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BWCAgoer
member (35)member
 
04/14/2021 11:41AM  
Hi all,

Going to make my first CCS tarp purchase at Midwest Mountaineering expo later this month. What length and size of rope do you use for the center line of a ridgeline setup? Based on what I’ve read on the forum, you want the center ridgeline to be a larger diameter rope than the rope used to tie the prusik knots to tighten the ridgeline, correct? Also, what diameter rope do you use for the guy lines? Thanks!
 
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spud
member (36)member
 
04/14/2021 01:00PM  
The fun rabbit hole that is tarps :)

So based on all the wise people on here, it seems a good number go with the yellow rope that CCS includes with their tarps..

Additionally a lot of recommendations for the lash-it or zing-it (color is the only difference) for corners and other tie-outs..

My recommendation is to learn how to tie a sheetbend knot if you don't already know, as it is one of the best ways to tie additional lengths to your rope/tie outs... A lot of folks will leave short lengths tied to loops on the tarp at all times, and then use a sheetbend to attach their tieout cordage depending on which of those locations works best for the spot you are hanging the tarp in..

while it seems like having long ropes would be beneficial, I have often run into situations where it is a negative thing and makes it more difficult to tie it.. And it just seems so bad when you have to cut your rope to shorten it or need additional length elsewhere :)

When it comes to setups, I always have looked at Buttheads posts with the standard that I hope to some day get to!
 
Argo
distinguished member (217)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/14/2021 01:18PM  
In my view that would depend on the the size and weight of your tarp. I have a heavy 15 x15 tarp car camping tarp that I use a decent robust climbing rope to make my ridgeline.

But for a smaller, lightweight tarp I have 750 paracord. I really like to lean into a trucker's knot (provided you can get leverage) at one end of the ridgeline in order make it really firm. This knot is also good if you're threading your ridgeline through the tarp loops first. I prefer to hang the tarps through from the loops provided the tarp has at least one loop in addition to the two end loops. My hammock tarp only has end loops so I drape the centre-line over the ridgeline.

I just use regular 550 paracord for tie-outs. If you can get the reflective stuff that's a bonus.
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/14/2021 01:37PM  
I use 1.75 mm Lash it on both my ridgeline (80 ft) and my six tieouts (20 ft). This ensures my tarp can be deployed at nearly any campsite. I also pair my tieouts and ridgeline with Dutchware Wasp and Flyz to ease the hands. I do a siberian hitch first on my ridgeline, I personally love that knot because of the ability to tie and cinch the knot high above reach level. My prussik knots consist of 1.75 too, as I wrap it 3-4 times, no problem. My .02 cents
 
Argo
distinguished member (217)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/14/2021 01:58PM  
Two thumbs way up for Lawnchair's Siberian Hitch suggestion.
 
BWCAgoer
member (35)member
 
04/14/2021 02:14PM  
Planning to get the 10x14 CCS tarp 1.1oz.

I’ve mastered the Siberian hitch as shown in this video.

https://youtu.be/f-xNVIbNVJM

What do you mean tying it “high above reach”?
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/14/2021 02:19PM  
With the siberian hitch, you have the ability to start your ridgeline at whatever height you want, not just at arms reach. For example, if I’m having a fire underneath my tarp, I can set my tarp up a little higher than normal (10 ft?) using a siberian hitch with my quick release down to the ground.

When I tie my siberian hitches, I hardly cinch them down with my hands like in the video. Tie the knot, pull on the working end until the knot reaches the tree to cinch itself.
 
04/14/2021 02:30PM  
The cordage CCS sells with their tarp work fine for all purposes, All the loop tie-outs, ridge if used and prusiks will work well with the 3mm 1/8th inch twisted poly cord.

butthead
 
04/14/2021 02:40PM  
Most anything you can do with a Siberian hitch can be done with a truckers hitch. The added benefit of more adjust-ability and tension adjustments.

butthead
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/14/2021 02:51PM  
BH,
You use a truckers hitch as your first knot on your ridgeline? I guess Im confused why the truckers hitch is being compared to a siberian.
 
Savage Voyageur
distinguished member(13738)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
04/14/2021 03:30PM  
With the tarp you will get 80’ of 450 cord. I would add a 100’ of 550 paracord for your ridgeline too. I don’t use any knots for my tarps. I use the figure nine cord tighteners. They are so much faster to use. No knots to learn, no knots to tie wrong. Simple, fast, easy. I leave the figure nine tighteners on the tarp lines.
 
