Anyone have any tips about setting up a solo canoe for a bwca trip? Just wondering
Mike

Well, I'm not going to drill holes in a rental . . .

The most obvious thing, of course, is painters. I put 25' on the front and rear, attached with a bowline around the thwart and held with BDB's. That's all I usually do, but might do a couple of other things if I owned one.

Some put pipe wrap on the gunwales to cushion their knees/legs. Others have attached bungee cord to thwarts to hold things. Kneeling pads if you kneel.

Dreaded quadruple post, darn phone.
Whatsit, looks like your new canoe already has the seat moved toward the stern, I would consider keeping it that way.

I moved my seat back so I could leave my portage Yoke on full time, then I trim it by putting my gear in the front or with my dog.
If I don't have any of the above items with me I use a dry bag filled with water and clip it to the bow.

Thanks Linden

quote boonie: "Well, I'm not going to drill holes in a rental . . .


The most obvious thing, of course, is painters. I put 25' on the front and rear, attached with a bowline around the thwart and held with BDB's. That's all I usually do, but might do a couple of other things if I owned one.


Some put pipe wrap on the gunwales to cushion their knees/legs. Others have attached bungee cord to thwarts to hold things. Kneeling pads if you kneel.


"

Hi boonie, thanks!
Sorry but a couple of things I don't understand. First I now own one so no more rental for me :-)
Secondly, what's "painters", and "BDBs"
And then what are the couple of things that you do when you own your canoe?
Thanks again
Mike

BDB's are one of the finest inventions for use in canoe tripping. Bungee Dealy Bobs

Mike-

"Painters" are bow and stern lines for tying your canoe up and lining it. TomT has already explained BDB's.

Things people do if they own it - there are a lot of things you could do. You could get a kit to attach the "painters" lower on the canoe to improve lining performance, but you'd have to drill holes through the hull.

Others have drilled holes in thwarts to string bungee cord for hold downs, but obviously not going to do that with a canoe that's not mine. Or glue kneeling pads or D-rings to the floor, or install foot braces.

Now you could do the pipe insulation thing, although I don't usually bother.

quote TomT: "BDB's are one of the finest inventions for use in canoe tripping. Bungee Dealy Bobs


"

Thats cool. I have an old scouts hat. I'm friends with their web guy
Thanks TomT

quote boonie: "Mike-


"Painters" are bow and stern lines for tying your canoe up and lining it. TomT has already explained BDB's.


Things people do if they own it - there are a lot of things you could do. You could get a kit to attach the "painters" lower on the canoe to improve lining performance, but you'd have to drill holes through the hull.


Others have drilled holes in thwarts to string bungee cord for hold downs, but obviously not going to do that with a canoe that's not mine. Or glue kneeling pads or D-rings to the floor, or install foot braces.


Now you could do the pipe insulation thing, although I don't usually bother. "

Thanks boonie
Here's a question. Any chance any of you have pictures of you solo canoes all fitted up that you could share? I wish I had my canoe here at the moment. :-(
Thanks again all
Mike

quote boonie: "Well, I'm not going to drill holes in a rental . . .


The most obvious thing, of course, is painters. I put 25' on the front and rear, attached with a bowline around the thwart and held with BDB's. That's all I usually do, but might do a couple of other things if I owned one.


Some put pipe wrap on the gunwales to cushion their knees/legs. Others have attached bungee cord to thwarts to hold things. Kneeling pads if you kneel.


"

I second all of the above. I've also made sure to install a Crazy Creek chair because I need the back support and padding when I paddle. Pipe insulation (or colorful swim noodles froma dollar store!) work great for paddle the thwarts and for hanging a small lure selection on for fishing.

If you can find some cheap(er) plastic 3in. clamps, they work well for attaching a fishfinder or a GPS or both.

Just some thoughts. Have fun---it's a great time-consuming project. Don't forget to set up your portage yoke too.

