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mike13
member (7)member
 
07/17/2021 09:03PM  
Just watched this YouTube video and lost count of the number of USFS violations they committed. Hope the forest service tracks them down and fines the crap out of them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUJd-PfhIRc "camping with the boys " by Its Max Camping with the boys
 
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Savage Voyageur
distinguished member(13910)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
07/17/2021 09:49PM  
Pretty sad video. Harassment of Bald Eagles is not cool. I wonder where this was located at?
 
07/17/2021 09:52PM  
mike13: "Just watched this YouTube video and lost count of the number of USFS violations they committed. Hope the forest service tracks them down and fines the crap out of them.
https://youtu.be/oCYUhtf2cfg "camping with the boys " by Its Max Camping with the boys "


Last year the forest Service was shown a YouTube video of a group of violators, i believe the video was used against them.

I hope the same happens with this group.
 
Stumpy
distinguished member(1756)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 12:05AM  
They're guilty of bad footwear and poor paddling.
 
PeaceFrog
senior member (75)senior membersenior member
 
07/18/2021 12:29AM  
Total disregard and wreckless. Makes me sick to watch them. No PFD being worn
 
HowardSprague
distinguished member(3159)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 04:02AM  
They must have gotten some good scathing comments, and switched it to “private”.
 
billconner
distinguished member(7956)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/18/2021 05:59AM  
Its now not viewable.
 
mjmkjun
distinguished member(2832)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 06:57AM  
billconner: "Its now not viewable."
Figures. It wasn't too smart of them to make it public in the first place.
 
podgeo
distinguished member (289)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 07:05AM  
PeaceFrog: "Total disregard and wreckless. Makes me sick to watch them. No PFD being worn"

I did not see the the video ...but you talk of not wearing a PFD I have seen lots of pictures that people have posted on here where they are not wearing life jackets.
 
schweady
distinguished member(7412)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/18/2021 07:11AM  
Didn't see it in time. I'm guessing that they set up their tent with an outie. Sheesh...
 
07/18/2021 07:42AM  
I watched it last night. The large fire outside the fire grate up on the hill was very disturbing. As was the idiot fondling his gun.

While not against the rules, at one point in the video one of them was splitting wood and using his foot as a brace. I was waiting for the hatchet to impact his foot and cut it off.

And the use of a drone was also not cool, especially chasing a bald eagle.

These people are just another example of humans who should not be allowed to breed.
 
07/18/2021 10:11AM  
Didn’t see the video…

What were all the violations? Drones are illegal in the BWCAW, large fire outside the fire grate, harassing wildlife…those are from the comments here.

T
 
07/18/2021 10:16AM  
A nephew is a WI DNR warden. He has told me several times that they frequently get tips on Facebook posts or YouTube videos showing all kinds of violations which they investigate and cite people for.
 
11842
 
07/18/2021 10:23AM  
Downloaded the video last night assuming they'd remove it at some point. Uploaded a copy of the video at the link below. If there's anything I missed in the timestamps, let me know and I'll add it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUJd-PfhIRc

Anyone recognize the lakes or sites they were at? The canoes are from Seagull Outfitters so I assume they weren't too far from there.
 
Savage Voyageur
distinguished member(13910)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
07/18/2021 10:50AM  
billconner: "Its now not viewable."


You didn’t miss much good with this video.
Chopping wood while holding the log with his foot.
Chasing a Bald Eagle with a drone.
Brandishing a weapon like a gangster.
Fires outside of a grate.
Probably more but I had to shut it off.
 
tschendel
 
07/18/2021 11:33AM  
I saw the video and the group was on, Seagull, Alpine and Ogish for sure. I just came back from there and I bet with a bit more research, they can easily identified. Deb Mark would be really disappointed with her equipment being used for this type of behavior. It's no wonder that chipmunks and other wildlife are often nuisances, that humans have conditioned. It's very disappointed to watch this. I personally picked up dozens of pieces of fishing equipment and garbage on my Ogish campsite this past week. It's embarrassing for me, a 13 time BWCA guest, to see this type of use.
 
whyzata
member (27)member
 
07/18/2021 11:40AM  
Smart move, good thinking.. These guys should be prosecuted and never allowed back into the BWCAW. Seagull Outfitters should have good records about clients.
 
24kGold
distinguished member (379)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 11:50AM  
For all of those violations, I hope they are caught, heavily fined and banned for a few years. Disturbing on so many levels. I understand being young, rambunctious and stupid (not wearing life jackets, chopping wood with an axe dangerously close to your foot, etc., but this goes beyond that. We all learn some things the hard way...this should be one of those times, I'm afraid.

Terry
 
07/18/2021 12:23PM  
tschendel: "It's embarrassing for me, a 13 time BWCA guest, to see this type of use. "

I suspect most of us on BWCA.com consider ourselves "guests" when we visit canoe country, and that the feeling of being welcomed to the area (as opposed to feeling entitled to visit) makes us feel embarrassed when we see callous displays such as the early portion of the video contained. I couldn't watch it all--just not interested in seeing idiocy and disrespect on display.

TZ
 
Duckman
distinguished member (480)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 12:31PM  
I have to think the dozens and dozens of rocks moved and thrown violates some regs. If nothing specific, certainly the spirit of them.

