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krick
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11/13/2017 04:06PM
OK, I've been to the BWCA with basically the same guys over a dozen times. We base camp and fish all day. This upcoming year, due to my son's HS baseball team possibly (hopefully) making a deep run in the state tourney, I have to plan on possibly NOT going since we're locked into the 2nd week of June. For this reason, I'm going to go solo since I can't commit to a partner 100%. (my group will have 6 or 7)
Having said all that, I have some specific questions about going solo:
1. Should I bring my kayak paddle or use the outfitters canoe paddle?
2. I'm still camping with my group, so I don't think I'll go stir crazy, but I'm used to fishing with a friend. I'm a little concerned about fishing alone all week - from a boredom perspective, - conversation, catching fish etc. Any thoughts on this??
3. Will the canoe be less stable? (am I at an increased risk of tipping over?)
4. Is getting in and out of the canoe harder? (while keeping my feet dry)
5. I'm assuming even though 1 person is lighter than 2, my canoe will be slower which is OK, but am I correct?

I think from a fishing perspective there will be some advantages. I'm usually in the back of the boat, so I'll finally get first shot and good areas LOL.
Positioning the boat for 1 fisherman will be a easier I'm sure. I get to go where I want when I want and fish how I want etc.
Any thoughts, input, or advice would be appreciated!
 
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11/13/2017 05:45PM
(1) Bring your kayak paddle and take the outfitters paddle. Good to have both for different uses and you'll have a spare - strap it in the canoe to the thwarts. You may do better traveling with the double and better fishing with the single. Try them both.

(2) So you're just paddling a solo canoe, but not taking a solo trip. I do solo trips and being alone for a week or two is not a problem for me. Nobody else can tell you how it will be for you; you'll find out. At any rate, it will only be a short term situation for you, so not a big problem.

(3) It will probably feel that way initially, but they usually have very good secondary stability and can be leaned nearly to the gunwales as long as you keep yourself vertical and between them, even if the initial stability feels less. Solo canoes are narrower, sometimes with a more rounded bottom. The key is to hold both gunwales, step on the center line of the canoe, keep your weight low and centered and get your butt on the seat.

(4) Maybe, but see #3.

(5) Maybe, probably - depends on a lot of factors. Using the kayak paddle may help you there.
11/13/2017 05:57PM
quote krick: ""
I have done this and will offer my 2 cents.

1. Should I bring my kayak paddle or use the outfitters canoe paddle? If you've not soloed before, bring both and determine which suits you best. If renting, I recommend you choose either a Northstar Magic or Northwind Solo. Both are stable platforms for fishing.

2. I'm still camping with my group, so I don't think I'll go stir crazy, but I'm used to fishing with a friend. I'm a little concerned about fishing alone all week - from a boredom perspective, - conversation, catching fish etc. Any thoughts on this?? Fishing alone has its advantages as does following your buddies. I did both and going alone was nice as it gave me solitude and the benefit of exploring the lake. But when a hot spot is discovered, stick with your bros.

3. Will the canoe be less stable? (am I at an increased risk of tipping over?)The canoes I suggested are stable. I own a Northwind solo and am very happy with its stability when unloaded.

4. Is getting in and out of the canoe harder? (while keeping my feet dry) Yes, getting in and out is a bit tricky. You HAVE to get in the water but not too deep. Choose a shallow spot with firm footing, and with hands on both gunnels place one foot mid-hull and sit down and pull yur second foot in.

5. I'm assuming even though 1 person is lighter than 2, my canoe will be slower which is OK, but am I correct? Not really. A good solo is built for speed. You may have to paddle a tad bit faster, but you will keep up.

I think from a fishing perspective there will be some advantages. I'm usually in the back of the boat, so I'll finally get first shot and good areas LOL. Yes.

Positioning the boat for 1 fisherman will be a easier I'm sure. I get to go where I want when I want and fish how I want etc. Yes.

