Does anyone have any pictures of lakes Two, three, or four from last year that shows some of regrowth after the fire? How do the campsites look? Are they burnt up also or did they survive like the sites on Seagull? Are there many areas to hang packs? And lastly, is there still enough decent wood to burn?

I am taking a May trip with someone who was unimpressed with the Seagull/Alpine/Jasper area and I want to assure him that it will be an excellent trip with a lot of new growth and area to explore, but I will need some pics to convince him.

Thanks

Went last year. Numbered lakes 2,3,4 are pretty burned up. Was very disappointing. Campsites had plenty of greenery around them and seems that the campsites were protected well with during the fire. But 30 yards from all the campsites was burned up. A lot of downed wood after the fire....you will have no troubles getting wood for campfire.
We were disappointed. It is interesting to see the fire area, but it was not my favorite trip.

Burnt up pretty bad from lake 2 all the way in to the south half of insula. There still are some good non-burned areas between lake 4 and insula. Hasn't had much time for new growth unfortunately.

this picture was from early june

Just a reminder for anybody that plans on going through those fire areas. The sticks (burnt trees) that are still standing are going to start coming down. Watch out, especially if its windy. I would not camp in a site that has been burnt over.

You say your friend was unimpressed because it was burned? Does he want to see the burn? I got the impression he didn't like it. So you want to take him to a more burned out spot???? Are you sure about that? The photos I've seen don't show a lot of growth except the expected fireweed and plant growth but all the dead blackened trees will be in evidence for years to come.

I have heard from others on this site that Lake Four and Hudson are all pretty much burned. The FS did manage to save many camp sites by dumping water on them during the blaze. Otherwise, you'll have to get all the way to Insula and head north before you are out of the burn area.

I have been traveling in the BWCA & Quetico for more than 30 years and there is always going to be someplace that is burned. It's nature , it happens.

The worst thing about burn areas IMO is the portages. If it's hot out, there is no shade from the sun - that sucks!

Good luck

I'm thinking what Hawbakers said. If your friend was unimpressed with Seagull, he'll be less impressed with the numbered lakes.

Strongly suggest you look at a different entry point, or if you already have reserved that point, head south on the Kawishiwi River. It's a really good and very pretty route.

Photos were taken on Lake Two near the entry into Lake Three in July of 2013. The campsites on Lake One and Two looked fine. Never made it to Lake Three because of a storm but I think it was affected more by the disturbance than One or Two.

It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)

quote The Great Outdoors: "It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)"

While it is good for the ecosystem, it's not good for the eyes.

And that is exactly why towns near the BWCA cannot exist solely on tourism, and seek other types of employment that aren't popular with many!

Not the numbered lakes but somewhere on the route from Pietro-Camdre-Clearwater. I wouldn't want to spend a week in burn area but a long day was great and fascinating. Several sites - I think on Pietro and Camdre - were posted as closed.

quote The Great Outdoors: "It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)"

Personally I like the burn area, you get to see the land like it was after the glaciers receded. Huge boulders on top of a cliff, that would have been hidden before the burn. It's a lot easier to move through the woods and explore, plenty of firewood, and not as many people because many will avoid these areas.

And think of the blueberries by this year!! Maybe a bumper crop?

quote BWPaddler: "And think of the blueberries by this year!! Maybe a bumper crop?"

Just what I was thinking. In the pictures above you can see the burnt trees and the underbrush coming back. There has got to be a bumper crop of them.

quote brantlars: "

quote The Great Outdoors: "It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)"

Personally I like the burn area, you get to see the land like it was after the glaciers receded. Huge boulders on top of a cliff, that would have been hidden before the burn. It's a lot easier to move through the woods and explore, plenty of firewood, and not as many people because many will avoid these areas."

Good for you, brantlars!!
I wish there were more people with your attitude.
You can always see trees, but you cannot always witness the results of Mother Nature's wrath!!

We went through the number chain and stayed on the South side of Insula for 5 days late last fall. I was really impressed with quite a few things: the berries for wildlife were everywhere the grouse this year will probably too fat to fly, the majority of campsites were saved by the forest service and are perfectly useable, firewood is plentiful, as someone else noted the amount of huge boulders and cliffs that are now visable are amazing, moose and bear as well as deer can be seen from a long ways away, hiking is possible in areas that were impassable before, and last but not least the fish don't seem to mind one bit. I really enjoyed the trip and wouldn't tell anyone to change their plans due to the burn.

