BWCA Shell Lake Fire and Closure Order Boundary Waters Listening Point - General Discussion
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BWCA
Administrator
  
10/08/2024 06:00PM  
NOTICE-Shell Lake Fire Closure Order & Fire Facts Sheet

Superior National Forest to Close area near Shell Lake Wildfire within the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness
A portion of lands within the BWCAW in the Superior National Forest will be closed effective October 8, 12:01pm CT.

Duluth, MN. October 8, 2024 — Due to the Shell Lake Wildfire on the Superior National Forest (SNF), Forest Supervisor Tom Hall is closing a portion of the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness (BWCAW) with an Emergency Forest Order - effective today, October 8 – prohibiting visitor entry on one lake, three specific campsites, and the loop portion of the Sioux-Hustler Trail (Forest Order 09-09-24-10). The restrictions will go into effect beginning at 12:01 p.m., October 8, 2024; see Forest Order Exhibit A for a list of closure areas and Exhibit B for a map of the area at Forest Closure Order 09-09-24-10 Shell Lake Fire.
The closure may be modified or extended as conditions allow.

The Forest Order closures include:
• The Sioux-Hustler Trail loop (Sioux-Hustler Trail from entry point to Devil’s Cascade still open)
• Agawato Lake with one (1) campsite on the lake
• Two (2) campsites on eastern side of Shell Lake

The Forest Service has posted the affected BWCAW Entry Points #14 and #15 on County Road 116 (Echo Trail) and notified cooperators and outfitters. Self-issue permits are required for both day and overnight visitor use in the BWCAW. This emergency closure is necessary for the safety of the public and firefighters.
The Shell Lake Fire is approximately 1/2 acre in size and burning in timber with a mixed boreal forest component. It is suspected to be human caused; however, an official fire investigation has not occurred yet. Initial aircraft fire size up showed the fire creeping, smoldering, and occasional single tree torching. The fire has some potential to spread to the east near Agawato Lake and a portion of the Sioux-Hustler Hiking Trail. The fire area and surrounding landscape has thick vegetation cover.

Northern Minnesota is facing drought conditions, causing active and increasing fire across the landscape. Federal and state firefighters have responded to several human caused wildfires in recent days. In addition, the availability of firefighting suppression resources including personnel and equipment is limited due to large wildfires still occurring in western states and firefighting resources supporting hurricane response efforts in eastern states. The National Preparedness Level was increased to 5-or the highest level as of 7:30 a.m. MDT today.

Shell Lake Fire Fact Sheet
Additional Fire Updates will only be made if significant fire activity occurs.
Date: October 8, 2024 12:00 noon
Fire Information and Location: On Monday, October 7, 2024, around 12:00 p.m. a fire was detected on the eastern side of Shell Lake, which is located 4 miles north of County Road 116 (Echo Trail), within the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness (BWCAW) of the Superior National Forest (NF). The fire is located in Township 65, Range 15, Section 13 on National Forest System Lands.
Description: The fire is approximately 1/2 acre and is burning in timber with a mixed boreal forest component. It is suspected to be human caused; however, an official fire investigation has not occurred yet. Initial aircraft fire size up showed the fire creeping, smoldering, and occasional single tree torching. The fire has some potential to spread to the east near Agawato Lake and a portion of the Sioux-Hustler Hiking Trail. The fire area and surrounding landscape has thick vegetation cover.

Current Status and Resources: Late yesterday afternoon the fire was creeping and smoldering and holding in place as temperatures started to cool and relative humidity levels increased. A Fire Crew is enroute to Shell Lake this morning to get an on the ground assessment of the fire activity. Above average temperatures are predicted for later this week and drought conditions continue across the Superior National Forest and fire area.

Firefighters will be assessing suppression tactics that utilize indirect fire control line locations and present the best opportunity for success. The indirect lines may include natural features such as lakes, creeks, and wetlands. Public and firefighter safety are the highest priority and ground access could be difficult. In addition, the availability of firefighting suppression resources including personnel and equipment is limited due to large wildfires still occurring in western states and firefighting resources also supporting hurricane response efforts in eastern states. The National Preparedness Level is currently at 5-or the highest level; having been increased today due to all these factors.

Closures and further information: The public is asked to stay out of the east Shell Lake area for safety reasons. Additionally, the Superior NF is putting on a temporary closure to the loop portion of the Sioux-Hustler Hiking Trail (the trail to Devil’s Cascade remains open), two campsites on the east side of Shell Lake and the campsite on Agawato Lake. To stay up to date, please send an e-mail to SM.FS.SNFNews@usda.gov requesting to be added to Superior NF Fire information. For the safety of firefighting resources, no drones are allowed near the fire area.
 
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LaVirginienne
distinguished member (218)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/08/2024 09:20PM  
Thank you!

I guess to begin discussion, if the fire was indeed human-caused, is it more likely to have been caused by hunters or paddlers defying the no fires regulation?