Go for it and have a great trip.
mastertangler
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11/13/2017 07:45PM
I generally prefer fishing alone as I don't have to get aggravated with a noisy partner.

I much prefer a single blade.

The little boats can take some rough water while under power but stop to fish or reel a fish in while trolling and things get uncomfortable very quickly in snotty water.

Generally speaking you will likely have to wet foot it. Make certain your vessel is not hung up on a rock unawares as you attempt to get in. When it releases the lurch can deposit you into the water very quickly. I do not consider myself clumsy and yet I have rolled my boat 3 times, twice at portage landings. Once being hung on a rounded rock and again on the same lake the following year while describing the previous years capsize to a friend with one foot in the boat and the other in the water........the boat slowly drifted away while we chatted and over I went once again (you can't make it up). Now when I get to that lake the agreement is to just dive in and get it over with. The third capsize was the result of being sideways to a big fish and breaking off with 25lb test.

So yes, best be careful and be brave in rougher water while close to shore.
martoonie
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11/13/2017 11:02PM
Boat control turns into a pain when fishing solo. The wind messes with you more. By time you get positioned and make a cast your get blown off the spot and you do a lot of odd ball retrieves. You get more snags and recovering them is more difficult. Bring some dry bags to fill with water for ballast and your food pack to weigh down the canoe. You can get much more actual fishing done with two in a canoe. All that said it is pretty cool to go one on one with the fishes.
bobbernumber3
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11/14/2017 06:07AM
quote martoonie: "Boat control turns into a pain when fishing solo. The wind messes with you more. By time you get positioned and make a cast your get blown off the spot and you do a lot of odd ball retrieves. You get more snags and recovering them is more difficult. Bring some dry bags to fill with water for ballast and your food pack to weigh down the canoe. You can get much more actual fishing done with two in a canoe. All that said it is pretty cool to go one on one with the fishes."

Yes. You make a lot of good points here. Wind really can be a problem. Sit on the front seat facing back and use rocks to ballast will help a lot.
mastertangler
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11/14/2017 06:42AM
Oh boy, here I go again disagreeing. In the highly acclaimed book "How to win friends and influence people" a big no-no was telling folk they are wrong. However, I prefer my mentors (Dennis Prager) philosophy of "clarity over agreement".

I have found the little boats to be less effected by wind. Which of course makes sense since there is less surface area to be effected. Bear that in mind as you decide what sort of packs to load. Everything above the gunnels will catch wind.

Where I will agree with the previous posters is there is no one else to keep you on a spot. Having said that I seldom have a 10x10 rock pile nailed down and generally fish contour lines or the entire reef. I am not so keen on using drift socks or anchors with my solo either. If it's windy enough to require them it's to windy for me in a solo (tandem is another story).

Have a trolling rod handy, drift your shoreline or reef jigging or casting and then troll your way back, rinse and repeat. Fish caught trolling may reveal valuable clues. Naturally I recommend a rod holder.......a clamp on Tite Lock is what you want for a rental boat. Bring a small (tiny) block of wood to use as a backing of sorts to clamp to. Don't lose the little block of wood.
billconner
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11/14/2017 06:47AM
As I'm quite new to solo canoes, a trip in 2012 and my second one this past spring, my thoughts. First trip I had my paddle and outfitters yak paddle. Hated the yak. Before this springs trip I bought a yak paddle. Never used the straight paddle, in love with my yak paddle. Rented a SR Tranquility fir first trip and then bought a used one. I found it more stable than other popular models, but my balance is not great. I'm also 6-2, 220 pounds. I think solos being narrower must be tippier but I have not flipped or dunked in a solo. I learned to get in without worry but always wet feet. I can't imagine a dry foot solo trip, but maybe it is possible. I don't notice much speed difference but I'm not in a hurry mode when canoeing. (On my second trip I was with someone in a Prism and could easily outpace them.)

