Boundary Waters Quetico Forum :: Gear Forum :: Bear barrels
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mc2mens |
Zulu: "I always think of kanoes when I use the washer to open the BearKeg. I really miss him and his opinions in the Gear Forum on this site." I probably learned more about BWCA tripping gear from him than anyone else here. |
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schweady |
I've listed Bear Vault and Ursack info, also, but don't believe the men's group would go to either of those systems... more as a way to explore what direction my wife and I could go, having enjoyed using a BV500 but finding it serviceable but *barely* adequate for our latest 3-night trip. This summer, we may get involved with a "group couples" trip, along the lines of kanoes' "group solo" arrangement, and each couple may be encouraged to go the BV/Ursack/dehydrated route. Also, I know that the aluminum liner might not be seen as needed in the Ursack, but wanted to get the info in here. (It more than doubles the weight; anybody here found this metal liner useful?) Anyway, glean whatever info you will from this and offer suggestions to add/edit. |
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MReid |
schweady: Also, I know that the aluminum liner might not be seen as needed in the Ursack, but wanted to get the info in here. (More than doubles the weight; anybody here found this add useful?) The aluminum liners are to keep bears from crushing the contents. Without them, the bears may not be able to get to the food (and thus helping to prevent food-conditioning), but they can play havoc with anything inside the bag. Personally, the Bear Vault is my staple (ex-Alaskan), and the Ursack is used for overflow. I just treat the Ursack as a bear bag, and hang it, or at least tie it to a tree. An unsecured Ursack won't stick around very long if a bear finds it. |
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Kendis |
Do any of you own and/or have used the Counter Assault or BearVault containers on trips to the BW? I would post links to these items but bwca.com is preventing me from doing so. I am looking for a container that can hold enough food for two people for a five-day, four-night trip plus one extra day of food as a backup. |
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hooky |
butthead: "TipsyPaddler: "hooky: "I've gone to a pantry style system to further cut down on packaging bulk." butthead is the reason I'm a pantry guy now. |
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Zulu |
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OldFingers57 |
ockycamper: "I have never heard of a bear getting into a Bearvault. Or even dragging one off. Ursack can be dragged off. Yes there was a bear that figured out how to get int a bear vault. The bear is now dead. As for bear vaults getting carried off, yes this has happened when in a pack or sone people have tied a rope or something to it and it thus gives the bear something to grab onto with its teeth and carry off. I’ve heard about this on some backpacking sites. |
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Zulu |
I use the BearVaults for backpacking out west. They work well. I will probably get a Bearikade for my JMT attempt when weight will be a factor. I added the bear sticker to cover up the warning about building a fire on it or using it to store deet. I use a credit card sliver placed between the tabs on the BearVaults to make opening them easier especially when it’s cold. I also added a washer to the BearKeg to make opening it more convenient. The late BWCA. com member kanoes taught me that. I think he upgraded to a Garcia though and posted his weight to volume reasoning. He believed in bear containers after one got the “nectar” out of his pack. |
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Zulu |
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ockycamper |
We stopped hanging and went to bearvaults years ago. We cook big breakfasts and dinners. Typically we use one BearVault 500 per day for a group of 6-7 men. We have also found that you can put 4 bearvaults into a Boundary Bag pack and carry them through 4 at a time. Best part is you can see what's inside, and can use them as chairs. As they empty out, they become trash containers to pack out. |
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LindenTree3 |
I also have a Ursack when I want to go lighter. If you pack dehydrated foods a BV 450 or 500 one, not both, plus a Ursack should get you by easily on your trip. By getting both you have options in the future. If you are worried about something getting into your Ursack, keep the food items that you can live without in there like snacks and such, and keep the survival food in your Bearvault. |
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houseofspam |
Zulu: " I also added a washer to the BearKeg to make opening it more convenient. The late BWCA. com member kanoes taught me that. I think he upgraded to a Garcia though and posted his weight to volume reasoning. He believed in bear containers after one got the “nectar” out of his pack." I did something similar using a rare earth magnet out of an old hard drive. It's glued to the inside of the lid on my Garcia barrel. Now anything magnetic sticks to the outside of the lid. That's a 2 pence coin I'm currently using. Inside the lid: 2 Pence vs gravity: Another shot: |
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yellowcanoe |
Bear Vault the company worked closely with the ADK DEC Rangers to find out exactly why the vault was compromised and to improve the design Its certainly understandable that unless you camp in the Eastern High Peaks of the Adirondacks you would not have heard of the "bear break ins" |
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ockycamper |
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andym |
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schweady |
TipsyPaddler: "hooky: "I've gone to a pantry style system to further cut down on packaging bulk." Bringing your goods in bulk and using a measure here and a portion there for each meal. Rather than a single package dedicated to producing each single meal. |
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butthead |
TipsyPaddler: "hooky: "I've gone to a pantry style system to further cut down on packaging bulk." schweady explained it well. Here is a thread with discussion of Pantry Style, thinking about meal planning butthead |
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TipsyPaddler |
hooky: "I've gone to a pantry style system to further cut down on packaging bulk." Sounds interesting...what’s pantry style? |
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TipsyPaddler |
Northwoodsman: "Another note on the Bear Vaults. They make a good wilderness washing machine. Add article of clothing, water and a drop of soap and agitate and let soak. Appropriately dispose of water. Add clean water and repeat to rinse. Also makes a wash basin for dishes." Great idea! I love this forum. |
