I just got an InReach Mini, one of the options when you set it up is to buy GEOS SAR 50 plan for $24.95. That covers you for expenses up to $50,000 in case of a rescue.

I bought this inReach Mini for peace of mind. If I am in the BWCA and, for some reason, get in real trouble and hit the SOS button, do I have to pay for my rescue?

Relevant link

Previous discussion on this very topic on this site.

Another relevant link

I have no idea if I would need to pay. And that is the main reason I purchased the insurance plan. If you own one you would have to ask this question every time you hit the SOS button. We travel all around the country in our camper to places that have no cell service. I was just reading that Garmin just had their 6000th rescue with the inreach units. You never know…

I can find out next week. I’m working with a guy that is on the SAR team for the BWCA and surrounding area. It’s still May and I’m already hearing stories of unprepared/ignorant people.

Generally no, and they'll get you out and probably to the nearest appropriate medical facility. Or an ambulance and your insurance will get you to a medical facility. But generally neither would get you to hospital near your family and home.

Like all insurance, its based on odds.

I paid for a rescue plane... Quetico, May 23, 2001.

Best $80 I ever spent!

That was pretty cheap bobber... I’d say the rescue people are usually volunteer, but something like aircraft could get pricey. Like here if you go by ambulance it is about two grand minus insurance. A helicopter is about 40 grand... but I wouldn’t be concerned about that if say you were having heart issues or something else serious. It’s why you need to be prepared for things and be smart about taking chances and such.

If you pressed that button because the mosquitoes are so thick, it's muddy, you are dirty & miserable and just want to go home. Yes/highly likely.

Some more info. Who pays for SAR

billconner: "Some more info. Who pays for SAR "

I read the link that Bill posted and it said an interesting thing that got me thinking. Places Lake and Cook don’t have many people to spread rescue costs around. Hennepin County on the other hand has lots of people to pick up the tab on rescuing people. My yearly cost for the SARS rescue plan is $24.99. I think it’s not that bad for insurance. I could see that in the future many places are going to start charging people for rescue.

Savage Voyageur: "

billconner: "Some more info. Who pays for SAR "

I read the link that Bill posted and it said an interesting thing that got me thinking. Places Lake and Cook don’t have many people to spread rescue costs around. Hennepin County on the other hand has lots of people to pick up the tab on rescuing people. My yearly cost for the SARS rescue plan is $24.99. I think it’s not that bad for insurance. I could see that in the future many places are going to start charging people for rescue. "

Mine was cheap because he was flying by anyway...

Think about it. . . we spend $3000 on a kevlar canoe, $300 on ultra light paddles, and who knows how much on the rest of the gear. Then we buy a Spot or Garmin In Reach or another device.

Then. . .balk at $12 to $20 for rescue insurance?

I just consider it as required when I bought the Spot. Just skip a McDonalds stop on the way up and you have it covered.

The SAR insurance wouldn't payout if the locals SAR forces would do it for free ordinarily. And then it will expect your health insurance to pay max. This makes lots of money for the people selling it. Make a donation to one of the local fire departments instead.

This is for BWCAW, not Siberia or Thailand or equally remote and exotic location. Well, maybe toss in New Hampshire who seem to be only place in US back charging for rescues.

ockycamper: "Think about it. . . we spend $3000 on a kevlar canoe, $300 on ultra light paddles, and who knows how much on the rest of the gear. Then we buy a Spot or Garmin In Reach or another device.


Then. . .balk at $12 to $20 for rescue insurance?


I just consider it as required when I bought the Spot. Just skip a McDonalds stop on the way up and you have it covered."

Exactly. Well put!!!

GEOS SAR benefits

Sorry, I called it insurance and as this says it is not insurance. It would be interesting to know if its ever paid out.

If you're in a group, it only covers you, so each person has to pay up.

In the end the GEOS benefits will just to cover the cost of extraction, should there be a charge. I'm not aware of any SAR in the US or CA that charge for bona fide emergencies, only negligent use. I'd rather tip generously when in Ely and usually make a donation to a local organization then send it to GEOS stockholders (who haven't really done that well).

So true... I've paid for insurance all of my adult life in one form or another what's another $20 a year. Just call it CYA.

I meant to add that at least Utah, Colorado, and New Hampshire have SAR cards. The income is distributed to the local SAR organizations. All voluntary. NH and UT are around $25/yr individual, $35 family. CO is $3/yr or $5/5 yr. I wish MN and NY would offer same.