Here are a few from August 2013

I found it very interesting hiking around the burnt area one can see all kind of different things.

I saw lots of old cans and stuff on one portage looked like a old fuel bottle was stuffed into the hollow base of a tree it had a old wire bail top for the cover. I am guessing from the 20s.

quote riverrunner: "I found it very interesting hiking around the burnt area one can see all kind of different things.


I saw lots of old cans and stuff on one portage looked like a old fuel bottle was stuffed into the hollow base of a tree it had a old wire bail top for the cover. I am guessing from the 20s."

That's the unfortunate part of burning an area. You see what everyone has left behind. However it is still fascinating what you can see with all the vegetation gone. Out here in Calif. I have found Native American arc sites, old mines and lots of old dump sites.

I like it that some call any modern items found in the woods today, littering, when 100 years from now they will be called artifacts! :)

quote billconner: "Not the numbered lakes but somewhere on the route from Pietro-Camdre-Clearwater. I wouldn't want to spend a week in burn area but a long day was great and fascinating. Several sites - I think on Pietro and Camdre - were posted as closed.





"

Most of Pietro burnt real good about 10 years ago also,now burnt again,the last one looks like it just cleaned up already down stuff. About 5 years ago the Pietro area was just all purple fireweed in August,it was rather pretty. Some of Pietro campsites were always not that highly rated but still workable.
I though it was very fascinating looking way out and thinking a moose would be eating on all the fresh grass that was there,when I went thru.

quote The Great Outdoors: "It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)"

I wasn't one of those but I do see the point.

I didn't say I would avoid it like the plague either. The fishing is still good. The only other reason I would avoid Lake One EP is because it's so heavily traveled.

I actually enjoyed seeing the exposed rock out on Seagull. It has a lot of that pinkish rock now visible since the fire.

Fires change the view but I don't think that will stop people from going there.

Thank you for all the pics. Being that seagull was completely barren as compared to some greenery and standing trees (although charred) left on the numbered lakes, I believe that we will be able to find enough scenery to keep us entertained between the fish bites. And the berries make it all the more enticing.

quote Hawbakers: "

quote The Great Outdoors: "It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)"

I wasn't one of those but I do see the point.
I didn't say I would avoid it like the plague either. The fishing is still good. The only other reason I would avoid Lake One EP is because it's so heavily traveled.
I actually enjoyed seeing the exposed rock out on Seagull. It has a lot of that pinkish rock now visible since the fire.
Fires change the view but I don't think that will stop people from going there."

I wasn't trying to single out any one individual, just commenting on how fickle some get when an area changes to something other than what they're used to.
Quite a few years ago when fires swept through Yellowstone (Yosemite???) Park, Ely had many cars with California and Colorado plates on them for about two to three years.
When asked why they came this far for vacation, the common reply was "The fires, we don't like looking at burnt forests because they're not very pretty!"
Traveling through an area that has burnt is an eye opening experience that people should appreciate, rather than avoid.
Some can go an entire lifetime and never see how eerily beautiful it can be. (if that's even a word??) :)

Here are some pictures on the portage from Insula to Hudson.

I should note, these and previous pictures are from our September trip of 2013.


Lake Four reflection
Scars on Pine
Second portage from L.One to L.Two

While most of these pictures show burned areas, my memory of our trip to middle Insula is that it was half and half as far as burned or not. I was very interested with the burned landscape. As others have noted, you get to see landscape that is usually grown in. Giant boulders, mounds, and hills and valleys. The standing burned trees are not as dry as we thought. They make take a year or more to really be viable firewood. My impression is that most of the campsites are in good condition.
Pagami Creek from above...
Pagami Creek Scar From Space

This actually makes it look worse than I felt it was. There are strips and spots of green, even in the most burned areas.

TGO I can see your point for sure. Thanks for clarifying.

Yes I agree TGO people are finicky,worse than the three bears trying to get it just right.

Yellowstone my favorite western park-backcountry.
People realized they were missing something in Yellowstone, and 2 years after the fire in 1988 attendance was up 25% higher than it was before the fire. Many people came to see the change plus even with there big fires much of the area was unburnt.

Did a lot of backcountry packing in Yellowstone in the 80's. The thing maybe that bothered me was some areas that were burnt hard there was a lot of black dirt or ashes so you had to watch where you laid things and just accept you would get dirty.

