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Author	Message Text
bumabu	07/06/2012 02:39PM   I have to say nctry's dog is a model for a perfect canoe dog. She tried to get in my solo canoe while "swimming" and she immediately obeyed his command to get back during some chaotic circumstances. Ben and his dog should put on a clinic for canoe dogs and masters. The encounter elevated that trip to a best trip ever for me, thanks again Ben!
IBFLY	06/11/2012 10:56AM   I'll echo a few comments made already. I've done many solo trips but have always paddled one of my tandems - sitting in the bow facing the stern. I'll adjust trim forward and even add some rocks if needed in wind. Yesterday I paddled a solo canoe (wenonah wilderness) for the first time. It felt very different than my tandems and I really had to adjust my paddling technique. I had a hard time getting my j-stroke to bite, my blade kept coming up too high after the power stroke. It didn't help that it was super windy but it did feel a little squirelly. I think I'd want more experience with a solo before I stuffed a dog in there - or, I'd want more boat. Hank's thought of renting a tandem makes some sense.
Bwoods	06/12/2012 01:26AM   I will have to think about it. Everything that has been said makes a lot of sense. I need to rent a tandem if I bring the dog. Or leave the dog and rent a solo boat. Right now I am leaning towards the tandem since I am used to paddling that alone. The problem is that I usually use an aluminum with a some room between the front seat and the thwart behind it. The last boat I rented from my outfitter was a Souris and the thwart was right behind the seat, in the picture I can find of the Northwind and Minn II (my other options) the thwart looks the same. Anyone with experience soloing any of these options?
Zulu	06/12/2012 07:17AM   The thwart behind the front seat on an SR17 is removable with a flathead screwdriver and 3/8" wrench to allow you to paddle it backwards. The thwart on an SR Q16 may also be removable. It works well for me.
georgiaphisherman	06/12/2012 08:34AM   On my first solo, I rented a SR16 (solo version) from Jordan's, which is essentially a tandem set up for solo use. The SR16 is super stable, can haul a lot of gear (and a dog), but I found it to be tough to handle in the wind. If I were considering soloing with my dog, I would definitely rent the SR 16 again. However, if the dog were to stay at home, I would only rent the SR 16 again if my main focus of the trip was on fishing, due to the stability of the boat.
Bwoods	06/03/2012 08:15PM   Suncatcher - I will look into the Bell's for the future when I purchase my own solo boat, for now I am going to stick with my friends at Jordan's outfitters. Yellowcanoe - That is exactly the kind of advice I am looking for. I may have to just leave the dog at home for my first solo and then figure out if it will work for me on future solos. With both boats being so trim sensitive is it going to be tough for me at 300 lbs with about 40 lbs of gear and food?
Hank	06/04/2012 04:16PM   I'd probably rent a 16' tandem and paddle it backwards. You have a good sized dog. You would have plenty of space in a tandem and the dog would act as ballast if the wind was up. Most of the solo boats that I've been it are too tender for me to be comfortable with a big dog. Perhaps that is because my 85 lb pooch is a complete spaz in a boat! Regardless, have fun and I'm glad you are going in August where a capsize isn't such a big deal.
ducks	12/04/2012 05:54PM   Thanks for the info. I thought maybe my eyes were broken and I was missing it on the website :) I know of a couple Gunflint Outfitters that help each other out like that. Every story I've heard about Mark have said "class act" all the way.