What is the difference between an insurance an GEOS? I guess I am a little bit confuse
and that is why I did not pick that option. And as someone else stated GEOS only covers for the person who owns the InReach. If they different things, how do you buy a SAR insurance?

aurora: "What is the difference between an insurance an GEOS? I guess I am a little bit confuse
and that is why I did not pick that option. And as someone else stated GEOS only covers for the person who owns the InReach. If they different things, how do you buy a SAR insurance?"

GEOS is the same thing as the insurance people are talking about. If you own a Garmin InReach unit or similar Garmin product you can get the GEOS SARS plan for $24.99 a year. It only covers one person (YOU)at this price. I will be adding my wife to this plan, this year for an additional price. I called it insurance because it covers you just like any other policy. Just like dental, life, health, auto, home owner, in the event of a need they will pay the bills. To purchase GEOS SARS you need to log into the Garmin site and buy it. GEOS is now owned by Garmin.

aurora: "What is the difference between an insurance an GEOS? I guess I am a little bit confuse
and that is why I did not pick that option. And as someone else stated GEOS only covers for the person who owns the InReach. If they different things, how do you buy a SAR insurance?"

Aurora-
From where in the world?
What do you want it to pay for?
Then ask your current health insurance provider what they won't cover in a rescue scenario.

As best I can tell anywhere in US or Canada, SAR is paid for by taxpayers. It will get you to medical transport without charges. My health insurance - a medicare advantage plan - will cover the transport and the rest of the medical except normal deductibles and co-pays.

Outside of US and CA, it can be different I believe.

If I have a health emergency and go to any emergency room, my health insurance will pay for the ambulance and er costs (less a $75 er co-pay). My homeowners will pay for temporary housing, board up, etc., even after I incur the expense before notifying them. Unlike insurance, GEOS will only pay for services they dispatch after you have notified them by the SOS button and only what your insurance doesn't cover. (Loose your device before hitting SOS and use cell phone, they won't pay). Its a membership and there are member benefits which they can provide how and when they choose.

I can't find anything it will pay for in US and CA where SAR is paid for by taxpayers. I also found no reports it has actually paid out.

Please do research on what insurance you already have covers as well as what local SAR provides for the area that you traveling and then donate accordingly. The mindset from the quote below plays into the business model that many companies are pushing currently. Offer a service for a price point just low enough that the public will subscribe but never fully utilize and then collect the annual premiums.

martian: "So true... I've paid for insurance all of my adult life in one form or another what's another $20 a year. Just call it CYA."

The only health insurance with premiums I can [barely] afford has deductibles so high that I'd never be able to afford to use it. Since a trip to the hospital would likely eviscerate me financially anyway, I'm not concerned about whether SAR would cost me anything as well. Yay for capitalistic healthcare systems and extortionist insurance providers.

Utah Colorado and NH all have versions of Hike Safe cards. Essentially it waives the cost of your rescue, except in instances of extreme negligence. Because of NH funding is NOT all at taxpayer expense the victim becomes the billee on occasion.

cost of rescue

I like the last quote: “You have to do something pretty outrageous to get billed"

I did some research. First, homeowners insurance will NOT pay for lodging in a SARS situation. The only time HO insurance pays for lodging is when your home is not inhabitable. Second, most of us have high deductible insurance plans. (You can thank the Affordable Care Act for that). I have a plan through my company that I own. Even that plan has a high deductible. Ambulance, etc., goes through the deductible on my plan

As others have stated, GEOS is not typical insurance. It covers what insurance does not. In my case, and the case of 99% of americans that is everthing under $8000 or whatever the deductible is.

From the benefits page:
GEOS Costs - GEOS will cover the costs attributable to the Member in respect of Search and
Rescue costs and expenses (including by air) necessarily incurred and arising from a need to
prevent bodily injury, illness, or danger to such Member's life provided that search and rescue
services have been recommended by the appropriate emergency authorities. These shall be
from the time when first responders advise that additional search and rescue services are
required and shall cease when the Member is delivered by the responders to a place of safety.

The place of safety is where you get into ambulance, and geos benefits cease.

There was a big stink about a family of four who called to be rescued. Here's the NYT article:

As her family began what was supposed to be a monthslong journey in a 36-foot sailboat from Mexico to New Zealand, Charlotte Kaufman wrote openly of her misgivings about taking her two daughters — ages 1 and 3 — to sail the South Pacific, with her husband as captain and herself as the crew.

“I think this may be the stupidest thing we have ever done,” she wrote in her trip blog, before concluding: “It is a difficult self-imposed isolation that is completely worth it.”

Less than two weeks later, 900 miles off the coast of Mexico, Charlotte and her husband, Eric, unable to steer their ship, the Rebel Heart, called for emergency help. Their younger daughter, Lyra, who had been treated for salmonella just weeks before the trip, was covered in a rash and had a fever. After a complicated rescue effort orchestrated by the California Air National Guard and the United States Navy and Coast Guard, the Kaufman family was on a Navy ship heading to San Diego, scheduled to arrive on Wednesday.

