In July my bil Tim and I are heading out for a trip. We will both have our vagabonds with us and only taking one car. A Toyota corola (can't spell it)
I don't have a canoe rack on the car. They are both 30 inches wide. What would be the best way to transport them on top of the car?
Thanks
Mike

You're going to have to get a rack. I like Yakima because they last forever and are high quality. Pricy but you get what you pay for. I would get the 66 inch bar for those 2 canoes on your car. The website is very good for fitting your car. Also I highly recommend the load stop brackets. If you're going to canoecopia they'll be there. You'll get a discount.

When I went to ely last spring the outfitter put two long 2x2s on the top of the car and that's how I transported one canoe but in my memory there was enough room for two canoes.
This is what I was thinking

It sounds like they're bringing the canoes from home.

When carrying 2 canoes, we use our Yakima 78 inch bars.

I totally agree with the longer bars. If you are bringing 2 canoes from Oklahoma or even closer, you need a stable rig!

quote Whatsit: "When I went to ely last spring the outfitter put two long 2x2s on the top of the car and that's how I transported one canoe but in my memory there was enough room for two canoes.
This is what I was thinking
"

That may be but you probably were not going that far from the outfitters to put in. Also maybe at slower speeds too. As opposed to driving longer distance and at highway or interstate speeds.

78" bars shown here.
Maybe not able to tell in that first photo, but the canoes' side-by-side bellies mean you need a lot more width (bar length) than you think.

quote Grandma L: "I totally agree with the longer bars. If you are bringing 2 canoes from Oklahoma or even closer, you need a stable rig!"

It will be from black river falls to sawbill Outfitters
So still a good few hours
Thanks
Mike

So I'm guess you are saying my 2x2 boards won't work? It's not an option for me to get those racks on my car. Any other ideas then?
Thanks
Mike

This guy recommends at least a 2x3.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBVCNGZrhXw

And he has rails to attach to.

I am not sure what you can do with a Toyota Corolla.

If I get a second canoe, I plan to go the yakima route with the 78 inch bars. I guess it depends on how paranoid you are and how far you are going.

Blatz,

Do you remember what kind of discount Yakima offered at canoecopia?

quote Whatsit: "When I went to ely last spring the outfitter put two long 2x2s on the top of the car and that's how I transported one canoe but in my memory there was enough room for two canoes.
This is what I was thinking
"

I think that's going to work out okay. I'm sure the Yakima rack is better, but I can't convince the woman to let us take the car that has the Yakima on it. She has big plans for hauling all the kids everywhere in the big car. Not having the big car isn't what she expected.

I think the 2X2s will be okay if we are careful. We'll tie everything down and double tie everything down. I've done it before. That's how I always hauled my canoe when I had the blue truck and the red truck. I went all the way to Wyalusing, to Buckhorn, and to Mead Lake like that.

Tim

Look at Spring Creek for their suction cup racks. You can buy parts from them and then build up with two by fours. Or just buy their complete racks.

Spring Creek Suction Cups for 2x4s You need to buy two sets for a complete rack.

Makes me glad I have the good old heavy duty suburban with Yakima racks...Windy days, bridges, semis still make that thing rock a bit with two canoes. The wind factor might be too much a risk factor with a smaller vehicle as that? Trailer another option.... even if you have them strapped in a boat trailer.

dr bob

quote schweady: "78" bars shown here.
Maybe not able to tell in that first photo, but the canoes' side-by-side bellies mean you need a lot more width (bar length) than you think.

"

I think The OP said his Vagabonds where 30 inches at the widest and the load stops won't be at that area. You certainly can use the 78inch bars but they will hang over a lot on a Corolla. You can always cut them down to any length you want. It seems like the bars are all the same price regardless of length from what I've seen.

quote rdgbwca: "Blatz,


Do you remember what kind of discount Yakima offered at canoecopia?"

It should be 10% off if I'm not mistaken.

