What are the rules/guidelines for posting on this site?

A post of mine was recently deleted. A number of my posts have been deleted over the years. Others have also had posts deleted. It appears that it happens most frequently when a minority view is expressed. I would like to hear from mods as to what the criteria is. Thanks.

It would be helpful if a simple email could be sent to the poster explaining why a post is deleted. Or can guidelines be posted? In my opinion, it is rude to simply delete without explanation.

I have never really had any problem with posts being deleted.
BUT
There is supposed to be a "Message Board Guide" with rules about posting.
I cannot find that guide.
Mods, can you show where that guide is?

At the bottom of the messageboard page, the very last line of text you see, there will be a link for "Legal Notice" that spells out the terms of service to which you agree by using the messageboard.

thebotanyguy: "At the bottom of the messageboard page, the very last line of text you see, there will be a link for "Legal Notice" that spells out the terms of service to which you agree by using the messageboard.
"

I just found that link and read it for the first time. It’s not prominent. I don’t see anything in it that justifies arbitrary post deletion. It seems highly open to interpretation.

old_salt: "

thebotanyguy: "At the bottom of the messageboard page, the very last line of text you see, there will be a link for "Legal Notice" that spells out the terms of service to which you agree by using the messageboard. "

I just found that link and read it for the first time. It’s not prominent. I don’t see anything in it that justifies arbitrary post deletion. It seems highly open to interpretation. "

Arbitrary post deletion-I guess that's why the mods make the big bucks. I seriously doubt that they have the time or inclination to justify their reasons for deleting a post. I'm betting that a little self reflection will probably answer your question as to why your post was deleted.

I did some self reflection before my original post. My purpose is not to make this thread about me. Rather the larger issue of post deletion. It would be very easy to frame it as pro mod or anti mod. That is not what this discussion should be. Overall, the mods should be appreciated.

My original question is to the point of having some kind of guidance? The legal notice is pretty vague and potentially any post could be deleted for any or no reason.

The legal Notices information refers to a Message Board Guide which I do not find a link to. ??? Never thought about it but now I am curious to read it.

As a member of this forum and others like it it I am a guest of the owner of the forum. I am invited to participate, however if the owner or his / her designated moderators don't like what I have to say, how I look or the canoe I paddle, they may at anytime without cause or explanation delete my posts or ban me from the forum.

This forum is one of the best, most civil I have been on. Not saying the mods haven't erred in their moderating at times, but i think they do a very good job here.

Blue Skies!
cc

old_salt: "I did some self reflection before my original post. My purpose is not to make this thread about me. Rather the larger issue of post deletion. It would be very easy to frame it as pro mod or anti mod. That is not what this discussion should be. Overall, the mods should be appreciated.


My original question is to the point of having some kind of guidance? The legal notice is pretty vague and potentially any post could be deleted for any or no reason."

I subscribe to the "you know it when you see it" philosophy (that was my point about self reflections) but I understand what you are asking. I am sometimes amazed at what some think is appropriate to post.

If the guidelines don't exist, let's make our own:

No profanity
No vulgarity
No politics
...

That's all very well and good, Dances with Sheep, but we all know posts are deleted for many more reasons than that.

I have had a post deleted because it referred to a positive experience with a guide who is not a sponsor of this board. I have had a post deleted because it supported a commercial cause. (There is no commercial posting allowed.)

Posts are deleted if they include criticism that appears to be personal in nature: things like name-calling, or sarcasm that crosses a certain line. This is a very subjective judgement and it depends upon the moderator, and sometimes the mood of the day, or what person is making the remark. Or so it seems.

In reality, profanity and vulgarity are often allowed, but I would say that the personal jabs and name-calling are the main reasons for a thread to go sour. Sometimes just keeping an argument going and going and going, long after it should have run its course is reason to get an entire thread pulled. The mods make a judgement and they are usually correct. :-)

Posts are always deleted if you start a thread asking why your posts have been deleted, or why a person has suddenly been banned from the board. :-)

I don't know if this helps, but it does describe the experience as I see it.

can you provide an example of a post that was deleted so we can offer some insight?