But well before they set foot on dry land, the Kaufmans have become the focus of a raging debate over responsible parenting. Some readers of their blogs have left blistering comments suggesting that the authorities should take their children away, seizing on such details in Ms. Kaufman’s postings as the baby rolling around and unable to sleep because of the ship’s violent pitch, and soiled diapers being washed in the galley sink.

Experienced sailors have also shaken their heads.

“I have a rule in my mind that I would never bring a kid less than 2 years old,” Matt Rutherford, who has completed several solo journeys across the seas and is planning to sail to Japan from Northern California this month, said in an interview. “There’s some real risks here, and you bring somebody else along and you’re taking the risk for them, too. That’s a serious question.”

Still, other observers said the parents were doing the right thing by following their passion and involving their children early. Pam Wall, who began sailing with her children when they were infants and traveled around the world with them for nearly seven years, said the Kaufman family — whom she does not know — had seemed to take the necessary precautions. “There were probably a series of events that two people just couldn’t handle,” said Ms. Wall, who has served as a consultant for dozens of families contemplating similar trips.

She often tells them that the sooner they get their children aboard a boat, the better. “The whole idea of being a family that goes out to sea is that you are totally self-sufficient,” Ms. Wall said.

But critics have borne down not only on the couple’s parenting judgment but also on their qualifications as sailors and the expense involved in their rescue, with some calling for them to be forced to pay the tab. The rescue involved three state and federal agencies and had California Air National Guardsmen parachuting from airplanes into open waters to escort the Kaufmans into inflatable boats before their sailboat was sunk on purpose.

James Gardner, 56, a fisherman from Oceanside, Calif., who said he had spent 45 years on the sea and now owns a bait shop near the docks, called the decision to take such young children on such a journey “ridiculous.”

“Teenagers, maybe, but kids of those ages — I think it was asinine,” Mr. Gardner said in an interview. “He put his family at risk. Any Joe can take a Coast Guard course and you are a captain — it is just above a cereal box certification.”

The couple had spent months preparing for the ocean crossing. They chose a route that is generally considered safe by experienced sailors — traveling along trade winds and waiting for the right conditions. Ms. Kaufman posted pictures on her blog and Facebook of mounds of food and diapers nestled into the boat’s crevices.

Just days before they were to set sail, Ms. Kaufman and Lyra were told they had salmonella and given antibiotics, according to posts on her blog. They postponed the trip for a couple of weeks and apparently had clearance from their family doctor in a small town on the coast of the state of Nayarit, Mexico, where they had been living since last year preparing for the trip.

Dr. Beth E. Ebel, an attending physician at Seattle Children’s Hospital, said it would not be unreasonable to take children on such a trip. “I think people should take the big important precautions, like wearing life jackets, but I don’t fault them for being out of instant touch with modern medicine,” she said. “It’s our job to be prepared and to have a backup plan. It sounds like they needed their backup plan and executed it.”

But some parenting experts said in interviews on Monday that they took a dim view of the whole expedition. “I am very much anti-Bubble Wrap and think we should be giving our kids safe risks, but that doesn’t mean exposing them to actual risks,” said Ashley Merryman, a co-author of a parenting book called “NurtureShock.” “It’s not as if a 1-year-old is going to remember an experience, whether it’s positive or negative. We all need to think about what they are really ready for.”

Even some family members questioned their actions. Ms. Kaufman’s brother, James Moriset, told a television station in San Diego, where the Kaufmans used to live, that he had refused to send them off.

“I saw this coming — I saw the potential for every bit of it,” Mr. Moriset said. “I don’t understand what they were thinking to begin with. I’m sorry, I don’t even like to take my kids in a car ride that would be too dangerous, and it’s like taking them out into the big ocean?”

In a statement issued from aboard the Navy ship, the Kaufmans vigorously defended their actions.

“When we departed on this journey more than a year ago, we were then and remain today confident that we prepared as well as any sailing crew could,” they wrote. “The ocean is one of the greatest forces of nature, and it always has the potential to overcome those who live on or near it. We are proud of our choices and our preparation, and while we are disappointed that we lost our sailboat and our home, we remain grateful for those who came to our aid and those family and friends who continue to encourage and support us.”

billconner: "I like the last quote: “You have to do something pretty outrageous to get billed"


"

And now that you are a New Yorker had you read of this rescue? Twice! Its a little different in that a PLB was activated ...twice.. The use of the PLB was what raised the ire of rescuers.rescue page 1

page 2

Yellowcanoe - do you know when this was? I searched for a year but didn't see it.

billconner: "Yellowcanoe - do you know when this was? I searched for a year but didn't see it."

