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RodPortage
senior member (55)senior membersenior member
  
05/10/2024 01:11AM  
We are all facing an order to hang food packs (or else store food/scents in IGBC-approved bear-proof containers). There are several teapots full of tempest over here if you want to get your aggression out.

I had all the gear I needed for a normal trip, so I guess I'm excited to have a project to work on before I go in July. Maybe I'll get to buy some cool new rope and carefully select a pulley! Maybe more than one!?! But I've always hated pack hanging and started stashing a few years ago, per Cliff Jacobson's instructions, so I'd love to hear what rope systems people are using if they are regular food pack hangers.

So far I am looking at videos of arborists tossing lead lines very high into trees so that they can set climbing ropes. I finally understand the name "Zing-It," it looks like a great rope to tie to a throw weight and zing up into a high branch. I think I'll pull a thicker amsteel rope up with the Zing-It line, and probably there'll be a pulley on that. But I haven't bought anything, so please give me (and everyone) your best tips.

In the thread linked above, TrailZen shows a fine looking rope setup. TZ, please tell me what you and your wife have put together there, if you see this.
 
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05/10/2024 11:04AM  
I wouldn't use zing-it as a throw cord. There is too much friction on the cord and will be more likely to get stuck. I use zing-it for my tarp and it doesn't like to pull loose when wrapped around a branch a couple times. It's great stuff but expensive and you want something a little smoother.

Honestly, I've been tempted to just use a weight on my spare rod and cast the line over the branch. Fishing line doesn't bind on a branch, is light, strong enough to pull up a rope, and is cheap enough to break it off if it gets stuck. You don't even have to cast it if you are more accurate throwing.
 
Lawnchair107
distinguished member (412)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
05/10/2024 01:28PM  
7/64 armsteel, sail pulleys (Harken) brand.
 
05/10/2024 03:22PM  
RodPortage: "In the thread linked above, TrailZen shows a fine looking rope setup. TZ, please tell me what you and your wife have put together there, if you see this."


Our bear hang setup isn't too special, but thanks for the compliment. I'm using parachute cord, but keep in mind that not all p-cord is equal. P-cord is one of many "kernmantle" style ropes, or rope with a multi-strand core (kern) and a braided outer sheath (mantle). I look for p-cord with a tightly braided mantle, as it's much less likely to snag on the bark of my bear hang tree limbs.

My hang assembly includes three 50' p-cords (550 pound), two pulleys, and a carabiner. My "clothesline" utilizes two of the cords; each is thrown over an appropriate limb as close to the bole of the tree as possible. Note that when I'm setting up the hang, the p-cord is only tied to the throw-weight--it's not tied to a pulley or another cord. If the cord doesn't thread across the limb as intended, I pull the cord on across the limb. DO NOT TRY TO PULL YOUR THROW WEIGHT BACK THROUGH THE TREE! When my two clothesline cords are over appropriate limbs, I connect them (bowlines), connect one of the pulleys to one of the clotheslines (butterfly hitch about a foot from the bowline), add the hoist cord (bowline) after threading one end of it through the clothesline pulley then through the lift pulley. Then WITH NO LOAD ON THE SYSTEM, I center the clothesline/pulley while Tia keeps the load pulley near the ground and prevents the hoist cord from tangling. (Note: I can and have done this solo, but it's easier with Tia's help.) Tension the clothesline by tying off the p-cords at each tree, then you can hang your food bags (carabiner) via the lift pulley using 2 to 1 lift ratio.

I'm certain that many readers who have gotten this far are in full TMI mode. Please keep in mind that I'm simply relaying what works for me (and has done so in areas, including burn areas, where some people would say "we can't hang here"). I am NOT saying this is the way everyone should do it. I am not saying that everyone should hang. If you feel that blue barrels, Bear Vaults, Ursacks, pots & pans stacked on your canoe, or something else works for you, go for it. I have been hanging our food since 1978 and plan to continue that practice as long as I can.

Respectfully submitted,
TrailZen
 
StLouisPaddler
senior member (82)senior membersenior member
  
05/12/2024 02:45PM  
TZ’s setup is the OG. I ripped it off and do something similar. 100 foot clothesline with an alpine butterfly knot in the middle, which gets centered when tensioning the clothesline. “Pack-a-pull” makes a cool little pulley system that weighs nothing and gives a 4:1 mechanical advantage. That’s probably overkill for a weeks worth of food and means the line running through the pulley system has to also be 75-100 feet. Overall, it’s a lot of cordage, but works pretty well on sites where we are going to be at for more than a night or two.
 