What the heck is going on with these people who think it’s ok to flaunt rules that keep BWCA pristine for everyone else? Does anyone have any insights to share?

I just have trouble getting my head around it…
 
Finnboy
distinguished member (246)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 04:29AM  
LaVirginienne: "Thank you!


I guess to begin discussion, if the fire was indeed human-caused, is it more likely to have been caused by hunters or paddlers defying the no fires regulation?


What the heck is going on with these people who think it’s ok to flaunt rules that keep BWCA pristine for everyone else? Does anyone have any insights to share?


I just have trouble getting my head around it…"


I’m hoping you’re not trying to distinguish between hunters and paddlers in your question.
 
adam
Moderator
distinguished member(3180)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 05:15AM  
 
Findian
distinguished member (135)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 06:32AM  
There was a rescue call to Shell Lake Sunday. Capsized canoe.
 
LaVirginienne
distinguished member (218)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 08:28AM  
No, not at all. I grew up hunting—I don’t hunt in BWCA though. I am wondering if hunters get the same information about fire bans as paddlers.

Something is going on and I am just trying to understand…
 
schwartyman
senior member (82)senior membersenior member
  
10/09/2024 08:37AM  
Spent this last weekend camping in SNF. We checked out 3 different rustic campgrounds before finding one that had an open spot. All sites we checked were clearly marked no fires allowed/fire ban. When we found our open site we were thinking back, and realized one of the occupied sites we passed had a full blown fire in the pit, and due to looking for a spot didn't think twice of it until we settled down in our open spot.

We were discussing, and came to the conclusion that maybe some people are just so confident that they wont start a fire or cause an accident, and that maybe no harm no foul? They think theyve had a million bonfires before with no accident, this is okay.

In the morning a ranger came by checking sites, and asked us to confirm if we knew there was a fire ban, and if we had a fire, which was great to see.
 
LaVirginienne
distinguished member (218)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 08:46AM  
schwartyman: "Spent this last weekend camping in SNF. We checked out 3 different rustic campgrounds before finding one that had an open spot. All sites we checked were clearly marked no fires allowed/fire ban. When we found our open site we were thinking back, and realized one of the occupied sites we passed had a full blown fire in the pit, and due to looking for a spot didn't think twice of it until we settled down in our open spot.


We were discussing, and came to the conclusion that maybe some people are just so confident that they wont start a fire or cause an accident, and that maybe no harm no foul? They think theyve had a million bonfires before with no accident, this is okay.


In the morning a ranger came by checking sites, and asked us to confirm if we knew there was a fire ban, and if we had a fire, which was great to see."


Wow—you saw more than one grate where you suspected ppl had defied the ban? The ban that was only set a few days ago on October 1? This is crazy.

Clearwater sites were almost all full last week and I didn’t see or smell a single trail of smoke. Well done fellow paddlers there. But I never would have thought I’d have to praise ppl for following BWCA rules and rega.
 
10/09/2024 10:26AM  
schwartyman: "Spent this last weekend camping in SNF. We checked out 3 different rustic campgrounds before finding one that had an open spot. All sites we checked were clearly marked no fires allowed/fire ban. When we found our open site we were thinking back, and realized one of the occupied sites we passed had a full blown fire in the pit, and due to looking for a spot didn't think twice of it until we settled down in our open spot.


We were discussing, and came to the conclusion that maybe some people are just so confident that they wont start a fire or cause an accident, and that maybe no harm no foul? They think theyve had a million bonfires before with no accident, this is okay.


In the morning a ranger came by checking sites, and asked us to confirm if we knew there was a fire ban, and if we had a fire, which was great to see."


Some people just ignore the ban. Last year I entered on the first day of the ban. I noticed another group with a fire. I decided to inform them that a ban was now in place. They seemed to brush off my information saying they didn't know about any ban. I told them it started today. They thought their "ignorance" would give them a free pass if a ranger stopped by.
 
LaVirginienne
distinguished member (218)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 10:53AM  
I had a similar experience last week. Rangers had not yet posted the ban at EP 62. I was informed at Clearwater Lodge. A father son party with a canoe mounted motor was taking extra fuel onboard “for the fire.” I spoke up and let them know about the ban. The father smirked (I am a woman and this really pissed me off) but the adult son seemed to want to comply. I said in response to the smirker, hey, we’re all out here together. We’re supposed to pass along safety information. The man said, Yeah well… then there was silence.

His attitude did not help me manage my first time guest and newbie bow paddler who was already very pissed off that her dream trip would not include campfires…

A few minutes later, the son took the extra fuel canister out of the canoe and returned it to their truck. They motored to the east end and spent the night on one of the lakes east of that portage.

If there had been an investigation they’d have looked at my permit and contacted me for sure, asking if I had any interactions with that party. False ignorance is no excuse.
 