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FOG51 |
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mschi772 |
Garcia and Counter Assault are very similar and quite effective. Bearikades by Wild Ideas are tremendous. They're expensive to buy, but if you have only the rare special need for something, they come in the widest array of sizes and can be rented quite affordably. There is also the Ursack for your consideration especially if lighter weight appeals to you and crushability isn't as much of a concern. Judging what you need to supply X number of people for Y number of days depends greatly on what and how you are planning to eat. |
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yellowcanoe |
MReid: "mschi772: "Depending on where you are going, BearVaults are potentially compromised having been defeated by some Adirondack bear Actually it was not a fluke at all. Yellow Yellow taught her cubs how to break into BV's also. That was several years ago and since then Bear Vault has been improving the design with the help of ADK users. |
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SevenofNine |
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MReid |
yellowcanoe: I'd posit that one bear figuring it out (and if I remember it was an "experienced" bear) is pretty much a fluke. Her teaching the kids is interesting, but not that unexpected. If I remember right, this was over ten years ago (I think I have one of the older Bear Vaults). Regardless, the catch has been modified, and so shouldn't happen again. For thoroughly tested and approved cannisters, see Interagency Grizzly Bear Committee Approved Cannisters. |
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TominMpls |
One note about Bear Vaults, try out the ones you're buying before you buy if possible - One of my BV500s is substantially harder to open than the other two. I can't really figure out why, but it's true enough that we tend to shift food around mid-trip to make sure we're only regularly opening the ones that are easy to open. |
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MReid |
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boonie |
schweady: "boonie: "I use an OPsack with the Ursack for additional moisture protection and odor containment. " Yes, 12X20 - it's the one on the Ursack site |
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schweady |
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GraniteCliffs |
Thankfully, no Adirondack bears in the BW or Q! |
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hooky |
As others have said, 2 people's food for 5 days/4 nights would be doable in a BV500 if you're using dehydrated food and it's not in bulky packaging. After seeing a few people on here use it, I've gone to a pantry style system to further cut down on packaging bulk. |
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Northwoodsman |
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bwcasolo |
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arm2008 |
mschi772: "Depending on where you are going, BearVaults are potentially compromised having been defeated by some Adirondack bears in t" One. And she died. Really, she has gone to the big campground in the sky. |
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houseofspam |
1 - Anything heavy or smelly goes in the Garcia barrel. I leave it in an obvious location and hope the bear finds it first and moves on. Like other people, I really only worry about it getting rolled into the lake. 2 - All the dehydrated or vacuum sealed stuff goes in a sack that I hang. This isn't very heavy, so I don't need a big tree branch. It's green so it blends in and I hide it a bit by picking a tree distant from camp or in an otherwise awkward location. I'm not convinced a bear would eat a dehydrated meal if you left it on the fire grate. |
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MReid |
mschi772: "Depending on where you are going, BearVaults are potentially compromised having been defeated by some Adirondack bear That was pretty much a fluke, and the design has been changed since then. I've used Garcias and BV, and much prefer the design of the BV (easier to load, easier to open, and easier to sit on). |
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Northwoodsman |
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schweady |
I will say that, even with the usual lightweight food items, it was quite a challenge to fit all of it into the vault. We ate well enough and if need be, we would be fine going in again with just the one BV500 (700 cu in), but I am tempted to add an Ursack (650 cu in). Do folks using these trust them as-is, or do you also use OPSak bags or some other odor-barrier inside the Ursack? |
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boonie |
I use an OPsack with the Ursack for additional moisture protection and odor containment. |
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mc2mens |
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schweady |
boonie: "I use an OPsack with the Ursack for additional moisture protection and odor containment. " Thanks, boonie. I see 4 different sizes of Opsak... 7x7, 9x10, 12x20, 20x28. Is it the 12x20 that has worked best for you? (assuming the standard size Ursack at ~ 8x14) |
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boonie |
As mschi said, a lot depends on what and how much you are going to eat. A typical day's food for me would weigh 18-20 ounces and provide +/- 2,300 calories. I don't carry an extra day of food on short trips (it takes a while to starve to death:). It took me a while to get it worked down to just what I eat, but I no longer carry twice as much as I need. I won't go into greater detail here since there have been numerous posts on the topic. If you want more detail, just let me know and I'll email you and answer any questions I can. If you can't get it all in one BV500, your options would be to get another one, maybe the smaller one, or just get two smaller ones maybe. I can get at least as much in the Ursack and I think they now make a larger one, so that might be an option. Or you might keep the extra, maybe the first night's dinner, in a stuff sack. I have done trips where we hung an extra day or two of food in a small stuff sack, which is a lot easier than hanging a big heavy pack. You could use some cardboard and tape to make a dummy barrel with the same dimensions to get an idea of the size, especially if you can't conveniently get somewhere to actually hold one. If you search through the site, especially if you join the solo tripping forum, you'll find some threads about it with some alternate methods of doing it. |
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Northwoodsman |
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