05/12/2024 11:55PM  
StLouisPaddler: "TZ’s setup is the OG. I ripped it off and do something similar. 100 foot clothesline with an alpine butterfly knot in the middle, which gets centered when tensioning the clothesline. “Pack-a-pull” makes a cool little pulley system that weighs nothing and gives a 4:1 mechanical advantage. That’s probably overkill for a weeks worth of food and means the line running through the pulley system has to also be 75-100 feet. Overall, it’s a lot of cordage, but works pretty well on sites where we are going to be at for more than a night or two. "


What these guys said. we use a sack with local rocks to get a light line over the branches. Then drag up some 1/4" nautical rope each side. One piece of rope with the pulley carbineered in the middle. about 75' total line. Then a two double pulley block and tackle haul up system with about 75' of line. Set the pulley rope and haul up and down as needed. It's handy to keep a few feet off the ground out of reach of the mini-bears and other varmints. The heavy duty line doesn't sag with EVERYTHING smelly attached. We had three large packs hanging with no problem.
you don't need a long or even large branch. just one to stop the rope from sliding down the trunk.






I must admit that I'm kinda surprised at the reactions. We have had to deal with bearproofing our food for going on 40 years, longer is some places. If you don't you're backpacking hungry. Bear proof garbage lockers are required for some residential mountain communities in many places.
 
IndyCanoe
distinguished member (165)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
  
05/16/2024 12:41PM  
we have used the Pack a Pull system for a few years. I take a two 35' sections and one 75' section of dyneema rope and have always been able to get a good hang. We were able to hang a blue barrel with a weeks food for 4 with no issues using that method. Dyneema rope is thin so gloves or a small log can be your friend getting the food in the air on a heavy load. Pack a pull has a few helpful videos on their website for different methods to use their system.

Same system could easily be recreated with pulleys but i do like the simple all in one system of the pack a pull.

Worst part that never goes away is getting that first rope over a suitable tree branch!
 
RodPortage
senior member (55)senior membersenior member
  
05/18/2024 04:03PM  
Thanks for the responses, and thanks for the full TMI detail, TZ. I now get it completely.

The pack-a-pull thing came up a couple times, does anyone have a picture of it in use, or are you willing to go into detail about getting that set up?
 
StLouisPaddler
senior member (82)senior membersenior member
  
05/18/2024 10:52PM  
RodPortage: "Thanks for the responses, and thanks for the full TMI detail, TZ. I now get it completely.


The pack-a-pull thing came up a couple times, does anyone have a picture of it in use, or are you willing to go into detail about getting that set up?"


I don’t have any photos that would be helpful. Pack a pull is basically a series of three pulleys: a double pulley on the ridgeline, then two single pulleys on the load (e.g., food pack). Here’s my best attempt to explain it in action: tie off one end of a 75 footish line to the housing of the double pulley, then thread it to one of the single pulleys, back up to double, down again to the second single pulley, then back a final time to the double. What you have then is 4:1 mechanical advantage on the 75 foot line. I tie a marlin spike hitch in that line, add a stick, and haul the food pack up. On the off chance my horrible explanation wasn’t helpful, here’s the link: Link
 
05/19/2024 04:35PM  
Not sure if this fits, but we always used to hang, but now we use URSAKS and an OPSAK liner, and havne't looked back.

Sometimes we find it difficult to find a good tree. I was driving past Tofte station as well as Sawbill Outfitters this past weekend, and both had demos set up for folks.
 
RodPortage
senior member (55)senior membersenior member
  
05/19/2024 05:39PM  
STLPaddler, that helps a lot, thanks.

MN_Lindsey, I'm with you. Finding trees was miserable before I started using the stashed barrel method. For this year, I bought a couple BearVault canisters because they're 20% off at REI and at their own website. I plan to stash those and hang a mostly empty pack with some overflow food/scented items. I'm hoping that with a lighter load (and better equipment and techniques) I can find more trees that will be strong enough.
 
05/20/2024 08:54AM  
StLouisPaddler: "
RodPortage: "Thanks for the responses, and thanks for the full TMI detail, TZ. I now get it completely.



The pack-a-pull thing came up a couple times, does anyone have a picture of it in use, or are you willing to go into detail about getting that set up?"



I don’t have any photos that would be helpful. Pack a pull is basically a series of three pulleys: a double pulley on the ridgeline, then two single pulleys on the load (e.g., food pack). Here’s my best attempt to explain it in action: tie off one end of a 75 footish line to the housing of the double pulley, then thread it to one of the single pulleys, back up to double, down again to the second single pulley, then back a final time to the double. What you have then is 4:1 mechanical advantage on the 75 foot line. I tie a marlin spike hitch in that line, add a stick, and haul the food pack up. On the off chance my horrible explanation wasn’t helpful, here’s the link: Link "


Interesting, thanks for the explanation and the link.
 
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