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QueticoMike
distinguished member(5167)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/13/2021 03:44PM  
I was told today that I wouldn't be issued a RABC permit to get into Quetico this year. They don't see the border being open in 2021. They will be sending me a refund. They also don't know if they are going to continue with the RABC program in the future. So the only way to enter Quetico in the future if this takes place is that you would have to drive to one of the northern entry points. Just sad news all the way around.
 
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01/13/2021 03:56PM  
That stinks. I've got 2 paddling buddies who could make an Upper Mo paddle this fall, so we put it off hoping travel would be able to happen this year. Looks like I'm a Cubs fan now. Wait 'til next year.
 
missmolly
distinguished member(7035)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/13/2021 04:25PM  
I'm sad you for you, Mike. I know how much you love Quetico.
 
QueticoMike
distinguished member(5167)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/13/2021 04:38PM  
missmolly: "I'm sad you for you, Mike. I know how much you love Quetico. "

Thank God for the Boundary Waters, it's as close as I am going to get this year.
 
pswith5
distinguished member(3371)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/13/2021 05:38PM  
So, Canada thinks we will give the virus to a moose then the moose will pass it on to people eh?
 
tumblehome
distinguished member(1794)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/13/2021 06:05PM  
It’s hard to imagine what life will be like if the RABC system was abolished. From my seat, it does seem to favor Americans more than a Canadian. I can’t imagine the impact it will have on Ely and Grand Marias businesses. And then you have the impact of everyone entering from the northern points. A very scary thought.

We shall see...

I did read today that Ontario is really restricting movement now with Covid raging up there. Sigh. Another BWCA trip for 2021...... :/
 
paddlefamily
distinguished member(1573)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/13/2021 07:31PM  
Bummer. Thanks for passing the info along. We were hoping to head into Woodland Caribou this year.
 
01/13/2021 08:30PM  
tumblehome: "It’s hard to imagine what life will be like if the RABC system was abolished. From my seat, it does seem to favor Americans more than a Canadian. I can’t imagine the impact it will have on Ely and Grand Marias businesses. And then you have the impact of everyone entering from the northern points. A very scary thought.


We shall see...


I did read today that Ontario is really restricting movement now with Covid raging up there. Sigh. Another BWCA trip for 2021...... :/"


As with 2020....I'd almost think Ely and GM will like that people can't get to Quetico at least in the short term. More visitors for the BWCA and more visitors coming to their towns and businesses. If the Q was open people would be driving across the border and spending money in Atikokan and such instead.
 
01/13/2021 11:18PM  
tumblehome: Sigh. Another BWCA trip for 2021...... :/"

Well that doesn't sound so bad. At least we do have the BW.
 
Wharfrat63
senior member (65)senior membersenior member
 
01/14/2021 07:23AM  
QueticoMike: "I was told today that I wouldn't be issued a RABC permit to get into Quetico this year. They don't see the border being open in 2021. They will be sending me a refund. They also don't know if they are going to continue with the RABC program in the future. So the only way to enter Quetico in the future if this takes place is that you would have to drive to one of the northern entry points. Just sad news all the way around."

Mike,

This is so interesting. My parents live in Florida and it is packed with Canadians this winter. I asked how they got in and I was told (take it as hearsay) that they just flew in. Ok, to fly they say...just can't walk/Drive/Paddle in. Hmmmm...I wonder what is true?

On another note, during my encounter with Canadian rangers last September, they told me that hoped the border would be open soon, because it is really the Americans that drive the Quetico Park Revenue.

Wharfrat.


 
Minnesotian
distinguished member(1892)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 08:13AM  
RunningFox:
This Covid thing has been blown out of proportion. ... Yes it is deadly for some, but not the vast majority. Even without Covid, just living life - living your life - puts other lives at risk. Somehow we lived with that fact — really lived — before COVID.
"


Read this thread.
Who here has gotten Covid-19?

And then go up to each and everyone in that thread who has had the virus or know someone who has and tell them that this thing "has been blown out of proportion."