04/14/2021 06:41PM  
I like the reflective rope that you can get with the CCS tarp. Otherwise, buy something that's reflective....no clue how many times at night I've thought "oh wow glad I can easily see where that corner rope is at so I don't trip on it"

Or if the ridgeline happens to be about head high somewhere.
 
MidwestFirecraft
distinguished member(660)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/14/2021 06:48PM  
I won't let 550 paracord anywhere near my tarps or hammocks. I am a huge fan of 3/16 to 1/4 Dyneema for the ridgeline and Zing-it for the tie-outs. The yellow rope that comes with the tarp is decent, but has more stretch than I care for. The Dyneema ridge line has no stretch and 50 feet weighs very little.
 
04/14/2021 07:08PM  
Lawnchair107: "BH,
You use a truckers hitch as your first knot on your ridgeline? I guess Im confused why the truckers hitch is being compared to a siberian."


+1 I use the Siberian Hitch for the anchor end, but that's all . . .

 
04/14/2021 07:46PM  
I tend to setup tarp different without center poles or a ridge-line,



The yellow corner anchor is loop to loop at the tarp and a truckers hitch at the tree anchor. The anchor is loose around the tree trunk and can be raised up and down as needed, without untying, tightened or loosened via the truckers hitch. I compared the use of a different knot in the same situation.

Sometimes I will use a loose bowline loop around the tree with the truckers hitch at the tarps corner loop. Again the loose bowline around the tree can be mover up and down the trunk for height adjustment and the truckers hitch to adjust the tightness of the setup.
When I do use a ridge-line the cord goes thru the loops except for the perimeter where prusik's are handy, anchors for the ridge-line are again a truckers hitch on one side and a loose bowline on the other.



Far as needing a heavier cord for a ridge or such with large tarps here is a 15x15 setup using all 1/8th inch cordage.



There are as many was to set a tarp as skinning a cat.
Old school terminology yes but that is me!

butthead
 
Argo
distinguished member (217)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/14/2021 09:40PM  
butthead: "
Far as needing a heavier cord for a ridge or such with large tarps here is a 15x15 setup using all 1/8th inch cordage.

butthead"


My Aquaquest Defender is over 7 lbs. This beast goes on motorized camping trips only!

I use the Siberian as my anchor, feed the standing end through the loops and use a trucker's knot at the other end. This is all done at 10'-12' off the ground for each end point of the ridgeline. The standing end used to tighten the trucker's knot is usually thrown over a tall branch to ensure it's on a close enough plain with the ridgeline when hauling the tarp up. I just don't see 1/8" rope in this role. I have to wrap it around my waist and really lean into it. It's one solid ridgeline when it's done. As you can see it there's not a lot of adjacent trees for the kinds of setups in your photos.

But I am curious to know if you still think I'm overdoing it with the rope after what I've explained. I've just used this climbing rope because I have it and the tarp is such a beast. I haven't critically thought it out from a scientific standpoint.
 
04/14/2021 09:49PM  
I use the CCS yellow cord for my ridgeline and green REI utility cord for my tie outs. Main reason is it helps me know which cord to grab as I’m pulling out of the bag - quicker set up.
 
mschi772
distinguished member(627)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/14/2021 10:28PM  
I HATE paracord. It is terribly stretchy, especially when wet, and does it ever love to drink water! Paracord has no place with me. I use amsteel cordage for most of my ridgelines and tie-outs (some accessorized with Dutchware hardware), but I still do carry some polyester cordage for whatever comes up. I sometimes have polypropylene cordage as well. Polypropylene floats, and there are times when that is handy.
 
04/14/2021 10:32PM  
Butthead, we both use a trucker's hitch - it seems you just use a bowline instead of a siberian hitch, not instead of the trucker's hitch, which is what confused us.
 
04/14/2021 11:23PM  
Not always, but I try to set up in such a way I can adjust heights without untying and retying.
Most times I can use a paddle blade to push up the anchor loops or pull them lower.

butthead
 
04/15/2021 11:02AM  
While I only use amsteel and lash-it/Zing-it for my hammock fly, I use the CCS cordage on my tarp. 80' for the continuous ridgeline and 20' on each corner. I use some thinner cordage to prussik to the ridgeline loop via S biner for quick release to lower the tarp ends when it rains. I also carry six additional 20' hanks of CCS cordage in case I have to extend my corner tieouts to distant trees. I attach the ridgeline at one tree with a bowline knot and I tension at the other tree with a truckers hitch. I also carry some figure 9's just in case, but I like to play with knots.
 