I read the comments before I watched. Figured the bracing the log with the foot thing was a stretch. Nope, hard to think of a more potentially dangerous way to do it than that.

I’d imagine chasing the eagle around with the drone is what will get them in trouble the most if anything is ever done.
 
jrlatt
distinguished member (477)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 01:30PM  
11842: "Downloaded the video last night assuming they'd remove it at

.


Thanks for downloading the video.

Just having a drone in the BWCA is a violation. I was upset with the
fire and the size of the fire. Fire is a real and dangerous threat to the BWCA.
These kinda of individuals should be banned from the BWCA.
I sent a link of the thread to the chat on recreational.gov.

Have a nice day
 
gravelroad
distinguished member (461)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 01:36PM  
The United States Fish and Wildlife Service is charged with protecting Bald Eagles, and they take it very seriously. I've sent the info on to them.

In case he takes umbrage at this development, the twerp with the drone and the pistol would do well to keep it holstered. His face is already known to me now. 'Nuff said.
 
07/18/2021 01:44PM  
I'm guessing that Seagull Outfitters has already been notified?
 
07/18/2021 02:21PM  
Was hoping someone would download the evidence.

The 4+ incidents (that we know of) where they harass eagles are all terrible.

As is their taste in music.

Winners of the Shitshow Olympics.
 
TylerJ
 
07/18/2021 02:41PM  
Not a violation, but kevlar canoes pulled up on rocks full of gear had me cringing. Doubt the outfitter would be happy about that.
 
yogi59weedr
distinguished member(2458)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 02:54PM  
I would so not want to be these guys.
Simple fun gone bad.
I doubt these young people will be drug over the coals as a few have suggested.
They are about to receive an education that will last a life time.
 
mychurchmyhome
member (25)member
 
07/18/2021 03:27PM  
Thank you 11842 and Mike13 for this information. I was able to share with the Forest Service, hopefully like last year, the group will be found and fined accordingly. This is a disgrace, they think they are just the shit. None of us want visitors like this in our BWCAW.
 
mike13
member (7)member
 
07/18/2021 04:36PM  
mychurchmyhome: "Thank you 11842 and Mike13 for this information. I was able to share with the Forest Service, hopefully like last year, the group will be found and fined accordingly. This is a disgrace, they think they are just the shit. None of us want visitors like this in our BWCAW. "

+1
I'm not real tech savvy so I'm glad 11842 was able to save video as potential evidence.
Thanks all!
 
andym
distinguished member(5079)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/18/2021 05:49PM  
Thank you to Mike13 for making the video known, to 11842 for preserving the evidence, and to those who are reporting it.
 
07/18/2021 06:12PM  
gravelroad: "The United States Fish and Wildlife Service is charged with protecting Bald Eagles, and they take it very seriously. I've sent the info on to them.
"


Thankyou.
It is called Harassing Wildlife, I worked for the US Fish and Wildlife Service for 15 years, they take this thing very seriously. There is a special USFWS agent who works out of Duluth.

§ 2.2 Wildlife protection. (a) The following are prohibited: (1) The taking of wildlife, except by authorized hunting and trapping activities conducted in accordance with paragraph (b) of this section. (2) The feeding, touching, teasing, frightening or intentional disturbing of wildlife nesting, breeding or other activities.
 
NotLight
distinguished member(1241)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 06:13PM  
Seems like, for the next few years, the game will be to figure out where Team Instagram-Snapchat-Tiktok-Adventure-Van is not (besides the library).


 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 06:21PM  
On second thought, I might start bringing my shotgun to the Boundary Waters to shoot down drones. I can't think of anything that would get me going more than a drone buzzing around my campsite.
 
Duckman
distinguished member (480)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 06:30PM  
Bromel: " I can't think of anything that would get me going more than a drone buzzing around my campsite. "

Match Box 20 being played on the lake so all four canoes can hear it is up there too!
 
Mocha
distinguished member(7468)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/18/2021 06:38PM  
Searched but can’t find it. I sure hope they gat caught. Debbie will NOT be happy, for sure.
 
Gaidin53
distinguished member (123)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 08:10PM  
What an idiot with the gun! He dry fired with it pointed about 10 yards to the left of his buddies in a different canoe! I’d have kicked his ass if he had pointed a gun that close to me or family and then dry firing it! What was the point of that! Fricking idiot shouldn’t have a carry permit! It is not a toy to be played with like it’s a toy!!!!

The fire has me ticked off beyond speech! Especially right now when I’m praying I get to go this year and already had to change my entry point due to the forest fires. Out of the fire grate not even near a fire grate and then the fricking size of it!

Yeah the hatchet or axe was pretty special! Drones are banned and then disturbing the eagles. I’m surprised they got through the trip without any major injuries requiring an evacuation with the stupid stuff they were doing.

Glad it got reported and glad somebody downloaded it and gave it to the forest service.

Ryan
 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/18/2021 09:12PM  
The Grand Marais Ranger District Office is aware of this. I hope the culprits experience some consequences.