HansSolo	01/12/2013 11:37AM   Wow TomT, I'm impressed! Good eye for the Patagonia Capilene identification. This is one of the things I love about this site, how many people would know that other than those that partake in similar activities. Like you, I still have that shirt, although it has a rather large hole worn through the elbow. I also cannot throw it away for much the same reason you describe. Hans
HansSolo	01/12/2013 01:39AM   First time on a solo trip, in a new, unfamiliar solo canoe,and a dog? I've got to agree with "mooseplums"; it's probably best to leave the dog at home if you're intent on renting a solo canoe to do your first solo trip adventure. I can't speak for the SR Tranquility, but the Wenonah Encounter is more than capable of taking you, your gear, AND your dog, provided you're familiar with the idiosyncrasies of the canoe. That being said, I don't know if it would be prudent the first time around. During the 80's, my primary Solo "Tripping" canoe was a "Sawyer DY Special", (black & white photo below). This canoe has been out of production for many years, but probably the closest comparison I could make to a current solo canoe would be the Sawyer "Shock Wave", now produced by Superior canoe or the Wenonah Advantage. During the time the "DY" was my "Solo Tripper", I took it on just about every type of water imaginable, with the exception of technical whitewater and the Great Lakes. My 55 pound English Setter often accompanied me on many solo trips throughout the decade. I also did numerous solo trips in the BWCAW and Quetico with the "DY" and "Lady", (the English Setter). Despite the "DY Special's" low profile, it was an amazingly seaworthy solo canoe even in "big water". I've paddled the likes of "Big Sag" with large whitecaps, Cache Bay with large following seas, and several other large lakes and rivers in the DY with a week's worth of gear and "Lady", as pictured below . BTW, English Setters are not nearly as hyper as the Irish Setters, but they don't exactly sit still either. This is especially true if any water fowl is in the vicinity. After the passing of "Lady" in 1990, I switched to using a Wenonah Jensen C1W as my Solo Tripper for most of the 1990's. I took a break from being a dog owner for a few years. (From 1987 to 1996 my wife and I had three great kids, which was enough work without training any new dogs.) Anyone that's familiar with the Jensen C1W can tell you that it can be a very "tender" boat and even more sensitive to weight and proper trim than other swedeform hulls. Definitely NOT the best solo canoe for tripping with a dog, but the Wenonah Encounter and the Wenonah Voyager were not available at the time I purchased my Wenonah Jensen C1W. The Wenonah Jensen C1W was the best solo boat for my intended purposes at that time IMHO. (The Jensen C1W & me pictured below at Wood/Siskiwit Lake, Isle Royale National Park.) Yeah I know, the Patagonia "Baggie Lite" shorts are ridiculous, but it was 1995 and the shorts were from the 80's! The C1W, which I still own, is a great boat, seaworthy, fast, able to travel with large loads, and it turns much better than the Sawyer "DY Special. Aside from solo tripping in Quetico-Superior country with the C1W", I've tripped with it on many of the Ozark Rivers, (i.e., the Current, Jacks Forks, and the Eleven Point Rivers), as well as many trips on the Lower Wisconsin River, Kickapoo River, Namekagon and St. Croix rivers, just to name a few. In another post, "yellowcanoe" mentioned how Wenonah canoes are very capable of handling insane big water conditions, including Lake Superior, which I can attest to. I did several solo trips on Isle Royale, which aside from paddling the interior lakes, it also involved paddling long stretches of Isle Royale's coastline on Lake Superior. When thinking back on those trips, I really "pushed the envelope" on several occasions, but the C1W handled it with aplomb. About 1995 I once again had another dog, an eventul 65 pound Golden Retriever named "Bailey", (pictured on the sandbar with the Wenonah Voyager in the background). Although I still used my C1W, I decided I needed a more "Dog friendly" Solo Tripper, but with the volume of the Jensen C1W. Although I still owned a DY Special, I became accustomed to the volume of the C1W. In 2004, I ordered a Kevlar Flex-Core Wenonah Voyager @ Canoecopia and it's been my Quetico-Superior and "big river" tripping solo ever since. I now have a 4 1/2 year "Golden" named "Buddy", that weighs in at almost 90 pounds, but the Voyager handles him, my gear, and my 6' 4", 219 pound frame with ease, albeit that's a lot of weight when you put it all together. A Wenonah Encounter would probably be a little better suited for that type of load, but I think I'd be "splitting hairs" by moving to an Encounter. Besides, I really love the Voyager. Although I also own several tandems, none are very suitable for soloing. Even if they were "solo capable", I wouldn't do it anyway. I just like "dedicated" solo canoes, but that's me. (After all, I am "Hans Solo"!) :-) I don't claim to be a Bill Mason or Ev Crozier, but I've spent enough time in canoes, especially big, long solos, to feel comfortable and secure with my paddling abilities and capable of handling various types of water conditions with gear and a dog. But I don't know if I could make that claim the first time I "soloed", despite canoeing since I was 9-years old. Just my two cents worth. Hans Solo
yellowcanoe	06/11/2012 11:17AM   It takes time to adjust psychologically. "Air J's" can be cured by bringing the bottom hand up. Many tandem people paddle with the bottom hand just above the blade. That is too low for a dedicated solo and will tend to pull you over the side.
