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Author	Message Text
jhb8426	08/24/2024 12:39PM   Agree on the use of a seat. Makes a big difference.
cowdoc	09/04/2024 08:16AM   He states in the OP that kneeling is out.
LaVirginienne	08/27/2024 09:14AM   Seat height was the number one reason I did not buy the NW. The seat on the Prism is higher and works great for me. Maybe give one a test ride? Dump the awful plastic tractor seat and switch it out for a webbing bench seat. Two paddlers on my recent trip with lower back issues used their crazy creek chairs for support. As for form, are you engaging your core on every stroke? That can help too. Regarding rotator cuff doctor advice, I’m managing those issues myself to avoid surgery. Congrats for getting through it! All I can say is, better to stop lifting the canoe overhead at all. Stand just behind the yoke and grab the seat rail, twist to put the bow in the sand, pull it up basically to shoulder height and “walk” your hands toward the yoke. Settle in and lift the bow. Much safer for a variety of reasons. It’s just not worth getting in a wreck out there solo. That’s how I’ve been managing knee and shoulder issues.
nctry	08/27/2024 01:52PM   I had the NW Solo which I loved to paddle… the first 20 minutes or so. Then my groin would be screaming. I figured I’d get stretched out or at least get used to it. Well, I traded Chuck at Spring Creek even up… he had a brand new prism that he put all the things I liked in it. And I never looked back. It was the same weight and I really loved the thing. I think the seat back was a Chosen Valley deal. I didn’t have long as my neck and arms just couldn’t handle canoeing anymore.
justpaddlin	08/27/2024 12:44PM   I think Northstar may position their seats extra low to make their canoes extra friendly for beginners. I usually kneel and Northstars are the only boats that I can't get my feet under...the seats in my Polaris are annoyingly low so a shorter paddle works better. I've had my share of lower back issues and light core exercises were my salvation. The exercises are not at all difficult. I think I read that core muscles are small and like regular exercise. Being carried away by a paramedic was my first serious wake-up call; I used to have to max out on Ibuprofin to survive long airplane trip. I bought a used tumbling mat that gives me a perfect place to lay down comfortably without some skinny little yoga mat moving around under me...that was also key to me developing a habit. Tons of core exercises available online, maybe just find a few you like and try them. 10 minutes a day 5 days a week or 15 minutes 4'days a week and you'll feel noticeably sturdier within 2 weeks. Leg lifts on your belly, side and back may do wonders for you. I have one boat with a backband. I still don't understand them but I can see where maybe they force you to maintain a better paddling posture since leaning back to paddle seems even harder on the lower back.
Savage Voyageur	08/24/2024 12:25PM   I used to have back problems in a canoe. I found that a chair like a crazy creek gives me the back support needed for a long day in a canoe. Might help you too.
THEGrandRapids	08/24/2024 12:14PM   This may turn into a meandering post…. I bought a NW solo 3 year ago with the stimulus money. Used it once then had some bulging disc issues in lower back. Kayaking as a kid (I’m 36) always sucked because eventually my lower back would numb out and become sore (no disc issue- but soreness). I got a solo to duck hunt and take my kids fishing. Went out today with it for 2 hours to loop around some flat water bay. 3 year old caught his first perch, great time. But by the time I got back my lower back was getting that same numbness I recall having every summer growing up. I can’t kneel (long story short- I have some head rush thing that happens and I could potentially pass out at the worst. At the best my legs would be cramping within minutes.) Do I sell this brand new solo and maybe try a 16 prospector? Thing is, I have zero problem paddling the stern of my SQ 17 and 18.5… have done 3 overnighters this year into the BW- short loops and long loops. Zero back issues (though I am very aware any wrong bend or twist could lead to an evac- I take some RX as a precautionary- flexril and the 4 painkillers they gave me but have never used last time I had an episode). Part of the problem may be the twichy feel of the solo putting my lower back muscles into hyper drive. Long post- shirt question- do I better my technique? Or lift the seat (figure that will cause balance issues) or get a deeper canoe that isn’t as ideal as a solo, but would work better for me?
scottiebaldwin	08/25/2024 06:11AM   I agree with the above posters about augmentation of your seat/seating to be more comfortable. Also, don’t be afraid to reach out to Bear at Northstar as I have found his help to be invaluable. At Northstar they’ve seen it all and really know their stuff. They want you to be comfortable and confident in their watercraft.
OCDave	08/25/2024 09:05AM   I paddled my own Northwind Solo with the standard sitting drops for less than a week before swapping for the shorter kneeling drops. I still sit rather than kneel a majority of the time but it is far more comfortable to be slightly higher. That was several years ago so, if it felt slightly more tippy seated a couple inches higher, I have forgotten. It made a world of difference in my enjoyment of the boat. Find them here or whereever Northstar accessories are sold.
Banksiana	08/29/2024 10:24AM   I have a pair of the Wenonah superseats that Cowdoc mentioned. Located in Ely- you'd be welcome to have one if they help.
WHendrix	08/24/2024 06:02PM   I paddled a Magic for many years. It was a Bell in the White Gold layup which is relatively heavy for a solo. I think it was 42 pounds or a bit more. After rotator cuff surgeries in both shoulders my surgeon told me that I should not lift more than 30 lbs. over my head. I sold it and bought a NW solo in the kev. light layup. The seat on the Magic was higher and had a slight slope or cant from back to front and I found that the NW with its lower flat seat was very uncomfortable. I raised and sloped the seat and and it was fine. It's not a very dificult thing to do. I think I raised the back about 2" and the front about 1". It's best done in short sections. I also installed a kayak style back support. It takes just a short amount of time to get used to the balance with the higher seat.