 
07/18/2021 10:00PM  
Some of their pictures look like they had a drone.
 
gopher2307
distinguished member (182)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 12:30AM  
I think the boundary waters won that fight. Something tells me the videographer won't be back up there much. They started fishing a bunch, clearly with dog crap methods, and ended up spending hours hucking boulders at a standing burnt pine. I can't believe the guy didn't use his sidearm to shoot at the tree once the boulders failed and caused a boo boo to a pointer finger. So much hype filming himself stroking his gun...and nothing...what a let down.

Log splitting with a fiskar hatchet, while standing, using the foot as a backstop was awesome. Dumping their canoe on flat water, and then falling off the shoreline rock, also priceless.

Waste of 10 minutes aside from those couple of high notes.
 
Stumpy
distinguished member(1756)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 02:53AM  
I've paddled or motored up on Eagles with camera or camcorder and ended up chasing them away.... kind of the same thing as in their video.
I've thrown my share of rocks in the bwca.
Had a close friend shock me pulling out a speaker thing with loud music on Fourtown Lake (I was pissed).
I've had some good sized fires in the fire pit (not during a fire ban).
I've had a gun in the bwca.

All that said.... I would not want to travel with these goofs..... But I have to say, I've seen WAY worse stuff out there.
Piles of garbage... Campsites destroyed.... even death, due to ignorance.
I'd go lenient on them, and let their embarrassment do the trick.
 
Northland
distinguished member (213)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 04:55AM  
11842: "Downloaded the video last night assuming they'd remove it at some point. Uploaded a copy of the video at the link below. If there's anything I missed in the timestamps, let me know and I'll add it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUJd-PfhIRc


Anyone recognize the lakes or sites they were at? The canoes are from Seagull Outfitters so I assume they weren't too far from there."


Thanks for saving the video. Does anyone recall the screen name of the YouTube account?
 
07/19/2021 07:15AM  
"Its Max"
 
PeaceFrog
senior member (75)senior membersenior member
 
07/19/2021 07:39AM  
Stumpy: "I've paddled or motored up on Eagles with camera or camcorder and ended up chasing them away.... kind of the same thing as in their video.
I've thrown my share of rocks in the bwca.
Had a close friend shock me pulling out a speaker thing with loud music on Fourtown Lake (I was pissed).
I've had some good sized fires in the fire pit (not during a fire ban).
I've had a gun in the bwca.


All that said.... I would not want to travel with these goofs..... But I have to say, I've seen WAY worse stuff out there.
Piles of garbage... Campsites destroyed.... even death, due to ignorance.
I'd go lenient on them, and let their embarrassment do the trick.
"


I agree with letting some embarrassment be part of their education. However, I feel that some financial penalties should be assessed to help them understand how serious this is. The guy flashing his sidearm all the time should not be allowed to carry. Ever! If he has a CCW, it should be revoked.
 
07/19/2021 08:44AM  
Finally watched it…

Since it was posted on YouTube and edited I obviously knew nothing bad happened but this group is an accident waiting to happen.
1. They got really close to the cliff, with part of it giving away
2. Standing in the canoe, finally tipped it then dragging it to shore the guy thought he broke his ankle, fell back with his ankle wedged in rocks
3. The hatchet…
4. The guy with the gun…the showing it several times was weird…as a gun owner I have worries and wonder about mental capacity…pointing it behind one of the canoes on video and dry firing? Very risky IMHO.
5. HUGE fire, lighting the cross logs on fire and running under neath them…

Yep give them a couple more trips and we will hear about a major injury.

I hope some embarrassment helps them out before they get hurt.

T
 
07/19/2021 09:01AM  
Pinetree: "Some of their pictures look like they had a drone."
They did. And thanks to them filming the drone flying over them in the campsite and canoes, you can pick out which one was operating it.
 
jillpine
distinguished member(643)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 09:53AM  
PeaceFrog: "Stumpy: "I've paddled or motored up on Eagles with camera or camcorder and ended up chasing them away.... kind of the same thing as in their video.
I've thrown my share of rocks in the bwca.
Had a close friend shock me pulling out a speaker thing with loud music on Fourtown Lake (I was pissed).
I've had some good sized fires in the fire pit (not during a fire ban).
I've had a gun in the bwca.



All that said.... I would not want to travel with these goofs..... But I have to say, I've seen WAY worse stuff out there.
Piles of garbage... Campsites destroyed.... even death, due to ignorance.
I'd go lenient on them, and let their embarrassment do the trick.
"



I agree with letting some embarrassment be part of their education. However, I feel that some financial penalties should be assessed to help them understand how serious this is. The guy flashing his sidearm all the time should not be allowed to carry. Ever! If he has a CCW, it should be revoked."


Unless wealthy, it is almost certain financial penalty will carry an impact. Humiliation and embarrassment - guesswork.
I'm certain it's also a unisex consideration for some, but think of these "goofs" camping near your wife, sister, mother, girlfriend, partner, aunt, daughter on her solo trip, especially when their Maker's Mark starts flowing. It progresses pretty quickly from annoying to threatening.
 
Porkeater
distinguished member (178)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 09:59AM  
airmorse: "I'm guessing that Seagull Outfitters has already been notified?"