I don't fish so can't help with that. First trip alone and second with another solo - I think I prefer with people but I didn't mind being alone. I'll probably do both in the future.
Northwoodsman
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11/14/2017 07:48AM
If you don't want to wet foot I highly recommend a pair of Chota Hippies.
11/14/2017 08:01AM
Regardless of what paddle you bring. You always want 2 paddles in a solo canoe. A Kayak paddle is nice to have going into the wind or crossing a big lake. The down side is you tend to get more water dripping into the canoe and on you from the paddle. Doe to length It's a little awkward placing the kayak paddle into the canoe before you get in. Plan on wet footing. Many campsite and portage landings are not very solo canoe friendly. Keep a bowline handy. Sometimes you need to hold on to it while getting in and out of your canoe. This prevents an unwanted swim to retrieve your canoe while it floats away.
Kraut88
Guest Paddler
 
11/14/2017 04:03PM
I went solo this year in a Min II and used the yak paddle, which worked our very well for me, especially in windy conditions when crossing bigger lakes. as others have noted I would recommend taking a canoe paddle with me and tie it to the boat just in case. water drip in the boat is the one negative I found and you might also want to consider the length of the paddle. my regular 220cm yak paddle would touch the sides of the Min II, so I bought me a 260cm paddle, which worked just fine, but then again you might not have that issue if you go with a solo canoe. just something to think about...
QueticoMike
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11/14/2017 05:43PM
Get an ultra-pod ( Google it if you don't know what it is ). Strap to the front of the canoe with a digital camera that has a timer and auto focus. This way you can takes pics of those big fish you catch. Also comes in handy for pics around camp. Sitting next to the fire, filleting fish, cooking, cutting wood, setting up camp, sitting on a granite front porch looking at the sunset...etc.


11/14/2017 06:10PM
Also, when you find fish drop an anchor and fish the area thoroughly. Do not try to anchor or fish in high wind conditions, whether solo or tandem. Either fish from shore or find a spot in the leeward. However, windward shores sometimes provide great fishing, but when in a canoe, it might be dangerous. When things seem perilous, smart paddlers head for shore.
billconner
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11/14/2017 06:38PM
I was warned about water in canoe from the yak paddle but I experienced very little. Bending Branches Slice Solo. Pleasant surprise.
AmarilloJim
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11/15/2017 07:15AM
+1
Get the 280 for canoe use and make sure to properly place the drip rings.
I almost exclusively use my yak paddle now when soloing(still have a paddle also for back up).
I do a lot of deep vertical jigging and have found the yak paddle superior to sculling with a single blade. I point the stern into the wind and occasionally paddle back wards. I just leave the yak paddle resting in my lap while jigging or landing fish.
I love my Magic for tripping but not so crazy about it for fishing. A little to tippy for my liking when stationary. Have a SRQ 16 for fishing and love it.
mapsguy1955
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11/16/2017 10:03AM
Used the SR Tranquility this year and found it too tippy for fishing when empty, so did little fishing in two weeks. For speed and traveling though, it was good, though tough to turn in a wind. I will try it again next year and will put some rocks in front and back for ballast. Maybe then the fishing will be ok!

I brought a Bending Branches yak paddle for a backup and my ZRE bent shaft paddle. Never used the the yak paddle but will bring it again next time for backup. The ZRE is so light and quick it makes switching sides no sweat at all. Did I say this canoe is fast?
AmarilloJim
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11/16/2017 10:36AM
I think the longer YAK paddles make it easier to turn as well.
martoonie
member (34)member
 
