Boundary Waters Quetico Forum :: Listening Point - General Discussion :: Water temp safety
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jwartman59 |
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justpaddlin |
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bobbernumber3 |
mschi772: "bobbernumber3: "Having been there, and done that, I wouldn't bother with a wet suit even now. But I would recommend being cautious and staying out of the water. If you are 50 years old, you have a 50-50 chance of surviving 50-degree water for 50 minutes." This folksy wisdom/catchy phrase only sticks with me because we were older than 50, colder than 50, and longer than 50. I agree it is totally unscientific. My other folksy phrase is "You're not really cold until you pass out." In my experience. |
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TechnoScout |
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bobbernumber3 |
Becoming bobber#3 |
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merlyn |
You can minimize the dangers by using common sense and listening to the advice on the forum but s..t happens and how you are prepared to deal with it could make the difference between having a cool story to tell or a tragedy to forget. |
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Canoearoo |
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bobbernumber3 |
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YetiJedi |
Hoping everyone stays safe and enjoys their trips! |
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bobbernumber3 |
IowaGuy: "...and always have a safety plan should a capsize occur... I'm curious on the details of your safety plan should a capsize occur? |
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lionman |
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EddyTurn |
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mschi772 |
bobbernumber3: "Having been there, and done that, I wouldn't bother with a wet suit even now. But I would recommend being cautious and staying out of the water. If you are 50 years old, you have a 50-50 chance of surviving 50-degree water for 50 minutes." I've heard a different variation of this psuedoscientific piece of "wisdom." "You have a 50% chance of making it 50 yards to shore in 50 degree water. It'd be better to find some real science/data to share instead of folksy wisdom based more on how catchy it sounds than how accurate it is. Cold shock (breathing, blood pressure, and cognitive impairment) can occur in water as warm as 50-60 deg F within as little as 3 minutes and can quickly result in hypothermia. Involuntary gasping (which is a drowning hazard) during a surprise capsize/immersion can occur in water as warm as 75 deg F. A human can survive in water of 40 deg F for 20-30 min before severe, dangerous symptoms overwhelm them. Wear a properly-fitted PFD. Wear/pack wool garments. Do not wear cotton, and do not rely on down. Carry and know how to use a PLB or satellite messenger. If you fall in, get to shore immediately. Get dry, even if that means getting naked first. Get into dry clothes and/or wrap yourself in a blanket or your sleeping bag. Start a fire and/or start heating water over your fire/stove. The fire is obvious, but drinking hot water is also extremely helpful. If you cannot get your body temperature to rise or you start to feel disoriented, activate the SOS on your PLB/messenger especially if you are solo. |
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HWMinngrl |
I have a question about safety measures on a trip when the water temp is quite cold. I’ve been to the BWCA twice before on day trips, but once was in early Sept after an entire summer of warming up the waters, and once was in mid-June when it was unseasonably warm (this was last June - it was so warm on Farm Lake / Kawishiwi River that wading in shallow water felt nearly like being in bath water and the air temp was 75 degrees). This year, however, I’ll be going in very late May and into early June. With the ice-out date still to come, but likely still occurring prior to my trip, are there any safety tips to keep in mind? I’m thinking that Gunflint Lake and the Granite River will be very cold, as cold as Lake Superior, I would imagine, and the one time I kayaked on Lake Superior I wore a full wet suit. I’m just thinking about the possibility of capsizing into water that is perhaps in the 40s. I’ve never heard of anyone wearing a wet suit in the BWCA, but what would you suggest for a trip when the water temps could be in the 40s? Thank you ! |
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HWMinngrl |
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IowaGuy |
If not, is there more than 1 canoe in your group? When I'm on solo trips in mid-May, I tend to canoe closer to shore if the conditions aren't perfect (wind/waves being the main risk). I don't take chances with big wind. Capsizing far from shore in a remote lake can be a death sentence in 40 degree water. Review the 1-10-1 rule, if you capsize you need to be able to reach shore in a few minutes before you start to lose muscle coordination. If more than 1 canoe then you can stay relatively close together to increase safety should one boat capsize, but you should definitely have a safety plan in place beforehand. Wearing lifejackets should be a non-negotiable. Not a bad idea to read the BWJ article about capsizing on Gabimichigami, it's a little dramatic but will get you thinking about how to avoid and/or deal with a cold-water capsize: https://www.boundarywatersjournal.com/images/samples/judgement_day.pdf I had a mid-May scare on Gabi many years ago when I was paddling across the main lake. I was a fairly inexperienced big-water canoeist at that point in life, and though it was very windy, the waves didn't look too bad from the lee side where I launched so I decided to go for it (young and invincible mentality). However, the wind steadily picked up from behind me during the crossing and as I slowly approached the windward side of Gabi the waves were growing larger than I'd ever canoed in. I started to slowly take on a little water from behind but luckily barely made it to shore without capsizing. It reshaped how I think about cold-water canoeing safety, I am much more risk-averse now and always have a safety plan should a capsize occur... |