I rummaged in Adirondack Explorer.It was 2005 I think.

A good (and recent) article on when to use an SOS. Nothing to do with GEOS membership.


When to initiate SOS

That's an interesting case, Yellowcanoe. At the very least, the man rescued twice should feel ashamed. He was clearly not prepared on his second trip into the woods.

At one time Wyoming had and additional fee you could pay that covered rescues when one brought a hunting or fishing lic.

It was like fifty cents. It is up to 2 dollars now

When I brought a lic I always paid it.

The last I checked many years ago they had millions in the account.

It is a great program others states should adopt it.

billconner: "A good (and recent) article on when to use an SOS. Nothing to do with GEOS membership.



When to initiate SOS "

^Great link^

billconner: "I like the last quote: “You have to do something pretty outrageous to get billed"
"

It was interesting in the articles linked to above that charges often seem to be applied when people have behaving somehow irresponsibly. I am no authority on the Terms and Conditions of the GEOS SAR insurance-like memberships, but their T&C’s also seem to have clauses that are similar. Under “Exclusions” they list:

• Negligent and willful exposure to dangerous situations except in an attempt to save human life. This does not exclude reasonable dangers associated with normal activities that a normally prepared person would engage in.
• Inadequate provision or training or competence needed to safely complete the trip being undertaken, as defined by regular participants of stated activity.

I read that as “you didn’t know what you were doing, you were not properly prepared or equipped, and you should not have been doing that” as reasons they might not pay. Does anyone read that differently? Please look at the actual T&C for full context.

First, Consumers' Reports article on health insurance and ambulances is interesting. Nice to affirm that on Medicare, its covered, air or highway. Even better that as part of one of the Covid relief packages passed by Congress that the balance billing or hidden surprise billings will be further limited as of 1/1/2021, though not all of them for all ambulance and all insurance.

Your ambulance ride...

Second, I called the customer support number for GEOS SAR BENEFIT TERMS AND CONDITIONS found in their terms and conditions and, as I knew was possible, did not get a clear answer. My questions focused on search and rescue in the US, and in particular the costs of transport from a base or marshalling area, like an entry point or an outfitter which I had seen via reports have both been used, to a hospital. It may or may not be the GEOS benefits would include paying the portion of an ambulance charge that your health insurance does not pay. They have to have coordinated it, and not sure if it means they have to select and call the ambulance or what.

So to answer the original question, I believe based on my research - and this is second time I looked at this extensively - that the search and rescue portion of a wilderness emergency requiring evacuation in the BWCAW and almost anywhere in the US (and Canada I think) would be paid for by the taxpayers, usually volunteers working with local authorities. That would get you to a landing or entry point or something like that. Getting you from that point to an "appropriate facility" for treatment if necessary may or may not be beyond "search and rescue".

So, most important, know what your health insurance covers in terms of transportation now, and as of 1/1/21 when the laws change. While I was working - sole proprietor - and buying own health insurance and now, on Medicare, I was covered. If your transportation is not fully covered, you might want to look into adding it to your insurance at additional cost, but I don't think you should assume the GEOS member benefits will cover it.

If you're concerned about getting from that region to one near your home, or getting your remains transported, that's medical evac, a different product, which GEOS also sells, at a much higher price. (I can't find a plan that would take my cremains to Quetico, a more certain eventuality. Guess I'll have to rely on my sons.)

In the end, I'd much rather give my $24.95 to the St Louis County, Lake County, or Cook County SAR, and believe there would be much more benefit to that. And if anyone reading this is a volunteer with those groups, THANK YOU!

billconner: "First, Consumers' Reports article on health insurance and ambulances is interesting. Nice to affirm that on Medicare, its covered, air or highway. Even better that as part of one of the Covid relief packages passed by Congress that the balance billing or hidden surprise billings will be further limited as of 1/1/2021, though not all of them for all ambulance and all insurance.


Your ambulance ride...


Second, I called the customer support number for GEOS SAR BENEFIT TERMS AND CONDITIONS found in their terms and conditions and, as I knew was possible, did not get a clear answer. My questions focused on search and rescue in the US, and in particular the costs of transport from a base or marshalling area, like an entry point or an outfitter which I had seen via reports have both been used, to a hospital. It may or may not be the GEOS benefits would include paying the portion of an ambulance charge that your health insurance does not pay. They have to have coordinated it, and not sure if it means they have to select and call the ambulance or what.