Dan at the sawbill Outfitters said they use a 2x4 with a 2x2 screwed to the bottom. Then the same as my sketch and he figured I'd be just fine.
I'm attaching a picture that I drove from Philips Wisconsin to Bartlesville Oklahoma about 15 hours and went 70 most the way

How long is that Sportspal? How do you like it?

Re: discount, Thanks Blatz

quote rdgbwca: "How long is that Sportspal? How do you like it?


Re: discount, Thanks Blatz"

It's 14 ft. I was given it when I was 16 from my grandpa. I love it. Weighs 40lbs and can hold 800lbs and very quiet and near impossible to swamp and fast. I have another Sportspal too. I finally brought it back with me from my moms house this summer. I have my wife two kids and myself in this canoe with no worries.
Mike

Whatsit,

I see those come up for sale every now and then. (I think you are quoting in excess of the current advertised specs of the Meyers S14...or do you have one made in Canada?)

What kind of middle seat do you use for the kids? It seems too wide for the drop in seats I have seen.

Another question I have when looking at used ones is, have you ever had to replace the foam?

I have been thinking the Sportspal might make for a good day trip on a small river. Do you paddle it on rivers or lakes or both?

quote rdgbwca: "Whatsit,


I see those come up for sale every now and then. (I think you are quoting in excess of the current advertised specs of the Meyers S14...or do you have one made in Canada?)


What kind of middle seat do you use for the kids? It seems too wide for the drop in seats I have seen.


Another question I have when looking at used ones is, have you ever had to replace the foam?


I have been thinking the Sportspal might make for a good day trip on a small river. Do you paddle it on rivers or lakes or both?"

I'm not quoting anything. This is the truth. It's the Canada one. Not a Meyers. This was made in North Bay Ontario. It's from the early 80's and foams great shape and never replaced. I have two foam chairs that came with it and put two life jacket squares down for each of them side by side. My sons 13 and daughters 9.

quote Blatz: "You're going to have to get a rack. I like Yakima because they last forever and are high quality. Pricy but you get what you pay for. I would get the 66 inch bar for those 2 canoes on your car. The website is very good for fitting your car. Also I highly recommend the load stop brackets. If you're going to canoecopia they'll be there. You'll get a discount."

+1. It more than pays for itself and saves both your rooftop and canoes.

It's a bad day when your canoe(s) go for a ride off your vehicle. If you decide to go with a wood rack of some kind, put in the hood loops and trunk loops that many people use for tie downs in the front and back.

You have some time, so find out what rack systems will fit the Toyota and start looking for used. I have three Thule load bars (50", 62", and 78") plus two sets of feet for my car, and a set of feet for my suv. The suv setup I got used from a shop for about $150. One set of feet for the car I paid $25. I was going to pick up a set of load bars used off craigslist for $20, and the guy had another set of feet and another load bar. I got the set of feet and two load bars for $40.

quote IceColdGold: "It's a bad day when your canoe(s) go for a ride off your vehicle. If you decide to go with a wood rack of some kind, put in the hood loops and trunk loops that many people use for tie downs in the front and back.

You have some time, so find out what rack systems will fit the Toyota and start looking for used. I have three Thule load bars (50", 62", and 78") plus two sets of feet for my car, and a set of feet for my suv. The suv setup I got used from a shop for about $150. One set of feet for the car I paid $25. I was going to pick up a set of load bars used off craigslist for $20, and the guy had another set of feet and another load bar. I got the set of feet and two load bars for $40."

I agree, but just know that if your tied good front and back and the bar or whatever is compromised the potential for a boat to fall and be dragged is a concern. Not something you'd like to happen. Good racks are a must in my book, whether bought/ built or Mygivered. Tony has a good idea to get on Craigslist and such while you have time.