11/16/2017 06:26PM
Do not use rocks for ballast.
If you take on water the rocks will sink the canoe. The air chambers are designed to keep an unloaded canoe afloat. Use dry bags filled with water. If you take on water the dry bags of water will be weightless once submerged, and will float, since you will most likely have some air in them as well.
11/17/2017 12:45AM
My thoughts on the yak paddle are, take one along on your first trip and try it out. I use a 260cm Bending Branches and have very little drips in my canoe. I can get a full mile per hour more speed when useing the yak paddle, but about 2 hours of steady paddeling is all my shoulders will take, useing the yak paddle I can keep up with most tandems for awhile. I did take my yak paddle on my fall solo and found my shoulders simply won't take it on that trip, my shoulders are getting in tough shape. I never have to add ballast to the front of my canoe, it has a sliding seat and that works to simply slide the seat way forward to make the bow behave, but I would never use rocks in the front end use the waterproof bag,no scratches in the canoe. FRED
mapsguy1955
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11/17/2017 09:47AM
quote martoonie: "Do not use rocks for ballast.
If you take on water the rocks will sink the canoe. The air chambers are designed to keep an unloaded canoe afloat. Use dry bags filled with water. If you take on water the dry bags of water will be weightless once submerged, and will float, since you will most likely have some air in them as well."


That makes sense.. Lots of people told me they use rocks but your logic is much better!!
11/18/2017 08:37AM
I never understood the rocks as ballast thing. It's impractical when on the move in the BW.Also I know some canoes behave differently when unloaded, but not so bad that you have to add rocks to your canoe. Have 2 packs to trim your boat if you don't have a sliding seat. And like mentioned it can be dangerous.
mastertangler
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11/19/2017 06:17AM
Despite many others suggesting they notice little difference wether loaded or unloaded I feel a substantial difference with my Bell Merlin. In the past I have used a sack of sorts meant specifically for grocery shopping (able to span a cart). Into the sack I would use rocks........the strurdy handle making for a much better lift and from a higher starting point.

Perhaps I need to rethink this? During a capsize wouldn't the rocks merely sink to the bottom independent of the boat?
11/19/2017 07:43AM
When I first started paddling my Magic I did use a variety of ballast, including rocks a couple times as that is what was available. As I got used to the boat I reduced the ballast and now use nothing for local paddling. I do feel more stable with some ballast, but don't need it now.

I also use a yak paddle and would not recommend the one I use. The 240 Corryvreckan by Werner is a huge blade and hauls water so getting wet is part of my tripping. I am able to remain fairly dry with care, but a smaller blade and longer handle would definitely reduce water carry into the boat. The benefits of the larger blade, mostly more torque when I bear down, are undercut with increased fatigue and being wetter. Go smaller and longer.

But since wet footing is a given in a carbon/kevlar boat a little wet foot while paddling is not such a big deal. I wear gaiters until really cold then hippies.
billconner
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11/19/2017 09:28AM
quote mastertangler: "Despite many others suggesting they notice little difference wether loaded or unloaded I feel a substantial difference with my Bell Merlin. In the past I have used a sack of sorts meant specifically for grocery shopping (able to span a cart). Into the sack I would use rocks........the strurdy handle making for a much better lift and from a higher starting point.


Perhaps I need to rethink this? During a capsize wouldn't the rocks merely sink to the bottom independent of the boat? "


They would probably sink if the canoe flipped but if it just swamped and stayed upright, they would still be ballast and possibly overcome the flotation.
krick
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11/20/2017 09:55AM
Thanks to everyone for their input. There is a lot of good info here.
I'm going to take my kayak paddle AND the outfitter's canoe paddle.

Keep the good input coming I have 7 months to plan. :)
mastertangler
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11/20/2017 03:14PM
Yes Bill I am envisioning just such a scenario. Particularly if the vessel ended up sideways in the water. An error in sound judgement on my part.
krick
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05/14/2018 08:40AM
Trip is a month away. I brought up possibly rotating a couple guys into the solo for a day or 2 and was told nobody wanted to get into the solo canoe. They don't trust their stability. None of us have been in a true solo canoe so I'm not sure if their concerns are warranted.
Anderson's lists their solo canoe as a 39 lbs Kevlar 16 foot. That's all I know about it.
My only concern now is stability. (compared to a regular tandem canoe)