Whatsit, still want it picked up?
I'm driving right by your canoe this weekend.
Give me a call tomorrow AM, after 9 am CDT. I feel bad, I got a roof rack on my car, and could pick it up, I just need to approach my wife with the idea, we have room in our garage.
218 849-3825

I would put foot braces on first. I'd put at least a thin skid plate in the front to protect if your going to do a fair amount of tripping. I guess I'm not kind to my boats. I don't think I've got to many hundred miles on last set. I had spring creek put in a version of Tugeyes... Google them. You want your painters just above the water line a few inches if your going to do any manuvering with them. I typically don't line through to much with the solo like I did my little tandem. And like h&D said, back support is a good thing. Colman used to sell a back rest that snapped on the seat. I just saw mine this summer... I thought it was long gone. And don't forget your bwca.com stickers. Haha!

Things to consider: Pack your packs and do a trial run to see how they fit. I had to move a thwart forward 8 inches to get my bigger pack in. I also need some back support. Do a trial run to see how a seat fits in. For those long days in the saddle, I also put a small closed cell foam pad on the seat. When I portage, I throw the map on the pad and close the seat and fasten with velcro.....quick and ready to portage. Portage yoke.....fit it, know where to store it when paddling, make sure it is in prime shape and won't fail. Painters.....already covered. Spare paddle storage.....I like a secure, "out of the way but easily accessible" storage place. A system to strap your paddle in while portaging (various BDB arrangements). Fish poles.......my tips slide into a tube I attatched in the bow and the handles get BDB'd to seat.
Easy quick strap down and storage for portage, easy quick unstrap when portage done, comfy seat, good pack arrangement. A smooth, secure, organized system will add to the pleasure.

Chuck at Spring Creek outfitters makes a foot brace for Royalex canoes. From what he said, it's not a good idea to drill holes in the hull to rivet a foot brace into a Royalex canoe. I bought my Vagabond from him and he included a foot brace. It is held in by two suction cups.

I wonder if your boat came from the factory with that seat and thwart placement. Mine has the seat in the middle, a thwart in front of the seat and a thwart behind the seat, plus a carry handle on each end. I have a removable yoke.

Definitely get some BDBs for strapping in poles and your extra paddle.

Cover installed, painter lines low for lining, bungee cords in thwarts, RAM GPS mount on foot brace, BDB's as needed where needed, some camera mounting holes, spray bedliner on stems, customized removable yoke, paddle clamps. It's personalized (I'm one who doesn't mind putting holes in a new canoe).

butthead

quote cowdoc: "When I portage, I throw the map on the pad and close the seat and fasten with velcro.....quick and ready to portage. "

I do that too. ...and take it a step farther by putting the blade of my paddle in the seat along with the map. The shaft is then BDB'd to the forward thwart. Fast, and very secure.

If you're into fishing, a through-the-hull sonar transducer mount is cool.

I'm working on my <1 yr old solo boat too right now. Skid plates are on the list, as it has a bit of wear already. Yoke is almost done. Footbrace is on the way. Maybe spray covers?
I'm also looking at a sliding seat so that I can slide back a ways and have my <45lb 4-yr old son ride in the bow.

quote LindenTree3: "Whatsit, still want it picked up?
I'm driving right by your canoe this weekend.
Give me a call tomorrow AM, after 9 am CDT. I feel bad, I got a roof rack on my car, and could pick it up, I just need to approach my wife with the idea, we have room in our garage.
218 849-3825 "

Hi Linden
Wow thanks! Very much appreciated
I sent you an email. If I don't hear back I'll call at 9
Mike

Great set up Cowdoc and Ken!
Thanks for the pictures :-). This gives me a lot of ideas. I'm hoping we can drive up when the kids have spring break and I can get it and do these mods before my may solo.
Mike

quote IceColdGold: "Chuck at Spring Creek outfitters makes a foot brace for Royalex canoes. From what he said, it's not a good idea to drill holes in the hull to rivet a foot brace into a Royalex canoe. I bought my Vagabond from him and he included a foot brace. It is held in by two suction cups.


I wonder if your boat came from the factory with that seat and thwart placement. Mine has the seat in the middle, a thwart in front of the seat and a thwart behind the seat, plus a carry handle on each end. I have a removable yoke.


Definitely get some BDBs for strapping in poles and your extra paddle."

