I have an 18’ 1991 Sundowner. In previous threads I see where some are talking about the canoe being tippy. This is the way it feels to me also. I really like the canoe but use it very little because of this. I was thinking of buying a web seat and replacing the rear tractor seat with this and moving it about 4” forward. Has anyone done this? Is my idea sound?

I say paddle it more. You'll soon get used to the way it feels. It might want to rock back and forth a little but will always stiffen up when you hit secondary stability. You've just got to let it move a little and not worry about keeping it perfectly flat. The more relaxed you are the better it will feel.

I've owned a Sundowner 18 and thought it was quite stable.

Alan

LOL - I picked up an 18' Sundowner from a guy whose wife was so freaked out by the instability that she wouldn't go paddling. The technical condition is poor initial stability but excellent final stability. This translates to a canoe that takes a little getting used to - but after a while it's fine.

And the 18' Sundowner tracks well, is fast and mine carried me many many miles.

Many years ago my group rented sundowners for our trip. My dad and his brothers had never been canoeing much before this trip. They were all in their 50's at the time. After the first day they got used to the canoes and it was no big deal.

quote Alan Gage: "I say paddle it more. You'll soon get used to the way it feels. It might want to rock back and forth a little but will always stiffen up when you hit secondary stability. You've just got to let it move a little and not worry about keeping it perfectly flat. The more relaxed you are the better it will feel.

I've owned a Sundowner 18 and thought it was quite stable.

Alan"

I totally agree Alan!

I'm surprised that many paddlers consider the Sundowner 18 unstable. Then again, as we often discuss on these Forums, stability is relative to the user.

During the 80's when I worked at Rutabaga, the Sundowner 18 was "THE"
popular Touring Canoe choice for those BWCAW bound. After test paddling sessions, many paddlers chose the Sundowner 18 over the Sawyer Cruiser, Sawyer X-17, the Old Town Canadienne, or the Wenonah Odyssey/Minnesota II, which were the other popular contenders at that time.

Most paddlers felt more comfortable and secure in the Sundowner 18 than the other aforementioned canoes. Although I owned and preferred the Sawyer Cruiser and the Wenonah Odyssey, I let the customers determine what they felt was the best canoe for them. As a result, I sold a lot of Sundowner 18's, although it was not my personal choice.

I remember Mark Walters, (who was the Production Manager of Wenonah Canoe at that time), remarking that many paddlers don't take the time to "learn the hull", as he put it. Mark went on to say, many paddlers are coming from Grummans, Alumacrafts, etc., and they are accustomed to the "feel" of those types of hulls. When you start paddling better designed and more sophisticated hull designs, there's a learning curve.

In other words, give the Sundowner 18 a chance. I think Alan Gage is spot on with his reply. Obviously the Sundower 18, or most any other canoe for that matter, will settle down once it has some cargo in it, which was the design intent of the Sundowner 18.

Nevertheless, if it still doesn't feel right to you, lowering the current seats a few inches would improve the initial stability somewhat, or at least make the hull feel less "tender" to you.

For what it's worth, the "Sundowner" was named after the favorite horse of Rutabaga's original owner, Gordy.

Hans Solo

I've used a Sundowner for over 20 years. I've not have any issues with it being too "tippy", unless I try standing in it.

Stability depends not only upon time in a canoe, but weight distribution. Taller and/or larger folks have more weight above the gunwales. So what feels stable to a 5'8 150 lb paddler may feel "Tippy" to that 6'2" 250 lb paddler?

As for seat re-positioning, "Yes," moving that seat to a wider point on the hull will make it feel more stable. I have moved seats closer to center on several tandems because there has always been a weight disparity between my wife and I. There has always been a noticeable increase in stability.

I say go for it, you have nothing to lose. Here's a picture of my old Northwind with stern seat moved forward about 12":

ozarkpaddler you hit dead on. I am 6'2' 270#. The stern seat it is so far back I am cramped against the gun walls. My thought was to give me more room and have a feeling of being more stable. I paddle this canoe when ever I can. I have never tipped it over but it just has a tippy feeling to it. When I am in my prism I am very stable and have no concerns at all.

quote Mickeal: "ozarkpaddler 04 you hit dead on. I am 6'2' 270#. The stern seat it is so far back I am cramped against the gun walls. My thought was to give me more room and have a feeling of being more stable. I paddle this canoe when ever I can. I have never tipped it over but it just has a tippy feeling to it. When I am in my prism I am very stable and have no concerns at all. "

Friends of ours had the 17' Sundowner and we paddled it a few times. No way I could fish from the boat and I too felt crammed-in to the stern. I had to kneel in front of the stern seat to be relatively comfortable in that boat. Had I been a smaller person, it may have suited me to a tee?

I'm looking for a sundowner, any one have one they want to part with?

I loved my Sundowner for many, many great reasons. I loved the efficient hull and speed of my Sundowner for starters.

But, it always felt scary to fish in it and my wife hated the feeling of it. I usually would take the newbie paddlers with me and they never liked the feeling of that canoe either.

By the end of the trip, they usually had the feel of it down and it didn't matter anymore. It became an extension of their body which built confidence in the canoes capabilities and their abilities to handle it. To me it would always feel like I could roll it in at any moment. But...it never went over. We've rolled the edge to the water line a couple of times and dipped some lake water in over the side and still saved it. The secondary stability was great and that's the one that counts. The initial feeling of paddling a wet log goes away after the first day of paddling.

I changed to a Spirit II for more initial stability for the newbies and for fishing. It was a fair compromise. When I paddle with good canoeists I do miss it a lot.