04/15/2021 11:21AM  
I getting disgusted with all these knotty posts!
 
spud
member (36)member
 
04/15/2021 12:01PM  
I do love these threads... My first trip up, our collective tarp game was pretty bad, so i have made it my goal to get better at it.. I do also go the way of using hardware, and have the figure 9's for my corner tieouts, and use the zing-it as I have plenty to use for my hammock tarp as well.. Its easier to get others to help, when you don't need to worry about their knot knowledge and all they need to do is know how to wrap it around the hardware.. Nothing gives the sense of pride more than a well implemented tarp setup!
 
04/15/2021 12:15PM  
Knots are fun to know and use but even with a good dose of that knowledge I'm not beyond a small bag of hardware to use.
Far as the photo, which I got some flak over from another member, the black bag with cordage also has a 12x14 CCS tarp in it. The green bag has a 10x12 CCS and is for size comparison. Most times this get broken down to a tarp needed cordage and some hawdware and carried in my pack.

butthead
 
BWCAgoer
member (35)member
 
04/15/2021 01:05PM  
Thank you all for chiming in. Appreciate the help!

@butthead what is all the hard wear for? Can you link to the S biners you use to connect the prusik line to the edge enter loop of the tarp?
 
Argo
distinguished member (217)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/15/2021 01:21PM  
Bowline anchor is fine when you are low enough to reach it.

Butthead mentioned using a paddle for elevation on the ridgeline endpoints. That's where the Siberian hitch excels as a ridgeline anchor point. You can elevate your anchor point as high as you want as long as you leave enough rope from your tag end to reach from the ground for a quick release.

A theme commonly mention is about the infinite number of variations in tarp erection. But I would posit there should be some rules:

1) Unless you are using a knot that deliberately jams - like a bowline, knots should never jam.

2) Whenever possible, tarp knots should have a one-pull release.

3) Never let anyone near your ropes that doesn't understand rules 1 and 2. :)
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/15/2021 02:07PM  
Argo: "Bowline anchor is fine when you are low enough to reach it.


Butthead mentioned using a paddle for elevation on the ridgeline endpoints. That's where the Siberian hitch excels as a ridgeline anchor point. You can elevate your anchor point as high as you want as long as you leave enough rope from your tag end to reach from the ground for a quick release.


A theme commonly mention is about the infinite number of variations in tarp erection. But I would posit there should be some rules:


1) Unless you are using a knot that deliberately jams - like a bowline, knots should never jam.


2) Whenever possible, tarp knots should have a one-pull release.


3) Never let anyone near your ropes that doesn't understand rules 1 and 2. :) "


This is great. Unspoken truth
 
Savage Voyageur
distinguished member(13738)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
04/15/2021 02:51PM  
MidwestFirecraft: "I won't let 550 paracord anywhere near my tarps or hammocks. I am a huge fan of 3/16 to 1/4 Dyneema for the ridgeline and Zing-it for the tie-outs. The yellow rope that comes with the tarp is decent, but has more stretch than I care for. The Dyneema ridge line has no stretch and 50 feet weighs very little. "

Totally agree with your point on using paracord for hammocks. But if Dan from CCS uses 450 cord for his tarp lines then that’s good enough for me.
 
AdmAckbar13
senior member (52)senior membersenior member
 
04/15/2021 02:54PM  
If you're interested in using a continuous ridgeline on your tarps, I've had fantastic luck with these over the years. It's incredibly fast and easy to set up.
They're pricey but I've had my original Dutch ridgeline for 5 or 6 years and it's still in fantastic shape.

Dutchware Gear Continuous Ridgeline
 
MidwestFirecraft
distinguished member(660)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/15/2021 03:34PM  
Savage Voyageur: "MidwestFirecraft: "I won't let 550 paracord anywhere near my tarps or hammocks. I am a huge fan of 3/16 to 1/4 Dyneema for the ridgeline and Zing-it for the tie-outs. The yellow rope that comes with the tarp is decent, but has more stretch than I care for. The Dyneema ridge line has no stretch and 50 feet weighs very little. "


Totally agree with your point on using paracord for hammocks. But if Dan from CCS uses 450 cord for his tarp lines then that’s good enough for me. "


Yellow Poly Cord

I'm not saying this to be a smart ass because 450 cord may be poly cord but I am not familiar with it. When I refer to paracord I mean 550 cord and from the link above Dan states it is not the same as paracord. I think it works well, but certainly has more stretch than Zing-it.