Mocha: "can you provide an example of a post that was deleted so we can offer some insight?"

I wouldn't..it was deleted for a reason.

Spartan2: "That's all very well and good, Dances with Sheep, but we all know posts are deleted for many more reasons than that.


I have had a post deleted because it referred to a positive experience with a guide who is not a sponsor of this board. I have had a post deleted because it supported a commerial cause. (There is no commercial posting allowed.)


Posts are deleted if they include criticism that appears to be personal in nature: things like name-calling, or sarcasm that crosses a certain line. This is a very subjective judgement and it depends upon the moderator, and sometimes the mood of the day, or what person is making the remark. Or so it seems.


In reality, profanity and vulgarity are often allowed, but I would say that the personal jabs and name-calling is the main reason for a thread to go sour. Sometimes just keeping an argument going and going and going, long after it should have run its course is reason to get an entire post pulled. The mods make a judgement and they are usually correct. :-)


Posts are always deleted if you start a thread asking why your posts have been deleted, or why a person has suddenly been banned from the board. :-)


I don't know if this helps, but it does describe the experience as I see it. "

All good points..well said.

Old_Salt...
" The legal notice is pretty vague and potentially any post could be deleted for any or no reason."

"That's about the size of it, Pilgrim."-- John Wayne

Well, I saw the quote and then went back and corrected my spelling and grammar. LOL!

Having said what I said, I would like to also say that this is a great message board, and a fine community. I love it here. I have been reprimanded in the past when I objected to having a thread deleted, and I have been told to straighten up and fly right. I have been upset, and I have pouted.

However, I think I have learned what to do and what not to do, and I do try now to be more circumspect. Do I always succeed? Only the moderators can judge that.

But sometimes the "rules" are a bit subjective, or so it seems. And we puzzle about it, and we just go with it. There are so many members, so many posts (especially in "Listening Point") and we tend to let it go when things disappear, as they often do.

Especially the mining threads. ;-)

I think the mods do a good job, whatever the guidelines are. I feel as though, having spent enough time on here, that I have a good sense as to what is appropriate and what is not.
Even if the guidelines were written, posted and pretty precise we would all make our own interpretations of what their meaning really meant.
I like the way things operate now and I am glad I am not a mod!

Now I'd be curious what spartan2 would say to be deleted. Haha... One of the nicest people you'd ever meet.

But you too old salt... I know you're a pot stirrer... Kinda like me. Haha. But I've never seen anything delete worthy. I'm guessing I miss the juicy stuff. Haha.

I could see some threads getting moved to correct categories... Such as political, gear related or trip planning... or even for sale.

I'll send you an email, Ben. :-)

Can't think of any specific threads that have been deleted, but I can think of a handful of members who have served suspensions because of profanity, vulgarity or a total lack of virtual social decorum.

I can’t believe Spartan2 had posts deleted :) seriously? Now OS I believe :)

Seriously this is a great site, BUT it does seem at times posts or threads get deleted because of a small “loud” minority. I hate that! BUT I feel like this has been better in the last year or so?

I would say a good rule to add is you get one complaint every 2 years about telling the mods to delete a thread or post...anymore than that then you are the problem and should be deleted or banned from the site!

T

Of all the sites I go on the internet, this is the most cordial and positive. I have had posts deleted....I suspect because they were a post that would like just "stir the pot". I just accept it and move on because I would rather the mods have a heavy hand and keep the site positive.

I agree with all who remarked that is a good site, appropriately moderated for the most part.

I have seen that posts which reference certain other sites concerned with the same subjects as this one get deleted.

Is your post in any of the main forums about politics, mining, guns, religion or any other unrelated hot topic? If it doesn’t belong here it will eventually get deleted. I said eventually because the moderators will let it go for a while. When everyone has had a say or it has run its course, or if it gets nasty, it gets pulled. This is NOT a place where free speech will be archived until the end of time. That takes money to archive data. This website is not a democracy where everyone has a say on how things are run. This place is also not a public owned website. It is owned by Adam. He makes the rules. Adam and the moderators have families, jobs, interests outside of here. They don’t have time to respond to everyone or give a reason when a thread gets deleted

It’s not that hard to understand. We don’t need a posting guideline manual stated out in print what we can or can’t talk about.
We also don’t need a reason that a thread gets deleted. If you follow the board you know exactly why it got yanked.