I don't need to buy these eventually as I normally travel with one canoe. As I said when I put my canoe on my car roof like the picture I showed you can't move it. It rode up there for over 15 hours straight. Dan at the sawbill Outfitters said he puts the wood beams on the cars and then puts two canoes on them and many travel an hour or more with the canoes on there. He said none yet have come off. He said just stop every hour or so and make sure everything is tight. Why can't this work?
Mike

Two 2x2s are fine (6' is more than enough). Get a set of the foam block canoe carriers. Instead of attaching them to the gunnels of the canoe, run the 2x2s through them forming a rack. Anchor the rack to the car with cheap rachet straps through the open doors. Now you've made a totally satisfactory rack for your car able to carry 2 solo canoes. I used this set up on my Geo Metro. Be sure to have bow and stern tie downs as well, either at the bumpers or the web tie downs under the hood.

OP asked: "What would be the best way to transport them on top of the car?"

2 Magics each 29" wide, sitting on 66" Yakima bars on top of a VW Jetta.
For tieing down the front I have 4 looped straps with an eyelet that are bolted to the engine compartment and slide up through the seam between the hood and fenders, 4 straps mounted, 2 per canoe for tieing down to each side of car.
For the rear there are two metal tie down loops on the inside rear of the trunk near the opening that I looped one continuous loop (sold for rock climbing at REI) through each tie down and ran them out the trunk lid/lip above the bumper and tied off to these for the rear. In the end I have each of them seperatly tied off in the front and rear and two belly straps per canoe strapped to the rack.

Interesting thread. I use the family mini-van for canoe-hauling, but I also own a Corolla for which I do not have a rack. Couple of thoughts:

1. 2x2's seem a little light if you're going to be at Interstate speeds. I guess that's the size that fits int he foam blocks, though. I wonder about, as another poster suggested, adding 2x4s on top of the 2x2's -- or some other way to reinforce?

2. I sure hope you get to test this whole system at highway speeds before the trip. It would be a huge bummer to find out an hour into your trip that there's a problem.

Dave

quote Blatz: "

quote rdgbwca: "Blatz,



Do you remember what kind of discount Yakima offered at canoecopia?"

It should be 10% off if I'm not mistaken. "

Canoecopia discount is 15% off on all but boats.

quote Whatsit: "So I'm guess you are saying my 2x2 boards won't work? It's not an option for me to get those racks on my car. Any other ideas then?
Thanks
Mike"

Whatsit, why do you say it's not an option to get those racks on your car? Are you just thinking of cost (which I understand; it's not cheap but definitely worth it)? You can do 78" bars with the Q tower set up which can be easily removed from your roof at any time. Safe, simple and effective and would give you the option of putting other things (ladders, lumber, pipe, unruly children, mothers in law, etc.) on the roof if you ever needed to. If you car top even one boat on a fairly regular basis I think you'd be glad you bit the bullet as a rack system makes loading and unloading easier too. You might even find what you need, or at least some of it, on CL or other gear swap(s).

BTW, here's an example, albeit perhaps not the prettiest one, of what a pair of 78" bars can handle.

quote DeuceCoop: "

quote Whatsit: "So I'm guess you are saying my 2x2 boards won't work? It's not an option for me to get those racks on my car. Any other ideas then?
Thanks
Mike"

Whatsit, why do you say it's not an option to get those racks on your car? Are you just thinking of cost (which I understand; it's not cheap but definitely worth it)? You can do 78" bars with the Q tower set up which can be easily removed from your roof at any time. Safe, simple and effective and would give you the option of putting other things (ladders, lumber, pipe, unruly children, mothers in law, etc.) on the roof if you ever needed to. If you car top even one boat on a fairly regular basis I think you'd be glad you bit the bullet as a rack system makes loading and unloading easier too. You might even find what you need, or at least some of it, on CL or other gear swap(s)."