As a side note I started using a carabiner on the standing end of the rope. You simple clip it over the ridgeline. Super easy adjustment with no knots. I then use a truckers hitch on the working end. With Dyneema you can get it tight rope tight!
 
04/15/2021 04:05PM  
I personally favor Dan's cordage for my community tarps because at 1/8" it's thicker than Zing-it/Lash-it, and it's not as slippery as amsteel so it holds a knot better. It's polyester, so it won't absorb water and stretch when wet. I actually like the bit of natural give it provides, almost like a little shock absorber. Again, this is just my personal experience/bias.
 
TipsyPaddler
distinguished member (284)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/15/2021 04:19PM  
AdmAckbar13: "If you're interested in using a continuous ridgeline on your tarps, I've had fantastic luck with these over the years. It's incredibly fast and easy to set up.
They're pricey but I've had my original Dutch ridgeline for 5 or 6 years and it's still in fantastic shape.


Dutchware Gear Continuous Ridgeline "


+1 I use these for my hammock tarps and CCS tarps. I like the soft shackle/prusik connectors. Simple and light weight.
 
04/15/2021 05:09PM  
It's a combination of Nite Ize carabiner's Figure 9's and such hardware with a few custom item made for me. When I use a bowline to anchor to a tree I leave a lot of space so the loop can be slid up and down the trunk as far as I can reach, it's never drawn tight to the trunk. I can raise and lower as needed while still tied the tension taken up with a truckers hitch at the loop of the tarp. Sometimes they are reversed truckers hitch at the tree, again no need to untie and retie. Either way works well depending on circumstance.

butthead
 
AdmAckbar13
senior member (52)senior membersenior member
 
04/15/2021 05:19PM  
Agreed, the prussik version is the way to go.
 
TuscaroraBorealis
distinguished member(4817)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
04/15/2021 05:35PM  
cyclones30: "I like the reflective rope that you can get with the CCS tarp. "

Just be aware that glass is what is used to make the cordage 'reflective'. Not saying it shouldn't be used but, just be aware that it could eventually cut through loops. You may want to tie some small regular cordage loops to heavily used loops on the tarp.
 
MidwestFirecraft
distinguished member(660)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/15/2021 07:56PM  
TuscaroraBorealis: "Just be aware that glass is what is used to make the cordage 'reflective'. Not saying it shouldn't be used but, just be aware that it could eventually cut through loops. You may want to tie some small regular cordage loops to heavily used loops on the tarp."

I know Dan has stated this before, but every manufacturer I have contacted said they do not use glass and it would not cut through. I tend to believe they have changed as Big Agnes etc. includes these with there tents and when you run your fingers up and down the line they are not sharp like they used to be.
 
04/15/2021 08:44PM  
Ridgeline is 1/8 or 7/64 inch Amsteel Blue cut to approx 80 ft.
 
04/16/2021 03:27PM  
Amsteel for the ridgeline and Dyneema/Lash-it for the tie outs and prusik knots.
I stay away from any materials that stretch when wet.
 
04/16/2021 07:16PM  
Well, looks like I have more things to experiment with . . .

Speaking of hardware . . . has anyone tried the Loop Alien ?
 
Argo
distinguished member (217)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/16/2021 09:54PM  
unshavenman: "While I only use amsteel and lash-it/Zing-it for my hammock fly, I use the CCS cordage on my tarp. 80' for the continuous ridgeline and 20' on each corner. I use some thinner cordage to prussik to the ridgeline loop via S biner for quick release to lower the tarp ends when it rains. I also carry six additional 20' hanks of CCS cordage in case I have to extend my corner tieouts to distant trees. I attach the ridgeline at one tree with a bowline knot and I tension at the other tree with a truckers hitch. I also carry some figure 9's just in case, but I like to play with knots.
"


I see you are not looping the ridgeline through the two end loops. I hadn't thought of that. So when you remove the S biner to lower the tarp ends, what do you do with the end loop? Tie it to the base of the tree or do you just add tension to the corners?
 
MidwestFirecraft
distinguished member(660)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/17/2021 07:55AM  
Argo: "I see you are not looping the ridgeline through the two end loops. I hadn't thought of that. So when you remove the S biner to lower the tarp ends, what do you do with the end loop? Tie it to the base of the tree or do you just add tension to the corners?"