So to answer the original question, I believe based on my research - and this is second time I looked at this extensively - that the search and rescue portion of a wilderness emergency requiring evacuation in the BWCAW and almost anywhere in the US (and Canada I think) would be paid for by the taxpayers, usually volunteers working with local authorities. That would get you to a landing or entry point or something like that. Getting you from that point to an "appropriate facility" for treatment if necessary may or may not be beyond "search and rescue".


So, most important, know what your health insurance covers in terms of transportation now, and as of 1/1/21 when the laws change. While I was working - sole proprietor - and buying own health insurance and now, on Medicare, I was covered. If your transportation is not fully covered, you might want to look into adding it to your insurance at additional cost, but I don't think you should assume the GEOS member benefits will cover it.


If you're concerned about getting from that region to one near your home, or getting your remains transported, that's medical evac, a different product, which GEOS also sells, at a much higher price. (I can't find a plan that would take my cremains to Quetico, a more certain eventuality. Guess I'll have to rely on my sons.)


In the end, I'd much rather give my $24.95 to the St Louis County, Lake County, or Cook County SAR, and believe there would be much more benefit to that. And if anyone reading this is a volunteer with those groups, THANK YOU! "

I completely agree, after reading the St Louis County Search and Rescue web page that they do not charge for rescues, but they do accept donations I will definitely make a donation to such brave group of people that risk their own lives every time someone hits the SOS button.

St Louis County search and rescue

I take out the policy each year along with the additional medivac coverage. Again, its less then my family spends at McDonalds. In reading the coverage, it will pay for any charges not covered by insurance for transport to a care facility. That goes beyond SAR, and can cover both ambulance and Medivac to a hospital in Duluth.

If you don't think that is important, check out what your health insurance covers for ambulance, and air transport. Then check out the deductibles.

Or you can just eat at McDonalds.

A good system imho.

NH rescue

As a Search & Rescue volunteer in Colorado I may be able to add some insight, but my info is only accurate for Colorado. Other states may vary.
Here in Colorado you can not be charged for a true search/rescue mission.
They don't want anyone to delay calling for help because of possible financial responsibility. With that said, you can be charged civilly and/or criminally.
Civilly - you crash your hot-air-balloon on the side of a mountain... and leave the wreckage there. The rescue of the occupants was free, removing the debris from the side of the mountain is what they were charged for, but only after the owner failed to remove the wreckage after many requests to do so.
Criminally - false reporting. Calling in a bogus call causing the launch of a mission only to determine it was a case of false reporting. They were charged with false reporting and pursued for reimbursement of actual costs for all of the rescuers expenses. (Mainly mileage and deputies time)
But.... you can incur a bill for medical. If you were hauled off by ambulance or air-ambulance you will get a bill for the ride in that medical vehicle, not the rescue mission itself.
Here in Colorado, "insurance" is not really insurance but rather a donation to a Search & Rescue fund. We have the CORSAR card. Colorado Outdoor Recreation Search And Rescue card. The card helps reimburse the expenses of search and rescue missions, by funding the Colorado Search and Rescue Reimbursement Fund. Twenty-five cents of each Colorado hunting and fishing license, and boat, snowmobile and off-highway vehicle registration also goes into the fund. Or the cost of the card directly which is $3 for a one-year card, or $12 for a five-year card. I always have a fishing license so I don't have / need the card.
Search / Rescue missions fall into 3 categories:
Tier 1, Tier 2 and Tier 3
Tier 1 is when the subject of the search/rescue is the person who actually possesses the CORSAR card, a hunting or fishing license, a boat or snow machine registration, etc.
Tier 2 is when the subject of the search/rescue is with/accompanied by a person who actually possesses the CORSAR card, a hunting or fishing license, a boat or snow machine registration, etc.
Tier 3 is when the subject of the search/rescue mission has not made any contribution to the fund in any way, like an Alzheimer's patient who walks away from a facility, or a non-recreator.
At the end of the year all teams (overseen by the county sheriff department) across the state compile their mission data and submit it to DOLA, Department Of Local Affairs. DOLA puts all missions in the three tiers and then starts dispersing funds with Tier 1 first, Tier 2 second, etc.
The reimbursement funds typically run out in the middle of the Tier 2 missions, the last I was in the loop on this.
That's it. That's all I got. I hope some of it was helpful.

yellowcanoe: "

billconner: "Yellowcanoe - do you know when this was? I searched for a year but didn't see it."

I rummaged in Adirondack Explorer.It was 2005 I think."

It was shortly after PLBs were authorized for use in the Lower 48 in 2003, after the pilot program in AK. I was a SAR responder in NH at the time. I think it might have been in the fall of 2004.