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TechnoScout
distinguished member (154)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/19/2019 01:38PM
In putting my gear together for next-month's trip I see that my OR 35L ultralight dry sack is compromised...looks like the coating is pealing away.
Options:
1) use the bag but put it inside of a contractor bag.
2) purchase a replacement

Opinions?

I read several threads on this board...mixture of sealine, sea2summit, and contractor bags.

I'm thinking I will just put my "mostly" waterproof bag in a contractor bag.

I have a bag liner for the portage pack, so this is just multiple layers of protection.

 
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TominMpls
distinguished member(523)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/19/2019 03:19PM
Buy a new one. They're like twenty bucks and you won't be constantly worrying about poking a hole in your contractor bag.

Also, "dry sack" sounds like a medical condition...
 
Banksiana
distinguished member(1946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/19/2019 03:40PM
I've had great luck with the Sea to Summit - Ultra sil dry sack . No coating to wear off and weigh next to nothing.
 
TechnoScout
distinguished member (154)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/19/2019 04:03PM
TominMpls: "Also, "dry sack" sounds like a medical condition..."
LOL...
 
TechnoScout
distinguished member (154)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/19/2019 04:05PM
Banksiana: "I've had great luck with the Sea to Summit - Ultra sil dry sack . No coating to wear off and weigh next to nothing."
I have this in my amazon list now. Waiting for more votes before I push the button.
 
08/19/2019 05:51PM
TechnoScout: "Banksiana: "I've had great luck with the Sea to Summit - Ultra sil dry sack . No coating to wear off and weigh next to nothing."
I have this in my amazon list now. Waiting for more votes before I push the button."


I have the sea to summit compression dry sacks. The ultralight ones are nice but the straps tend to twist in the buckles. If weight is not an issue and there is a sturdier version I would go for that. If weight is an issue I would get the lightweight one.
 
mschi772
distinguished member (284)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/19/2019 06:37PM
With OR's lifetime warranty on stuff, contact them and see if they'd consider its failure something more than wear and tear that they'd be willing to cover. Doesn't hurt to ask.
 
Banksiana
distinguished member(1946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 12:34AM
drnatus: "
I have the sea to summit compression dry sacks. The ultralight ones are nice but the straps tend to twist in the buckles. If weight is not an issue and there is a sturdier version I would her that. If weight is an issue I would get the lightweight one."


I use their compression e-vent dry sacks for clothing and for sleeping bag- unbelievably excellent product. Haven't tried the ultra sil compression sacks because the others have not been compromised. But I love the ultra-sil dry sacks for keeping non-compressible gear (journals, my maintenance kit, camera, tp) dry and organized- just bought four more for an upcoming trip. Really light, strong and functional.
 
08/20/2019 06:26AM
I also use the StS e-Vent compression dry sacks for sleeping bag and clothing. They reduce bulk and add that extra layer of protection.
 
TechnoScout
distinguished member (154)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 07:06AM
boonie: "I also use the StS e-Vent compression dry sacks for sleeping bag and clothing. They reduce bulk and add that extra layer of protection. "

These look pretty nice.

BTW, I contacted OR about my dry sack--sent them a picture. They agreed that the coating was pealing off and thus compromised. However, they thought that since I had it for nine years, I had gotten my money's worth out of it...they offered a 15% discount and free shipping on a replacement.

Here is their "infinite guarantee"
Infinite Guarantee

I am not going to pursue it, but come on...don't tell me one thing and do another.
 
08/20/2019 09:29AM
I like mine, have used for many years. One nice thing is there is no coating to wear off. It's also a roll top vs. zipper. The e-Vent dry sacks, although not technically compression sacks, can be compressed a good bit by forcing air out the bottom.

I have an old OR one, but haven't used in years. I don't know what "the lifetime of the product" is and whether you got that or not, but no gear is immortal . . . ;). Marketing terms are sometimes unfortunate and "lifetime of the product" is vague. Mine is a good bit older than that, but may not have seen as much use. I'll have to check mine when I start packing - I'll bet it's delaminating too.
 
mutz
distinguished member(1114)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 09:43AM
TechnoScout: "boonie: "I also use the StS e-Vent compression dry sacks for sleeping bag and clothing. They reduce bulk and add that extra layer of protection. "


These look pretty nice.


BTW, I contacted OR about my dry sack--sent them a picture. They agreed that the coating was pealing off and thus compromised. However, they thought that since I had it for nine years, I had gotten my money's worth out of it...they offered a 15% discount and free shipping on a replacement.


Here is their "infinite guarantee"
Infinite Guarantee


I am not going to pursue it, but come on...don't tell me one thing and do another."