Very interesting you could see where the elk laid in the burnt over areas and one group of elk in the park took a liking to eating the burnt bark on lodgepole pine in the park. Why? I have no idea.

Hope to get back there this year and enjoy the wildlife,scenery and awesome fishing in the backcountry. It has been a while.

quote PINETREE: "Yes I agree TGO people are finicky,worse than the three bears trying to get it just right.

Yellowstone my favorite western park-backcountry.
People realized they were missing something in Yellowstone, and 2 years after the fire in 1988 attendance was up 25% higher than it was before the fire. Many people came to see the change plus even with there big fires much of the area was unburnt.


Did a lot of backcountry packing in Yellowstone in the 80's. The thing maybe that bothered me was some areas that were burnt hard there was a lot of black dirt or ashes so you had to watch where you laid things and just accept you would get dirty.


Very interesting you could see where the elk laid in the burnt over areas and one group of elk in the park took a liking to eating the burnt bark on lodgepole pine in the park. Why? I have no idea.


Hope to get back there this year and enjoy the wildlife,scenery and awesome fishing in the backcountry. It has been a while. "

The picture is Yellowstone coming in from Cody last summer.

We went through Yellowstone the summer after the fire. In a couple areas there were wild flowers all on the side of the road. My wife said, see how the forest is coming back! We stopped to have lunch in one of those areas. Later we walked to the top of a small ridge that paralleled the road. Over the top, no wild flowers! It looked to me like the Park Service seeded some of the road sides!

A Pic of the Island River, and a reopened site on the Isabella River. May 2013.

quote Barnabee: "...from our September trip of 2013.

Lake Four reflection
"

Great shot, Barnabee! Do you recall what shore this was, exactly?

quote The Great Outdoors: "

quote brantlars: "

quote The Great Outdoors: "It's interesting that quite a few individuals who support burning as the best way to revitalize a forest, will avoid that area like the plague for many years after a fire has gone through! :)"

Personally I like the burn area, you get to see the land like it was after the glaciers receded. Huge boulders on top of a cliff, that would have been hidden before the burn. It's a lot easier to move through the woods and explore, plenty of firewood, and not as many people because many will avoid these areas."

Good for you, brantlars!!
I wish there were more people with your attitude.
You can always see trees, but you cannot always witness the results of Mother Nature's wrath!!"

+1 Burned-over areas are a fact of life in the boreal forest. Without fire there would be no boreal forest as we know it. Paddle in the sub-arctic sometime and you will see the tremendous scale of some of these fires.

quote schweady: "

quote Barnabee: "...from our September trip of 2013.

Lake Four reflection
"

Great shot, Barnabee! Do you recall what shore this was, exactly?
"

Well, I can't say exactly but I'm pretty sure it was in that narrower channel with three campsites lining the shore. West end of the lake.
Near site 1500

This is an awesome pic.

quote Mike1984: "
A Pic of the Island River, and a reopened site on the Isabella River. May 2013."

It was one of those sites I stopped into about a year ago and it had all kinds of little jackpine trees sprouting up everywhere.

Anyone have pictures from the 2014 season?

quote PINETREE: "

quote Mike1984: "
A Pic of the Island River, and a reopened site on the Isabella River. May 2013."

It was one of those sites I stopped into about a year ago and it had all kinds of little jackpine trees sprouting up everywhere."

Weird how those few trees remained unscathed while everything around is devastated. Are there any campsites along the Island River route that are not burnt??? It's a spot I've had in mind for a quick trip with my son...something easy.

May 2014 in area of mouth of Pagami Creek itself - we canoed up Pagami Creek for a ways and it was kind of eerie. The fire when it started was kind of fickle, hitting some areas hard and missing others altogether.











Another day nearby

I believe the first campsite downstream of the Little Isabella is not burnt,just looking at a fire map?

I was camping there the day the fire broke out. Decided it was time to head out. Big Bull moose and cow were sitting in the river on my way out.

This Forest Service site has 3 slide shows with images of the affected area 1, 2, and 3 years after the fire. Very encouraging to see the images from last September.

In VNO's 2015 Gazette, John & Lynn mention that "two new campsites opened up on the north side of Lake One to help ease the pressure of the campsites that were closed..." Anyone know where these sites are located or have a link to a map with those spots marked?