I'm not sure of anything yet about if the seat was factory like that or not? I wouldn't screw into the royalex. I kind of wish it came with foot braces but will live without them. Did it take you a while to get use to the vagabond or was it like any other canoe? I've read where people say they feel very tippy.
Thanks!
Mike

I have a carbon fiber magic and no way am I drilling holes, other than the painters. Ted used epoxy to glue the foot brace mounts and it works really well.

quote Whatsit: "

quote IceColdGold: "Chuck at Spring Creek outfitters makes a foot brace for Royalex canoes. From what he said, it's not a good idea to drill holes in the hull to rivet a foot brace into a Royalex canoe. I bought my Vagabond from him and he included a foot brace. It is held in by two suction cups.

I wonder if your boat came from the factory with that seat and thwart placement. Mine has the seat in the middle, a thwart in front of the seat and a thwart behind the seat, plus a carry handle on each end. I have a removable yoke.

Definitely get some BDBs for strapping in poles and your extra paddle."

I'm not sure of anything yet about if the seat was factory like that or not? I wouldn't screw into the royalex. I kind of wish it came with foot braces but will live without them. Did it take you a while to get use to the vagabond or was it like any other canoe? I've read where people say they feel very tippy.
Thanks!
Mike "

'Lively' is the term that some prefer. It's a different feel when you are in a solo. They are smaller and lighter than a tandem, and there is not another person sitting in the canoe providing ballast, or holding the canoe while you get in or out. When you get in, you have to step in the center with one foot, sit your butt down, then bring the other foot in.

The Vagabond is about as stable as it gets in a solo. Not at all hard to get use to.

quote IceColdGold: "The Vagabond is about as stable as it gets in a solo. Not at all hard to get use to."

Thanks! That's what my BIL said too
Mike

quote boonie: "Well, I'm not going to drill holes in a rental . . .


The most obvious thing, of course, is painters. I put 25' on the front and rear, attached with a bowline around the thwart and held with BDB's.


"

I'm just curious. How many of you use painters for lining in the BW? I had them on for 20 or so years and maybe lined once. Now I just keep some rope handy in a thwart pack

Not so much for lining, but painters come in handy to tie a boat up at portages and down at night.

Blatz, I have wondered the same. I sometimes walk my canoe through a BWCA stream, but don't recall lining. Maybe those who use the technique can offer some examples of places it has been helpful? Getting a little off topic, but it's interesting (to me).

Dave

quote Blatz: "

quote boonie: "Well, I'm not going to drill holes in a rental . . .



The most obvious thing, of course, is painters. I put 25' on the front and rear, attached with a bowline around the thwart and held with BDB's.



"

I'm just curious. How many of you use painters for lining in the BW? I had them on for 20 or so years and maybe lined once. Now I just keep some rope handy in a thwart pack"

My use for them is tying up the canoe as bhouse noted. I have never lined one in the BW myself; I have just walked it through like NotSoFast, but I imagine it has been done by others in the BW and certainly other places. If I had a canoe, the BW is not the only place I'd use it and some of those other places might present opportunities for lining.

quote NotSoFast: "Blatz, I have wondered the same. I sometimes walk my canoe through a BWCA stream, but don't recall lining. Maybe those who use the technique can offer some examples of places it has been helpful? Getting a little off topic, but it's interesting (to me).


Dave"

I got caught in a bad windstorm on the downwind side of a Lake.
It wasn't safe to Paddle, I unloaded my dog, got out and lined it along the shore, after a 1/4 mile I was able to get back in and paddle but I had to have the dog walk on shore for another 1/4 mile until it was safe for us both to be in the canoe.
This was the same day the boy scouts had to be rescued on Basswood Lake in June 2014.

Yea I've lined in places other than the BW. The shore terrain and the rockiness of the streams where the portages are in the BW make lining a rare occurrence. But I would have some rope handy for those just in case moments.

There's a guy on YouTube called wintertrekker (I think?) and he uses them a lot in Ontario Canada. Not sure if he's in the quetico or not

The Wintertrekker guy, Hoop, paddles further north usually, and on some pretty extended trips in remote areas. Excellent videos.