I don't know what a cooperator's obligation is to the Forest Service when they become aware of violations by their customers, but I sure hope they do the right thing here.
 
gravelroad
distinguished member (461)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 10:33AM  
The twerp lives in Minneapolis. Various details of his life are being collected for forwarding to the appropriate authorities.
 
07/19/2021 10:56AM  
Gaidin53: "What an idiot with the gun! He dry fired with it pointed about 10 yards to the left of his buddies in a different canoe! I’d have kicked his ass if he had pointed a gun that close to me or family and then dry firing it! What was the point of that! Fricking idiot shouldn’t have a carry permit! It is not a toy to be played with like it’s a toy!!!!"

I own firearms and hunt a lot.

Took firearms safety when young, took it again with my son recently.

Pretty sure this would be an automatic fail by the Safety Instructor - sighting down your weapon with people downrange...good grief.
 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 12:13PM  
Here is the tip line for reporting suspicious or illegal activity within the Superior National forest.
 
07/19/2021 12:41PM  
Bromel: "Here is the tip line for reporting suspicious or illegal activity within the Superior National forest. "

This should be handed out when getting a permit
 
07/19/2021 01:06PM  
They seem pretty bored. Throwing rocks at trees and off a cliff, feeding chipmunks, drinking, and playing with fire. I hope these guys never go back to the boundary waters. They could have easily started a forest fire.
 
07/19/2021 01:51PM  
This is most certainly Alpine Lake, campsite 541. I'm confident Deb at Seagull is fully aware of the situation and the Forest Service is on the case.
 
Mike5914
distinguished member (119)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 02:04PM  
tschendel: "I saw the video and the group was on, Seagull, Alpine and Ogish for sure. I just came back from there and I bet with a bit more research, they can easily identified. Deb Mark would be really disappointed with her equipment being used for this type of behavior. It's no wonder that chipmunks and other wildlife are often nuisances, that humans have conditioned. It's very disappointed to watch this. I personally picked up dozens of pieces of fishing equipment and garbage on my Ogish campsite this past week. It's embarrassing for me, a 13 time BWCA guest, to see this type of use. "

If this video was from early June of this year, wonder if these were the people who were operating a drone on east end of Alpine....and they snuck up right by my boat with my son then my dad's boat....then flew way up and south out of view.

There were also a few nights we heard gunshots. Fairly close to our site as well. Those shots came from south of the Alpine/Seagull portage, probably north of Jasper Falls.
 
gravelroad
distinguished member (461)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 03:53PM  
Mike5914: "tschendel: "I saw the video and the group was on, Seagull, Alpine and Ogish for sure. I just came back from there and I bet with a bit more research, they can easily identified. Deb Mark would be really disappointed with her equipment being used for this type of behavior. It's no wonder that chipmunks and other wildlife are often nuisances, that humans have conditioned. It's very disappointed to watch this. I personally picked up dozens of pieces of fishing equipment and garbage on my Ogish campsite this past week. It's embarrassing for me, a 13 time BWCA guest, to see this type of use. "


If this video was from early June of this year, wonder if these were the people who were operating a drone on east end of Alpine....and they snuck up right by my boat with my son then my dad's boat....then flew way up and south out of view.


There were also a few nights we heard gunshots. Fairly close to our site as well. Those shots came from south of the Alpine/Seagull portage, probably north of Jasper Falls. "


Pretty likely, given dates gleaned elsewhere.
 
11842
 
07/19/2021 04:17PM  
gravelroad: "Mike5914: "tschendel: "I saw the video and the group was on, Seagull, Alpine and Ogish for sure. I just came back from there and I bet with a bit more research, they can easily identified. Deb Mark would be really disappointed with her equipment being used for this type of behavior. It's no wonder that chipmunks and other wildlife are often nuisances, that humans have conditioned. It's very disappointed to watch this. I personally picked up dozens of pieces of fishing equipment and garbage on my Ogish campsite this past week. It's embarrassing for me, a 13 time BWCA guest, to see this type of use. "



If this video was from early June of this year, wonder if these were the people who were operating a drone on east end of Alpine....and they snuck up right by my boat with my son then my dad's boat....then flew way up and south out of view.



There were also a few nights we heard gunshots. Fairly close to our site as well. Those shots came from south of the Alpine/Seagull portage, probably north of Jasper Falls. "



Pretty likely, given dates gleaned elsewhere."


Yeah, he posted a video reviewing a hammock on May 30 with a comment about going camping in a few days. I think that was definitely them.

jillpine: "PeaceFrog: "Stumpy: "I've paddled or motored up on Eagles with camera or camcorder and ended up chasing them away.... kind of the same thing as in their video.
I've thrown my share of rocks in the bwca.
Had a close friend shock me pulling out a speaker thing with loud music on Fourtown Lake (I was pissed).
I've had some good sized fires in the fire pit (not during a fire ban).
I've had a gun in the bwca.



All that said.... I would not want to travel with these goofs..... But I have to say, I've seen WAY worse stuff out there.
Piles of garbage... Campsites destroyed.... even death, due to ignorance.
I'd go lenient on them, and let their embarrassment do the trick.
"




I agree with letting some embarrassment be part of their education. However, I feel that some financial penalties should be assessed to help them understand how serious this is. The guy flashing his sidearm all the time should not be allowed to carry. Ever! If he has a CCW, it should be revoked."



