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02/07/2012 11:07AM |
Ho Ho, that is why I find the similarities between those two likenesses so interesting. Burial mounds originally built by people of the Hopewell culture, and then more recently used by the Dakota, were located on top of Dayton’s bluff. (A few still exist in nearby Mounds Park)
I know Daniel Greysolon, Sieur DuLuth was sent to the west end of Lake Superior to help negotiate peace talks between the Ojibway and Dakota in 1679, so that French fur trade expansion could continue uninterrupted; and that by the early 1700’s the Dakota were pushed west and south of the Mississippi. So I’m wondering (speculating) if perhaps the pictographs are of Dakota origin and at least 350 years old.
I once heard speculation in a history show that the Hegman pictographs were a recruiting message for Tecumseh’s war, but that would make them about 200 years old.
Hum, I thought France was in Europe. : )
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02/07/2012 05:06PM |
I take back my speculation. I see that the pictographs around the BWCA are similar to ones found throughout even the eastern Lake Superior area. I also see the Ojibway are commonly associated with pictographs, and that even the word "O-jib-i-weg", some say, means those who make pictographs.
Maybe that figure has a more ancient meaning.
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02/02/2012 10:14PM |
quote Kowboy: "I've been reading "Crossing Boundary Waters: A Spiritual Journey in Canoe Country", by Andrew Rogness. In this book the author claims that the pictographs were not ancient native american paintings but put there in 1963 by a man named Bird Moccasin trying his hand at the art of his ancestors. I tried googling Bird Moccasin but didn't turn up anything. Have any of you heard this? It is on page 41 if any of you have the book."
Maybe it's because I don't want to, but I find this hard to believe. I do have to say, however, that the pictos on S Hegeman are very vivid and bright while others are faint and very old looking. Those do make me wonder now.
I prefer to think of them as something more sacred than someone paddling around and painting on rocks in the 60s.
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02/06/2012 05:22PM |
I saw that the Minnesota Archeological Society has documents citing BWCA pictographs. Some of these include descriptions by State Geologist Newton Winchell, AJ Hill, and TH Lewis from 1911, and Armin Arndt from 1935.
I also saw a document that lists the pictographs and a petroglyph on the U.S. side of the BWCA that are on the National Register of Historic Places. To be on the list they had to have documentation showing they were at least 50 years old at the time they were listed in 1990. Those I saw on the list was a petroglyph at Curtain Falls and pictos at Seagull, Fishdance, Crooked, and Crooked Lake #1, Island River, Jordan, Polly, Kekekabic, Hegman, King Williams Narrows, Burntside, Rocky Lake, and at the Beatty Portage. Two others I saw on a list from the MN Archeological Society include those at Red Rock Lake and the Granite River. If the Hegman pictos were repainted I’m sure there was a bunch a red tape to cut though.
Some documents had blacked out sections that probably described locations, but I also saw a map that showed where many historical "Rock Art" sites are located. Including that petroglyph on the St. Croix. The most interesting old drawing of some petroglyphs was the ones that are no longer along Dayton’s Bluff. (Carver’s Cave?) It included an anthropomorphic figure that looked just like the Hegman figure.
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02/06/2012 07:57PM |
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02/06/2012 10:02PM |
quote starwatcher:
I'm particularly interested is this pictograph on Darky Lake. One long dragon-like image, and on the right it appears to show the image of someone shooting a gun and a dark image of the lead ball, or I understand a round image could also indicate death. Explorers have been in the region since the 1600's so this still fits the 400 year time element they cite.
starwatcher
"
Starwatcher, I also have always been intrigued by that firearm pictograph on Darkwater. One thought I had is that it could have been painted even before European explorers went through the area. I believe the Ojibwe got firearms through trade channels to the east very early on, and for some time they were probably the most common people bearing arms up around here, not Europeans. I think this is one of the things that allowed the Ojibwe to push the Sioux out of the Quetico-Superior region back then. Just a thought . . .
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02/07/2012 08:17AM |
Tom
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02/02/2012 06:23PM |
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02/02/2012 06:34PM |
Just don't ask me where I went two years ago and what I saw.
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02/02/2012 06:42PM |
quote mocha: "was the author referring to petroglyphs (rock engravings) or pictographs (paintings on rocks). i've never seen a petroglyph in the BW or Quetico but then again i haven't been everywhere."
Pictographs, thanks, I edited the posting
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02/02/2012 06:42PM |
I’ve heard of one petroglyph in the BWCA, but the pictographs were well known before the 1960’s. I haven’t found a book yet older than 1967 that describes them, so I could provide a link to it, but I read portions of one that mentioned them before.