Last Loop

I think this will help with a visual for your answer ^
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/17/2021 08:19AM  
boonie: "Well, looks like I have more things to experiment with . . .


Speaking of hardware . . . has anyone tried the Loop Alien ?"


This looks like an awesome alternative (looks like it could fit 2.2 mm zing it?) to the Dutchware hardware that requires 1.75 mm cord.

One of the reasons I went with Dutchware Wasps and Flyz for my truckers hitches was to avoid the rope to rope abrasion over time. With the hardware, I’m hoping to get longevity out of my cordage. Anyone else dealt with this? Im specifically talking about the truckers hitch knot of when you really tug to get taut.
 
04/17/2021 08:58AM  
Argo: "unshavenman: "While I only use amsteel and lash-it/Zing-it for my hammock fly, I use the CCS cordage on my tarp. 80' for the continuous ridgeline and 20' on each corner. I use some thinner cordage to prussik to the ridgeline loop via S biner for quick release to lower the tarp ends when it rains. I also carry six additional 20' hanks of CCS cordage in case I have to extend my corner tieouts to distant trees. I attach the ridgeline at one tree with a bowline knot and I tension at the other tree with a truckers hitch. I also carry some figure 9's just in case, but I like to play with knots.
"



I see you are not looping the ridgeline through the two end loops. I hadn't thought of that. So when you remove the S biner to lower the tarp ends, what do you do with the end loop? Tie it to the base of the tree or do you just add tension to the corners?"

I have a 20' hank of cordage attached to each end loop. When there's a storm approaching I will unhook the end loops from the S biners and then tie the ends out low, either to a tree or to a stake. It works beautifully.
 
BWCAgoer
member (35)member
 
04/17/2021 09:02AM  
For the S biner attachment to the center peripheral tarp loop attachment to prusik line, how strong does S-Biner need to be?

Nite Ize Size-2 S-Biner Dual Carabiner, Stainless-Steel, Black https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000WUIGYA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_SPXGWYFE8TGJVGRZG2YX?psc=1

Size 5 (100lb)?

Thanks!!
 
04/17/2021 11:12AM  
BWCAgoer: "For the S biner attachment to the center peripheral tarp loop attachment to prusik line, how strong does S-Biner need to be?


Nite Ize Size-2 S-Biner Dual Carabiner, Stainless-Steel, Black https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000WUIGYA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_SPXGWYFE8TGJVGRZG2YX?psc=1


Size 5 (100lb)?


Thanks!!"

I think that your linked size 5 S-Biner might actually be overkill. I'm all about weight savings, so maybe a size 2 or 3 would be more appropriate in this application. I've used small lightweight carabiners as well. They don't need to be load bearing as they are just used as a quick-release point while attached to the prusik loops when the tarp is deployed during non-storm mode.
 
04/17/2021 11:36AM  
I think the S-biners on my setup are the smallest ones, maybe next up. I actually have all the center loops attached to the ridgeline with them. I've used it in some conditions with probably 40-50 mph gusts. Like unshavenman said they aren't load bearing.
 
campnfish
distinguished member (294)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/17/2021 11:48AM  
For my Lean 3 i use the following method from dereck hansen, i use method 4b, with the carabiner on one end and the dutch stingerz on the other. i leave it all attached and its as easy of a method i have found. Wrap the one end around the tree and connect the biner as shown, then wrap the other end around the other tree and cinch. Then move the tarp along the ridgeline to where you want it and stake it out. i have 75' of zing-it for the ridgeline and that will cover any campsite ive been at.