Unless wealthy, it is almost certain financial penalty will carry an impact. Humiliation and embarrassment - guesswork.
I'm certain it's also a unisex consideration for some, but think of these "goofs" camping near your wife, sister, mother, girlfriend, partner, aunt, daughter on her solo trip, especially when their Maker's Mark starts flowing. It progresses pretty quickly from annoying to threatening.
"


The hammock review I just mentioned was filmed at his dad's $6+ million house. Unfortunately I don't think financial penalties will impact their behavior one bit.
 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 04:26PM  
Kiporby: "This is most certainly Alpine Lake, campsite 541. I'm confident Deb at Seagull is fully aware of the situation and the Forest Service is on the case."

Does anyone know for sure if Seagull Outfitters is aware of this? Or is it just speculation?
 
dschult2
distinguished member (136)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 04:49PM  
I finally watched the video and to be honest it made me very sad and worried about our future. I really hope these guys get tracked down and delt with.
 
billconner
distinguished member(7956)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/19/2021 06:13PM  
Bromel: "Here is the tip line for reporting suspicious or illegal activity within the Superior National forest. "

So, I'm not really savvy on the new satellite communicators but could you contact USFS tip line with one? Could be reason to upgrade.
 
WHendrix
distinguished member(543)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 07:30PM  
Yes, I think you could do that. Of course you would need to have their email address with you or better yet have it in your address list on the unit (I'm talking now about an InReach). Actually, I like that idea and I think I will put it in my address list. It could be useful for a number of reasons
 
podgeo
distinguished member (289)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 07:42PM  
Pinetree: "Bromel: "Here is the tip line for reporting suspicious or illegal activity within the Superior National forest. "


This should be handed out when getting a permit "


Maybe they should require photos of trip leader and alternate leader.... for the records
 
BigCurrent
distinguished member(611)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/19/2021 09:28PM  
This group is the perfect example of who shouldn't be allowed in the BW.
 
07/19/2021 09:58PM  
Jeez....heck of a guy to trip with. Let me fly my drone over you while you've flipped your canoe and are struggling to grab your stuff that's floating around. Gotta get that content....not help your friends
 
mjmkjun
distinguished member(2832)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 05:13AM  
Stumpy: "They're guilty of bad footwear and poor paddling. "
After actually watching the video I agree with Stumpy.
 
yogi59weedr
distinguished member(2458)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 06:39AM  
They should be allowed ,but they need a better education on what the Boundary Water is.
 
Duckman
distinguished member (480)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 06:43AM  
yogi59weedr: "They should be allowed ,but they need a better education on what the Boundary Water is."

I agree with this. They wanted a backcountry "spring break" style trip. There's a time and a place for that, most of us have been in that frame of mind at some point in our lives. It's a lot like the people who use the BDUB for an Alone style bushcraft playground. It's just not the place for that.

So better education is probably the right answer. I'd imagine everyone in that video is aware of this thread and hopefully figuring out the mistakes they made. Hopefully one or two of them are actually contrite over the whole thing.

 
PeaceFrog
senior member (75)senior membersenior member
 
07/20/2021 07:02AM  
Duckman: "yogi59weedr: "They should be allowed ,but they need a better education on what the Boundary Water is."


I agree with this. They wanted a backcountry "spring break" style trip. There's a time and a place for that, most of us have been in that frame of mind at some point in our lives. It's a lot like the people who use the BDUB for an Alone style bushcraft playground. It's just not the place for that.


So better education is probably the right answer. I'd imagine everyone in that video is aware of this thread and hopefully figuring out the mistakes they made. Hopefully one or two of them are actually contrite over the whole thing.


"


I'm really challenged by this one. Stumpy and others have valid points for them being allowed. However, should they continue to be allowed?? I just struggle with feeling like most of the individuals would truly grasp what many of us are saying and feel about BW; solely based on the behavior that was recorded. I believe I did pick up on one individual in the video express concern about the size of the fire they had up on the rock above camp. Maybe at least he could be someone that could help educate his buddies. I do hope there is some follow-up from USFS on this in some fashion. Grace and Mercy goes a long way but Humility is the key in accepting it.
 
bretthexum
senior member (52)senior membersenior member
 
07/20/2021 07:38AM  
Hopefully they pay a fine, learn their lesson, and move on with life. Are some suggesting they get banned forever?

People make dumb decisions and (hopefully) learn from them. Was it ignorance, stupidity, or just plain not giving a crap? Probably all of the above. A nice stiff fine will probably teach them not to do this nonsense again.
 
Northwoodsman
distinguished member(1627)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 08:26AM  
A fine may not have an impact, but community service might. Portage maintenance, latrine moving, campsite cleanup, fire grate replacement, etc. Three benefits - 1) hopefully they will learn a lesson and learn about rules, 2) hopefully they will get educated and gain respect for nature, 3) it would provide some much needed maintenance assistance.
 
bretthexum
senior member (52)senior membersenior member
 
07/20/2021 09:53AM  
Northwoodsman: "A fine may not have an impact, but community service might. Portage maintenance, latrine moving, campsite cleanup, fire grate replacement, etc. Three benefits - 1) hopefully they will learn a lesson and learn about rules, 2) hopefully they will get educated and gain respect for nature, 3) it would provide some much needed maintenance assistance."

