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Any advice for Little Sag?

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Date/Time: 04/29/2024 10:18PM

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Any advice for Little Sag?

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Author	Message Text
Lightfoot	02/16/2018 12:07PM If you stay on Gillis, Little Sag, and Tuscarora, you shouldn't have any trouble finding trees to hang your food bag.
TuscaroraBorealis	02/16/2018 10:01AM If you've not been to Little Sag before? ?? I highly recommend entering from Virgin Lake. It unveils the majesty of Little Sag unlike the other portages. Although, it's a tough climb. And the landing on French Lake for the portage to Powell is treacherous. But it's a great route. You can find plenty of unburned sites on Gillis, Little Sag & Tuscarora.
A1t2o	02/16/2018 08:07AM My tripping buddy brought up a good question last night, with the burn area, are we going to have problems with hanging a food bag? I thought the lakes we are staying on were at least mostly out of the burn but I don't know if we can count on having good trees to hang from. Do we need to invest in a food barrel? Are bears a big concern in this area?
cowdoc	02/15/2018 09:33PM I have heard of the Crag route for winter travel, but not for open water times. Lots of it I thought was through a swamp. Has anybody used it during paddling season?
boonie	02/15/2018 08:55PM Enjoyed reading your trip report and viewing the pictures again, lightfoot, especially now that I've been over all that route. I was also reading the portage reviews again and was struck by how much some can vary with conditions. When I did Gotter to Flying last Sept. there was no landing at the bottom of the steps, which was vastly different from some of the pics, even one only about a month earlier!
Lightfoot	02/15/2018 07:43PM We did that exact route in 2012 and I did a short trip report. Brant Lake entry report.
boonie	02/15/2018 04:14PM You guys will be fine. A couple of half days to get there - I'm more than twice your age and would plan on a couple of half days or so. It sounds like you're organized, so should go pretty well. I have so many pockets between my pants, shirt, and PFD, that I don't need the fanny pack/thwart bag I used to take! But it doesn't take long to clip them on. Personally, I'd take the canoe first and let the guy with the pack lead, although Crag might be an exception; I'll bet they don't get much use. Otherwise you're not too likely to run into anything you can't step over; I didn't. I haven't really been on any of the 2nd day lakes, so just go with the flow. It's not going to be much different either way and probably easier overall than the 1st day. Here is a link to my Shutterfly account that has some pictures of the route out to Gillis in the 2017 album. You might be interested in some of the portage pictures and a few others. After you click on the thumbnails to enlarge, there are captions. The 2015 album would have some pics from Mora up to Tuscarora and out to Round. BTW, if you haven't done it before, it will probably take you a good 3 hours to drive from Duluth to Round Lake, maybe a little more. You'll have a good trip, see some nice new country. Enjoy it.
A1t2o	02/15/2018 01:56PM Yeah, I use the carabineer on the water bottle myself. At camp I reuse it to hang the food bag, its a big carabineer. Everything in bags, we do have day packs though with our tackle boxes and sometimes snacks and cigars, basically everything we might need when not at camp so we don't need to ever open our bags, except for rain gear. So I guess it is 5 bags but the day packs are so small they get tossed on our front or clipped to another bag, whatever is fastest, and might as well be only 3. We always do the bags first, canoe second. That way we can scout the trail without being half blinded by the canoe. That way we also have our saw with us if we need it. Yes the plan is to go from Little Sag to Tuscarora via Mora and Crooked. I've heard good things about the portage and stream from Gillis to Tuscarora though so I might need to check that one out after setting up camp on day 1. The whole idea of the one route vs the other is basically about what lakes are worth visiting and if there are any portages to avoid. Just looking at it, the Peter and Gab route looks more interesting because they are bigger lakes, but sometimes the smaller lakes like Powell, West Fern and Virgin are prettier to see. I figured that this might be one worth asking about. I also fully realize that this is likely to depend on weather and energy levels, so we are probably just going to take in the information we can and make the call when we are there. 4-5 hours to Gillis is not a concern, its just good to know so we can plan ahead. We'll drive from Duluth so we'll probably plan to get on the water around 9 or 10. That will get up to camp around 2. To me that sounds good. Maybe we'll swap drivers halfway and take turns napping in the car so we are well-rested when we get on the water.
