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bradcrc
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The top item on my xmas list this year is likely to be a bear proof food container ...so I'm looking for any advice or recommendations.
I'm wondering if I should just get the regular bear vault container, it would be ok for longer trips if I decide to take one, as well as group trips.
Or, should I get the smaller solo size and also a regular one so I can use either one?
Or is there an alternative that I'm not aware of?
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Savage Voyageur
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Bradcrc, there is an alternative to the bear barrel. Kanoes talked me into trying a five gallon pail with a screw on Gamma seal lid. I can get the pail for free and the Gamma seal lid at Fleet Farm for $6.00. The Gamma seal lids will fit many sizes of pails. I plan on putting two of them in a Army duffle bag with shoulder straps for portaging. One of the main reasons that I have read is that the bears can not smell the food as well if it is in a airtight container. The Gamma Seal lid solves this problem. For me this is an upgrade to the food pack hanging in the tree. It will also keep the main problem away from my food, Squirrels, chipmunks and mice.
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Merganser
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A plastic bucket with a gamma lid won't be bear proof, if its found. Same goes with the big blue barrels. As long as Yellow Yellow doesn't find a Bear Vault it is. (Yellow Yellow is a lone bear in the Adirondacks that has managed to open them).
I actually have several of bigger ones and one of the smaller ones. It is nice having some options. The larger size is supposed to be good for a person-week of food. Obviously this would depend on what you pack, how you pack it and how much you eat in a week. My wife could easily get a weeks worth of food in one full sized BV. For me five days would more realistic, I think I could manage six.
When I have used my small one it was always as an overflow when food doesn't fit in an even number of full size vaults. The weight difference isn't a lot, the advantage of having one of these is mostly size.
Watch the sales. REI usually has these marked down a good 10 bucks couple times a year.
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PortageKeeper
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The buckets (as said) won't be bearproof. Any container that a bear can grab with its teeth to carry way back in the woods where you likely won't find it, isn't bearproof.
I have both sized bearvaults and use the larger one the most. I never get more than six days food in it, for a solo trip, as I like to include a little 'real food'. I also have one Garcia, and although the Garcia has been proven more safe from bears, the bearvault wins its turn on trips because it is so much more convenient, with its see-through sides and larger opening.
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Savage Voyageur
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PK, I know that the pails are not bear proof but neither are the blue barrels. Look one this forum to see pictures of ripped up bear barrels. I have had more trouble with small critters chewing through my expensive packs to get at the food than bears. I think that this should work great and save me $75 plus. They are air tight and from what I have read it is the smell that attracts the bears. With the handle on the pail it would be easy to hoist in the air.
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kanoes
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savage? link that photo of the ripped up bearvault please.
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Savage Voyageur
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Sorry K I corrected my post to reflect this. It was a picture of a blue barrel that was tore up.
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Merganser
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Of course then you'll have to worry about Vikings :)
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Savage Voyageur
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Here is the link to the previous thread to show the chewed up blue food containers. I'm not sure who made the one that got chewed on. bwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=forum.thread&confId=1&forumId=15&threadId=168855
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Koda
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Having had a number of dogs over the years, I wonder if it's possible to odor-proof anything. Has anyone tested the olfactory "signature" of their food packs with dogs?
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bradcrc
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you might have better luck if you can find a container that fits inside like a pretzel jar or something that's just small enough to fit inside.
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sdebol
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"you might have better luck if you can find a container that fits inside like a pretzel jar or something that's just small enough to fit inside."
Do you mean find a container that fits inside and then use the spray foam between the two? That probably would work better than having the foam constantly exposed to the frozen items. Will have to start searching for the perfect liner...
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kanoes
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i didnt think id ever seen a bearvault torn open. :)
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tg
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i am a bear vault fan-own one of the larger ones. even for short solo trips where i only half fill it with food i make use of extra space in the vault by putting the dog's food, stove, booze, toothpaste etc in there.
tg
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PortageKeeper
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But bear barrels and blue barrels aren't the same as BearVaults.
I'm not particularly fond of hanging my food, which is another reason I use the bearvaults. Just put it on the ground, away from the lake.
A bear can smell through most anything, sealed or not. If there is very little smell coming from the inside, there is still residue on the outside, imo.