Is the post about canoeing in any way? Then it won’t get deleted. Does the thread talk about unrelated topics, does it get nasty, is there name calling? It gets deleted. If you want to talk about any of the hot topics there are private groups you can join here at the bottom of the first page where most topics can be discussed there.

Bottom line, thanks for All the work that Adam and the moderators do here for keeping this place civil, friendly and a great site to visit.

I am curious now. I went to the "legal notice" link at the bottom of the message board page and read all of the information there. And this is what it says about the message board:

"Online Messageboard Information
Using our BWCA.COM Online Messageboard constitutes your agreement to our Messageboard Guide. This guide serves as the official rulebook and code of conduct for our BWCA.COM Messageboard. This guide is specific and applicable to only the Messageboard area of BWCA.COM.
By using the Messageboard, you agree to abide by these rules."

But I have never seen a copy of this "Messageboard Guide." I would like to see a copy.

Moderators: is there such a guide and where do we find it??

Spartan2: "But I have never seen a copy of this "Messageboard Guide." I would like to see a copy.

Moderators: is there such a guide and where do we find it??"

I have never seen a copy of a "Messageboard Guide", but maybe Adam has one somewhere.

There have been a lot of great and understanding comments in this thread. Much of what would be in any Messageboard Guide would be information shared in this thread... by active members of the board. Just another indication of why this board requires very little moderating.

Savage Voyageur may have explained the situation best. When a comment, or entire thread, gets pulled, it was deemed to have crossed a line of decorum or was snarky enough that it wasn't keeping in the spirit of the board. Yes, there is a fair amount of judgment on the part of the moderator, but I equate being a moderator to being a referee. You make the best call possible within general guidelines of courtesy and board decorum, then move on.

This is a great bulletinboard and everyone here can take credit for that. You'd be hard pressed to find a forum on the internet, especially one with as many members as we have, that is better. Thank you for that.

Now let's go canoeing.

Spartan2: "I am curious now. I went to the "legal notice" link at the bottom of the message board page and read all of the information there. And this is what it says about the message board:


"Online Messageboard Information
Using our BWCA.COM Online Messageboard constitutes your agreement to our Messageboard Guide. This guide serves as the official rulebook and code of conduct for our BWCA.COM Messageboard. This guide is specific and applicable to only the Messageboard area of BWCA.COM.
By using the Messageboard, you agree to abide by these rules."


But I have never seen a copy of this "Messageboard Guide." I would like to see a copy.


Moderators: is there such a guide and where do we find it??"

The last line, in a nutshell, is the crux of my question. I don’t find a link to it.

As for the side issues that have been raised, I’m not looking to get into the weeds.

I have found the folks who participate here helpful and friendly. Please point me to the link to the message board guide. Thanks.

I think Jackfish and I posted at same time.

Yes, What Pete said! This is a great board, with a lot of great people, many of which I know personally and have met many others. As repeated above this is a board about the BWCAW and Canoe Tripping. While there are other discussions that occur and many are "let ride" until it comes time to delete. It is not easy as a moderator to get on here every day, and check every post in every thread for content or being appropriate. And it's that way for all the moderators... therefore somethings don't get checked as soon as they need to be.

Adam being the ultimate moderator has the final say in all of it, as he is The Man. the rest of us just try to keep it civil, on topic and appropriate as we can.

Thanks to all of you who post! And you ideas, your thoughts, and your experience!

Bruce

Nothing too complicated about the possible guidelines and how they are implemented here. They work well from my perspective, written or not.
I think the guidelines wording should be..........Post like an appropriate adult should act in public or the moderators will delete your post.
Again, thanks to Adam, the mods and members for a great site to visit.

Pete and Bruce, I love you both. And I know Adam is the boss.

However (and I hope this isn't beating a dead horse) I tend to agree with old_salt on this one. If, as members posting on a message board, we are "agreeing to the rules in the Message Board Guide" as listed in the Legal Notice very clearly and succinctly, then there should be a copy available of said guide for us to read. If we want to. I dare say, most of us couldn't care less, and wouldn't read it. I would.