Perfect! Some latrine digging would definitely make them think twice about it!
 
07/20/2021 10:01AM  
Bromel: "Kiporby: "This is most certainly Alpine Lake, campsite 541. I'm confident Deb at Seagull is fully aware of the situation and the Forest Service is on the case."


Does anyone know for sure if Seagull Outfitters is aware of this? Or is it just speculation?"


I can assure you it is not speculation Bromel. :) I have alot of contacts up their including my daughter who currently is working there this summer.
 
CityFisher74
distinguished member(540)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 10:14AM  
cyclones30: "Jeez....heck of a guy to trip with. Let me fly my drone over you while you've flipped your canoe and are struggling to grab your stuff that's floating around. Gotta get that content....not help your friends"

He's a rich silver spoon punk. These aren't his friends. At best they're frat brothers. Most likely they're just grifting and enjoy Daddy's house in the summer time.
 
07/20/2021 12:19PM  
Very true....and also why a fine probably won't hurt him at all. Needs to be service as mentioned before....with no gopro allowed
 
07/20/2021 12:25PM  
cyclones30: "Very true....and also why a fine probably won't hurt him at all. Needs to be service as mentioned before....with no gopro allowed "

Most States if crime is high enough, hunting and fishing license are suspended and many States have agreements that will carry over to other states. Thus he cold be blocked out from activities from many states.

 
07/20/2021 12:28PM  
cyclones30: "Very true....and also why a fine probably won't hurt him at all. Needs to be service as mentioned before....with no gopro allowed "

I don't know about the gopro. It might be a good punishment that is relevant to the nature of the crime. People are acting this way to establish a certain online reputation. Having the FS show people exactly what that type of behavior gets you would probably be a pretty effective deterrent and specifically address those types of people that otherwise just wouldn't get it.
 
07/20/2021 03:18PM  
They don't want to be educated. Too important, too arrogant, rules are meant for other people. Fine the crap out of them just so you feel a little better and put some money towards helping heal the wounds.
 
07/20/2021 04:16PM  
cowdoc: "They don't want to be educated. Too important, too arrogant, rules are meant for other people. Fine the crap out of them just so you feel a little better and put some money towards helping heal the wounds."

+1
 
northallen
distinguished member(671)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 05:11PM  
Young and dumb. Looks like a few first timers. I am sure they learned a lot about camping on that trip.
The large fire and gun were the egregious/creepy aspects of the video. Mostly just a group I'd try to distance from.
Ironic that we are casting stones and lighting the torches...
 
mjmkjun
distinguished member(2832)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 05:22PM  
northallen: "Young and dumb. Looks like a few first timers. I am sure they learned a lot about camping on that trip.
The large fire and gun were the egregious/creepy aspects of the video. Mostly just a group I'd try to distance from.
Ironic that we are casting stones and lighting the torches..."


:-)
 
billconner
distinguished member(7956)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/20/2021 06:45PM  
Seems like the same antisocial behavior reported on airplanes, in restaurants and other public accomodations, probably soon in classrooms, and elsewhere. Sad commentary on society.
 
schweady
distinguished member(7412)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/20/2021 06:52PM  
So, the other day, a punk in Yankee Stadium threw a baseball and intentionally hit a Red Sox outfielder in the back. That person is now banned from attending MLB games for life.

The egregious nature of the multiple violations committed by these morons warrants a far greater barrage of penalties... banishment, monetary fines, jail time, hard labor, public shaming, tar and feathers... whatever else they can think of.

And, send me the drone footage of each of the above being handed down.
 
Stumpy
distinguished member(1756)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/20/2021 11:48PM  
northallen: "Young and dumb. Looks like a few first timers. I am sure they learned a lot about camping on that trip.
The large fire and gun were the egregious/creepy aspects of the video. Mostly just a group I'd try to distance from.
Ironic that we are casting stones and lighting the torches..."


Agree
 
07/21/2021 07:34AM  
Morons. I weep for the future.
 
WhiteWolf
distinguished member(4473)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberpower member
 
07/21/2021 07:38AM  
Just a lack of respect for nature and others. The drone after the bald eagle really is bothersome. It actually made me cringe. A total disregard for rules and regulations. SAD>
 
ShawnV
 
07/21/2021 08:58AM  
A great example of what not to do on many fronts. It’s a great opportunity to show correction and move on. If you live anywhere within 40 miles of the Mississippi and it’s larger tribs or on a non-BWCA lake in MN/WI then you know Eagles are everywhere and around human activities on a regular basis and will certainly survive this encounter.
 
07/21/2021 09:33AM  
Don't get me wrong, I made a ton of mistakes on my first trip and was very ignorant of many of the rules. It was only afterward that I learned that the can of condensed milk was a violation. But this group seems proud of their ignorance , either that or they enjoy flaunting the rules. Chasing eagles with drones and bon fires out of the fire grate are not simple mistakes. How could you not know it's wrong? Especially with how dry it has been.