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silverback
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You could put your food in the end zone. Doesn't seem like the Bears get there much!
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Merganser
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Ouch.
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gutmon
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Another option is the Ursack Pack. My buddy and I used these this past fall and were really happy with them. We were able to easily get 7-8 days food per pack (per person) by packing smart. I like the fact that they are not rigid- as they are emptied they take up less space, they stand up and stay open to allow easy access, can be tied to a small tree to prevent critters from carrying it off and for extra protection can easily be hung from a tree (unlike rigid containers without something to put them in). Only drawback I could see is that they are not considered "legal" bear protection in some Western states and Alaska.
Ursack packs
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andym
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I agree that keeping something truly odor proof and no odor on the outside after cooking and handling it for a few days is pretty hard. The bear resistant containers don't rely on being odor proof. In fact, they (at least Ursack) are tested by making them seem obviously enticing to bears. One can then up the odds of them not getting tested in the wild by sealing the food well.
Another Ursack fan here. I can see the good of the rigid containers like the Bear Vault but can't get myself to carry the extra weight. Our usual trips are 4 people, 11 days, and so at 44 people days we would need something like 7 Bear Vaults or 8 Ursacks. That makes the Bear Vaults weigh an extra 14 pounds. I do sometimes think about having one on a trip for a small cache of very safe food. But then I think that we can just spread out where the Ursacks are tied up and it is very unlikely we would lose them all at once. And so, Urasck it is.
If I was doing a trip where I could get all of my food into just one container then it would be...... two Ursacks for under half the weight. But that is partially because I already own them.
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sdebol
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I just purchased two of the large ones this fall during REI's sale, but I haven't tried them yet.
I think I may line one of them with Great Stuff and carve it out neatly with a styrofoam cutting knife (my wife uses one for crafts) to make a Bear Vault cooler!...
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Merganser
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sdebol, How about getting some 3/8" closed cell foam and gorilla glue and make a BearVault cozy?
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bradcrc
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anyone know of any great sales going on for bear vaults? going to ask the parents for one as my xmas present this year? :)
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OldGreyGoose
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My two cents: First, I think that forums like this, where we can share our experiences with bears -- especially if we are specific about the location and date -- is a great first line of defense.
As far as the scent of food attracting bears goes, I ran across this at a deer hunting web page -- What animals smell compared to humans: Bloodhounds smell 300 times better; Deer smell 1,000 times better (maybe more); BEARS SMELL 2,100 TIMES BETTER. (Source: Pa. Game Commission)
Maybe we should try using "cover-up" scents, like deer hunters.
Fox urine anyone?
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Patches the Canoe
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Silverback nice football commentary, I'm still chuckling.
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fishguts
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SunCatcher
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I own two of the large Bear Vaults and one small one. This allows for flexability based on the groups size as to which one (one's) we take and based on the quanity of food and size of group. I don't like the extra weight...but really like the vaults. I also think they are way damn proud of em based on the price...but I looked at it as a long term investment. Heck, if a BEAR can't get in em, then they will last a long time. We split em up between us with a large group and disperse em away from camp aways, so when YOGI and Boo Boo come around I'm not close to em. I truly like em. As the food supply drops and the trip progresses, we transfer all the food to one or two vaults and put other items in em to save on space, even garbage in a zip lock, that we want to carry out. Hope this helps.
SunCatcher.
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sdebol
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Merganser--I think you recommended that to me in a previous thread and I haven't forgotten. I was just thinking lately that it might be easier to spray in expanding foam rather than cut closed cell foam to fit. Plus I thought it might be lighter. Any opinions?
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sdebol
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Good point.
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kanoes
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closed cell wont absorb liquids. thats the key.
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andym
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A cooler choice that might not take up as much width as some foam are these liners from NRS.
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sdebol
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Those look great--I could use one of them inside the BearVault and not have to permanently alter it to try it out as a cooler.
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snakecharmer
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Great suggestion andym!
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sdebol
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Did a little checking online:
The large BearVault is listed as 8.7" x 12.7".
The small NRS cool dry bag liner is 7.5" x 13" and the medium is 9.5" x 20". Looks like I can go a little bit smaller in diameter or go with the medium and just compress the extra material at the top. I think I may try the medium first.
Steve
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