I am a rule-follower. Or at least I try to be. When I sign those forms at the doctor's office I usually read them. It drives the receptionist crazy, as she expects me to just sign and get on with it. If my participation in the board for the past twelve years has been dependent upon my agreeing to a set of rules that are in a "guide" somewhere, I would really like to see a copy of the guide.

And really, that doesn't seem unreasonable.

If you want to know the posting guidelines why not just ask Adam instead of asking it here? He’s not like the Great and Powerful Oz behind the curtain. He has a link here to click on. It will go to his email. He has responded to my emails every time. Everyone assumes he reads every thread and post. He probably has not even read this thread.

Savage Voyageur: "If you want to know the posting guidelines why not just ask Adam instead of asking it here? He’s not like the Great and Powerful Oz behind the curtain. He has a link here to click on. It will go to his email. He has responded to my emails every time. Everyone assumes he reads every thread and post. He probably has not even read this thread. "

Email sent. I will let you know when I receive a reply. :-)

I think it was mentioned toward the start of the thread but a little self reflection could go a LONG ways with some folks.

IMO if there is a documented list of guidelines then it should be a sticky topic on the top of the forums. However, compared to most forums I've been on this is such a minor issue on this site. The vast majority of folks know what should and should not be posted and most will probably never have a post removed. From my experience on other forums (not sure if it holds true here or not) the folks that have posts or threads removed tend to be chronic offenders. If they don't learn from their first or second mistake I would guess that a list of guidelines posted somewhere wouldn't do much to teach them the errors of their ways.

Spartan2: "When I sign those forms at the doctor's office I usually read them. It drives the receptionist crazy, as she expects me to just sign and get on with it."

Just curious Spartan, did you read your whole mortgage/rental agreement for your home? I'd love to see the agent's reaction to that! I've always wondered how I was supposed to read all of that in one sitting at the closing....

My suggestion on "appropriate adult behavior" was made to make a point. Define what is allowed with a few words or ten pages or words and in the end it just comes down to the mods making a decision and moving on quickly, the way it should be.
It does seem to work pretty darn well since the site is great and there are no apparent written rules.

I agree with Old Salt. I have seen too many good threads get deleted because one forum user pollutes it. So we all pay when one person does that. I have said before, delete the naughty users posts, but don't delete the morsels of good information.

Just like this very thread has one angry person posting, but the whole thread will disappear?

Back to the question of "where's the documented policy?" I think the simple answer is there is none. I suspect that's just canned legaleze that is typically inserted by the software creators as a placeholder for some future document.

I agree that it's unfortunate to see whole threads with good information within them disappear because far down into the discussion it went off the rails. But, if that's the cost for having an otherwise peaceful board in which to share about our common interest in paddling, I can handle that.

tumblehome: "And, the level of moderation on this forum is inappropriate. Way to much personal bias from the moderators. More than any forum I have ever used. Sad."

Not surprising but I completely disagree with this statement. The mods do not over moderate this board. They try to keep things civil which is a full time job for some posters.

Dances with Sheep: "As I said. It gets really old having politics injecting into so many threads here. The fact that you don't see it is amazing. "

Then don't inject it! Let it go. It's one thing to object to it but to object to political posting and engage in it in the same thread is ludicrous.

Banksiana: "

Dances with Sheep: "




As I said. It gets really old having politics injecting into so many threads here. The fact that you don't see it is amazing.



"

Then don't inject it! Let it go. It's one thing to object to it but to object to political posting and engage in it in the same thread is ludicrous."

Respectfully, I didn't inject it. Reread the postings and you will see that. I did challenge it and to no surprise I became the bad guy. It seems that certain political beliefs get a pass while others get attacked. I'm sure you have seen this.

BTW..is it "ludicrous" for you to be engaging in this debate?

tumblehome: "And, the level of moderation on this forum is inappropriate. Way to much personal bias from the moderators. More than any forum I have ever used. Sad."

