I'm looking for input from anyone who has been to both parks within the last couple of years. I am familiar with WCPP, but have never been to Wabakimi.

I'm interested in knowing if portages and campsites are similar in terms of development, ease of locating, etc. Is route planning significantly more difficult at one vs. the other? (I understand the train option at Wabakimi.)

Just looking for some general ways to compare the two parks. Thanks in advance for any input.

Not been to Wabakimi mainly because it looks like a roylax boat trip with more of a river / white water feel. It's a bigger park and possibly has more opportunities. So I'm interested in replies. Wcpp just seems to have what I like.

http://www.bwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=forum.thread&threadId=426314&forumID=16&confID=1

http://www.bwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=forum.thread&threadId=50423&forumID=17&confID=1

http://www.bwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=forum.thread&threadId=796785&forumID=292&confID=1

Probably more where those came from.

Alan

I have been to both parks - to Wabakimi once for 22 days (5 years ago) and this August will be our fourth trip to WCPP, each trip for 22-26 days. So it's probably obvious which is the park I prefer. Having only been to Wabakimi the one time I can't say that my trip was typical but I was disappointed by the amount of motor boat and lodge traffic that I encountered. I also didn't have a particularly good experience with the outfitter - not acrimonious but I didn't feel that he knew the park very well at the water level. I mean it is a beautiful park and all but after going into WCPP the following year, I doubt I'd go back.
WCPP also has boat traffic but it seems much more localized and predictable. In the three trips I've done so far it was very minimal. In fact last year we didn't see a human being for the first 20 days of our trip. The other thing that I really like about WCPP is Red Lake Outfitters. Harlan Schwartz who is the owner, knows the park intimately. He has paddled it as much as anyone around and can relate to what I'm looking for in a long trip. I don't rent equipment but he has been instrumental in introducing to me to the park and is a big reason I keep coming back. He really looks after me and I'm, by no means, one of his "big" customers.
As for camp sites, I didn't feel that there was much difference between parks. They aren't marked in either case and neither are the portages. The WCPP map is very good better than the park map of Wabakimi. I have stayed at some amazing camp sites at both parks. However you can get detailed maps of Wabakimi - The Wabakimi Canoe Route Maps - which pretty accurately mark most portages and established camp sites.
So that's my take and, as you might gather, it is really a question of personal taste and style of tripping. Keep in mind that both parks are boreal forest, which means there is no deciduous trees aside from Birch. In WCPP there isn't even cedar, mostly just Black Spruce and some pine. Also both parks are susceptible to major forest fires, which means that certain areas of the park can be bleak but beautiful in their own way.

Thanks, KerryG. I was looking for input from someone with direct recent experience in both parks. Great details and pretty complete picture. As you say, much of it boils down to personal preference.

Sans a float plane ride, WCPP seems to be easier to access. You nailed it in regard to Harlan. He has been nothing but helpful to me and like you, I am not one of his bigger paying customers.

Hope we hear from a few others with direct experience. I expected that camp sites and the forest would be similar in most respects. I would also expect that portages have improved considerably over the recent years based on the work of the Wabakimi project. I almost wonder if Wabakimi's portages may be clearer that WCPP in a lot of areas (understand that finding them would be similar at both parks).

Thanks again!

I wouldn't think Wabakimi's portages ss a whole would be any better. Woodland Caribou has crews that pretty much covers the whole park on a three year cycle. In 2012 they had a blow/snow down event. The next couple years they had extra help reopening all the portages. I don't know how often the Wabakimi park revisits portages. I picture the "project" mainly just opening up old portages. Am I wrong here?

quote KerryG: "I have been to both parks - to Wabakimi once for 22 days (5 years ago) and this August will be our fourth trip to WCPP, each trip for 22-26 days. So it's probably obvious which is the park I prefer. Having only been to Wabakimi the one time I can't say that my trip was typical but I was disappointed by the amount of motor boat and lodge traffic that I encountered. I also didn't have a particularly good experience with the outfitter - not acrimonious but I didn't feel that he knew the park very well at the water level. I mean it is a beautiful park and all but after going into WCPP the following year, I doubt I'd go back.
WCPP also has boat traffic but it seems much more localized and predictable. In the three trips I've done so far it was very minimal. In fact last year we didn't see a human being for the first 20 days of our trip. The other thing that I really like about WCPP is Red Lake Outfitters. Harlan Schwartz who is the owner, knows the park intimately. He has paddled it as much as anyone around and can relate to what I'm looking for in a long trip. I don't rent equipment but he has been instrumental in introducing to me to the park and is a big reason I keep coming back. He really looks after me and I'm, by no means, one of his "big" customers.
As for camp sites, I didn't feel that there was much difference between parks. They aren't marked in either case and neither are the portages. The WCPP map is very good better than the park map of Wabakimi. I have stayed at some amazing camp sites at both parks. However you can get detailed maps of Wabakimi - The Wabakimi Canoe Route Maps - which pretty accurately mark most portages and established camp sites.
So that's my take and, as you might gather, it is really a question of personal taste and style of tripping. Keep in mind that both parks are boreal forest, which means there is no deciduous trees aside from Birch. In WCPP there isn't even cedar, mostly just Black Spruce and some pine. Also both parks are susceptible to major forest fires, which means that certain areas of the park can be bleak but beautiful in their own way."

I think KerryG's perspective is deeper than I could provide however I was just in the western end of Wabakimi and once you get past the lakes where lodges/outfitters are located, it quiets down considerably. I had a different feel when I was in WCPP that I can't describe. Both are enjoyable. Both have some similar characteristics. I think WCPP is more of the drop-and-pool water system which is stunningly beautiful. Wabakimi had more glacial erratics and portages that carried you around them and their hidden streams. The latter is also characterized by more "swifts" but I haven't the breadth of experience in either park to state whether that is categorically true throughout.