Do I need to be more concerned about tipping a solo canoe? Is it less stable than a tandem?
05/14/2018 12:20PM
You're worrying more than necessary. I had very little experience in canoes at all and managed to get in and out of a solo and paddle it many times without incident. You don't have to worry about a partner dumping you; you'll only have yourself to blame ;). When you get in step on the center line of the canoe and keep your weight low while holding the gunwales. After you're seated keep yourself inside the gunwales.
GearJunkie
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05/17/2018 01:11PM
For you guys that have rented solos before. Do most outfitters offer a low seat option? Similar to the seat Joe Robinet uses in his YouTube vids? That would add a ton of stability. I’ll be doing my first solo this year as well.
Canoodler
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05/17/2018 01:16PM
Krick, others have tried to calm you down about the stability of solo canoes but do not be deceived, they ARE less stable than tandem canoes. I have a Prism and it is 16.5 feet long. It is "pencil" shaped and fast but the waterline width at 29.75 inches does make it tricky when the boat is empty. Loaded with packs the boat is fairly stable but still not as stable as a loaded Winonah 17' that has a waterline width of 34.5 inches. That being said, extra care in entering and exiting should do you well. Fishing from the empty boat is another matter. Be careful in landing a large fish! I often take my Prism out to get camp water and a bucket full is VERY carefully and slowly lifted out of the water and slowly swung over to the boat's center line before setting it down. Another consideration is that it is harder to control an empty solo in the wind. In summary, if you are going with seven then you have a partner and a tandem will be best. If you are the odd person, rent a three man canoe (Itaska, Minnesota III or such) instead. Fish one one each side and the stern man trailing a line directly astern. Solos are best anchored near a honey hole and cast.
AmarilloJim
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05/17/2018 02:10PM
krick: "Trip is a month away. I brought up possibly rotating a couple guys into the solo for a day or 2 and was told nobody wanted to get into the solo canoe. They don't trust their stability. None of us have been in a true solo canoe so I'm not sure if their concerns are warranted.
Anderson's lists their solo canoe as a 39 lbs Kevlar 16 foot. That's all I know about it.
My only concern now is stability. (compared to a regular tandem canoe)


Do I need to be more concerned about tipping a solo canoe? Is it less stable than a tandem?"

That sounds like a SRQ 16 solo. Which is a tandem with the bow seat moved back some and the stern seat removed. Very stable!
05/17/2018 04:17PM
GearJunkie: "For you guys that have rented solos before. Do most outfitters offer a low seat option? Similar to the seat Joe Robinet uses in his YouTube vids? That would add a ton of stability. I’ll be doing my first solo this year as well."


IIRC, Joe uses a Swift pack canoe, which is a slightly different animal than the solo canoes most outfitters rent. The seat in the Northstar Northwind that I rent from Sawtooth feels pretty low to me, but that would be a question best addressed to your outfitter, as it may vary from one to the other.
05/17/2018 04:27PM
AmarilloJim: "krick: "Trip is a month away. I brought up possibly rotating a couple guys into the solo for a day or 2 and was told nobody wanted to get into the solo canoe. They don't trust their stability. None of us have been in a true solo canoe so I'm not sure if their concerns are warranted.
Anderson's lists their solo canoe as a 39 lbs Kevlar 16 foot. That's all I know about it.
My only concern now is stability. (compared to a regular tandem canoe)



Do I need to be more concerned about tipping a solo canoe? Is it less stable than a tandem?"

That sounds like a SRQ 16 solo. Which is a tandem with the bow seat moved back some and the stern seat removed. Very stable!"