Yes cost. My wife is ready to run away with all the expense these trips are costing me and she can't justify a "hobby" being so expensive. I don't dare tell her one more expense or she'll put an end to all this "hobby"
So that's why another few hundred dollars isn't an option especially as our system 99% of the time is one canoe at a time, plus I normally put the canoe on my work truck and don't worry about using a car. But truck not safe enough to drive from Oklahoma to Wisconsin then to Minnesota.
Mike

Just get a couple of 2x4s, buy the suction cup mounts and a few eye bolts. Get some rope and you are set.

quote Whatsit: "

quote DeuceCoop: "

quote Whatsit: "So I'm guess you are saying my 2x2 boards won't work? It's not an option for me to get those racks on my car. Any other ideas then?
Thanks
Mike"

Whatsit, why do you say it's not an option to get those racks on your car? Are you just thinking of cost (which I understand; it's not cheap but definitely worth it)? You can do 78" bars with the Q tower set up which can be easily removed from your roof at any time. Safe, simple and effective and would give you the option of putting other things (ladders, lumber, pipe, unruly children, mothers in law, etc.) on the roof if you ever needed to. If you car top even one boat on a fairly regular basis I think you'd be glad you bit the bullet as a rack system makes loading and unloading easier too. You might even find what you need, or at least some of it, on CL or other gear swap(s)."

Yes cost. My wife is ready to run away with all the expense these trips are costing me and she can't justify a "hobby" being so expensive. I don't dare tell her one more expense or she'll put an end to all this "hobby"
So that's why another few hundred dollars isn't an option especially as our system 99% of the time is one canoe at a time, plus I normally put the canoe on my work truck and don't worry about using a car. But truck not safe enough to drive from Oklahoma to Wisconsin then to Minnesota.
Mike
"

10-4. I understand that...............or I used to. ;)

quote Whatsit: "In July my bil Tim and I are heading out for a trip. We will both have our vagabonds with us and only taking one car. A Toyota corola (can't spell it)
I don't have a canoe rack on the car. They are both 30 inches wide. What would be the best way to transport them on top of the car?
Thanks
Mike"

Sounds like most people think the answer to your original question ("best way to transport them") is a rack. It sounds like your question was really, "what do you think about 2x2s"; personally, I'd be too nervous to drive at highway speed that way.

If you can't buy a rack and you've got to drive the distance you're talking, why not just bring one canoe and then rent a second canoe from a north country outfitter? That way you don't have to worry about a rack, you don't have to worry about potentially losing two canoes on the side of the road, and you're only out a couple hundred bucks. If this two-canoe situation is a one-off, then there's not much reason to invest money or energy into getting the two canoes to the BWCA. Anything you come up with is going to cost you more than renting one canoe, and/or leave you worrying about losing a canoe at highway speed.

You could always try making something out of metal and brackets. If you know someone who could weld then even better. I say this because it seems like you are somewhat restricted on the size of the material you are working with because you keep going back to 2x2s. This way you could custom build your own roof rack and then you just need a way to mount it. If you have driven with a custom rack before then just use the method you used before, even if you need to use some wood to soften the contact between the rack and car.

If you were not restricted on material size, then just make a 2x4 frame. My buddy's dad made a frame for his trailer so the canoes can sit up over the back of the SUV, and that was made out of 2x4s. We also use 2x4s to make fish tank stands, and those can weigh a thousand pounds 2x4s can take a lot. Just frame it together and make it strong then set it on top of the car as one piece and secure it. If you can tip it or move it around then it is not secure. Then you attach the canoes to the frame, not to the car except at the front and back. No padding needed between the canoes and frame, just between the frame and car. Bonus points if you shape the wood to fit the car and reduce pressure points

I get the cost thing if its a one time deal. I used the suction cup things many years ago and they did work. You might get some marks on the top of your car. If your going to use 2x4s take it a step further and screw in some small pieces of wood to act as load stops. Don't skimp on your top straps they're the important ones. NEVER use bungee cords use nylon straps on the top. You can use rope for the front and back, but know which knots to use to chinch them down, but not too much chinching

quote Blatz: "I get the cost thing if its a one time deal. I used the suction cup things many years ago and they did work. You might get some marks on the top of your car. If your going to use 2x4s take it a step further and screw in some small pieces of wood to act as load stops. Don't skimp on your top straps they're the important ones. NEVER use bungee cords use nylon straps on the top. You can use rope for the front and back, but know which knots to use to chinch them down, but not too much chinching"