Of course, Wabakimi doesn't have Harlan...and that's a big selling point for WCPP! Having said that, I'm tentatively looking at a late summer/early fall trip back into Wabakimi with a paddling partner so I can say that I did enjoy the "wildnerness feel" to this park (at least coming in from the western boundary). Just my two cents.

I went with the Wabakimi Project in 2008 but we were outside the park on the west side. We had total solitude as we were opening long lost portages. While there I missed the exposed rock that is so prevalent in much of WCPP. I enjoy the easy access to various parts of WCPP and being able to keep the costs down. WCPP has Harlan and also a helpful park staff that encourages paddlers. Wabakimi has more diversity of tree types as WCPP is Jack Pine on the rock and Spruce in the low places. There are scattered Aspen and Birch in the areas with some soil. The lack of soil in WCPP is one of the draws for me. I enjoy being able to look back into the forest as I paddle rather than only seeing a wall of green vegetation. Like others that have posted here WCPP is where I have found my kind of canoe tripping. At the end of this season I will have spent a cumulative total on one year tripping in WCPP and still look to return. That is the best recommendation I can give.

I was in southeastern Wabakimi in 2011 and eastern WCPP in 2014.
Wab is definitely more remote because access is more difficult.

I experienced smaller water in WCPP than Wab. Both parks are drop and pool paddling.

I like to sleep in a hammock. In WCPP I had a spot for the hammock each night. In Wab I could not find sufficient trees on a couple nights.

Portages are much better maintained in WCPP. Park management style is more hands on in WCPP. Between park managers and Harlan the park is promoted more heavily. I think Wab has about 10% of the visitors each year than WCPP. Both parks have few visitors per sq mi in any given year.

The Wabakimi Project has been working on connecting routes for the last few years all around the park borders. The WabProj maps are very detailed in regard to portage location and have a lot of campsites, especially sites big enough for 4 or more campers. Smaller campsites, i.e. one tent pad type sites are not necessarily shown on those maps. Portages in both parks are generally closer to the rapids than in BW/Q and can be hard to find.

I was in Wab during mid-August and saw only one motor boat. But fishing season is pretty much over by that time, so YMMV.

Both parks have a fair amount of air traffic. This is a big difference from the no-fly zone over BW/Q.

quote jcavenagh: "I was in southeastern Wabakimi in 2011 and eastern WCPP in 2014.
Wab is definitely more remote because access is more difficult.


I experienced smaller water in WCPP than Wab. Both parks are drop and pool paddling.


I like to sleep in a hammock. In WCPP I had a spot for the hammock each night. In Wab I could not find sufficient trees on a couple nights.


Portages are much better maintained in WCPP. Park management style is more hands on in WCPP. Between park managers and Harlan the park is promoted more heavily. I think Wab has about 10% of the visitors each year than WCPP. Both parks have few visitors per sq mi in any given year.


The Wabakimi Project has been working on connecting routes for the last few years all around the park borders. The WabProj maps are very detailed in regard to portage location and have a lot of campsites, especially sites big enough for 4 or more campers. Smaller campsites, i.e. one tent pad type sites are not necessarily shown on those maps. Portages in both parks are generally closer to the rapids than in BW/Q and can be hard to find.


I was in Wab during mid-August and saw only one motor boat. But fishing season is pretty much over by that time, so YMMV.


Both parks have a fair amount of air traffic. This is a big difference from the no-fly zone over BW/Q."

Does the fishing season end in mid-August due to lack of hatchings, water temps going down or some other reason? Curious as to what happens at that time up there.

I think it is the time after hatching and before they fatten up for winter. But, don't take any info about fishing from me...I am the world's worst fisherman.
I was in WCPP for 10 days and caught ZERO fish.
In Wabakimi, I caught 2 fish in a week.
...I am the George Costanza of fishing, baby!

quote jcavenagh: "I think it is the time after hatching and before they fatten up for winter. But, don't take any info about fishing from me...I am the world's worst fisherman.
I was in WCPP for 10 days and caught ZERO fish.
In Wabakimi, I caught 2 fish in a week.
...I am the George Costanza of fishing, baby! "

That made me laugh!

i've been to both parks in the last ten years. our trip in WCPP involved a float plane to the headwaters of the bloodvein river. i love the open feel of this jack pine forest. also few bugs. as we paddled into manitoba the country changes into a very lush river flood plain type forest. i had paddled here in the 80's. one thing to note. the winds are about what you would expect considering how near the canadian prairies.

we did a ten day trip to wabakimi no so long ago. i love this park and have paddled quite a bit of it back in the 70-80s. the terrain is rather flat and boggy, not as scenic as WCPP, but it feels much wilder then WCPP. one thing i like about wabakimi is the variety of paddling. big lakes, whitewater rivers, nasty clogged up streams, it's all there. on our most recent trip we went in without any research or consulting with the locals. we used canadian govt topos. some portages that i know were there in the 70's were hard to locate. from what i read on this site i would bet that many of these portages have been reestablished.

i love both parks. i prefer wabakimi as it really gives you a chance to test your paddling skills. the albany river on the north of the park is an excellent river, some gorgeous waterfalls and amazing fishing.

the forest in wabakimi is much thicker than WCCP, rather than jackpine most of wabakimi is spruce, campsites sometimes have to be made out of the bush. we had some bad ones. we don't canoe for campsites so that really didn't matter.

as far as woodland caribou, i have seen several in wabakimi, none in WCPP.