A buddy and I are going to each take solos up to Lower Basswood Falls the end of the month. I'm shooting for single portaging and am pretty sure I'll be able to pull it off. What are my options for trimming the canoe, a prism? I was thinking of getting an inexpensive dry bag and filling it up with water at the end of each portage. Would this cut it? Is there a better way? I'm looking for any and all advice here so any input helps!

I have a Prism. My seat is not centered, but is maybe about 15" towards the stern. I put my main 60 lb gear pack just ahead of the permanently mounted yoke. The 20 lb food pack goes ahead of the forward thwart, close to the main gear pack. I use a kayak paddle, so I can push the food pack closer to the bow to trim the canoe when I need to. Works really well. I paddled through 2-3 foot rollers this way on August 2nd, and that was really hairy, but not because of trimming. I had to quarter the waves for about a mile and then do a 3-second 90 degree turn downwind to get the portage. Second worst paddling experience I've had. The first was on Brule in a tandem with my 16 year old son at the time, but that is another story. The waves were coming OVER the back of the canoe. I think it was a Souris River.

At home at local lakes, I use 5 gallon pails of lake water in the same way. At the end of canoeing, I just dump the water back into the lake. The pails have screw tops, so they don't leak when I'm canoeing. I really like my Prism. Had it for 11 years now.

Tomster

Does the Prism have a sliding seat?

For what it is worth, a gallon of water weighs about 8.3 pounds per gallon.

Sorry - I sell pumps, so water and nasty chemicals are my game.

Tomster

quote KevinL: "Does the Prism have a sliding seat?"

Nope, adjustable seat set just a few inches from rear thwart. Almost center. I'll be paddling kneeling.

quote quark2222: "I have a Prism. My seat is not centered, but is maybe about 15" towards the stern. I put my main 60 lb gear pack just ahead of the permanently mounted yoke. The 20 lb food pack goes ahead of the forward thwart, close to the main gear pack. I use a kayak paddle, so I can push the food pack closer to the bow to trim the canoe when I need to. Works really well. I paddled through 2-3 foot rollers this way on August 2nd, and that was really hairy, but not because of trimming. I had to quarter the waves for about a mile and then do a 3-second 90 degree turn downwind to get the portage. Second worst paddling experience I've had. The first was on Brule in a tandem with my 16 year old son at the time, but that is another story. The waves were coming OVER the back of the canoe. I think it was a Souris River.


At home at local lakes, I use 5 gallon pails of lake water in the same way. At the end of canoeing, I just dump the water back into the lake. The pails have screw tops, so they don't leak when I'm canoeing. I really like my Prism. Had it for 11 years now.


Tomster"

Your seat set up sounds like how Bill at Sawbill outfitters set up his solos. My seat is almost center. In the spring I had a 50lb pack behind me and a roughly 30 lb ccs rucksack in front and would push the ruck forward as needed. I did get caught in a side wind and was at its mercy until I got to shore. Just could not turn the boat and keep it tracking, it was a little hairy.

Perfect trim may not do much for you in any sidewind. It is mostly meant for head or tail winds. To me, one of the worst winds is a quartering tailwind. I havent paddled them much, but I think Prisms are know to catch a little wind.

I do have the Bill at Sawbill setup in my Prism. Like it a lot, although it may not be the best for curvy steams. Not bad though. I love my boat, and would not have it any other way. It is really fast going straight.

Tomster

And, when I was going at a 45 degree angle into the 20-25 mph winds on Alton with the food pack pushed nearest the yoke, the canoe tracked perfectly straight, and didn't "weathervane", which is very common in solo canoes, and tough to paddle against. I believe that weathervaning happens when the canoe is loaded too heavy towards the bow. Had my canoe been doing that, that day, I would have probably dumped. It was the only time I have ever tied my packs into the canoe. It was that bad.

Tomster

And, again, Cowdoc, my Prism excels at "breaking wind". That is why I have the woven nylon seats.

Tomster

quote cowdoc: "Perfect trim may not do much for you in any sidewind. It is mostly meant for head or tail winds. To me, one of the worst winds is a quartering tailwind. I havent paddled them much, but I think Prisms are know to catch a little wind."

I'm thinking then, since I don't need to cover a lot of big water, I could be fine. I'm not so much worried about the river, just getting there. Maybe I'm overthinking it.

I have a Bell Magic and single portage with a CCS Pioneer Hybrid.
I bring along two 3 gallon dry bags.
IF I need extra weight in the front (usually only when it's a strong headwind) I fill one of the dry bags up with water from the lake and place it in the bow. If it's still too light, then I repeat with the other one.
Empty the bag(s) when I get to a portage. Repeat on other side.

quote IBFLY: "I have a Bell Magic and single portage with a CCS Pioneer Hybrid.
I bring along two 3 gallon dry bags.
IF I need extra weight in the front (usually only when it's a strong headwind) I fill one of the dry bags up with water from the lake and place it in the bow. If it's still too light, then I repeat with the other one.
Empty the bag(s) when I get to a portage. Repeat on other side."

Sounds like my new plan, Thanks IBFLY.

Single portaging while running a solo seems silly to me. I guess you will have a friend with you, but if you get hurt carrying too much it will still suck. And if your friend isn't single portaging what is the point? Perhaps he is. At any rate, not worth the risk IMHO. I'd rather have the creature comforts and not worry about getting hurt or being unprepared. Plus, I've learned to enjoy seeing a portage without a boat on my head. :-)

Where can I find me a trip partner that will paddle his own solo canoe and single portage all our gear? You busy this spring?

quote quark2222: "And, when I was going at a 45 degree angle into the 20-25 mph winds on Alton... It was that bad."