Videographers that do this for attention should be treated differently. They are setting an example by cultivating a following and posting their own violations online. The FS setting an example through enforcement is an appropriate response. So is our conversation where we speak out against this type of behavior.
 
gravelroad
distinguished member (461)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/21/2021 07:12PM  
ShawnV: "A great example of what not to do on many fronts. It’s a great opportunity to show correction and move on. If you live anywhere within 40 miles of the Mississippi and it’s larger tribs or on a non-BWCA lake in MN/WI then you know Eagles are everywhere and around human activities on a regular basis and will certainly survive this encounter."

FYI:

“ How close is too close?
Under federal law, it is illegal to pursue, shoot, shoot at, poison, wound, kill, capture, trap, collect, destroy, molest or disturb eagles – including getting too close. During breeding season, we recommend that any activities that could disturb a breeding pair be kept at least 660 feet away from an active eagle nest. This extends to waterways as well. Motorized boats and other vehicles should follow the same distancing recommendations and be mindful of nesting pairs. Please note that it is also illegal to trail or pace an eagle with a drone while the eagle is in flight.

“Legal penalties
Not only can people potentially cause an eagle pair to abandon an active nest for the breeding season, they can lose expensive equipment to a defensive eagle attack. These actions can result in expensive penalties under multiple federal, state and tribal laws. Under the Bald and Golden Eagle Protection Act, the first criminal offense is a misdemeanor with a maximum penalty of one year in prison and a $100,000 fine for an individual or a $200,000 fine for an organization. The second offense becomes a felony, with a maximum penalty of two years in prison and a $250,000 fine for an individual or a $500,000 fine for an organization. The act also provides for maximum civil penalties of $5,000 for each violation.”

Keeping bald eagles and other wildlife safe from drones
 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/21/2021 07:46PM  
gravelroad: "ShawnV: "Under the Bald and Golden Eagle Protection Act, the first criminal offense is a misdemeanor with a maximum penalty of one year in prison and a $100,000 fine for an individual "

If the kid who chased the eagle with the drone goes to prison for one year, I will be OK with that.
 
Stumpy
distinguished member(1756)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/22/2021 12:01AM  
I find the over the top outrage more bothersome, than what these guys actually did out there.
 
Unas10
distinguished member(1448)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/22/2021 04:29AM  
Stumpy: "I find the over the top outrage more bothersome, than what these guys actually did out there.
"

Yep.
 
07/22/2021 04:53AM  
Unas10: "Stumpy: "I find the over the top outrage more bothersome, than what these guys actually did out there.
"

Yep."




I’ve tried to convey that but couldn’t find the right words so I deleted. The eagle thing alone I don’t see them “being chased”. If that’s the case every car that goes by a roadkill with an eagle flying off should go to jail. Yeah the drone... and a couple fires, mainly the tree. But really their camps were clean and organized. So what if they had a hatchet and a machete... the gun thing? Eh... I don’t advocate needing a gun. But unless I wasn’t watching close enough I don’t think there’s evidence of wrongdoing ( I mean legally). Dragging loaded canoes? Really didn’t see anything worthy of bashing to this extent. I agree that there were violations... and good for you to report them if that makes you feel high and mighty. But there are definitely bigger things to be concerned about. I’m sure they realize now their screwups. Let it rest!
 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/22/2021 07:43AM  
Stumpy: "I find the over the top outrage more bothersome, than what these guys actually did out there.
"


I don't think it is outrageous to expect people to follow the laws and respect the wilderness. That's why we all have enacted such laws. I don't feel outraged by their activity.
 
07/22/2021 08:28AM  
Stumpy: "I find the over the top outrage more bothersome, than what these guys actually did out there.
"


I totally see your side—what you are trying to say…

I think part of it is people are tired of running into what idiots have done up there and now…here is evidence of some idiots…sort of a modern day lynching (exaggerating I know)…it is a symptom of what many of us are tired of today. Just blatant disregard of authority/rules. People (of all ages) feel like they can just follow the rules they agree with. Just tired of it and this group got caught red handed because they bragged online.

BUT…the HUGE fire in dry conditions, the pointing the gun at another canoe are un acceptable and are worthy of outrage. I am gonna agree to disagree there. I still respect the point you are trying to make though.

T
 
PeaceFrog
senior member (75)senior membersenior member
 
07/22/2021 08:43AM  
timatkn: "Stumpy: "I find the over the top outrage more bothersome, than what these guys actually did out there.
"



I totally see your side—what you are trying to say…


I think part of it is people are tired of running into what idiots have done up there and now…here is evidence of some idiots…sort of a modern day lynching (exaggerating I know)…it is a symptom of what many of us are tired of today. Just blatant disregard of authority/rules. People (of all ages) feel like they can just follow the rules they agree with. Just tired of it and this group got caught red handed because they bragged online.


BUT…the HUGE fire in dry conditions, the pointing the gun at another canoe are un acceptable and are worthy of outrage. I am gonna agree to disagree there. I still respect the point you are trying to make though.

I'm with you. I've said my peace and feel like we can all move on. I will continue to be a voice for the BWCA and help educate those that could use some assistance. Cheers to everyone!


T"
 
PeaceFrog
senior member (75)senior membersenior member
 
07/22/2021 08:46AM  
I'm with you. I've said my peace and feel like we can all move on. I will continue to be a voice for the BWCA and help educate those that could use some assistance. Cheers to everyone!
 