I think I lined a canoe once in the BWCA, but that really misses the importance of the painters. On a solo trip, it becomes extra important to secure your boat at portages. I nearly learned this the hard way on a solo trip shortly after ice out. I pulled up at a calm portage and lifted a pack out and carried it about 10 feet to a rock. As I set it down, a puff of wind came from no where and pushed my boat free from the gravely shore and it started drifting. I waded as deep my boots allowed and could just reach it with a paddle. Another 2 feet and I would have had to swim or make very extended hike around the shore. Its also very smart to tie down your boat at night in case storms with strong winds come up. With a group its no bid deal if a boat gets away. Solo, you are truly stuck.

Yes Hoop. Some trips he goes way north but some he stays close to home for an odd weekend trip

What Jaywalker said, Mike. Not much need or opportunity to line in the BW, although you may get an occasional one if you do a lot of river paddling.

They can get away from the soloist - or even pair if no one's holding the canoe - pretty quickly sometimes. Of course, with that Royalex beast, you can just grab that bow painter and drag it across the portage! :).

quote boonie: "What Jaywalker said, Mike. Not much need or opportunity to line in the BW, although you may get an occasional one if you do a lot of river paddling.


They can get away from the soloist - or even pair if no one's holding the canoe - pretty quickly sometimes. Of course, with that Royalex beast, you can just grab that bow painter and drag it across the portage! :). "

:-) yes I was planning on just dragging it but wasn't going to tell any of you, ha!
Yes thanks jaywalker. I never thought of that. You think for those few seconds you have your back to the canoe you are safe but yes it only takes a momen and you are stuck. Les the survival guy did a show about that being stuck in Alaska where you get out to check something out on shore and the next second the wind comes and takes your canoe away. I also have read stories of the wind taking the canoe at night while the guy slept. So all great advise. Thanks!
Mike

Wouldn't ya know my experience varies from most.
May be because I drilled and installed them myself, I use them often, just about anywhere the canoe can be floated with out my butt in it. Anytime it is easier to keep more than an arms length from the canoe.
The Horse river and Kawishiwi river are just 2 examples where I can line the canoe much easier than wadding and dragging it. I line it thru the short narrows entering Seagull all the time.

butthead

Canoe cover- I do my canoeing more in the shoulder seasons.
Kneepads- I kneel when Paddling.
Some times Bungie cord for paddle holding- Tie in not drilled in.

So, I just picked up a Prism UL. I previously had a prism toughweave/gel coat, and then went to a Q16 for both solo and tandem. I really missed the prism paddling the Q16 from the bow seat, so I'm super stoked to have a true solo again.

I'm interested in adding a spray skirt/cover to reduce wind resistance. My question is, will it be sufficient to cover from both the bow and stern decks to the thwarts, or do I need the full skirt to reduce wind? I fish *a lot* and I don't see the full skirt like Cliff's design as something I would use. Thoughts?

It's good to cover up when it's cold. But 90+ percent of my use with a cover on is just to the paddling position. The back can stop right behind the seat (as CCS covers do), the front to where cockpit access is good (CCS covers have ties placed about 3 feet ahead of the seat to reef in the cockpit section).

I do not think It harms the fishing!

butthead

Thanks Butthead, and nice pike! Where you have it reefed up front is where I was thinking of stopping. Maybe it makes more sense to make it like yours and have the option to fully enclose. Thanks for the pics, they are helpful.

Both shown in the posts are CCS covers. Noticeable difference in the Moccasin with the cover in wind, the Advantage not as much. Probably all due to hull shape.

butthead

My solo is a cedar strip, so most of my modifications don't apply. However, here is one of my greatest upgrades to my Q17 that directly apply. They are nylon pad eyes.

Pad Eyes



I can't find any in-action photos at the moment, but use your imagination.

1 in the far bow and stern with a BDB for the painters. Frees up the carry handle to be used for its intended purpose.

2 on the left rear to hold 2 piece rods. 1 6" in front of the carry handle, one 2' in front of that one.

3 on the right rear to hold one piece rods spaces appropriately.

While I was at it, I did the same rod carriers on the front.

One in front of me to BDB my water bottle to. Keeps it out of the bilge water.