I have found that if you call a company about a warranty it is easy for them to come up with a reason on the phone to deny your claim. I now just send the item in with an explanation (even a fishing rod that I said I stepped on and requested cost for a new tip section, brand new rod in less than two weeks with hand written note saying no charge enjoy the new rod), it is easier for them to replace than the hassle to contact you to tell you they won’t. I enclose my e-mail address if the need credit card info and ask them to dispose of the item if not reparable. If I send the item in I don’t expect it back unless the can repair it.
 
TipsyPaddler
distinguished member (156)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 10:56AM
boonie: "I also use the StS e-Vent compression dry sacks for sleeping bag and clothing. They reduce bulk and add that extra layer of protection. "

+ 3 or 4 :-) I use these for same purposes. Zero regrets on the money spent.
 
mschi772
distinguished member (284)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 11:23AM
TechnoScout: "boonie: "I also use the StS e-Vent compression dry sacks for sleeping bag and clothing. They reduce bulk and add that extra layer of protection. "


These look pretty nice.


BTW, I contacted OR about my dry sack--sent them a picture. They agreed that the coating was pealing off and thus compromised. However, they thought that since I had it for nine years, I had gotten my money's worth out of it...they offered a 15% discount and free shipping on a replacement.


Here is their "infinite guarantee"
Infinite Guarantee


I am not going to pursue it, but come on...don't tell me one thing and do another."


"We want to see our customers use our gear to its full potential, which will include natural weathering from outdoor environments. Because of this, we do not accept warranties for this type of normal wear and tear"

"guaranteed to perform throughout the lifetime of the product"

Not forever. The lifetime of the product. Imagine yourself trying to succeed as a business where you only ever sell a product once and then just replace it for free every time someone needs a new one. That's stupid. Nothing lasts forever, and that's why lifetime guarantees (the smart ones anyway) always have to tell people that normal wear and tear is not covered; if they don't, people will take advantage with no regard for how disingenuous they are being. For example, years ago REI had to end its members' lifetime warranty because of how badly people were abusing it.

I think it says a lot (positive) about OR that even though it's simply a case of 9 years of wear and tear that they have no responsibility for, they still offered a discount and free shipping anyway. You got 9 years out of an ultra-light dry sack before it *started* to fail? To me, that's not a reason to replace it with a competitor's product or to demand warranty fulfillment. It's a reason to buy another OR dry sack.

P.S. Two separate posters made claims that their S2S bags have no coating to wear off. This is not true, at least not today. They have polyurethane coatings and are plainly described as such on the store pages I've seen.
 
TechnoScout
distinguished member (154)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 01:10PM
mschi772: "

"We want to see our customers use our gear to its full potential, which will include natural weathering from outdoor environments. Because of this, we do not accept warranties for this type of normal wear and tear"

"guaranteed to perform throughout the lifetime of the product"

Not forever. The lifetime of the product. Imagine yourself trying to succeed as a business where you only ever sell a product once and then just replace it for free every time someone needs a new one. That's stupid. Nothing lasts forever, and that's why lifetime guarantees (the smart ones anyway) always have to tell people that normal wear and tear is not covered; if they don't, people will take advantage with no regard for how disingenuous they are being. For example, years ago REI had to end its members' lifetime warranty because of how badly people were abusing it.


I think it says a lot (positive) about OR that even though it's simply a case of 9 years of wear and tear that they have no responsibility for, they still offered a discount and free shipping anyway. You got 9 years out of an ultra-light dry sack before it *started* to fail? To me, that's not a reason to replace it with a competitor's product or to demand warranty fulfillment. It's a reason to buy another OR dry sack.

P.S. Two separate posters made claims that their S2S bags have no coating to wear off. This is not true, at least not today. They have polyurethane coatings and are plainly described as such on the store pages I've seen."


mschi772: First of all, I have a number of OR products. In fact I have two of the 35L dry sacks bought on the same day. One failed and the other did not.

Second, "Infinite guarantee" is misleading. "Lifetime of the product" is also misleading. Both phrases are meaningless. In addition "normal wear and tear" is also meaningless.

You argue that because my DS failed after nine years, that is no reason to buy a different product. True, it is not. BUT, technology has changed in nine years, n'cest pas? Should I NOT take a fresh look at what is available nine years later? I am certain you would do the same...thus my post on this message board.


 
08/20/2019 01:48PM
mschi772: " Two separate posters made claims that their S2S bags have no coating to wear off. This is not true, at least not today. They have polyurethane coatings and are plainly described as such on the store pages I've seen."

The silicon is applied to the outer surfaces for waterproofing, the poly is on the inside to allow seam-tape to stick. Similar fabric treatment is used by Big Agnes on some tent lines.

The OR warranty is as stated very ambiguous and open to interpretation. A big reason to stay with personal experiences over warranty language. Because of this I like to recommend Granite Gear as I have dealt with their product support. eVent Sil Drysack

butthead
 
gonorth1
senior member (51)senior membersenior member
 
08/20/2019 08:20PM
Curious what size dry bag you use for a summer down bag? Also is the e vent system really worth it, or can a person get by just fine with the old stash and mash style bag?
 