A few years ago, when there was a big brew-ha-ha with a relatively new member who seemed to have no discretion in his comments, someone described this message board as "Adam's living room," which I thought was a great way to describe this site. He has invited us into his house to talk about a common passion, but let us not forget it is his house and he has entrusted the care of his house to a few people he trusts. He is the one who has invested the time and capital to create this space, though some of us have donated to the cause. He has the right to maintain it as he sees fit. I may not like the furniture or the artwork in his living room, but it's not my house. And while I have benefitted immensely from it over the years, I also respect the fact that this is a privately held entity and in many ways is a reflection of Adam and his values. It is a privilege to post on this board, and should I say something he or any moderator thinks crosses a line, it is entirely his right to remove it. Could the guidelines perhaps be enumerated more clearly? Sure. But I would like to think there are things far more important in life to be concerned about whether or not a comment or thread of mine got deleted. As a friend of mine likes to say, "That's a rich person's problem."

Dances with Sheep: "Respectfully, I didn't inject it. Reread the postings and you will see that. I did challenge it and to no surprise I became the bad guy. It seems that certain political beliefs get a pass while others get attacked. I'm sure you have seen this.

BTW..is it "ludicrous" for you to be engaging in this debate? "

Why would it be ludicrous for me to engage in this debate?

Before the mods took down the offensive posts you did drop a MAGA, which would qualify as an "injection of politics".

I think people with a flying moose below their name should have much more latitude as to what they are allowed to post. The larger the flying moose the more leeway...... ;)

The mods do a great job. My complaint if I wanted one is when a person starts a decent thread than it is hijacked or one individual goes on attack. You go to bed,next morning your thread is gone thru no fault of your own.
Just delete the bad posts in that thread. I think the moderators are getting better at doing that.
Yes the mystery of when you get up and your thread is gone and you don't know why. I feel guilty,what did I do wrong? Than I get over it.
Just like umpiring baseball games,I did it a few times,and never again. Tough to be right all the time-same for moderators-when do you pull the plug? I see sometimes I wonder why profanity was allowed or name calling- i hate that.-we each have maybe a little different set of criteria.

unshavenman: "I think people with a flying moose below their name should have much more latitude as to what they are allowed to post. Th Ite larger the flying moose the more leeway...... ;)"

My thoughts too. When the site owner asks for money from the users, do they not become shareholders? As painful as it may be, I think so.

I do not want to enflame this but i no longer have a flying moose because of the deletion of threads and for that I am sorry.

The disappearing thread can be disappointing, but it is almost always done with good reason.

I do like how the mods have waded in on this thread and pulled off topic posts and let it drift back on topic. As a poster that occasionally gets acerbic and outside the lines I've generally deserved my deletions.

I've definitely had my posts moved. Maybe deleted? IDK.

I figure its for good reason though. There's enough insults and insanity on Facebook and Twitter that its kind of refreshing that we keep it pretty civil over here, even if it is monitored speech.

In another forum I am a member of the Mods will simply lock out a thread.
(Keep it up for viewing, but not allow anyone else to post).

The mods usually do this after a general warning to all posters of the thread that it is getting out of hand, if the posters do not heed their advice, it gets locked, but is kept up for viewing

I liked that thread lock out system because it stops the discussion, but provides an oppertunity for people to see where the thread got off the rails and may help them self correct .

MN_Lindsey: "I've definitely had my posts moved. Maybe deleted? IDK.


I figure its for good reason though. There's enough insults and insanity on Facebook and Twitter that its kind of refreshing that we keep it pretty civil over here, even if it is monitored speech."

Agree. It has to rank up there with one of the best forum setups.

Banksiana: "

Dances with Sheep: "Respectfully, I didn't inject it. Reread the postings and you will see that. I did challenge it and to no surprise I became the bad guy. It seems that certain political beliefs get a pass while others get attacked. I'm sure you have seen this.

BTW..is it "ludicrous" for you to be engaging in this debate? "

Why would it be ludicrous for me to engage in this debate?"