And, I hope you don't get it and suffer from it. Because there are a lot of people who it hasn't been "deadly" for but are still suffering and may have to endure it for the rest of their life.
 
Blatz
distinguished member(1508)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 08:32AM  
Minnesotian: "Read this thread.
Who here has gotten Covid-19?

And then go up to each and everyone in that thread who has had the virus or know someone who has and tell them that this thing "has been blown out of proportion."

And, I hope you don't get it and suffer from it. Because there are a lot of people who it hasn't been "deadly" for but are still suffering and may have to endure it for the rest of their life. "

Most people don't die in car accidents. Doesn't mean we should do away with traffic laws and safety measures that the government has imposed. Wait a minute. Maybe that's why most people don't die in car accidents. That's all I have to say on this subject
 
thistlekicker
distinguished member (406)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 08:47AM  
Carving out border-restriction exceptions for Q paddlers might seem like a low-risk proposition but I'm sure that gets lost in the big picture. Really unfortunate, and another example of why we can't have nice things.
 
GopherAdventure
distinguished member(749)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 09:21AM  
Wharfrat63: "QueticoMike: "I was told today that I wouldn't be issued a RABC permit to get into Quetico this year. They don't see the border being open in 2021. They will be sending me a refund. They also don't know if they are going to continue with the RABC program in the future. So the only way to enter Quetico in the future if this takes place is that you would have to drive to one of the northern entry points. Just sad news all the way around."


Mike,


This is so interesting. My parents live in Florida and it is packed with Canadians this winter. I asked how they got in and I was told (take it as hearsay) that they just flew in. Ok, to fly they say...just can't walk/Drive/Paddle in. Hmmmm...I wonder what is true?


On another note, during my encounter with Canadian rangers last September, they told me that hoped the border would be open soon, because it is really the Americans that drive the Quetico Park Revenue.

Wharfrat "

I don’t know this for certain, but I believe the US/Canada border is only closed to Americans entering Canada. I believe Canadians are still allowed to travel freely as long as they immediately quarantine for two weeks upon re-entering Canada. Again, I’m not certain of this, but it’s what I was told this fall by someone in Grand Portage with more knowledge of the situation than me. That may explain why there are Canadians in the US on a non-work trip.

Tony
 
Jackfish
Moderator
 
01/14/2021 09:29AM  
If you want to have a conversation about Covid, the appropriate place for it is the Covid Forum.
 
MikeinMpls
distinguished member(711)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 10:17AM  
Jackfish: "If you want to have a conversation about Covid, the appropriate place for it is the Covid Forum. "

Fair enough, Pete. My apologies.

Mike
 
Grandma L
distinguished member(5456)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/14/2021 12:07PM  
I wonder if and how any of this Canada/US border closing stuff will eventually affect the portages covered by the Webster-Ashburton Treaty? Any ideas or information?
 
GopherAdventure
distinguished member(749)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 02:07PM  
Grandma L: "I wonder if and how any of this Canada/US border closing stuff will eventually affect the portages covered by the Webster-Ashburton Treaty? Any ideas or information?"

Funny you mention it GrandmaL, but I know back in September the participants of the Border Route Challenge were strongly encouraged to take the American portage whenever they came to a location with two portage possibilities (one on each side of the border). Back then, nobody was quite sure how intensely the Canadians were monitoring the border and they just wanted us to be careful. I remember scooting across bottle portage super fast as I was a little nervous since there is an alternate portage about a mile away by the American Ranger Cabin. I was also a little nervous on some of the border lakes as I wanted to stay on the US side of the imaginary line out of an abundance of caution.

There are numerous portages where there are two trails (one on each side of the border). A couple that come to mind...

1. Bottle portage
2. Prairie Portage
3. Lower Basswood Falls
4. Two of the portages heading up to Knife Lake from PP
I know there are more as I think there’s a couple on the Gunflint side (Granite River area comes to mind).