10/09/2024 11:46AM  
LaVirginienne: "I had a similar experience last week. Rangers had not yet posted the ban at EP 62. I was informed at Clearwater Lodge. A father son party with a canoe mounted motor was taking extra fuel onboard “for the fire.” I spoke up and let them know about the ban. The father smirked (I am a woman and this really pissed me off) but the adult son seemed to want to comply. I said in response to the smirker, hey, we’re all out here together. We’re supposed to pass along safety information. The man said, Yeah well… then there was silence.


His attitude did not help me manage my first time guest and newbie bow paddler who was already very pissed off that her dream trip would not include campfires…


A few minutes later, the son took the extra fuel canister out of the canoe and returned it to their truck. They motored to the east end and spent the night on one of the lakes east of that portage.


If there had been an investigation they’d have looked at my permit and contacted me for sure, asking if I had any interactions with that party. False ignorance is no excuse. "


Since there is very little to none accountability for people's actions why should they care.

Your right in saying we are all in this together. If someone has a fire during a fire ban and starts a forest fire that person not only puts his life in danger but also other campers AND fire response teams.

The whole attitude of I know better and I'm gonna do what I want is a mindset that has proliferated thru society. People can think it's all about THEM but the hard FACT is that it's not.

Perhaps it's time to revisit reserving campsites. That way there can be the idea that if you start a fire during a fire ban, or trash a campsite, or decide to cut down 100's of small trees to build your bushcraft hideout there would be some accountability.

I would say end of rant, but I think I'm just starting.
 
LaVirginienne
distinguished member (218)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
10/09/2024 12:14PM  
airmorse: "
LaVirginienne: "I had a similar experience last week. Rangers had not yet posted the ban at EP 62. I was informed at Clearwater Lodge. A father son party with a canoe mounted motor was taking extra fuel onboard “for the fire.” I spoke up and let them know about the ban. The father smirked (I am a woman and this really pissed me off) but the adult son seemed to want to comply. I said in response to the smirker, hey, we’re all out here together. We’re supposed to pass along safety information. The man said, Yeah well… then there was silence.



His attitude did not help me manage my first time guest and newbie bow paddler who was already very pissed off that her dream trip would not include campfires…



A few minutes later, the son took the extra fuel canister out of the canoe and returned it to their truck. They motored to the east end and spent the night on one of the lakes east of that portage.



If there had been an investigation they’d have looked at my permit and contacted me for sure, asking if I had any interactions with that party. False ignorance is no excuse. "



Since there is very little to none accountability for people's actions why should they care.


Your right in saying we are all in this together. If someone has a fire during a fire ban and starts a forest fire that person not only puts his life in danger but also other campers AND fire response teams.


The whole attitude of I know better and I'm gonna do what I want is a mindset that has proliferated thru society. People can think it's all about THEM but the hard FACT is that it's not.


Perhaps it's time to revisit reserving campsites. That way there can be the idea that if you start a fire during a fire ban, or trash a campsite, or decide to cut down 100's of small trees to build your bushcraft hideout there would be some accountability.


I would say end of rant, but I think I'm just starting.
"


There’s now a very simple fix for this problem, and a request for grant funding could be bundled with a request for bear boxes. I know ppl have informed me that this is pie in the sky thinking, but I’m only putting forward a concrete solution to the problems posed by campers, not a funding solution.

A small solar powered GPS device (working on Apple iOS 18 technology or similar cost effective technology) can be placed in a sky/facing location at every campsite. A numeric code will be issued with every permit. On arrival , permit holders enter the code and the device powers on and transmits that code as a text message to a server that logs it for SAR use.

The grant request could be safety oriented. Being able to see who is at any given campsite (rather than controlling access, which simply won’t work for touring canoeists—this is a vastly different ci text from any other) gives rescuers info about the resources needed to mount a rescue. This would have been immensely helpful in the 1999 blowdown when so many portages were impassable.

Ppl will say that BWCAW is wilderness and ppl need to take personal responsibility, but that argument no longer holds water given the resources needed to address fires. It’s clear to me that if we don’t take steps to hold ppl accountable, we may be close to the end of an era when we enjoyed the privilege of being able to enjoy campfires in the wilderness.

Thoughts?

 
10/09/2024 12:22PM  
 
WalkieTalky
  
10/11/2024 11:22AM  
I actually wholeheartedly agree with you. Something so significant yet with such a small visual impact to the wilderness could save our beautiful bwca. My husband and I have been backpacking these trails for years. We too have encountered people having fires during a fire ban. I have never been a fan of arrogant people. They hurt a lot of people with zero care. And in these cases, animals and land that takes years to come back from. We love our fires while we are out there just as much as everyone else, but we understand that the fire bans are there for a reason. People like that are one of the many reasons why our world is in turmoil. People who are caught having fires during fire bands should be hit with a hefty fine and some jail time. Whoever starts a fire during a fire ban should be responsible for the cost that it took to put the fire out. If there is zero accountability, than what is stopping people from not following the rules that are set in place for a reason?
 
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