Speckled
distinguished member (331)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/22/2021 10:24AM  
Man alive! Interesting video...interesting response...interesting thread.

My thoughts:

Wealthy kid - who cares, irrelevant to the discussion.

Harassing the Eagle - ya, not really, at least not to a degree that most of us are not already guilty of. I've approached all kinds of wildlife in an effort to get a better pic and had it fly, bound or run away. I'd bet the majority here have as well. So the eagle flew away - they fly every day.

Drone - yep against the rules, mail them a ticket and move on... not lifetime ban worthy in my opinion and certainly not jail worthy.

Throwing rocks at a dead tree or off a cliff - oh well, is there a rule against it? I'm not aware if there is... I don't think so. If it's not putting anyone in immediate danger or being disruptive to others, then carry on.

Bonfire outside of the fire grate - yep, not their best move considering the drought and certainly against the rules... again mail them a ticket and move on.

I, for one, am guilty of much stupider things (not in the BW) at that age. Also guilty of breaking a few rules on our first few trips, looking back nothing damaging in my opinion, but as time went on, we did further educate ourselves and become better BW trip goers.
 
Savage Voyageur
distinguished member(13910)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished membermaster membermaster member
 
07/22/2021 10:55AM  
The link in Mike13 original post says it is a private video and does not work. But if you copy the entire link then it will open.
 
Northland
distinguished member (213)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/23/2021 11:03AM  
ShawnV: "A great example of what not to do on many fronts. It’s a great opportunity to show correction and move on. If you live anywhere within 40 miles of the Mississippi and it’s larger tribs or on a non-BWCA lake in MN/WI then you know Eagles are everywhere and around human activities on a regular basis and will certainly survive this encounter."

I don't think it's about whether the eagle will survive the encounter or not. It's the fact that the law stipulates that you can't do what this person did.
 
Lionabe
member (47)member
 
07/23/2021 11:08AM  
Northland: "ShawnV: "A great example of what not to do on many fronts. It’s a great opportunity to show correction and move on. If you live anywhere within 40 miles of the Mississippi and it’s larger tribs or on a non-BWCA lake in MN/WI then you know Eagles are everywhere and around human activities on a regular basis and will certainly survive this encounter."


I don't think it's about whether the eagle will survive the encounter or not. It's the fact that the law stipulates that you can't do what this person did."


I agree. While my concern for the wildlife remains, this is a matter of the law!
 
07/23/2021 11:32AM  
While the eagle in the video appears to be bothered very little by the drone it is really hard for us to know. What is probably more important is what animals the drone operator may disturb in the future without being informed on a drones potential to harm wild life. A couple quotes from an article. I will post the link for your reading.

"In June 2020, during the COVID-19 pandemic, some 3,000 elegant tern eggs were abandoned at a Southern California nesting island after a drone crashed and scared off the birds. The drones were flown illegally over the Bolsa Chica Ecological Reserve in Huntington Beach in May and one of them went down in the wetlands, The Orange County Register reports.

Fearing an attack from a predator, several thousand terns abandoned their ground nests. Now, during the month when the white birds would be overseeing the eggs as they begin to hatch, the sand is littered with egg shells. It’s one of the largest-scale abandonment of eggs ever."

“There was a recent video that showed an eagle attacking a drone. And a lot of the social media reaction made it like the eagle defeated the drone. That eagle was probably hurt bad or even killed by that encounter. I see an eagle anywhere in the vicinity, the drone is coming down, even if it means I lose data.”



Link. How drones scare wildlife.
 
Bromel
distinguished member(558)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/23/2021 11:54AM  
Lionabe: "Northland: "ShawnV: "A great example of what not to do on many fronts. It’s a great opportunity to show correction and move on. If you live anywhere within 40 miles of the Mississippi and it’s larger tribs or on a non-BWCA lake in MN/WI then you know Eagles are everywhere and around human activities on a regular basis and will certainly survive this encounter."



I don't think it's about whether the eagle will survive the encounter or not. It's the fact that the law stipulates that you can't do what this person did."



I agree. While my concern for the wildlife remains, this is a matter of the law!"


I agree with Northland and Lionbabe 100%. The law is the law and it should be followed. Your opinion that some of us are overly "outraged" doesn't really matter. If visitors to the Boundary Waters break the law, they should be punished according to the law. The example of the 3,000 term eggs being abandoned due to a drone crash is a great example of how drones can affect wildlife in ways that we couldn't imagine. There are reasons behind the wildlife harassment laws.
 
07/23/2021 12:40PM  
I commented on one of his other videos and gave him a few thumbs down votes...
 
Zulu
distinguished member(1860)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/23/2021 02:08PM  
I watched a YouTube the other day called Boundary Waters 2020 and at the 3:39 marker they pan over their food supply at the campsite and there are two cans of food clearly visible. I’m surprised they didn’t realize that was a violation then filmed it!
 
Bo
 
07/23/2021 10:41PM  
https://youtu.be/lUJd-PfhIRc
 
tumblehome
distinguished member(2117)distinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished memberdistinguished member
 
07/24/2021 07:06AM  
 
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