IBFLY	06/11/2012 12:27PM   quote yellowcanoe: "It takes time to adjust psychologically. "Air J's" can be cured by bringing the bottom hand up. Many tandem people paddle with the bottom hand just above the blade. That is too low for a dedicated solo and will tend to pull you over the side. " I found that out on Sunday! My bottom hand was too low and the blade kept coming out of the water. I ended up rolling the canoe. Talk about humbling! It will be some adjustment for this 50+ body to make but I guess it's back to school.
nctry	12/02/2012 04:54PM   quote bumabu: "I have to say nctry's dog is a model for a perfect canoe dog. She tried to get in my solo canoe while "swimming" and she immediately obeyed his command to get back during some chaotic circumstances. Ben and his dog should put on a clinic for canoe dogs and masters. The encounter elevated that trip to a best trip ever for me, thanks again Ben!" Never read your comments Bud. Thanks... That was a memorable trip for me too. What a year!
ducks	12/02/2012 04:37PM   Hey Bwoods.... what did you end up deciding to do and how did it go?
Bwoods	12/03/2012 10:13PM   I rented a Souris 16 footer and left the dog at home. Went out on Mudro with a restricted permit. I did a 4 day loop and loved every minute of it. Had a tough last day when I missed a turn on the portage coming out of Sandpit. I turned one medium length portage into 3 tough short portages. I was hurting at the end of the last day. I had to double portage but my loads weren't all that heavy. I had very warm weather it got into the mid to upper 80's on one of the days. It was nice being alone so I could be comfy walking around in my boxers at the campsite. My hammock was great and after getting over the initial heebie jeebies at night I slept well. I was worried about getting spooked at night and it was much of an issue for me. I kept reminding myself that I had nothing to worry about and I was fine. I loved the boat. It was plenty fast enough for me and responded well to my beginners level of solo paddling skills. I will be soloing again in the future, not going to let the lack of a partner stop me from going up north. I will keep thinking about a way to make it work with me and the dog on a solo. I tried hammocking with him a few weeks ago and he did well tied up under my hammock. He was a little confused that I wasn't putting him inside a tent but he eventually relaxed and went to sleep. I think he would adjust quickly on a multi day trip. Still not sure where he would fit in a solo boat.
Bwoods	12/04/2012 09:51AM   Mark at Jordan's doesn't have a rental solo boat. He, as always, went out of his way to make it easy for me and he picked one up from another outfitter. He didn't even charge me extra for doing that. I go through him for all my trips, I think he just wanted to make sure I didn't fall for another outfitter in town. I paid $35 per day for the boat.
Bwoods	05/31/2012 11:26PM   I am doing my first solo in August and considering bringing my dog. My outfitter said he could get me a Wenonah or a a Souris solo boat. I am guessing he means an Encounter or a Tranquility. I am a big guy at about 300 lbs, and my dog weighs about 60 lbs. He is very well behaved in a boat but he needs a disant amount of space to be comfortable in the boat. I will have one large portage pack and a small daypack in addition to me and the dog. What would be the best fit for me with and without my dog? I want good secondary stability and enough leg room to keep mt legs from falling asleep.
yellowcanoe	06/12/2012 10:03AM   There are other dog issues..probably you have thought about them. One is controlling the dog on portages. I do not keep mine on a leash for my safety. I don't know how BWCA dog trippers manage their on crowded portages. The other is dog behavior in camp. Mine tends to explore and has gotten acquainted with other wildlife like porcupines. There isn't a handy vet so you might take a leatherman with needle nosed pliers. And the fun of camping in rain with wet dog. Maybe towel will be needed and extra space in the tent. I had pretty good luck two months ago in three days of rain. She had a raincoat and a Canine Floatation Device..mostly to stay warm in the boat. The dog isnt moving around much. She went under and stayed under the tarp in the rain at camp
ducks	12/04/2012 06:51AM   Glad to hear that you had a good trip! and thanks for the report on how it went. I'm working on possibly doing my first solo next summer and like you were, I'm on the fence about bringing my dog along. How much was the SR Q16 per day at Jordan's? I can't find that canoe listed on their outfitting page. Good luck w/ solo #2 and if you bring the dog next time I'm anxious to hear how it goes.