It isn't..much like it isn't for me.

tumblehome: "

unshavenman: "I think people with a flying moose below their name should have much more latitude as to what they are allowed to post. Th Ite larger the flying moose the more leeway...... ;)"

My thoughts too. When the site owner asks for money from the users, do they not become shareholders? As painful as it may be, I think so.


I do not want to enflame this but i no longer have a flying moose because of the deletion of threads and for that I am sorry."

maybe you can get it back if you ask pretty please :)

I also have contributed and lost my moose...would a mia culpa suffice? On second thought. I do not believe that the site owners asked for money. I willingly contributed to a worthy website. I do NOT believe that I became a shareholder by my minimum contribution. I am not owed a thing! They do us a service...not the other way around.

We’re in like the 20th year of active mesageboarding on the internet.

Message boards live and die by how owners and moderators moderate/manage/allow discussion.

Worrying about moderation is silly. You can tell if it’s being done right for better or worse by participation rates.

A board dies, probably bad moderation. Successful long running board like this, probably good or decent moderation.

I’ll worry about moderation when it looks like it’s killing the board. Until then, no concern of mine. I don’t own it and it seems to be doing fine.

Given the recent nonsense in this thread that I contributed to, I wanted to say thank you to the mods and Adam for the great website that you run. We all have a tremendous passion and love of the BWCA and although we come from many differing backgrounds, you have given us an amazing opportunity to express that through this website. I know that we don't always make it easy for you, but you do an amazing job at righting the ship when we take on water. For what it's worth, I truly thank you for your efforts and apologize for any extra work that I have added. You have a great website and I hope it continues for many years to come

Respectfully,
DWS

Dances with Sheep: "


It isn't..much like it isn't for me"

I did not suggest it was ludicrous for you to be engaged in the debate. I am sorry I offended you.

Banksiana: "

Dances with Sheep: "It isn't..much like it isn't for me"

I did not suggest it was ludicrous for you to be engaged in the debate. I am sorry I offended you. "

Me too..peace bro.

Well...... After reading through another petty dust up the original question has still not been clarified or clearly answered. DWS, if your gonna moderate don’t get in the mud hole and start slinging. Bad form! OS, I assume it’s gonna remain one of the worlds mysteries. I must have missed any answer other than “I know it when I see it”. “The best way to spread Christmas cheer is singing loud for all to hear”

I have had no answer to my email to Adam. Perhaps it is pending.

I am sorry that this thread went into unpleasant directions, and as I said earlier, I love it here. It is a fine community and a good place to be. Whether we are discussing canoeing, or other subjects, most of the time it is civil and the "talk" is interesting and informative. Let's do our best to always keep it that way.

There are other Boundary Waters forums on the internet. I come to this website because of how great the moderation is. I choose to live a life as peaceful as possible with as little cursing as possible. BWCA.com is a breath of fresh air. I have had posts deleted in the past and I didn't worry about it. Most likely someone said something to hurt someone and thankfully I missed it.

Internet forums are owned by one person and it is not free speech. A owner can remove a post or a person however they want. I am a forum leader on a moms forum and, trust me, there are so many trolls out there it is unbelievable. Forum leaders make no money and do what they do for free. There is usually a good reason a post is removed and I usually don't want to know why.

I love the people on this forum and am thankful this forum is here. I have donated three times this year to make up for all the years I could not. BWCA.com is a rare peace-filled area of the internet... a place where we can all share our passion, obsession and infatuation of the Boundary Waters Canoe Area with others who understand us.

I agree that it can be frustrating when a post or a thread is deleted without explanation. I can also see how some might be frustrated by the lack of stated guidelines. However, I think the lack of stated guidelines is a feature, and serves a useful purpose.

The vast majority of people here are well-intentioned folk, who do a good job of being courteous. Let’s face it, though, some people here have strong opinions at times, are occasionally prone to nitpick, and can be argumentative from time to time.

Let’s try a thought experiment…Imagine if a set of guidelines were, in fact, posted on the site. A certain thread takes an unpleasant turn, and a moderator determines that because of the tone of the entire thread, it’s detrimental to the site, and so he deletes the whole thing.

