Is it just me?

I got the park map that shows portages, but is on such a small scale, there is no way to navigate safely with it. Got the topo maps, and while they show detail, portages are not marked. Thing is, I already know the portage is on the east side... I want to know *where* on the east side.

I now found a map on ontario park's website that is the same as the map showing portages, but it shows campsites instead... And not the portages.

Am I missing something?

They have all the data. As far as I can tell, the maps are all government issue. ( And as far as I know, they are my only map options...)

One of the challenges of navigation through Woodland Caribou is the maps. There are quite a few options but none of them are perfect by themselves.

Part of the fun of planning a trip to WCPP is the gathering of information regarding portages, points of interest, campsites and fishing spots and transferring that information to a single map, a GPS or something else.

When I do my planning I work from the old WCPP map, the new Adventure series map that came out earlier this year from Chrismar, other maps I have acquired on the web or from other paddlers, TOPO maps, my GPS maps etc etc. I make marks on my WCPP map and load waypoints into my GPS in case the map is confusing on the water or I can't seem to locate what I am looking for. In addition I talk to others I know who have gone to the area that I am going including Harlan at Red Lake outfitters and Claire with WCPP and mark my maps as necessary.

When I actually go on the trip I bring my marked adventure map, my GPS and maybe one other map that I have printed and transferred information to.

Hope this helps. Look at the map planning as part of the fun of the trip that can be done during hard water season.

I take the MNR topo maps and save them as pdf files.
Then I add the portages and approximate campsite locations.
I add some coordinate points just for reference.
Then I print them at the local library color printer.
Then I laminate them.
Then I figure I am ready as I'm going to be.

For WCPP, I use something like this:






This sample is an early version ... more details on the more current rendition (e.g., cabins, lodges, boat caches, pictos, etc.) In the sample, the top of Mexican Hat is at the lower left corner and the map generally demonstrates the route from Glenn to Telescope lakes (from a 2010 solo trip I took). Blue dots are from the park staff's campsite database ... probably about 60% accurate as far as finding a usable campsite at the indicated spot. Portages are marked in rods (fewer digits covering map details this way) based on a 5:1 ratio (rods:meters). The 1 or 2 letter codes in some lakes are the fish species known to exist there. I've also toned down the "electric yellow" background to something a bit more subtle. (I also have background maps with green for land mass, but I find yellow somewhat easier to read in a map case.)

I print at 1:35,000 scale for more shore line detail (although I typically add a distance scale to each map for additional clarity). I print on 13" X 19" waterproof paper and put a map on both sides of the page (generally offset so I can "marry" adjacent pages to produce a larger area ... I select a little overlap to aid in alignment).

dd

Last year was my first trip to WCPP and I really did not know what to expect despite doing lots of research. Dentondoc helped me with some waypoints. Trip reports were very valuable. Studied google earth until I had it memorized. But still there was conflicting info. Some said portages were hard to find. In my experience, finding portages was not an issue using the old style park maps. The portages were exactly where they were marked on the map. Sometimes I had to go back and forth a couple times before I saw an old faded tree blaze. Even with a super high res map I still would have had to see the tree blaze to find the portage. Once or twice I had to get my GPS out to get back in alignment with the map but the map itself was adequate for navigation. I had all the campsite locations in my GPS and some I was targeting inked on the map.

In my opinion the navigation in the park is what makes it feel much more like a wilderness than the BWCA. Planning your first trip to WCPP is a lot of fun. Having some unknowns going in can make it more exciting with greater anticipation.

I have found that the park map, can be used quite easily for navigation, but I still use the topo 50,000:1 and my GPS. Whenever I plan a new route, which I'm in the process of doing, I take the park map, and put the portages on the topo map, and then with my GPS and topo mapping on that, I put the portages into my GPS.

So far it works great. I'm still working on what dentondoc does, and when I master that, it will be even better.

One thing to remember about the Caribou, this is a wilderness remote area, map reading skills are imperative as is the use of a compass and GPS. In the BW, its pretty easy to get around, or follow somebody, but you won't find that up there.

Blazes on trees, are many times hard to find, or have been burnt by a forest fire. But, the park map is very accurate. So, have fun with your preparation.

The best answer that I can give...
Until late, they expected you to camp where you choose, though in general, there really aren't that many places to choose. Now they want to start seeing people camp in specified spots. They wanted to get these specified spots on this latest map, but they are still ironing out where those specified spots will be. You can bet that the next 'new map' will have some camp site locations listed. Also, keep your ears open for another 'new map' that may be available before your trip. Just don't tell anyone about it ;)
As Bog's stated, we have gotten our best information by beg, borrow and stealing from others. Ask here and on other boards about peoples personal camp site data bases and you might get the best info. Be sure to include your intended route.