I added one more to the right side in front of me so that, in addition to the others, I bungee my spare paddle in front of me to use as a filet board to clean fish on the way back to camp.

In the end, I ended up adding BDBs to all of them.

I planned from the start to contribute to this thread, but have been waylaid by a very busy work season. I finally had a chance to take photos of my latest solo setup. This is the third solo I have set up this way. It was a pleasure to use on a ten day solo in June 2016.

The basic idea is two thwarts equidistant from the center of the boat. Parallel rails are hung from the same attachment bolt as the thwarts on a symmetrical hull. On a an asymmetrical hull the rear attachment of the rails would be from the thwart itself inward from the gunwales to keep them parallel. At the center of the boat a block is hung from the gunwale and the rail screwed into it for support. Both the seat and the portage yoke attach to the rails and can be moved around easily. The seat is held to the rails by those wonderful bungeedealeebobs. The yoke in this case is attached with nifty clamps that came from an Old Town brand clamp-on yoke. I made a similar clamp by bending thin sections of wood and laminating them for the clamps. I found some big wingnuts that allowed enough leverage to tighten the clamps sufficiently for rough portaging.

When on tour I can move the seat back far enough to get a little more steering leverage when packing the outfit forward. Moving the seat and yoke into place at the portage takes a few seconds. I tend to move the yoke forward for paddling. Its a nice place to park a paddle or set compass.

Sweet set up sedges.

Love that seat, Seges. Elegant solution to a solo boat.
I actually have aluminum parts out in the garage-trying to piece together something similar. Looks like the middle bracket is key.

Yes, the center bracket stiffens the whole unit. It takes a little bit of trial and error to get it fit right. I get the rails set and then measure and figure angles and make a cardboard pattern to test the fit.

The gunwales on this one are western red cedar, clear and straight grained. I glued them to the hull and eliminated a bunch of screws. I capped them with shortleaf pine 1/8th inch thick for abrasion resistance for transport. They are definitely lighter and stronger than the ash gunwales that came screwed onto the boat. The boat with seat and yoke weighs in at 30 pounds.

This rig has been so comfortable and convenient. It allows a lot of flexibility in loading different outfits for a variety of trips.

Good luck with your setup Muddyfeet. Its fun to experiment.

Don't think anyone has mentioned this yet because its not an actual change to the canoe, but be aware of how the total weight will be placed in the canoe, including yourself and your pack or packs. Mostly you want to keep the canoe pretty level although there may be conditions where you want the front a little higher or lower. In a double canoe, the most weight is usually the people in front and back, with the packs sitting in the middle. In a solo, pack weight will determine trim. I have a prism with an adjustable seat which makes weight distribution a little more adjustable and take two packs for easier weight distribution.

So before your trip, practice loading your packs and see how they will sit in the canoe, and if your seat is adjustable, find the right placement.

quote Chicagored: "Don't think anyone has mentioned this yet because its not an actual change to the canoe, but be aware of how the total weight will be placed in the canoe, including yourself and your pack or packs. Mostly you want to keep the canoe pretty level although there may be conditions where you want the front a little higher or lower. In a double canoe, the most weight is usually the people in front and back, with the packs sitting in the middle. In a solo, pack weight will determine trim. I have a prism with an adjustable seat which makes weight distribution a little more adjustable and take two packs for easier weight distribution.


So before your trip, practice loading your packs and see how they will sit in the canoe, and if your seat is adjustable, find the right placement."

Great advise. I do not have an adjustable seat. Thanks, I most certainly will do a dry run.
Mike

I didnt Come up with this idea, but did add to it to make it work a-little better. I have aluminum thwarts and did not want to drill into them to secure the shock cord, so i just made loop knots on the ends of the shock cord and secured around the bolts, and made sure my length would have good tension. Now that i have the shock cord all the way across i can use velcro straps to make any size area along the thwart, here i use it for securing a map case in font of me, the velcro holds the map case tight, when i portage i just grab the map case and pull it out or for short portage wrap it around the thwart and tuck under the shock cord. This has worked so well, i never have to stop paddling to see my map, i had it right in front of me arranged however i needed it. I will be adding this to my Souris River tandem stern thwart.