boonie	02/15/2018 12:40PM Well, I probably know less about how long it will take you than you do, but . . . :) Portaging is always slower for me even though I've become more organized and efficient about it - I finally took seriously the advice about having everything in a pack, etc. At each portage, you'll have to unload and reload at the other end, which can be more time-consuming than we imagine. I've found that not having to deal with multiple loose items at each portage helps and not doing things multiple times helps. Plus sometimes there are a few minutes extra looking for the portage if it was misplaced ;). You'll have, I think, 8 portages from Round to Gillis, although it's not that far - maybe 8 miles total even double portaging. You won't walk as fast as you can paddle, maybe 2 miles per hour on average since none of the portages are really tough or bad, although we don't know about the ones into/out of Crag. There's some boardwalk on a couple that will slow you a little and a couple of rocky or muddy patches, but should mostly be pretty straightforward. I'd guess maybe 4-5 hours for you to get to Gillis. So just be on the water early, no problem. Here's what I do solo on portages that keeps me moving right along: I have a spare paddle, which is attached to thwarts so I don't have to do anything with it at portages. My Sawyer Water Bottle has a carabiner to attach to the pack. My map case is attached to a pack. So when I reach a portage, I step out and carry my larger pack, water bottle, and paddle, and set them out of the way with my PFD. Then I put on the small pack that I carry with the canoe, attach the yoke, pick up the canoe and go. Things are just reversed on the other end. I assume you'll have three packs and a canoe. It will be a lot easier and faster if you don't fish while traveling and strap the poles in the canoe. If all you have is packed in packs, all you have to do is take two out and set them aside with paddles and PFD's, put on the other pack, lift the canoe and go. I think you'll find it easier, but you can try different approaches and just kind of keep track of it; that will give you a good reference for the future. I know a lot of people say not to take the canoe first, but most of the time - probably 99% - there's no problem. That avoids lifting everything out of the canoe, lifting the canoe out of the way, lifting the packs again to put them on, and . . . you'll figure it out for yourself with a little trial and error. Some people also don't want to carry anything in their hands, but I don't mind carrying a paddle in one hand with my arm through the PFD armholes. I usually eat while walking back for the second load and drink water on the third trip. This stuff may or may not work for you, but think about giving it a try. It's some stuff a guide I met on a trip one time told me. If you're moving pretty smoothly through there, 4 hours is certainly possible. As for your second day, I've never been either way; I've always come from Malberg through Elton, or from Tuscarora through Mora, which I assume is the way you'll head out . . . ? Of the two options you listed both have the same number of portages and they are about the same total distance of portages, although the one is obviously a longer total distance (maybe an hour more paddling), but not much depending on where you want to end up on Little Sag. Since portaging is tougher, especially with a heavy canoe, I'd say take whichever looks easiest.
A1t2o	02/15/2018 07:59AM How long do you think it will take to get to Gillis from Round? I'm more used to judging paddling time so these short paddles and lots of portaging throw me a bit. Would you say 3-4 hours? We are likely to double portage since we do not have a light canoe, probably going to take my Old Town since it does well with rocks and cuts through the water really well. For the second day, would you recommend Peter-Gab-Rattle or Powell-West Fern-Virgin to get from Gillis to little Sag? I was thinking Peter route might be better since it looks like less portaging but more paddling and the elevation on the Powell route doesn't look fun.
boonie	02/14/2018 06:42PM I assumed that's what you meant; I never did find the one to Fay last fall. Flying to Green is tough and that's both ways (I did it both ways) as mentioned. It seemed a lot longer than the listed length too. It was hidden back in the trees quite a ways on Flying - the water level must have been a couple of feet higher. That was a good thing on Gotter for the portage to Flying, although I don't know how it'll be when you get there and how that would apply to the Crag portages. Definitely give the Crag portages a go. I'll be interested to hear how those are. The three portages from Round to Brant are flat, not hard, maybe a little muddy, some boardwalk. The worst part is there is only a couple of minutes paddling between them. Brant is a pretty nice lake. The Brant to Gotter will be your toughest portage of the ones I know - all except the Crag portages. Green to Bat is not hard and Bat to Gillis is not hard. The hardest part about it is there's not much paddling between them. BTW, the Tarry to Crooked portage is a bit of boulder field at the Tarry end, tough takeout - especially solo on a windy day ;). It'll be a little easier with a helper. I think you'll like the trip.