I had the same thought - it's a big solo, quite stable, but also a big sail in the wind, especially if you're not big. You can always put some ballast in it when you go out fishing.
GraniteCliffs
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05/18/2018 08:24PM
Krick, I don't know how old you are but.......many if not most of the people paddling on solo trips are not exactly young. I will be 67 this paddle season and can still get in and out of the canoe without much difficulty, wet footing of course. There are a lot of folks here a lot older than me still getting it done. That means the old coots paddle in wind and waves all of the time and hop in and out of the canoe multiple times a day. If we can do it you surely can to. It took me all of a lake or two to feel comfortable in my Prism when I bought it.
I know nothing about fishing out of a solo since I don't fish but when on group trips we have fished out of tandem canoes with three guys. I paddle and the two guys in front of me fish.
Have a good time.
gymcoachdon
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05/21/2018 11:56AM
You have gotten a lot of info already, but here is my experience. 3 years ago, I had the opportunity on short notice to use a week of vacation. I called Piragis and decided to finally make a BWCA trip happen. I went solo, rented a Northstar Magic. I had canoed probably 10 times before I took this trip. Because of the late date, I ended up entering Stuart River EP, which starts with a long portage. (blessing in disquise! loved the entry!)
I did have the opportunity to borrow a friends Prism to paddle around a gravel pit a few times before I left. That was why I rented the Magic, so I could compare the two. I got a bentshaft and a yak paddle from the outfitter, and tried both. On the river, I used the single blade. On a windy day from Iron Lake through Lac LaCroix, I used the yak paddle. I never used it other than that day, I found that I prefer the single blade. (YMMV) The seat on the Magic was very low, and I found it to be very stable, although maybe not as comfortable. I had absolutely no problems stability wise fishing from it, although fishing solo from a canoe is a test in patience if you are trying to cast to specific spots. Any breeze will quickly move you off your spot. As MT stated above, I have since turned to trolling with a rod holder, and my success has gone up, while frustration has lowered!
I have since purchased a Bell Magic, and have yet to take a spill. I have, one time, lost my paddle when a big gust caught it as I switched sides, so always have a spare handy. I don't think a yak paddle, broken down, and fastened to the thwarts is handy, so I have 2 bent shafts.
Unless the water and air temp are really cold, I will always stand in the water while loading and unloading the canoe unless you have that perfect landing. Easier to balance, lift, and load for me, and I don't mind squishy feet. I have sandals and dry socks for camp. Some of the portage trails are worse than the landings, I'm not sure how people keep dry feet carrying the canoe!

edit to add:
I found the seat on my Bell was really low. It was originally a Piragis rental as well, but I have since raised the seat 2 inches. I feel more comfortable, and still feel perfectly stable, although on the first test, it did feel a bit squirrely.
billconner
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05/21/2018 07:27PM
"...and hop in and out of the canoe multiple times a day"

For me, "hop" might be slightly misleading. Climb or clamber in and out might be more descriptive of what I do.

bmaines
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05/22/2018 12:29PM
Bell Magic is an excellent fishing boat. No ballast required and managed to get this 42" pike in the boat with me.
05/22/2018 11:46PM
An obvious point I have not seen posted involves building a strong core and keeping the center of balance in that core rather than chest or shoulders. This also accounts for the spills when folks turn to look back; the elevated center of balance shifts over the side of the boat and over it goes. One of the high risk times is entry and exit. Getting tense raises your center of gravity and contributes to spills. Take a breath and think positive.
And take some time at the entry point to find the balance point with the packs and practice a couple entry/exit maneuvers. I recall my first paddling experience solo. I got in and was pleased how easy that went. When I started to get out I lost balance and over I went. Fortunately I was on a home lake where I could practice and learn. You will get that opportunity on the water. Try it out before you head out.
A good exercise to increase core awareness involves standing with both feet spread about shoulder wide. Focus your attention on the weight on each foot and establish balance. Now lean to the right and left while keeping your legs straight and the pressure on each foot the same. Move only above the waist and pay attention to the pivot point and allow the center of gravity to move to that point and below to your feet. When you get your own solo you will want to install foot braces.
 
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