We've had a 17' canoe for years, but recently got an 11' kayak for our son. We got some 60" rails so we can transport both on our vehicle, but I'm struggling now with how to tie them down, due to their difference in size. I'd prefer to just purchase additional straps to tie the kayak down and not have to get the J-hooks for it. I've attached some photos of what it looks like with both of them on a vehicle with our longer rails. This is not the vehicle we'd use for normal transport - we'd be using our minivan. Any ideas?

I hate to say this, but I think that your 60" rails are too short if you want to tie on both boats with the gunwales resting on the rails in the manner shown in your pictures.

Ausable: "I hate to say this, but I think that your 60" rails are too short if you want to tie on both boats with the gunwales resting on the rails in the manner shown in your pictures. "

What would you suggest?

I think your choices are longer rails or the j hooks for the kayak. 72” will give you space for both boats without them rubbing but will hang over past the sides of the vehicle a bit. The j hooks may be harder to load when on top of the van. That depends on the height of the van and how tall you are.

I always use separate straps for each boat whether it is two canoes on their gunwales or a canoe on its gunwales and a kayak on j hooks. I have fiberglass/Kevlar composite kayak and kayaks are better off on j hooks. They are strongest on the curve of their sides. That may not matter for your kayak. That looks like material that will be strong in any position.

I use 78" Yakima crossbars on my AWD for years - they look kinda too wide, but as a matter of fact it's exactly the span of the car's mirrors, so it's legal. I put bright tennis balls on bar ends to protect myself and others approaching the vehicle. As for protecting the boats from crosswinds I use canoe brackets for my canoe - they make huge difference. You can find different attachments for kayaks, including the one that allows to carry kayak on its side - it's called something like "stacker", I think.

andym: "I think your choices are longer rails or the j hooks for the kayak. 72” will give you space for both boats without them rubbing but will hang over past the sides of the vehicle a bit. The j hooks may be harder to load when on top of the van. That depends on the height of the van and how tall you are.


I always use separate straps for each boat whether it is two canoes on their gunwales or a canoe on its gunwales and a kayak on j hooks. I have fiberglass/Kevlar composite kayak and kayaks are better off on j hooks. They are strongest on the curve of their sides. That may not matter for your kayak. That looks like material that will be strong in any position. "

Can you explain how you do the straps for two canoes and a canoe with a kayak on j hooks? Thanks.

Good gear for transporting can get expensive, but load stop brackets for the canoe and saddles or j hook mounts are far better than directly securing to the crossbars. Two straps, I prefer nylon web with camshafts, for each boat secured to the vehicle rack, not the crossbars. Add front and with shorter vehicle, rear tiedowns.
I noticed from the side view the old town's bow is high and could create a lift pulling the boat up. The large hatch opening will make it hard to establish a clean air flow further supporting saddles or other kayak mounts.

I have a Tacoma with 78” bars and a RAV4 with 58” bars. Looking at your picture, your best option is to get stackers from Thule or Yakima so that the kayak can be mounted vertical. I have used them for years with my white water kayaks without troubles. If you aren’t hauling two canoes at a time on a regular basis, the 78” bars are a bit much. I don’t have tennis balls on mine and after more than 15 years, still hit my forehead on them regularly. Not the best pic, but the kayak is strapped to stackers.

Can you explain how you tied down your canoe in that photo? That's one of the things I'm struggling with. Normally we run the strap over the canoe and attach it to the rails on either side, but I don't see how we could do that with the kayak on also. It doesn't look like you did that from the photo.

Kat2,

My canoe is sitting on gunwale brackets, which are attached to the round crossbars. You can make them out if you zoom in. The cam straps go around the belly of the canoe and the round cross bars as is typically done if you are only transporting a canoe. In the picture I drew the straps tight from the passenger side.


The kayak is vertical and strapped (totally separate from the canoe) to the vertical stackers you can’t see behind the kayak. Those straps also make one turn under the crossbar to prevent lift. The best way to see that is to visit Yakima’s site and review their instructions for stackers. So either boat can be removed separately without disturbing the other.

My canoe would be in the same location and tied down the same way whether the kayak was there or not and vice versa for the kayak.

I found two more pictures of how they are attached.

A different view from the front of the canoe and kayak together with a clear shot of the Yakima Stackers.


A picture of my Truck with two canoes and 78" bars. the rockstar has the gunwale brackets and the northstar has no brackets but the straps are attached the same either way. in the middle are Thule kayak stackers.


I don't own j-hooks. Hopefully these help to clarify what I and others are describing.

Good Luck,
Barry

My straps look a Barry’s straps. They go around the rack at the sides of each boat. I’m trying to remember if with the j hooks, the strap goes around the top of the j hook instead of down to the rack. It’s been a while since I car topped that kayak. But basically, each boat gets its own set of straps that are set up as if that was the only boat. It can be a little easier if you put up one boat, then it’s straps, then put the second straps around the middle of the bars before putting up the second boat. If you put up both boats first, it can sometimes be tricky to get the straps in place.

I think I understand it now. I was trying to figure out how the straps would attach to the far rail with the other boat in the way. I realize now that they don't - I just attach the strap to the crossbar on the inside. Thanks everyone.

Oh yes, boats in the way is a major challenge of loading multiple boats. I do a lot of throwing the straps for the second boat over the first boat, then load the second boat, then throw the straps back over the second boat. It helps to put the loose end through the cam before throwing so that both ends make it over. I carried two kayaks and a canoe this weekend, and it required a lot of trips back and forth both sides of the car tossing straps.

I run the straps around the bars and then walk the ends to the front or back of the vehicle. Then when the boat is on the rack, it is easy to walk them back over the boat to the where the will get tied down.

andym: "I run the straps around the bars and then walk the ends to the front or back of the vehicle. Then when the boat is on the rack, it is easy to walk them back over the boat to the where the will get tied down."

X2!

Best way to haul the kayak is with the kayak saddles. That frees up real-estate on the rack for the canoe in this instance and ease of tying everything down. One thing I always like to do is check and retighten when needed. Andy’s way is good... I also will use one of those grabber deals to help thread the strap back over each boat. Saves a few steps?

Look into Malone Seawings. These are how I haul my two kayaks. They work great. You would only need one set.