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ForestDuff |
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Jaywalker |
If you have two or more canoes, it would be good to learn how to "right" a swamped canoe using the others, but keep in mind there is very little time to get that done and you might be better just focusing on getting to shore. There were 3 experienced paddlers on Tuscarora I think two years ago who tipped in cold water while fishing, and unfortunately time spent trying to right their own canoe may have been partially why only 2 of the 3 made it to shore. Paddling close to shore is really big, and if you have two canoes stay fairly close together so one can aid the other quickly. I believe people tend to substantially overestimate their swimming abilities in good conditions, and its even worse in cold water and/or waves. Stay close to shore. Stay on shore if winds are bad and don't worry about keeping your schedule. In my PFD pocket I have a sealed Altoids tin with 2 types of fire starters, matches, lighter, and fire starter, mini-flashlight, cord, mirror, razor, and a space blanket. If you go in cold water, first thing is you have to get out fast. Then focus on getting warm. Throughout the process you have to determine when/if you need to summon help. I also have a loud whistle in my PFD, and have sometimes carried an air horn. Finally, my Garmin InReach Mini is attached and can be activated if needed. |
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bobbernumber3 |
Bayley Bay, Basswood Lake, Quetico - August 2012 |
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boonie |
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bobbernumber3 |
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HWMinngrl |
IowaGuy: "Are you on a solo trip? Thank you! I will not be solo; my husband will also be on the trip. We will either be in one canoe or in two kayaks. I think we will plan to stay close to shore and paddle around bays rather than across them. Thanks for sharing that article; I am interested to read about that. I’m glad you made it out safely from your mishap! I am a pretty risk-averse person and like to have a plan in place ahead of time. |
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IowaGuy |
When soloing in cold water, I always bring a spare set of warm dry clothes including stocking cap, synthetic long underwear top & bottom, warm pants, fleece jacket, warm socks, and gloves. I keep these in a dry bag and take them on all day trips. Dry bag also has fire-starting materials and a first-aid kit with loud whistle. Dry bag is lashed to the canoe. In addition, I have paracord tied to the canoe handle so I can line it if necessary. If some wind, then I always canoe fairly close to the windward shore, even if it means a very circuitous route (I'm usually fishing anyway so biggie to stay somewhat close to shore in May). That way if I capsize, the canoe (with my dry clothes and firestarter) and I will quickly drift into shore (as opposed to blowing out to the middle of the lake, or getting separated from the canoe). Once I get to shore, while I still have muscle coordination, I will change out of my wet clothes and into my dry ones, and get a fire started for warmth. Also, IMO just thinking through in detail what one would do upon capsizing is a very useful exercise and is part of a safety plan, so as to hopefully minimize panic if it ever actually happened... |
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HWMinngrl |
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MikeinMpls |
bobbernumber3: "This is where you want to be on windy days. We saw three canoes capsize while we watched from shore and never for a second considered going out to "help". Your post made me think back to the times I have gotten in my canoe to "help" someone who had capsized. Two times were on solo trips, and the water was calm. Inexperienced canoers, one who decided to fish from his canoe, standing up, without a pfd. Another time was with my wife on a Minneapolis lake. Dude paddling around a tandem, alone, again without a pfd. Too rough of water for him. I instructed him to hang on to my gunwale with one hand, but if he attempted to climb in my canoe, I would chop his fingers off. I was serious...sorry if I sounded llike a jerk, but panicked people do panicked things, and we didn't need three in the water. So many times I/we've been at camp, whitecaps, water I wouldn't be on, and I've been paddling 45 years. I've asked myself if I would go out to assist in those conditions... I think I probably would not. Besides the inherent problems paddling an unloaded canoe in high winds, what would do? Perhaps hang on the canoe as I paddled them in... but their packs? Where would I bring them? To the shore...then what? To my campsite...uhhhh, no. Much of the above was just stream of consciousness babbling cuz I'm wasting time. Mike |
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OgimaaBines |
I have friends were were delayed for 3 days in the BWCA due to heavy winds. One of the group members was so worried that his girlfriend was worried that he convinced the rest of the group to go out in the whitecaps. They couldn't make it to the next portage and had to go opt for a worse campsite on the windward side of the lake. I also wear wool, top and bottom as it is able to hold your heat better even when soaked. I stopped once for lunch at a campsite, and flipped the canoe getting back in, soaked up to my chest. It wasn't a cold and windy day but it was May in the BWCA and man I was glad for that warm wool. |