Hello,
I live in the Adirondacks and like to do backcountry pond fishing and camping trips averaging 1-4 days. I am in the market to finally buy a pack boat, I’m torn between a few models and was hoping for some feedback, unfortunately I don’t have the opportunity to try all of them.

For reference I am 6’ 210 pounds, looking for as light as reasonably possible for longer portages.

Northstar ADK: I have a northwind 17 and love the boat, love the quality of the boats and designs.

Placid boatworks rapid fire or spitfire 13: I have paddled a rapid fire, loved the speed, heavier than the northstar.

Swift pack boat 13.6, great quality, heavier than the others, and is the price truly justified?

Any help or experiences would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!

The first time I saw a Hornbeck, I nearly jacked it from the guy who had it on his truck. WIH aren’t they on your list? ;-)

Hornbeck Boats

I have several friends who have hornbeck, they are very purpose built hosts, and I understand the local adk allure to them. However while cheaper I would prefer to go to something with a stronger construction, that are still light and a little more performance oriented design.

I thought I was sure I was going for Hornbeck until I tested them. Not for me.

I ended up in a Swift Prospector 14 Pack. Live it. At 29 pounds, lightest canoe I own. I'm an inch taller and 15 pounds heavier and an intermediate paddler.

I would be interested to hear your impression of these Hornbecks in particular if you have seen them:

New Tricks

The Northstar ADK (with it's Starlite layup) is 12' and 19#'s - $1,600 USD - Optimal load up to 250#'s according to Northstar Canoe website. Hard to argue with the price of this boat.

With those numbers in mind; A few really wordy thoughts...

The Placid Boatworks Spitfire (12' pond hopper), is 12' and 18#'s. Same length, and pound lighter, if you're looking for the lightest boat possible. It looks to be solid for loads up to 250#'s. It is, however, $3,400 USD. So it's not inexpensive.

One thing I noted about the Placid Boatworks - I was watching this video...

Placid Boatworks Thwart issue...

...where the owner popped the thwart, apparently leaning on it while getting into the boat. That didn't instill much confidence in me, that the thwarts aren't attached very well to the gunnels. If I lived 1 to 2 hours away from PBW, and I could get that fixed fairly easily, I would probably have had the Rapidfire very high up on my list. However, living a good 15 hour drive away, I just didn't want to deal with that possibility.

---

The Swift Pack Boat 12.6 - 12' 6" - loads up to 260#'s safely - a bit longer than the ADK.
• Kevlar fusion + skid plates + universal mounts = 25#'s - $3,350 USD
• Carbon fusion + skid plates + universal mounts = 23#'s - $3,650 USD
Add carbon thwarts and handles, reduces the weight by 1.5 #s - is that weight savings worth $200 is up to you.

The Swift Pack Boat 13.6 - 13' 6" - loads up to 280#'s safely - a foot longer than the ADK.
• Kevlar fusion + skid plates + universal mounts = 27#'s - $3,350 USD
• Carbon fusion + skid plates + universal mounts = 25#'s - $3,650 USD
Add carbon thwarts and handles, reduces the weight by 1.5 #s - is that weight savings worth $200 is up to you.

Is this Pack boat 12.6 worth it? It's definitely a bit heavier than the Northstar ADK. The universal mount system is fantastic - especially since you're into fishing. It's the lighter of the two Swift Pack Boats.

The Swift Pack Boat 13.6 is a 18" longer than the ADK - so more room. That might be a bonus, depending what you're packing. The Kevlar fusion, while a bit heavier, is also a bit more durable. The carbon fusion layup is lighter by 2#'s, but also a $300 add-on. I'm not really a fan of that pricing point - seems like Swift is the only boat maker that uncharges (at least significantly) for their Carbon layups, compared to Northstar, Wenonah, and Placid Boatworks. Then again, I don't know the details in how the layups are made - so that's just me being ignorant. LOL

I added skid plates to the build of the Swift boats - which increased the price by $150 USD, and about a 1# pound per boat. Are they necessary? I guess it depends where you're paddling. If you don't feel you need skip plates, you probably don't need the durability of the Kevlar Fusion layup. So you could save yourself up to 3#'s right there. Adding the Carbon Thwarts and handles will reduce the weight by another pound or so. If that's worth it to you. ...I do love the universal mount system - adding camera mounts in the middle or either end, fishing rod holders (on either side of the boat), or whatever you want. That's a pretty cool feature, rather than relying on a "clamp".

