on the road to help settle the dust. They replaced that with tree sap, another bad idea. And then the ditch where what wouldn't burn got dumped. Yeah, I recall a lot of things. And I miss the clean water.
Good post to reflect on what I do moving forward.

Burning and crushing the cans for disposal in lake was accepted practice. When crossing the border into the Quetico one of the required steps was to watch a presentation from the Canadian rangers on how to properly burn and crush the cans. You were then expected to package the refuse in a plastic trash bag along with rocks and sink it in the lake. Canadian rangers would supply the group with an ample supply of trash bags for that purpose. Times have changed!

I am glad to see that science is focusing on PVOH films for packaging. They are water-soluble, biodegradable and safe for the environment. It would be nice to see this technology take off an be used more in general packaging. Right now it is mostly used for things like Tide Pods.

Of the nearly two billion tons of garbage produced worldwide each year, nearly half of it is burned for disposal. I don't endorse burning trash, but sadly, what we do in this country has little impact on the problem. The atmosphere is not local, it global, and a global approach to clean air is needed to preserve the planet's life support system.

AndySG: "Of the nearly two billion tons of garbage produced worldwide each year, nearly half of it is burned for disposal. I don't endorse burning trash, but sadly, what we do in this country has little impact on the problem. The atmosphere is not local, it global, and a global approach to clean air is needed to preserve the planet's life support system."

+ 1 million

bhouse46: "Anyone remember melting plastic milk bottles over an open fire to watch the burning pieces drip?..."

I always volunteered for trash burning duty as a kid. Hi-lex bleach bottles were the best. Rolled em up on a stout stick as it melted for quite the torch. Each drip made a loud 'zwoop' sound and flared the brightest blue.

schweady: "

bhouse46: "Anyone remember melting plastic milk bottles over an open fire to watch the burning pieces drip?..."

I always volunteered for trash burning duty as a kid. Hi-lex bleach bottles were the best. Rolled em up on a stout stick as it melted for quite the torch. Each drip made a loud 'zwoop' sound and flared the brightest blue.
"

It’s alot of fun until the burning plastic lands on your head!!

Captn Tony: "

schweady: "

bhouse46: "Anyone remember melting plastic milk bottles over an open fire to watch the burning pieces drip?..."

I always volunteered for trash burning duty as a kid. Hi-lex bleach bottles were the best. Rolled em up on a stout stick as it melted for quite the torch. Each drip made a loud 'zwoop' sound and flared the brightest blue.
"

It’s alot of fun until the burning plastic lands on your head!!"

:-) You actually had to hold it up over the burn barrel flames to keep it just the right temperature for the best colors...

Captn Tony: "

schweady: "

bhouse46: "Anyone remember melting plastic milk bottles over an open fire to watch the burning pieces drip?..."

I always volunteered for trash burning duty as a kid. Hi-lex bleach bottles were the best. Rolled em up on a stout stick as it melted for quite the torch. Each drip made a loud 'zwoop' sound and flared the brightest blue.
"

It’s alot of fun until the burning plastic lands on your head!!"

Or your hand, I still have a scar from burning those plastic jugs. Loved dripping the melting/burning plastic on my army men.

Oh yeah, burning trash was a big deal back in the day. Burn barrel and the garbage can in the back yard. The trash man would come for the garbage and empty out cans into a sort of container they could easily carry. They’d have to carry it to the front yard to their truck in the street. Now a garbage man never leaves his truck!