We went into WCPP for the first time last year. Although we had our own equipment we used Red Lake Outfitters (Harlan) as our main resource for information and planning the air and ground shuttles. Harlan marked up our topos with the portages and campsites along our intended route. He did this several months in advance so we could plan ahead. His information was accurate and extremely helpful. We did a couple of side trips while basecamping and did not have any issues finding portages on our own.
I agree with what everyone else said. You just have to be prepared and observant. Most portages are located where the park map indicates but on a few occasions it took a little scouting to figure out exactly where they started.
Enjoy your trip!

Dentondoc, what was your source for the topo? I have the skills to do something like that. Best of all, my old eyes could easily read it. I'm a paddler that needs to know where I am at ALL times.

The other problem with the topos I have is that they are b&w. I have trouble reading them quickly.

Yes, reading maps in WCPP is definitely different from BWCA maps. We had an interesting time, but once we realized that the portage markings on the maps were "approximate" we did just fine. Our GPS helped occasionally as well...especially on Jigsaw. Yikes-that is an awesome lake but VERY confusing. We "marked" the portages on our topo maps as best as we could too. Harlan had marked "campsites" for us too on the topo map. But that is part of WCPP's allure....difficult map reading and solitude. It is awesome! We got the new park map in the mail, definitely nice, but not necessarily for navigation.

When you have your exact route figured out you could put it here and others will have some explicit info to add.

quote gnegard: "One thing to remember about the Caribou, this is a wilderness remote area, map reading skills are imperative as is the use of a compass and GPS. In the BW, its pretty easy to get around, or follow somebody, but you won't find that up there. "

I'd say just the opposite, portages in Woodland Caribou make sense, they are for the most part where you think they'd be, in the BWCA they could be, and are, just about anywhere.

I too make my own maps when going just about anywhere, on them, I mark where I am told the portages/campsites are by someone I trust, either by asking or reading trip reports.

quote ECpizza: "Dentondoc, what was your source for the topo? I have the skills to do something like that. Best of all, my old eyes could easily read it. I'm a paddler that needs to know where I am at ALL times.

The other problem with the topos I have is that they are b&w. I have trouble reading them quickly."

Sorry for the delay. I spent all yesterday on the air plane (or in airports).

I generally use downloaded geo-refereneced Toporama maps which I connect to from geogratis. These maps come in the traditional "topo green" which I personally tweeked to get the colors I want (a few steps to do that, but IMHO, well worth it). The search function works pretty well if you have a location reference (esp. if you know what quad's you are looking for).

Aloha

dd

Found a few places (free) to print topo maps. Need some play time to figure out how to do what I want to do. What either can't be done or I haven't figured out yet, would be (on the website) to print out a map larger than 8.5 x 11. As it is It looks like I'll be stitching together a few maps to get the size and scale I want.

quote ECpizza: "Found a few places (free) to print topo maps. Need some play time to figure out how to do what I want to do. What either can't be done or I haven't figured out yet, would be (on the website) to print out a map larger than 8.5 x 11. As it is It looks like I'll be stitching together a few maps to get the size and scale I want."

That's the main reason I download quads so I can stitch them together locally and print at whatever size and scale I want. If you go this route, make sure you download geo-referenced versions of the quads ... it makes the stitching process more or less automatic. (I've been using Memory Map software to do this for about 8 years now.)

dd

I don't stitch mine together because I don't want to fumble with a big map, I find that an 8-1/2 x 11 is a good size to handle and to get a good scale. I overlap the areas so I don't suddenly have to change maps. The park map is used for planning.

I have plastic bags that are the perfect size for the map so I don't concern myself with waterproof paper. And I do take 3 sets of maps although I rarely have had a need for more than one. 1 on the thwart that is always at hand, 1 in my waterproof bag that holds other VIP items, and 1 in my pack holding tent & sleeping bag, in fact I often leave it in the tent because I know I'll probably want to study a map before going to sleep.

I've never bought or owned a commercial map other than the Ontario Park maps

Well, I downloaded maps from the ontario topo site. I liked it better than the national topo format. I stitched together 32 maps on Photoshop. Not as simple a process as it sounds. In some blank space I filled in "Here be Dragons".

I am playing with color and font to fill in portages. I will do some test prints to see what size I will print the map (or maps if need be). I am adding in stuff from trip repots I've read as well.

A big thanks to everyone guiding me on this. I feel 10times better having this self made map that I can read!

Here is my map...

I am welcoming comment and suggestions.

My WCPP map

The file size is greatly reduced for your viewing ease...

Overall, very nice and simple.

I personally prefer a few more lake names.

I'd usually mark picto locations (there is one on Paull and one on South Aegean that immediately come to mind).

Mine has the cave on Aegean marked

There is a 2nd portage on the approach to the falls on Mexican Hat. You start on the left of where the water begins to descend into the channel leading to Mexican Hat (rather than the published right side). I'd only recommend this one if the water level is relatively low because once you start, you pretty quickly take a dog leg to the right and cross the stream and meet up with the normal portage. (Normal portage can be a bit boggy right after you do the landing.)

dd

Lake names are coming, and I am hoping for locations of interesting items, but have no source good enough to put them on a map.