Banksiana
distinguished member(1946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 08:53PM
mschi772: "

P.S. Two separate posters made claims that their S2S bags have no coating to wear off. This is not true, at least not today. They have polyurethane coatings and are plainly described as such on the store pages I've seen."


Silnylon isn't really a coating, rather the fabric is impregnated with water repelling silicone. So the silynylon dry bags and compression bags aren't subject to the flaking of a urethane. E-vent compression sacks were initially coated only but they've since come out with a silnylon version.

To go north: Yes the e-vent bags are worth the price (haven't tried the silnylon version yet). I can fit my 20 degree quilt into an x-small; by the time it's compressed it's the size of a softball. They are decently waterproof, especially when new (over time coating abrasions may create small holes that can be breached), but the compression itself discourages water infiltration as well.
 
gonorth1
senior member (51)senior membersenior member
 
08/20/2019 09:12PM
Thanks for the reply. Just wanted to double the size of the dry bag... A sleeping bag into an extra small dry bag? Sea to Summit lists their xs bag at 2 liters. That seems really small to stuff a bag into. For example, I have a hard time envisioning my sleeping bag stuffed into a 2 liter pop bottle (of course with a wider opening). You mention that the bag is decently waterproof. Do you put the dry bag into another sack to ensure dryness? Of along the items I want dry when I get to camp, my sleeping bag is at the top of the list.
 
Banksiana
distinguished member(1946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/20/2019 10:44PM
I've used the e-vent sacks for at least four years. After my first use of two I bought enough so that I could outfit the people I trip with as well. In all those years I've experienced dampness once on a trip last year- but it was after I paddled a long day in rain and wind with lots of water in the bottom of the canoe (enough rain that I had to stop and empty the boat on a big lake crossing). Of the three e-vent sacks I was using on the trip one had allowed minor seepage.

My quilt is a 800fill 20 degree. It takes some stuffing to get it into the x-small. I usually carry it in a small with an inflatable pillow and a Egyptian cotton liner. The small also is capable of carrying my NorthFace Blue Kazoo (20 degree 550 fill) or my 15 degree Marmot (800 fill).
I do not put the bag into another sack. I do line my packs with a plastic pack liner- but the pack liners are always compromised and I use them trip after trip.
 
mschi772
distinguished member (284)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/21/2019 09:38AM
Banksiana: "mschi772: "


P.S. Two separate posters made claims that their S2S bags have no coating to wear off. This is not true, at least not today. They have polyurethane coatings and are plainly described as such on the store pages I've seen."



Silnylon isn't really a coating, rather the fabric is impregnated with water repelling silicone. So the silynylon dry bags and compression bags aren't subject to the flaking of a urethane. E-vent compression sacks were initially coated only but they've since come out with a silnylon version.


To go north: Yes the e-vent bags are worth the price (haven't tried the silnylon version yet). I can fit my 20 degree quilt into an x-small; by the time it's compressed it's the size of a softball. They are decently waterproof, especially when new (over time coating abrasions may create small holes that can be breached), but the compression itself discourages water infiltration as well."


I know what silnylon is, and I also know how to read what is written in the product descriptions. S2S makes numerous different models of dry sack, and many of them mention having a polyurethane coating, and even some of the more robust ones (unlikely to be used by this community) have TPU coatings.

The UltraSil models that make no mention of a coating are also discouraged for paddlers by S2S with the basic lightweight model with white polyurethane coating being recommended instead. This seems silly to me as I don't feel like we are any harder on gear than a regular backpacker. Maybe S2S is thinking of kayakers that have to separate their cargo in order to fit it into their boats properly.
 
Banksiana
distinguished member(1946)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
08/21/2019 10:35AM
mschi-
Sorry if my phrasing was offensive. You made the claim " Two separate posters made claims that their S2S bags have no coating to wear off. This is not true, at least not today. They have polyurethane coatings and are plainly described as such on the store pages I've seen."

This is not true in the case of the ultra-sil compression sacks . There is a Gortex like membrane/coating at the base of the sack to permit air to escape as it is compressed. Unfortunately the straps aren't as robust as the original e-vent bags. I agree that there is no reason that they wouldn't be effective for canoeing.
 
ross0201
 
08/21/2019 02:44PM
mutz: "

I have found that if you call a company about a warranty it is easy for them to come up with a reason on the phone to deny your claim. I now just send the item in with an explanation (even a fishing rod that I said I stepped on and requested cost for a new tip section, brand new rod in less than two weeks with hand written note saying no charge enjoy the new rod), it is easier for them to replace than the hassle to contact you to tell you they won’t. I enclose my e-mail address if the need credit card info and ask them to dispose of the item if not reparable. If I send the item in I don’t expect it back unless the can repair it."


This is a fantastic idea I'm going to keep this in mind!
 
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