One of the offenders starts a new thread, asking why the original thread was deleted. The moderator feels obliged to reply, and cites the rule saying that being disrespectful of others is not allowed. The offender then replies, saying that he wasn’t being disrespectful, he was:
A) Stating a fact, or
B) Offering an opinion, which he is entitled to, or
C) [Insert your own justification here]
Others chime in and agree with the offending poster. Still others reply, in support of the moderator. Things get heated, and before long, the second post is just as ugly as the first one.

Folks, this would take the moderators even more time, question their judgment, and put them on the defensive. Our moderators do what they do for the personal satisfaction. Having to defend their decisions on a regular basis would make being a moderator a truly unpleasant task. It would also put an undue burden on them, and take them away from more important work here.

As others have said, spend some time here, and you can discern what is not acceptable. Intentional ambiguity forces people to follow the spirit of what is acceptable, rather than clinging to legalistic justifications while pushing the limits.

The more I think about it the more I'm in favor of not having a posted set of guidelines. Not that I'm opposed to them but because I really don't think they are necessary. The nature of the beast pretty much dictates that moderating a forum is a subjective process and best done on a case by case basis.

At times different extenuating circumstances may come in to play such as how many times a controversial topic has already been discussed, how long of a leash a chronic offender is given, or the specific tone in a post. If you were to write guidelines for how the site would moderate such things the guidelines would be filled with the reoccurring phrase "based on moderators discretion". Its simply not a black and white thing most of the time.

The things that are black and white (no swearing, name calling, etc) are already common sense. If someone is already inclined to break such an obvious rule I doubt writing it down for them is going to help.

If you have a problem with how the site is moderated then that is a private discussion you can have with Adam. If you have a question as to why a thread or post was deleted that is another private conversation to have with Adam or the moderators. If you have something removed perhaps start with self reflection, I'm guessing most often you can narrow down the possible reasons before even talking to a moderator.

I have done around 5000 posts.
Probably had 3-5 deleted over the years.
Not really a problem that needs solving.

jcavenagh: "I have done around 5000 posts.
Probably had 3-5 deleted over the years.
Not really a problem that needs solving."

Ditto, if I only count individual posts. When entire threads go, I lose count.

Agree its not many posts. Several with links to certain other canoe oriented web site but I still smile about a link to a Leslie Nielsen scene in Naked Gun that got deleted. Some quip about a nocturnal semiaquatic rodent seemed suitable to the discussion.

In most cases, I can understand why things get deleted. Right around when my own frustration threshold kicks in, 'POOF', there goes the thread. I generally try to stay away from anything that I know is going to be a hot button issue. Not sure if any of my posts have caused deletion, but I have been involved in some discussions that could have caused it.

billconner: "Agree its not many posts. Several with links to certain other canoe oriented web site but I still smile about a link to a Leslie Nielsen scene in Naked Gun that got deleted. Some quip about a nocturnal semiaquatic rodent seemed suitable to the discussion."

Surely you can't be serious!

jcavenagh: "

billconner: "Agree its not many posts. Several with links to certain other canoe oriented web site but I still smile about a link to a Leslie Nielsen scene in Naked Gun that got deleted. Some quip about a nocturnal semiaquatic rodent seemed suitable to the discussion."

Surely you can't be serious!"

I am serious and don't call me Shirley (Airplane 1980). I met Leslie Nelson once at a high end hotel bar in San Francisco - funny guy!

99% of the time, this board is very high quality and respects others. Problems mainly occur when someone hijacks the topic for his own agenda. This board is the best, and so many of us now have cherished friends from here and we don't even know what they look like, which doesn't matter anyhow.

I would consider myself as a new guy here. I've read this entire thread. At the macro level it does not appear there is a problem with posts or threads being deleted. I can understand that not knowing why a personal post or thread is deleted may be a bit of contention for the poster. With that said, why do we need written guidelines for this board? From my view as a new guy it appears that this board is very well self regulated by the users. We are all adults with at least one common interest, the BWCA.

Here's my guidelines, treat everyone with respect, freely share your great knowledge, don't be critical of others opinions and have FUN. Written guidelines are restrictive and unless we don't regulate our selves they are not needed, IMO.

Don't try and fix what's not broken.

agree