Thanks!
This is my new plan. I'm going by what Sandbill Outfitters explained to me
Two 2x4's with a 2x2 screwed into the middle of each of the 2x4s. Then drill in a few holes for the straps to go thru. I'll place these on the foam gray thingies that normally are used for placing a canoe on your car roof. We will strap them in and also strap them from both front and rear. We won't be driving crazy and will check it every hour or so. The reason I was always saying 2x2 for those wondering that's what the ely outfitter used on our car roof last spring and you couldn't move the canoe if you tried it was so secure. I appreciate everyone's help and concern for Tim and I. As this is only March and I won't be going until the middle of July with Tim I will have plenty of time if I decide to change my mind.
Thanks again
Mike

Just a comment, not all 2x2's are made the same. Made a roof rack out of white oak with the rubber suction cups and they worked well for a number of years. If I was making it again and didn't have access to a strong type of wood I would laminate something together.

Also, I screwed in 1x2" blocks on top of the 2x2 to keep the canoes in place and from hitting each other.

In our area, there are Yakima and Thule racks on Craigslist all the time. I bought a whole set for my car, bars, towers, canoe mounts for $100.

That said. . . there is no way I would put my canoe on the roof of my car with a 2x4. We had a 17 foot kayak almost blow off the roof once. . .and it was on a J hook and roof rack. If you get into wind, you have a sail on top of your car now mounted on a 2x4.

Take others advice. .. if you can't find a used Yakima system, rent the canoes. A lot cheaper then the cost of car repairs and destroyed canoes.

quote Savage Voyageur: "Just get a couple of 2x4s, buy the suction cup mounts and a few eye bolts. Get some rope and you are set. "

Thanks. That's the noisywet (Tim) and my plan :-)
Mike

Two 2x2's work fine. We have done this with a few different vehicles. Pictured here is my old Saturn with two Canoes, travelling from Saint Cloud doing speed limit on the interstate.

quote Canoe Dude: "Two 2x2's work fine. We have done this with a few different vehicles. Pictured here is my old Saturn with two Canoes, travelling from Saint Cloud doing speed limit on the interstate. "

Foam blocks on the 2x2s, wrap straps around the 2x2s and front thwarts. Make sure you have the canoes tied down in front and back too. To make easy tie downs in front, loosen a screw for front quarter panel and tie a rope or something in a loop.

quote Whatsit: "

quote Blatz: "I get the cost thing if its a one time deal. I used the suction cup things many years ago and they did work. You might get some marks on the top of your car. If your going to use 2x4s take it a step further and screw in some small pieces of wood to act as load stops. Don't skimp on your top straps they're the important ones. NEVER use bungee cords use nylon straps on the top. You can use rope for the front and back, but know which knots to use to chinch them down, but not too much chinching"

Thanks!
This is my new plan. I'm going by what Sandbill Outfitters explained to me
Two 2x4's with a 2x2 screwed into the middle of each of the 2x4s. Then drill in a few holes for the straps to go thru. I'll place these on the foam gray thingies that normally are used for placing a canoe on your car roof. We will strap them in and also strap them from both front and rear. We won't be driving crazy and will check it every hour or so. The reason I was always saying 2x2 for those wondering that's what the ely outfitter used on our car roof last spring and you couldn't move the canoe if you tried it was so secure. I appreciate everyone's help and concern for Tim and I. As this is only March and I won't be going until the middle of July with Tim I will have plenty of time if I decide to change my mind.
Thanks again
Mike"

this 2x2 & 2x4 combo looks good. i wouldn't trust 2x2s alone personally. likely would work but the cost for failure is way too high. i ended up getting thule 78" long bars eventually