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02/08/2012 07:02PM |
This book was the definitive study of pictographs on the Canadian Shield until research in the late 1990s. I bought it some years ago at the Mn. Hist. Soc. bookshop.
By the way, the petroglyphs on the west side of Canadian Agnes are on a rock about the side of an overstuffed chair, and each separate animal figure (5 in all?) is about the size of your hand.
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02/08/2012 10:18PM |
starwatcher
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02/04/2012 09:32AM |
I've read that there are 49 pictograph sites on 34 lakes or streams in the Boundary Waters and Quetico. I've seen some pictographs that are small, depicting a lone moose, and others with multiple images on prominent granite cliffs. Some are just a smear of red color where the image has worn away with time. If you are ever out in the western U.S., I was amazed at the number of pictographs I saw on the rocks while hiking the trails around the White Tank Mountains, west of Phoenix, AZ. Of course they most likely are better preserved in a dry climate.
I'm particularly interested is this pictograph on Darky Lake. One long dragon-like image, and on the right it appears to show the image of someone shooting a gun and a dark image of the lead ball, or I understand a round image could also indicate death. Explorers have been in the region since the 1600's so this still fits the 400 year time element they cite.
starwatcher
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02/03/2012 08:14AM |
The University of Minnesota has information on the Hegman site too.
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02/03/2012 12:56PM |
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02/03/2012 02:28PM |
Schweady, we too, took the Trease portage "shortcut". Very memorable experience!. Almost as long as the Angleworm portage with a few mudholes; went up to the thighs. I'll always remember my gymnastic move of leaping to a birch tree, hugging the trunk and spinning around to land onto a solid piece of ground. Too bad nobody saw it.
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02/03/2012 03:37PM |
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02/03/2012 07:51AM |
quote Zulu: "Someone told me recently that the Hegman pictographs were repainted by a Native American using the methods and materials he believed the people who created them used. I don't know when this supposedly took place, whether it is true or any other details.
Maybe that is what the book Kowboy was referring to meant and why the Hegman pictographs are so much more vivid than the others."
You know, Zulu, when I saw your Hegman photo on the January 2012 contest page, I thought the pictos looked very sharp and distinct. We went by there in 1997 on our way out from Angleworm (the Trease portage looked like a nice 'shortcut,' compared to going back to the Angleworm entry point - NOT!), but our photographer was out of film (yes, film) and nobody else had a camera. Another of my BWCA regrets. But I remember the paintings as appearing faded almost to the point of disappointing.
For anyone interested in ancient drawings in the BW, I suggest Michael Furtman's Magic on the Rocks.
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02/03/2012 11:59AM |
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02/02/2012 11:59PM |
quote Kowboy: "I've been reading "Crossing Boundary Waters: A Spiritual Journey in Canoe Country", by Andrew Rogness. In this book the author claims that the pictographs were not ancient native american paintings but put there in 1963 by a man named Bird Moccasin trying his hand at the art of his ancestors. I tried googling Bird Moccasin but didn't turn up anything. Have any of you heard this? It is on page 41 if any of you have the book."
Pffffft! I guess I'd read a different book.
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02/03/2012 03:08AM |
There are some petroglyphs on Agnes in the Quetico.
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02/03/2012 07:06AM |
quote snakecharmer: "quote Kowboy: "I've been reading "Crossing Boundary Waters: A Spiritual Journey in Canoe Country", by Andrew Rogness. In this book the author claims that the pictographs were not ancient native american paintings but put there in 1963 by a man named Bird Moccasin trying his hand at the art of his ancestors. I tried googling Bird Moccasin but didn't turn up anything. Have any of you heard this? It is on page 41 if any of you have the book."
The author is mistaken. There are multiple references to the pictos in books and manuscripts prior to 1960, or 1860 for that matter."
....besides the fact that they have been studied by those who would know the difference
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02/03/2012 07:38AM |
Maybe that is what the book Kowboy was referring to meant and why the Hegman pictographs are so much more vivid than the others.
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02/03/2012 06:27AM |
quote Kowboy: "I've been reading "Crossing Boundary Waters: A Spiritual Journey in Canoe Country", by Andrew Rogness. In this book the author claims that the pictographs were not ancient native american paintings but put there in 1963 by a man named Bird Moccasin trying his hand at the art of his ancestors. I tried googling Bird Moccasin but didn't turn up anything. Have any of you heard this? It is on page 41 if any of you have the book."
The author is mistaken. There are multiple references to the pictos in books and manuscripts prior to 1960, or 1860 for that matter.
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02/02/2012 05:55PM |
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02/02/2012 11:24PM |