The kicker here is: I've been told by the people at Rutabaga, the Swift Pack Boat seat is the best in the business — saying it's nearly twice a big as some of the other boats, and nicely padded (read more comfortable). They've paddled all the boats - and apparently some even paddled the Placid, IIRC. If you're going to be on the water a LONG time, whether paddling or fishing, to me, the seat is significant.

When I was looking at boats, I considered everything you did - including the Northstar ADK (I'm too big if I want to load the ADK for any kind of tripping), and other Northstar boats with a pack seat. I went the larger route, with the Prospector 14 Pack because of the extra room, and the initial stability while sitting in the water. ...especially if a larger musky-type fish happens to cross my line. ...which I'm fully expecting. ;) Sitting in that seat while test paddling at Rutabaga, completely sold me.

I also considered the Swift Pack 13.6, which is supposed to be a very stable boat as well. I mean, you can literally watch 5 summers worth of Joe Robinet canoe videos to see how that boat performs - even on portages. ...and he's tiny. Joe had enough room in his boat to pack for 8-10 night canoe trips. Will post a bunch of videos here if you or anyone interested hasn't seen them.

Joe's first time in the Pack 13.6 (red)

Joe's first trip with the Pack 13.6 (green loaner)

About Joe's red Pack 13.6 - Swift has updated this seat since this video.

8-day canoe trip (red pack 13.6)

Joe sold Doug his red Pack 13.6, and bought a new green Pack 13.6

Joe Bushwacking with his green Pack 13.6 - this video is literally a Swift Pack 13.6 vs. John's heavy Nova Craft canoe. ...Bless John for lugging that beast around.

There are a TON more paddling videos on Joe's Youtube Channel.

If weight and price are your top two goals, I'd go with the Northstar ADK. You're not going to beat it. Maybe a Hornbeck? That's in the same size, weight, capacity, and price area; but with that boat, you're sitting on a (foam?) pad on the floor of your boat. I also noticed, on Northstar's website, it looks like they're using a new (larger) seat.

If you look at the bottom two seats, compared to the top seats - the depth is definitely different. That's a HUGE plus, IMO. ...damn. That's interesting... :)



Swift Pack 13.6 - more room. heavier at 24-27#'s, more expensive - about the same price as the Placid Boatworks. If price isn't a big issue, I'm going with this boat because it's of the seat (***not sure this applies anymore***), it's a bit bigger/roomier, and the universal mounts. This one (I believe) also has the least amount of rocker than all the boats. If that's important to you...

Happy hunting.

:)

Thanks for the thorough and incitevul response, definitely have me a few things to think about.

I thought I replied last night but, in any case, I tested both the New Tricks and The Classic. Predictably the New Tricks was less stable than Classic. I found the New Truck uncomfortably unstable and both of them difficult to get in and out. 6-1, 225, some mild arthritis, 70 in 8 weeks. I trip with probably 60- 70 pounds of food and gear do wanted over 300 BB pound capacity easily. Just a simple view. Great family company, do go visit and test.

I'm reading this thread with interest as I am looking to get into a lightweight boat....not necessarily a pack boat though.

If your in ADK, I'd take a look at Slipstream Watercraft. They are making some darn nice lightweight boats. Their factory is in Broadalbin , NY.
Some nice lightweight composite options and they are now vacuum-bagging as well. Custom options are amazing. Also- they have a policy where you can order your boat without down payment and when you take deliver or pick it up....if you're not satisfied, you have no obligation.
Significantly, for handmade boats in New England, their prices seem to be well below the competition.

Blackdogyak: "I'm reading this thread with interest as I am looking to get into a lightweight boat....not necessarily a pack boat though.


If your in ADK, I'd take a look at Slipstream Watercraft. They are making some darn nice lightweight boats. Their factory is in Broadalbin , NY.
Some nice lightweight composite options and they are now vacuum-bagging as well. Custom options are amazing. Also- they have a policy where you can order your boat without down payment and when you take deliver or pick it up....if you're not satisfied, you have no obligation.
Significantly, for handmade boats in New England, their prices seem to be well below the competition."

Interesting. They could use some web site improvements.

billconner: "I thought I replied last night but, in any case, I tested both the New Tricks and The Classic. Predictably the New Tricks was less stable than Classic. I found the New Truck uncomfortably unstable and both of them difficult to get in and out. 6-1, 225, some mild arthritis, 70 in 8 weeks. I trip with probably 60- 70 pounds of food and gear do wanted over 300 BB pound capacity easily. Just a simple view. Great family company, do go visit and test."

Oops, that query of mine was actually directed at the OP (who related having friends with Hornbecks). I do appreciate your response.