It will be interesting to see how these next few months play out. I was going to do my first Quetico trip this year, but it looks like I’ll be doing my 30th BWCA trip instead. No big deal, I’ll still be in my favorite place in the world!!!

Tony
 
Grandma L
distinguished member(5456)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/14/2021 03:45PM  
Tony, I think back at the Border Challenge we were given poor information. Once on the trail some of our paddlers encountered Canadian authorities that said the use of the W/A portages was just fine. The Dawson portage is definitely in Canada and is not part of the old treaty - so it would require an RABC. Like you said - just have to wait for all this to play out. Who knows, by summer we might all be on home lock-down and I will have to paddle around the back yard.(haha)
 
01/14/2021 04:20PM  
It sounds like Canada needs to put a Canadian Border Services building in Cache Bay now.....
 
01/14/2021 06:52PM  
Wharfrat "
I don’t know this for certain, but I believe the US/Canada border is only closed to Americans entering Canada. I believe Canadians are still allowed to travel freely as long as they immediately quarantine for two weeks upon re-entering Canada. Again, I’m not certain of this, but it’s what I was told this fall by someone in Grand Portage with more knowledge of the situation than me. That may explain why there are Canadians in the US on a non-work trip.

Tony"

I'm a dual citizen and most of my familiy live in Canada. According to them, this is correct. However, they've just added the stipulation that you need proof of a negative Covid test within 72 hours of your flight to enter back into Canada.
Been a real bummer for me. Haven't been able to visit my family and there's no end in sight to the quaratine requirements.
 
billconner
distinguished member(7421)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/14/2021 07:03PM  
I think Canadians and anyone entering New York State has to have a test within 72 hours before arrival and another within 72 hours after entry. Easier to enforce, record names, etc., if they enter by air.
 
gopher2307
distinguished member (159)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 07:19PM  
Let's work the problem. How do we apply for dual citizenship?

At every hockey game they have the better national anthem anyway.
 
outsidethebox
member (48)member
 
01/14/2021 08:25PM  
pswith5: "So, Canada thinks we will give the virus to a moose then the moose will pass it on to people eh?"

No, but Canada knows there are too many with such a cavalier attitude who will not exercise good, respectful judgement.
 
tomo
distinguished member (106)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/14/2021 08:55PM  
If the border is closed this summer, I will understand but will also be extremely bummed.
 
RunningFox
senior member (82)senior membersenior member
 
01/14/2021 10:27PM  
Minnesotian: "RunningFox:
This Covid thing has been blown out of proportion. ... Yes it is deadly for some, but not the vast majority. Even without Covid, just living life - living your life - puts other lives at risk. Somehow we lived with that fact — really lived — before COVID."

Read this thread.
Who here has gotten Covid-19?

And then go up to each and everyone in that thread who has had the virus or know someone who has and tell them that this thing "has been blown out of proportion."

And, I hope you don't get it and suffer from it. Because there are a lot of people who it hasn't been "deadly" for but are still suffering and may have to endure it for the rest of their life. "

I hope you don’t get it either; I hope no one does.

Appears my post was taken down. Censored. What I’m trying to say is this: hundreds of thousands will go to the BW this summer. Q will likely be closed, but would receive one-tenth the number of visitors. So to close the Q seems out of proportion, but I respect Canada’s right to decide what they will.

Tell me, because I’m slow and insensitive, should the BW be closed as well? Probably would save lives if it were closed. If not, if it remains open, must I go to everyone who is adversely affected (infected) by the decision not to close it and personally apologize (because I’m for it being open)?

Can I have any say in the matter? Or do you own the proportion knob on this?


 
mjmkjun
distinguished member(2694)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/15/2021 05:41AM  
outsidethebox: "pswith5: "So, Canada thinks we will give the virus to a moose then the moose will pass it on to people eh?"