 
04/18/2021 11:00AM  
I have a green 10’x14’ CCS 1.1 oz Silicon Tarp, 35oz including 8 20’ loop tiedowns stuffed inside a CCS ridgeline stuffsak. Additionally, for my ridgeline I am using 100’ of 1/8” Amsteal-Blue green color, 2500lbs ridgeline strength, 7.75oz. For the tiedown cord I use Lawson yellow Reflective Glowwire, 2mm x 300' 3.9oz/100ft, strength: 250 lbs. I like the Lawson glowwire because it’s very reflective and makes great Pusik Loops which grip well to the ridgeline, I use it for my tent tiedowns too. I make the Pusik Loops by first cutting a 16” piece of the glowwire (see pic #1) and heat seal the ends. This eventually makes a nice 3.5” loop when attached to the ridgeline by a Pusik Knot (see #5). These Pusik Loops slide perfectly well and grip like crazy under tension as the reflective material in the cord adds some additional grab power. I leave these Pusik Loops on the ridgeline during storage so that they are there for quick deployment. Steps #2 and #3 of the Pusik Loop construction is to form a loop from the cut piece and tie a single overhand knot at each end. Step #4 in the picture is to leave a small tab at the knot ends to facilitate opening the loop if necessary. Pulling the loop to full size pulls the knot ends together forcing them to tighten on each other. I attach the loops to the ridgeline and cleanup the Pusik Knot leaving the Loop end knots away from the ridgeline. In #6 I have a supply of these Pusik Loops for quick use if needed.
 
04/18/2021 12:34PM  
It’s pretty cool to see so many variations. I tend to stick to the same few A-frame configurations using lots of bowlines and truckers hitches. This thread has inspired me to mix it up this year. I’m going to start by practicing the Siberian hitch.

As far as rope goes, anything with nylon, including 550 paracord, will stretch noticeably. The high strength UHMW ropes, like amsteel will have low stretch. I don’t really like those braids for knots, especially in small diameter. Tying and untying knots in Zing-It types ropes is not ideal. The hammock community has a ton of neat hardware, although I just haven’t been able to get used to hardware instead of knots. For tarps, I like sheath core type cord whether it’s polyester or UHMW. Lawson Equipment has some pretty good cord in both Dyneema and polyester. CCS cordage has been polyester and doesn’t stretch nearly as much as paracord. (I’m also not familiar with 450.) For very light cord, zpacks has 1.3mm z-line core-sheath cord (they also have “slick” 1.2 mm and 2 mm braided). The small cord have >200 lbs of breaking strength, but it’s hard to pull on cord that thin, so I usually use it sparingly or with small tarps, like when backpacking.

Also, even if the reflective tracers are not glass, they are much more abrasive than the fibers. I no longer trust 2 mm reflective cord for tight truckers hitches because I’ve sawed right through the line more than once. I only use non-reflective rope on the web loops to prolong the webbing and tie rope loops at various locations. After awhile, you can see where the rope loops have been abraded. I also use non-reflective cord for the ridge line. It’s impossible to know how much it matters, but I tend to trust Dan Cooke’s advice when it comes to tarps.

 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/18/2021 01:40PM  
cycle003:
Tying and untying knots in Zing-It types ropes is not ideal. The hammock community has a ton of neat hardware, although I just haven’t been able to get used to hardware instead of knots. For tarps,

"


Agreed. Anytime I am using Zing-it/ Lash-it cord I am 100% using a quick release knot. You’ll really love the siberian hitch!
 
goaljohnbill
distinguished member (224)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/19/2021 01:42PM  
MidwestFirecraft: ...

As a side note I started using a carabiner on the standing end of the rope. You simple clip it over the ridgeline. Super easy adjustment with no knots. I then use a truckers hitch on the working end. With Dyneema you can get it tight rope tight!"


This /\ although if you aim for tight rope tight make sure you have a heavy enough biner. We werent paying attention one of the 1st times we did it and streched the standing end carabiner open from over tightening the truckers hitch. Had to get one of the spares off a boat to fix it. I have a home built sil 10*12 in a ridgeline stuff sack with ~65' of 1/8" amsteel for the ridge and permanently attached zing it for corner ties and prussiks. The standing end carabiner is permanently on the rope and sits outside of the stuff sack.
 
Argo
distinguished member (217)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
04/19/2021 06:10PM  
goaljohnbill: "MidwestFirecraft: ...


As a side note I started using a carabiner on the standing end of the rope. You simple clip it over the ridgeline. Super easy adjustment with no knots. I then use a truckers hitch on the working end. With Dyneema you can get it tight rope tight!"



This /\ although if you aim for tight rope tight make sure you have a heavy enough biner. We werent paying attention one of the 1st times we did it and streched the standing end carabiner open from over tightening the truckers hitch. Had to get one of the spares off a boat to fix it. I have a home built sil 10*12 in a ridgeline stuff sack with ~65' of 1/8" amsteel for the ridge and permanently attached zing it for corner ties and prussiks. The standing end carabiner is permanently on the rope and sits outside of the stuff sack."