Alton on a windy day is so much fun. :)

The way the prism is set up (from the factory not the permanent yoke set that sawbill uses) encourages stern-heavy loading and the boat paddles best a little stern heavy. When pushed around by a side wind or quartering tail-wind, the adjustment is to add more weight to the stern not less. If you load your pack close to the seat you should be able to reach neutral trim using the sliding seat unless your pack is heavy and you are not.

quote MNDan: "Single portaging while running a solo seems silly to me. I guess you will have a friend with you, but if you get hurt carrying too much it will still suck. And if your friend isn't single portaging what is the point? Perhaps he is. At any rate, not worth the risk IMHO. I'd rather have the creature comforts and not worry about getting hurt or being unprepared. Plus, I've learned to enjoy seeing a portage without a boat on my head. :-)"

I agree, you do miss the sights of the portage with only one trip across but to me, it just seems redundant to walk one portage three times. It's not that I'm in a hurry to move but it does save me time to do more things around camp, fish more, travel farther and avoid to portage backups that can sometimes occur.

I put the gear pack right behind the seat of my Rockstar. Then the barrel in front so I can move it when trimming is required. I realize this is not a single portage set up but it works well for the type of paddle camping I do.

Trimming a solo canoe while still single portaging is easy if you take the food(typically the most dense load) and put it in a stuff sack at the top of your full size pack. While on the water put it in front of you and your pack behind you. No need for water ballast or anything else. As Your food stores go down put it closer to the end of the canoe or add something else to it. when you get to the portage put it all in the main pack and portage away.
Most folks have the hardest time recognizing when the canoe is out of trim, or how to load it for the conditions they are encountering.

quote RainGearRight: "

quote IBFLY: "I have a Bell Magic and single portage with a CCS Pioneer Hybrid.
I bring along two 3 gallon dry bags.
IF I need extra weight in the front (usually only when it's a strong headwind) I fill one of the dry bags up with water from the lake and place it in the bow. If it's still too light, then I repeat with the other one.
Empty the bag(s) when I get to a portage. Repeat on other side."

Sounds like my new plan, Thanks IBFLY."

Here are the bags:
The Perfect Rock

I didn't use them at all on my last solo.

quote DanCooke: "Trimming a solo canoe while still single portaging is easy if you take the food(typically the most dense load) and put it in a stuff sack at the top of your full size pack. While on the water put it in front of you and your pack behind you. No need for water ballast or anything else. As Your food stores go down put it closer to the end of the canoe or add something else to it. when you get to the portage put it all in the main pack and portage away.
Most folks have the hardest time recognizing when the canoe is out of trim, or how to load it for the conditions they are encountering."

if i ever thought id be able to single, that would be my plan.

quote DanCooke: "Trimming a solo canoe while still single portaging is easy if you take the food(typically the most dense load) and put it in a stuff sack at the top of your full size pack. While on the water put it in front of you and your pack behind you. No need for water ballast or anything else. As Your food stores go down put it closer to the end of the canoe or add something else to it. when you get to the portage put it all in the main pack and portage away.
Most folks have the hardest time recognizing when the canoe is out of trim, or how to load it for the conditions they are encountering."

Yes, that will work too - but takes just as long as filling or emptying the dry bag. An empty and rolled dry bag can just clip to a thwart so no need to dig into your pack.

quote IBFLY: "I have a Bell Magic and single portage with a CCS Pioneer Hybrid.
I bring along two 3 gallon dry bags.
IF I need extra weight in the front (usually only when it's a strong headwind) I fill one of the dry bags up with water from the lake and place it in the bow. If it's still too light, then I repeat with the other one.
Empty the bag(s) when I get to a portage. Repeat on other side."

+1 have a Merlin II, exactly what I do. Works well. Very light if you never need them.

I'll be bringing the dry bags. The food bag idea is good, but all my food will be dehydrated and pretty light. I could put the whiskey up front with the food but might get a little queasy with it that far out of reach:). Thanks for all the replys fellas.

You'll definitely want your whiskey close at hand.

quote RainGearRight: "I could put the whiskey up front with the food but might get a little queasy with it that far out of reach:)"

quote IBFLY: "You'll definitely want your whiskey close at hand."

The horror... imagine if you were to capsize and your whiskey floated away. I would just have to turn around and head for home.

I plan on using the dry bags full of water method myself to trim my solo.

You could also fill your dry bags with whiskey.
Yes, you'd have to carry them instead of emptying them but it might be worth it!
When you're after drinking down the one, you can fill it with water and have a little room to adjust your trim accordingly. Of course, it you start on the whiskey too early in the day, you'll not know if you are in or out of trim, though at that point you wouldn't give a fiddler's fart any way.

quote IBFLY: "You could also fill your dry bags with whiskey.
Yes, you'd have to carry them instead of emptying them but it might be worth it!
When you're after drinking down the one, you can fill it with water and have a little room to adjust your trim accordingly. Of course, it you start on the whiskey too early in the day, you'll not know if yopu are in or out of trim, though at that point yopu wouldn't give a fiddler's fart any way. "

LOL!!!

quote IBFLY: "You could also fill your dry bags with whiskey.
Yes, you'd have to carry them instead of emptying them but it might be worth it!
When you're after drinking down the one, you can fill it with water and have a little room to adjust your trim accordingly. Of course, it you start on the whiskey too early in the day, you'll not know if yopu are in or out of trim, though at that point yopu wouldn't give a fiddler's fart any way. "

I like the way you think.