The real challenge is the printing. This map is very vivid on the screen, but when I print it it seems a bit dull. I am experimenting with printer settings so I can see what works best for my old eyes. Also figuring the smallest size printed that I can easily read from 2-3 ft away.

Interesting map, where did you get the campsite info?

I always go with grayscale for ta map, in low light situations that's all you can see anyway. the most important thing being the shoreline.

portages= to me, the most important thing "is there one?" and secondly which side of the river is always nice to know, beyond that, I can find it

quote ZaraSp00k: "Interesting map, where did you get the campsite info?

I always go with grayscale for ta map, in low light situations that's all you can see anyway. the most important thing being the shoreline.

portages= to me, the most important thing "is there one?" and secondly which side of the river is always nice to know, beyond that, I can find it"

My current rendition map of Woodland Caribou PP look like this sample:





Campsites are either dots or flags:

Blue dots: sourced from WCPP Staff data (an approximation of this information is also available in a jpg file). I tend to use the data because then I can ask staff about a specific campsite (since each of the campsites are numbered). The data tends to be about as accurate as legacy data that was the original source of much PCD campsite data.
Red dots are campsites that are not recommended by the park since they are heavily utilized as shore lunch sites by lodge guests (from Sabourin Lake, in the case of Mary's lake, which is pictured)
Yellow dots are campsites that are undesirable due to their proximity to shore lunch sites.
Green dots are campsites which were recommended by park staff (however, few of these campsites were used on a recent trip due to the condition of the sites after last seasons snow-down event or for other reasons)
Red Flags are campsites that are not likely documented by the park staff but have shown up in trip reports from the area
Black triangles are possible campsites (actual usability unknown)

Of course, the obligatory portages (in this case to/from Mary's Lake to Artery Lake...NW corner of map) along with rod length ... line and length both in red

One or two letter initials appearing in water: fish species known to exist in this lake or watershed

Small float plane: landing site

Thunderbird: pictograph location

Caribou symbol: Known calving area

There are several more symbols that appear on other map segments (e.g., boat cache location, lodge, fishing cabin and so on).

BTW: I find the contrast afforded by yellow land background superior to green and better than grayscale images.

dd

quote dentondoc: "
BTW: I find the contrast afforded by yellow land background superior to green and better than grayscale images.

dd
"

it does look nice, I should admit, the main reason I go with gray scale is I'm both cheap and lazy

How did you get the data? All I've found is a map on the ontario parks site. It can't be that accurate because about 20% of the campsites are shown in the middle of the lake.

quote ECpizza: "How did you get the data? All I've found is a map on the ontario parks site. It can't be that accurate because about 20% of the campsites are shown in the middle of the lake."

I got the data from the WCPP park staff back in 2010. I'm guessing they would be perhaps a bit less likely to want to share it now since there has been some change in personnel and they are into a project to more accurately document the campsites ... with something more advanced than the PCD-type representation. But as previously stated, the accuracy of the data is "legacy-like." I'd say 60-70% accurate in the sense that you can confirm the existence (or former presence) of a campsite. Keep in mind that even some of the better campsites don't get used even on an annual basis. I've had to clean growing vegetation from fire rings on quite a few occasions. Then there are also campsites that are not present in the data or other maps (e.g., west side of "pork chop" island on Wrist Lake).

I've located two different on-line accessable maps that have campsite markings ... one shows the locations as exclamation points and the other uses multiple symbols, but mostly green tent-shaped triangles.

dd

One of the cool things about WCPP is the bit of unknown. Yea, it's nice to know where the good campsites are but it can be fun to improvise as well. You can't do the that in the BWCA. Scout out a new spot and practice leave no trace where there was none to begin with.

What Dentondoc said about some of the nice campsites don't get used on an annual basis is very true. Take time on your trip to check out some of the campsites along the way, even if you don't plan on staying.

quote ECpizza: "Here is my map...


I am welcoming comment and suggestions.


My WCPP map


The file size is greatly reduced for your viewing ease...


"

Water level can make a big difference.
Anybody know if the portage north into East Lunch been changed? A couple years ago you started on the left, crossed over to the right, and I think you were not yet done, something else which I cannot remember needed to be avoided, maybe now there is a portage around it all on the left.
Secondly, on East Lunch in low water there are a few places you will likely have to negotiate by getting out and walking the canoe thru. If you have a canoe with a keel I have to believe it will be even more of a problem. Two of these are not rock gardens but smooth rock that is broad and can be hard to find a path thru, I think the third is just a narrow channel that is also hard to find a path. There may even be a fourth, I am going by memory.
And on the body of water between Lunch & Jake ( a wide stream really) there is a rock garden you will either have to get out and walk your canoe thru or even portage.
Maybe someone else has better and more recent info.
And calling out an obstruction between Leano & Bunny, that is minimizing what it really is, it is a full blown carry over or portage IMO unless something has changed the last few years.