You still need to knot the carabiner to the cord. Why not just tie a permanent bowline at the standing end, come around the tree and feed a bite through and secure it with a toggle (stick). Less weight and less hardware.
 
04/19/2021 07:05PM  
BWCAgoer: "Planning to get the 10x14 CCS tarp 1.1oz.

I’ve mastered the Siberian hitch as shown in this video.

https://youtu.be/f-xNVIbNVJM

What do you mean tying it “high above reach”?"


SIberian hitch is a slip knot, so you can throw the working end up over a tree branch, tie the knot and then cinch it so your anchor point it now up at the branch level. Be sure to leave enough line hanging off the knot in reach to untie. Or a loop you can untie with a stick as shown at the end of this video,
 
tomo
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04/21/2021 02:01PM  
Zing it for ridgeline and tie outs, dutchware hardware for ridgeline (dutch hook, wasp), NAMA claws in place of prusik NAMA CLAWS

 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/21/2021 03:14PM  
tomo: "Zing it for ridgeline and tie outs, dutchware hardware for ridgeline (dutch hook, wasp), NAMA claws in place of prusik NAMA CLAWS
"


How are the NAMA Claws? Do they eat up the line at all when theyre in use?
 
tomo
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04/22/2021 08:56AM  
I’ve been pleased with them. I was worried about what they might do to my rope, but I haven’t noticed any damage.
 
schweady
distinguished member(7318)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
04/22/2021 02:56PM  
tomo: "...NAMA claws in place of prusik NAMA CLAWS "
So, is the 1/8" yellow poly that Dan sends with his CCS tarps too big to use with these?
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/22/2021 03:10PM  
schweady: "tomo: "...NAMA claws in place of prusik NAMA CLAWS "
So, is the 1/8" yellow poly that Dan sends with his CCS tarps too big to use with these?
"


CCS cordage looks to be too large.



Tomo, I went ahead and purchased a couple of these, thanks for the tip.
 
tomo
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04/23/2021 04:25PM  
Hope you like them!
 
Argo
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04/24/2021 01:17PM  
This has been an excellent thread.

I thought I had my tarping down. I had good knots and good technique that I learned over the years from Youtube. But none of the videos ever talked about rope. They mostly seem to use paracord and I went along with the crowd. But I checked out some Dynema and Zingit rope after reading about it here and it's excellent stuff. Maybe a bit less supple than para but stronger, lighter, and doesn't absorb water.

My Kayak rack that I've had for years came with sections of this awesome blue tie-down rope. I always liked this cord and thought it would be great for tarping but never knew what it was. Now I think it's the famous Amsteel Blue. I though it was just the typically average stuff you generally get with equipment where ropes are included. Now thanks to BWCA.com I realize what it is. The battle now is to actually find this stuff in Canada. We generally don't have the variety and abundance of gear you guys in the States get. And when we do find it, it's always way more expensive :(

I'm also looking forward to not rigging the ridgeline through the end loops on my large 15 x 15 tarp and saving those only for the Prussic connection in case we're visited by inclement weather. Beats lowering the tarp and dealing with the ridgeline and all the attendant tie-downs.

I'm still a knot guy. I fail to understand the allure of the rope hardware. I could tie a hitch or a tension knot quicker than rigging these doohickeys and its fewer things to carry or lose.

Thanks all.
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/24/2021 02:07PM  
Argo: I'm still a knot guy. I fail to understand the allure of the rope hardware. I could tie a hitch or a tension knot quicker than rigging these doohickeys and its fewer things to carry or lose.
"


I agree, I love my knots. But in all, all my hardware that goes onto my tarp tieouts and ridgeline stay onto my tieouts and ridgeline. No extra pieces, no missing hardware. They all get tied and wrapped around the famous hair braid that stays onto the tarp. My only problem was- associated with the truckers hitch, was the rope abrasion that happens when you really crank down the tension. Argo, have you dealt/ seen this? This was my only reasoning to buying hardware. Well that, and dealing with 1.75 mm lash it can get tricky sometimes. My 2 cents.
 
ODoyle
member (7)member
 
04/25/2021 04:27AM  
Or if using 1/8 or 7/64 dyneema for the ridge line, splice an eye in the end. Or if you get far enough down the rabbit hole, make a soft shackle and use that with the eye splice instead of a carabiner. This is how I have been re rigging my tarps in the ridge line stuff sacks.
 