Dolpho	08/25/2024 08:45AM   All good suggestions so far. Along with seat height consider the style and length of your paddle and how that affects your bend/reach/rotation on your torso. Compare seat height with your tandem. You may not want the same paddle for both boats. I have my solo seat almost up to the rails to minimize my lower back angle. I experimented with seat height by placing different thicknesses of foam temporarily and changing between them to see what seemed best before making hardware changes.
cowdoc	08/25/2024 05:59PM   Wenonah Superseat....not as tall as Crazy Creek styles. Good straps for seat attachment and for snugging it to your lower back. Velcro strap to keep it closed on portage, which holds my one inch foam pad in place that I cut to fit seat. Comes in bench or bucket style.
THEGrandRapids	08/26/2024 03:13PM   Thanks for all the replies. My neighbor had an aluminum frame seat back, i forget the name, I borrowed that yesterday and it worked better. Will use that for awhile and may use some angled foam to see if lifting and tilting it will work before I do any woodwork on the hangers. The shorter paddle seems like a good idea too, though I'll stick to one variable at a time.
keth0601	09/04/2024 07:25AM   Have you tried kneeling rather than sitting? I have spondylosis and spondylolisthesis and two bulged discs and so I have had back problems for a long time and sitting in the canoe for long periods of time was always painful even with the gci/crazy creek chairs (though they help a bit). I switched/learned to kneel in the canoe 4 years ago and it completely changed paddling for me. I can go all day and my back actually feels better rather than worse. Get a good kneeling pad like the one from Northstar and put kneeling drops in your canoe (super easy to install, I ordered my phoenix with them because I knew the standard drops are much too low) and give it a try. You might be amazed. Another thing that made it much more comfortable for me is either wearing soft footwear like neoprene/wading boots or just going bare foot when in the canoe (less strain on the ankles).
keth0601	09/04/2024 09:28AM   cowdoc: "He states in the OP that kneeling is out." Ahh yes I missed that. In any case I wonder if many people count out kneeling before understanding how it's properly done in a canoe. I think most people don't realize you still have your butt on the seat while kneeling and you're not in a true kneeling position as most people think/imagine it being. Takes most of the pressure off the knees and ankles which is what most people associate with being uncomfortable when kneeling.
THEGrandRapids	09/04/2024 10:45AM   Thanks Keth0601- I get light headed when I stand up from squatting- basically when I'm putting my kid into a car seat on the floor and stand up. (I've had an echocardiogram, but they couldn't find anything. I believe I have "Orthostatic hypotension" but no tests they did could rule this as a culprit. I'm physically fit and bike 20 miles a day throughout the year to and from work.) This "squat" is different from kneeling. I still suspect I'm not limber enough, with the other issue aside. I'll give it a try though!
Sunburn	08/25/2024 04:13PM   I have issues with intermittent back spasms. It's not too bad (yet), but definitely can ruin my day every once in a while. When I bought my NW solo a couple years ago, it came with the standard sitting height seat drops, but I also ordered a pair of kneeling drops. I have found the kneeling drops are much more likely to aggravate my back (when seated - no issues when kneeling) as opposed to the lower sitting drops. I think, for me at least, the slightly canted angle of the seat with the kneeling drops is the primary cause of my back pain while paddling. So YMMV... I am by no means a seasoned canoeist, and didn't feel there was any significant loss of stability with the higher kneeling drops (although physics tells us there is at least some loss of stability). If you want a minimally used pair of kneeling drops at a good price, shoot me an email.
brulu	08/25/2024 12:15PM   I have an outfitter version of the NW Solo (it has aluminum seat brackets riveted to the side of the hull rather than seat drops). I was shocked and disappointed with how low the seat was. The almost recumbent, kayak-like sitting position was unacceptable to me, plus there wasn't room to get my feet under the seat if I ever wanted to kneel. So I raised the seat by inserting a spacer between the brackets and the seat (made from an old ash hockey stick shaft using the wider dimension), which raised the seat by a little more than an inch (see first picture). This was an improvement for sitting, and allowed enough room to get my feet under the seat when kneeling. But I still craved a more tandem-like (higher) sitting experience, so I made a booster seat from 3 inch thick closed cell foam. I was originally just experimenting with seat heights, but quickly realized it would be a permanent part of my setup. I attach it with straps in such a way that it can be quickly flipped back out of the way or down into place (see pictures). When in place it puts my seat height close to the gunwales. So I have 4 positions that I can use depending on the situation: 1) Kneeling for when conditions are a little bit sketchy and I want the lowest center of gravity possible. 2) and 3) Sitting directly on the webbing seat (with legs either stretched out a bit in front of me, or cross-legged with my knees tucked under the gunwales). 4) On the booster seat when conditions are mostly calm. Just sharing ideas for anyone who might be interested, and to reinforce what others have said about it being OK to raise the seat.
sns	08/26/2024 07:46AM   I have installed the same back band as WHendricks in all my canoes due to back issues, and they allow me to paddle long days.