BWCA Siobhan River south of Little Roland Boundary Waters Trip Planning Forum
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n8roar
member (44)member
  
02/16/2024 07:42PM  
Gonna make it up to Crooked first week In June. Does the Siobhan River dump into Crooked or flow into Roland.
 
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02/17/2024 07:57AM  
Crooked drains into Iron via Curtain Falls.
n8roar
member (44)member
  
02/17/2024 08:36AM  
Thanks for the response, yes, I know Crooked dumps into Iron Via Curtain Falls. Great fishing the whole area.

The Question is:
Does the Siobhan River dump into Crooked((just NE of Curtain) or does crooked flow out? On the map there is a 40 rod portage and some rapids. I wanna know if it is flowing in or out.
CardinalNation
senior member (96)senior membersenior member
  
02/17/2024 09:13AM  
Siobhan River flows out of Argo to Roland to Middle Roland to Little Roland (Finger) into Crooked north/northeast of Curtain Falls.
n8roar
member (44)member
  
02/17/2024 06:15PM  
Perfect!
Thanks CN
02/17/2024 09:11PM  
In case you aren’t doing a strictly Q trip. Make sure you have a Quetico Permit, Ontario outdoors card, Ontario fishing license, and follow the barbless hooks no live bait if you fish the outlet of the Siobhan…

The Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources likes to patrol that area by float plane, Especially at walleye opener since theirs is a week later.

T
n8roar
member (44)member
  
02/18/2024 08:36AM  
T,

That brings up a good question. I had always been told that if you are legal on one side of a boarder lake (IE Iron). As long as you are not on land fish you are OK. I am familiar with the Barbless and no live bait along with the permits. So this raises 2 questions:

1. If you don’t go to land on a boarder lake and are 100% legal one one side are you OK?
2. What is the punishment for fishing illegally in the CANADA? Is it a fine or can they take your gear and worse.

Thanks
02/18/2024 09:03AM  
I like the name Siobhan. Good Gaelic origin.

Hopefully everyone pronounces it correctly - shiv-awn.
02/18/2024 09:13AM  
n8roar: "
1. If you don’t go to land on a boarder lake and are 100% legal one one side are you OK?
2. What is the punishment for fishing illegally in the CANADA? Is it a fine or can they take your gear and worse.
Thanks"


1) There is a blue dashed line down the middle of the lake that marks the border. Canadian laws apply immediately when you cross that line.
2) The punishment is swift and brutal. Do not even think of violating just a little bit or the consequences will be huge. Canadian prisons are filled with American fishermen who don't understand the laws in Canada.
02/18/2024 10:20AM  
n8roar: "T,


That brings up a good question. I had always been told that if you are legal on one side of a boarder lake (IE Iron). As long as you are not on land fish you are OK. I am familiar with the Barbless and no live bait along with the permits. So this raises 2 questions:


1. If you don’t go to land on a boarder lake and are 100% legal one one side are you OK?
2. What is the punishment for fishing illegally in the CANADA? Is it a fine or can they take your gear and worse.


Thanks"


A few years ago I would say you are completely wrong on your assertion…if you were over the border on an international lake you could receive at minimum $250 fine per person, per offense and upwards of thousands in fines, gear confiscated including the canoe and jail time. Depends on if MNR gets you or Canadian Customs. Customs less likely but more serious. I know for a fact if you were on the Canadian side of crooked they would drop down and do checks for licenses, permits, bait, hooks—-do definitely wasn’t reciprocity a few years back.


There has been some talk of reciprocity lately though for LOTW and I am not sure if that includes Quetico and BWCAW border lakes.

What I am pretty sure is you must follow the most restrictive rules if you fish a border lake. The barbless rule fine is $250/person and the no live bait is $250/person. The Canadian’s do not give warnings and do not believe in ignorance. They rely on severe punishment to get the word out.

Since you are crossing into Quetico (whether you land or not) you may need a day pass or permit. Once again with the talk of reciprocity I am not sure about this anymore, but I’d be surprised if you didn’t need a Q permit. The issue is you aren’t just fishing Canadian border waters you are entering a Wilderness Designated Ontario Park with special fishing regs.

Your best bet is to email or call the Park Superintendent for Quetico. Ask them what would be required. I’d email…then print it out…in case you get stopped so you can prove you followed what was told to you by an official. Trevor Gibb - trevor.gibb@ontario.ca

T
n8roar
member (44)member
  
02/18/2024 10:26AM  
I understand that Canada is the newest Communist country with their newest tyrannical leader. But seriously I understand you might be protecting your favorite fishing spot. I have heard of a group getting a fine of $300 for having trash in their fire pit.
Bottle River and Curtain falls River are split down the middle. You don’t have to hug the North or South Shoreline. My understanding is there is a leniency on the boarder lakes that as long as you don’t set foot on the land you are OK if you have legal papers to be there BWCA or Quetico in general .

Can anyone confirm bobbernumber3 prison time and relay any accurate consequences.

Thanks
N8roar

02/18/2024 11:03AM  
n8roar: "I understand that Canada is the newest Communist country with their newest tyrannical leader. But seriously I understand you might be protecting your favorite fishing spot. I have heard of a group getting a fine of $300 for having trash in their fire pit.
Bottle River and Curtain falls River are split down the middle. You don’t have to hug the North or South Shoreline. My understanding is there is a leniency on the boarder lakes that as long as you don’t set foot on the land you are OK if you have legal papers to be there BWCA or Quetico in general .


Can anyone confirm bobbernumber3 prison time and relay any accurate consequences.


Thanks
N8roar


"


N8roar, you are taking a separate issue/rule and extrapolating that to fishing. That could be a costly mistake. The Webster Ashburton Treat applies to TRAVEL on border lakes not fishing nor site seeing. If you are fishing the Canadian side of the river you could be in violation of international law. Did you see the Feds came down on someone for netting ciscoes 100 feet over the border near the river outlet at Prairie Portage? The chances of getting caught are not super high but the consequences are usually severe.

I am talking out of both sides of my mouth because liek I said in an earlier post there was talk of some reciprocity. I don’t know 100%.

Besides the Ciscoe situation mentioned above, there have been numerous reports of fines by people on this site over the years. There was one for the narrows leading to North Bay and Bayley Bay on Basswood, and Moose Bay on crooked. I personally got stopped (I had a Q permit) on Crooked. This isn’t made up.

I wouldn’t call the Canadians communists for protecting their border. Whether it is the middle of a lake or river or land…it’s an international border. You are entering a foreign country and thus subject to their whims and laws.

T
n8roar
member (44)member
  
02/18/2024 03:31PM  
T,

I appreciate your insight. I wasn’t calling them communist because of the boarder protection. I wish we protected our boarder.

It’s the lock downs and mandatory government interference.

Thanks,
N8roar
02/19/2024 09:33AM  
Boarder = Someone who pays to stay at your house
Border = Line separating designated territories.

I have witnessed float plane license checks on Crooked from the MNR. Best to be polite and respectful of the Canadian and Ontario rules and authorities. They tend to be polite but strict, straightforward and dry in matters of enforcement. The Canadian government fails to meet the definition of communism as understood by any informed rational person. Communism is defined by economic not public health decisions.
02/19/2024 10:16AM  
Banksiana: "Boarder = Someone who pays to stay at your house
Border = Line separating designated territories.


I have witnessed float plane license checks on Crooked from the MNR. Best to be polite and respectful of the Canadian and Ontario rules and authorities. They tend to be polite but strict, straightforward and dry in matters of enforcement. The Canadian government fails to meet the definition of communism as understood by any informed rational person. Communism is defined by economic not public health decisions."


Just so.
 
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