Argo
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04/25/2021 07:32AM  
Lawnchair107: "Argo: I'm still a knot guy. I fail to understand the allure of the rope hardware. I could tie a hitch or a tension knot quicker than rigging these doohickeys and its fewer things to carry or lose.
"



I agree, I love my knots. But in all, all my hardware that goes onto my tarp tieouts and ridgeline stay onto my tieouts and ridgeline. No extra pieces, no missing hardware. They all get tied and wrapped around the famous hair braid that stays onto the tarp. My only problem was- associated with the truckers hitch, was the rope abrasion that happens when you really crank down the tension. Argo, have you dealt/ seen this? This was my only reasoning to buying hardware. Well that, and dealing with 1.75 mm lash it can get tricky sometimes. My 2 cents."

I haven't used it enough to have an answer for you on the trucker's knot. I did wonder about that too. But the contact point changes every time. Perhaps others can help.
On another site I did see someone wondering about the abrasion issue with hardware. If someone can settle that question, I would be happy to use a good piece of hardware to save the rope.
As far as the rabbit hole goes, splicing is not on my radar at the moment. But I'm sure we all know that gear obsession can eventually take you places you never imagined :)
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
04/25/2021 08:01AM  
Argo, you’ve probably seen this before, but this is a quick tutorial of some of the hardware I utilize (wasp/ flyz).

Tarp Hardware- Dutchware
 
Saberboys
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04/27/2021 10:21AM  
What length is everyone using for the ridgeline? I recently purchased one of Dan's 15x15 tarps and am wondering if I use the supplied rope for the ridgeline at 80 feet, or cut it into 4-20 foot sections for the tie outs and add a new ridgeline. I am thinking that a 50 foot ridgeline may not be enough in certain circumstances?
 
portagedog09
member (30)member
 
04/27/2021 10:44AM  
50 ft. I don't recall ever needing more than that and if the trees are that far apart, would you really want that much ridgeline anyway. I can imagine the amount of sway a good wind would induce in that length of line. Seems like you'd be out in the open and better off with poles to support the ridgeline, then stake it into the ground, around a log/downed tree or boulder. Some folks here use some pretty thin ridge line and mentioned that Dan's supplied stuff doesn't stretch, but I cannot really see using that for a ridgeline. I use 7mm climbing rope.
 
Argo
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04/27/2021 11:06AM  
Saberboys: "What length is everyone using for the ridgeline? I recently purchased one of Dan's 15x15 tarps and am wondering if I use the supplied rope for the ridgeline at 80 feet, or cut it into 4-20 foot sections for the tie outs and add a new ridgeline. I am thinking that a 50 foot ridgeline may not be enough in certain circumstances? "

Discaimer: I have previously offered advice on this thread only to discover that some of my more learned colleagues have more informed advice. If you suffer from headaches, diarrhea or vomiting, call you doctor. Cheques will not be honoured.

You're right. You will hit the odd site where 50' will be too short. I would stick with 80'. Joining rope along a ridgeline presents issues related to the location of your sheet-bend (joining knot). It can interfere with tarp placement along your ridgeline if you run it through the loops, or impact the location of your prussic loops or tension knot - particularly the trucker's hitch. There are solutions around these issues. But it's an unnecessary wrench into the gears in my opinion.
 
04/27/2021 11:22AM  
Saberboys: "What length is everyone using for the ridgeline? I recently purchased one of Dan's 15x15 tarps and am wondering if I use the supplied rope for the ridgeline at 80 feet, or cut it into 4-20 foot sections for the tie outs and add a new ridgeline. I am thinking that a 50 foot ridgeline may not be enough in certain circumstances? "
Go with an 80' ridgeline using Dan's cordage and add additional 20' hanks at each corner.
 
Lawnchair107
member (50)member
 
05/01/2021 06:22AM  
tomo: "Hope you like them! "

I’ve been playing around with these for about a week now. Awesome little piece of gear. Thank you! I now have these attached to my ridgelines on my tarp and lean. Not only are they smaller than my mitten hooks, but also a little more secure than using a prussik knot on those slippery dyneema cords.
 
Saberboys
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05/06/2021 12:20PM  
So I've opted to try 80 feet of Amsteel with Loop Alien's for the ridgeline of my 15x15 1.9 oz since it is a heavier tarp and has the potential to catch some wind. I'll be using the included yellow cord that came with Dan's tarp for the corner tie outs.
 
05/06/2021 03:38PM  
I'd be interested in your experience with the loop aliens.
 
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