A1t2o	02/14/2018 03:41PM boonie: "Second, what do you know about the Flying to Green portage? And what's the slightly longer route you plan to take? The Flying to Green portage landing was flooded out and hidden well back in the trees." Everything I've read about Flying to Green is that it sucks. Steep 60 foot climb and decent. The alternative route would be to never go to Flying Lake at all and take Crag instead. A bit further but less rocky and not nearly so steep. I don't mind traveling further, it is the rough terrain where you could hurt yourself that sucks. I'll do it if I need to but given the chance, I'll just go around.
boonie	02/14/2018 02:33PM First, the campsite inspector13 mentioned is nice. It's a climb to the site, but I like elevated campsites. It has a nice tent pads. I think there are several nice sites on Little Sag, although I've not checked the others out. I've never seen more than a couple of people there. Steve and I didn't see anyone when we there for a day and a half. Second, what do you know about the Flying to Green portage? And what's the slightly longer route you plan to take? The Flying to Green portage landing was flooded out and hidden well back in the trees. Water levels were high throughout that area last fall when I was there; not sure how much was due to beaver activity vs. rain. On Gotter go as far back in the NW corner as you can - the portage is around the corner behind a rock. Flying is a little bit of a pain - the steps are quite steep and there was no landing at the bottom. The water at the bottom of the steps was deep also. At least there will be two of you. A day would be plenty of time for paddling around Little Sag without fishing. You could also day trip SE or SW; depends on whether you'd rather fish or explore. Go down to Fente if you have time. On Tuscarora, camp 520 is nice, and 542 is also a decent site. Your last day will be mostly portaging, starting with a pretty good climb out of Tuscarora. After that not too bad, just long. Little Sag is really nice, Tuscarora is nice. You'll like it. Enjoy yourselves!
inspector13	02/14/2018 01:31PM Boonie and I camped at the site that is listed as 812 for two days. It is on the narrow peninsula located on the lake’s north-west side. The main area is elevated with a nice view and it also has a sandy beach area. Nicek, I’m thinking you are using the map section on this website, but it is a little messed up. Vierge Lake is a small lake by the peninsula site we stayed at, but it is hidden on the other side of a ridge. A1t2o, I just saw your post as I was about to make one. The map is messed up on this website.
A1t2o	02/14/2018 01:22PM What's the difference between Little Sag and Vierge Lake? Some maps say its all Little Sag and others say there are two different lakes there.
nicek	02/14/2018 01:04PM This is from campsite 531. Great view of the Vierge lake. Good site. Enjoy it.
A1t2o	02/14/2018 12:36PM So I think my buddy and I are decided on this years trip. The plan is to drive up mid June to Round Lake and use the Brant EP. Night one on Gillis, night two and three on Little Sag, night four on Tuscarora, then exiting using the Missing Link EP back to Round Lake. The idea is to take a loop and see more lakes without going out of our way to make things difficult. I know Brant to Gillis is going to be rough, but that is why we want it on day 1. Getting in and hitting it hard at the beginning is our style so this works. After that it should be easier. I already know about the Flying to Green portage and plan on avoiding that by taking the slightly longer route. Any other tips or advice about this route that I should know? Detours worth taking? Where on Little Sag to go on our layover day and where to camp? Same for Tuscarora and Gillis on where to camp and things I should do. I have read reports and campsite reviews, but thought I would check with the community to see what others have to say for someone who has never been up the gunflint. I do worry that Little Sag is going to be a large lake to explore in a day and a half. Should I pick a section and stick to it or try to cover ground and just see as much as I can? We will be fishing too so any advice would also be appreciated.