No, but Canada knows there are too many with such a cavalier attitude who will not exercise good, respectful judgment. "


This!
 
outsidethebox
member (48)member
 
01/15/2021 06:20AM  
Clearly, Running Fox, you do not get it-and you demonstrate having no intention of attempting to get it. In plain and simple terms, "you" pose a major problem for agencies who take their responsibility for the well-being of the general public seriously. Maybe plan your next journey to the wizard's castle and ask for a heart and a brain-and figure out how to use them. Otherwise, I believe you are in violation of what the spirit of this forum is about.
 
billconner
distinguished member(7421)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/15/2021 07:04AM  
gopher2307: "Let's work the problem. How do we apply for dual citizenship?


At every hockey game they have the better national anthem anyway."


My bil and sil did that a few years ago. Learn french.
 
MagicPaddler
distinguished member(1383)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
01/15/2021 07:17AM  
Did anyone else get one of these informative phone calls or did one of QMike’s neighbors/friends prank him/us?
 
Grandma L
distinguished member(5456)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/15/2021 09:14AM  
Good question, Magic. We might have to do some checking since last fall it was "officials' who gave out the incorrect portage use information. Dang, we better double check before we get all uppity. (haha)
Remote Area Border Crossing information -website
Anything else documented?
 
QueticoMike
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01/15/2021 11:35AM  
MagicPaddler: "Did anyone else get one of these informative phone calls or did one of QMike’s neighbors/friends prank him/us?"
My trip buddy who lives in Texas received the call. They left him a message. I personally spoke to the rep. The only people they are calling are the people who had an RABC paid for already last year, did not obviously get to use the pass and were given the option of a refund or push it 12 months from when the RABC was purchased with a new RABC permit given to those who already paid for said RABC permit in 2020.

Since my 12 months were up and I was to be sent a new RABC, they called to tell me that they don't foresee the permit program taking place in 2021 and asked if I wanted a refund or no refund. I guess some people have chosen no refund for whatever reason. So they said they would send me a check. I asked if I could apply for an RABC if the border opens this year and he said it does not look like that will happen in 2021 and that is why they are offering the refund.

Then he went on to say he wasn't sure if the RABC program was going to continue once the border opens again. Sounds like they are still undecided on how they will proceed with this issue. That's all I obtained from the phone call.
 
01/15/2021 02:19PM  
That's a bummer, QM! I was hoping for a QP trip this year as well, maybe two, but neither are likely to happen now. I'll hope that things turn for the better by mid-year and this situation is re-assessed. Who knows? We have family up there as well and my wife and I won't be seeing them this year...unless they are in fact allowed to travel south to see us. No guarantees, I suppose.
 
Grandma L
distinguished member(5456)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
01/15/2021 03:25PM  
thanks QM for the clarification. I was hopeful for better news - but maybe next year!
 
RunningFox
senior member (82)senior membersenior member
 
01/15/2021 07:41PM  
Dear Outsidethebox:

You win. Just a little about me for you to consider:

1) I always wear my mask when in public
2) I always avoid shopping when stores are crowded
3) I Have avoided all social gatherings, with the exception of my two adult children and two sisters
4) I want the vaccine shot for COVID; the sooner the better
5) 61 yrs. old now; zero speeding tickets in my life; no arrests ever; worked since graduating college and paid all my taxes; still working, not retired
6) same employer past 33 yrs.
7) sent BWCA.com cash last yr.; same with Friends of BW Wilderness
8) as sensitive as a rock

Stay safe and keep it cooling.



 
01/15/2021 09:00PM  
outsidethebox: "pswith5: "So, Canada thinks we will give the virus to a moose then the moose will pass it on to people eh?"


No, but Canada knows there are too many with such a cavalier attitude who will not exercise good, respectful judgement. "


I understand your point and have frustration with many that flaunt the CDC guidelines but going to the Quetico is a wilderness trip. I have never been close enough to another person in Quetico to be considered “exposed” under the current CDC guidelines. The park is not well funded and depends on American dollars to keep it running. There is room to make an argument the park could be opened safely to Americans. It is annoying sometimes how some people act like Canada is the bastion of perfection. They make good and bad decisions just like every other country. They have every right to keep us out, but it is also okay to question the judgement of a government.

T
 
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