nctry	12/04/2012 07:43PM   My son with my Old Town Pathfinder with his dog. This was the worst I saw him trim the canoe. I used that canoe for a lot of years solo and paddling from the stern and dog at my feet. We found the Kayak paddle to be extremely faster in this situation.
butthead	07/06/2012 08:19PM   Not my dog, but Baxter is welcome on any trip I go on! His normal place is sniffing out the front, and is well behaved even when PJ is out on his own. butthead
SunCatcher	06/02/2012 06:36PM   I cannot comment on those two models. I have a Bell RockStar in Kevlight, and it would have plenty opf room. I had a 65 lb lab and I on a 7 day solo and plenty of room. I think you could check but I think SawTooth Outfitters may still rent some of those? Other folks may have a better idea of the boats you mentioned. SunCatcher
yellowcanoe	06/02/2012 07:57PM   Other questions.. does your dog lie down when the bottom of the boat is wet? Mine doesn't. If you have a swedeform boat, which both rentals you are considering are, they are extremely trim sensitive. You might not be able to control the boat at all. Most weight needs to be in back of you. Significant weight in the front will hamper steering unless you are in a headwind. The Tranquility is a hard turner. Adding all that weight is not going to help you maneuver. I am a big fan of my dog. However she needs to be home when I solo.
yellowcanoe	06/03/2012 10:34PM   No..you are in the middle..Theoretically it should be possible for dog to be in the stern and pack ahead as it is lighter than dog. But is your dog stationary and lacking the ability to see what is going on back there are you comfy with switches in weight as he adjusts now and then? I am not..and my dog wants to be in front of me.. So in order to do that I have to have a really big solo..like the Swift Raven and throw all my gear in the back (its about dog weight) and her in the front. Then I can't get to my gear...oh well. I prefer smaller solos so that kind of nixes the dog. Which is actually fine with me. There isn't room for her in my solo tent..especially when she is wet.
mooseplums	06/04/2012 06:36AM   if this is the first time you go solo, I would leave the dog home until you yourself are comfortable, and used to soloing. Solo canoes have a different feel than a tandem has. They can be a bit squirrelly at first, and I personally would want to get used to the boat, before I put a dog in it.
TomT	01/12/2013 07:10AM   Hans, that blue longsleeved patagonia capilene shirt you're wearing in the last picture - I still wear one of those from time to time. I recognize it from the colors of the botton top. Mine's from the 80's and now has a "moth hole" near the cuff. It's getting real thin but there's so much history in it I can't bear to throw it away. Carry on.
nctry	06/30/2012 04:41PM   Just got back from 26 days with my dog Bernice in my Encounter. My biggest problem is being able to go out and fish on windy days with her. Without the load in the back I have a terrible time going with the wind. I tried to put her in back once and it scared the living $#it out of me when she moved. I paddled in some nasty down pours with her on this last trip and she was awesome... handled everything well. She had two packs and we had a resupply in the middle flown in with new canoeing partner. (He paddled solo too). My dog will be with on my 40 day adventure this fall... She's a keeper!
Bwoods	06/14/2012 11:28PM   I have slept in the same tent with him after he has gotten wet in the river and from the rain. It makes for a stinky tent but he sleeps on a towel and tends to keep his mess to one part of the tent. My plan for portages was to keep him on a leash as a courtesy to other people on the same portage. He is a very friendly dog and always has a stick in his mouth ready to play fetch. Someone with a boat on their back may not appreciate his offer. I am planning on attaching his leash to my waist, I will practice this around my house with a boat to make sure he is comfortable with it. He is unlikely to run and chase animals since he is around a wide variety of critters around my house constantly. That is good news about the SR canoe thwarts, I hadn't checked that option out. I am still unsure of what I want to do. At least I can make the choice with a lot more information now.