One of them is in the first "arm" coming down from the entry and to the east.

Will have to grab my maps & info & then I'll let you know about the other one.

Edited; both are in that top area. The second one is just north of where the dam is on the map, where the creek starts heading south towards the dam.

GTO
I've always been confused about litter and artifacts. Why is it that if you find something from 20 years ago it's litter and you're supposed to pack it out. But junk left 100 years ago are considered artifacts and your supposed to leave it there?? My grand kids think that 20 year old stuff is historic artifacts?
On that note I don't understand why things written on the bathroom walls are considered graffiti and is washed off. but stuff written on the rocks at the bdud are considered pictographs and they try to keep it on.
Boy, the forest sure got irate when they found me cleaning all that old graffiti off the rocks!! Evan though I explained that I was just following the boy scout motto and leaving the place better then I found it!!

quote Captn Tony: "GTO
I've always been confused about litter and artifacts. Why is it that if you find something from 20 years ago it's litter and you're supposed to pack it out. But junk left 100 years ago are considered artifacts and your supposed to leave it there?? My grand kids think that 20 year old stuff is historic artifacts?
On that note I don't understand why things written on the bathroom walls are considered graffiti and is washed off. but stuff written on the rocks at the bdud are considered pictographs and they try to keep it on.
Boy, the forest sure got irate when they found me cleaning all that old graffiti off the rocks!! Evan though I explained that I was just following the boy scout motto and leaving the place better then I found it!!"

Had the same thoughts my self

quote VoyageurNorth: "One of them is in the first "arm" coming down from the entry and to the east.


Will have to grab my maps & info & then I'll let you know about the other one.

Edited; both are in that top area. The second one is just north of where the dam is on the map, where the creek starts heading south towards the dam."

Thanks, Lynn!

Weird how those few trees remained unscathed while everything around is devastated. Are there any campsites along the Island River route that are not burnt??? It's a spot I've had in mind for a quick trip with my son...something easy."

Yes, as you head west from Isabella, on the way towards bald eagle, it turns green about half way to bald eagle. Even prior to that some of the camp sites are usable And you should be able to reach that area within a day's paddle.

We were on Lakes One, Two and Three in September of 2013. We camped on the north side of Lake three. Plenty of greenery. Picture attached. If I remember correctly the burn area was on the south/southwest side of Lake Three and spread east. I thought there were plenty of viable camp sites on One and Two and part of Three until you get to the south side of Lake three.

quote Captn Tony: "GTO
I've always been confused about litter and artifacts. Why is it that if you find something from 20 years ago it's litter and you're supposed to pack it out. But junk left 100 years ago are considered artifacts and your supposed to leave it there?? My grand kids think that 20 year old stuff is historic artifacts?
On that note I don't understand why things written on the bathroom walls are considered graffiti and is washed off. but stuff written on the rocks at the bdud are considered pictographs and they try to keep it on.
Boy, the forest sure got irate when they found me cleaning all that old graffiti off the rocks!! Evan though I explained that I was just following the boy scout motto and leaving the place better then I found it!!"

Are you serious?

You don't understand the difference between discarded kimbies or plastic bags and things left by early settlers or Native Americans, or bathroom graffiti and 1,000 year old petroglyphs?

quote gkimball: "

quote Captn Tony: "GTO
I've always been confused about litter and artifacts. Why is it that if you find something from 20 years ago it's litter and you're supposed to pack it out. But junk left 100 years ago are considered artifacts and your supposed to leave it there?? My grand kids think that 20 year old stuff is historic artifacts?
On that note I don't understand why things written on the bathroom walls are considered graffiti and is washed off. but stuff written on the rocks at the bdud are considered pictographs and they try to keep it on.
Boy, the forest sure got irate when they found me cleaning all that old graffiti off the rocks!! Evan though I explained that I was just following the boy scout motto and leaving the place better then I found it!!"

"Are you serious? "

No, not serious.

How about entering at Kawishiwi Lake instead? Going north you will pass through some of the eastern most section of the burn, but will also head into some very pretty unburned country north of Lake Polly.

Just a thought.

quote Michwall2: "How about entering at Kawishiwi Lake instead? Going north you will pass through some of the eastern most section of the burn, but will also head into some very pretty unburned country north of Lake Polly.


Just a thought.


"

I've had this route on my to-do list ever since the summer after the fire. Still unchecked. Grr.